[93182] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] scope of {-be'} and {-Qo'}
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Felix Malmenbeck)
Tue May 8 05:25:17 2012
From: Felix Malmenbeck <felixm@kth.se>
To: De'vID jonpIn <de.vid.jonpin@gmail.com>, KLI <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
Date: Tue, 8 May 2012 09:24:22 +0000
In-Reply-To: <CA+7zAmMb1s468Mnb0as+_5aZf+J0_ZAm_G_aZRUt785tD_GqiA@mail.gmail.com>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@stodi.digitalkingdom.org
Aye, it is rather confusing. There's also examples like =AByIQeqQo' neH! Do=
S yIqIp!=BB ("Don't just aim; hit the target!"); the -Qo' takes the whole p=
hrase into consideration ("Don't merely aim!"), not just the verb it's affi=
xed to.
[...as do some Type-9 suffixes, it seems.]
Another interesting example is =ABnot qoHpu''e' neH ghIjlu'.=BB - "Only foo=
ls have no fear"; without that translation, I'd read it as "One never frigh=
tens only fools." [Though perhaps the -'e' makes all the difference: It's a=
statement about fools, not about scaring people in general.]
I'm not sure what to think about phrases like =ABbatlhHa' bIvangbe'=BB; it =
feels wrong to me, but I'm not sure.
If you'd like to be on the safe side, consider constructions such as =ABbIv=
angDI' bIquvHa'be'=BB.
________________________________________
From: De'vID jonpIn [de.vid.jonpin@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2012 10:36
To: KLI
Subject: [Tlhingan-hol] scope of {-be'} and {-Qo'}
What is the scope of {-be'}? The sentence {Hoch DaSopbe'chugh batlh bIHegh=
be'} always sounded just a little strange to me. It sounds like "you will =
not die, with honour" (i.e., you will not die, and your refraining from dyi=
ng is done with honour).
I recently wrote to someone who believes that he had committed a faux pas, =
{batlhHa' bIvangbe'; bIQagh neH}. Now that I look at it though, it looks l=
ike I wrote "you did not act, with dishonour" (i.e., you did nothing, and i=
t was dishonourable to have done nothing). My meaning was understood, but =
I wonder if I could have phrased it in a better way?
I also wanted to say to someone, "Don't argue about X" (as general advice, =
i.e., stay away from topic X in a particular venue, e.g., X =3D politics, r=
eligion, OSes, programming languages, text editing software, etc.).
First, what is the object of {ghoH}?
I went with {Xmo' yIghoHQo'}. But on reading what I wrote, my instinct wan=
ts to interpret this as "because of X, don't argue", i.e., X is a reason no=
t to argue in general. Again, what is the scope of {-Qo'} here? How would=
you express the idea I wanted to convey?
--
De'vID
_______________________________________________
Tlhingan-hol mailing list
Tlhingan-hol@stodi.digitalkingdom.org
http://stodi.digitalkingdom.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol
