[108430] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [tlhIngan Hol] ghorgh and nuqDaq next to nouns
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (mayqel qunenoS)
Fri Dec 16 07:31:49 2016
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From: mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2016 14:31:44 +0200
To: tlhingan-hol@kli.org
Reply-To: tlhingan-hol@kli.org
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qurgh:
> Where is the rule that they can't be part of a
> noun-noun construction, I must have missed
> it?
SuStel wrote this a few days ago, at the "who shall call them from the
twilight ?" thread.
qunnoH jan puqloD
ghoghwIj HablI'vo' vIngeHta'
On 16 Dec 2016 2:21 pm, "qurgh lungqIj" <qurgh@wizage.net> wrote:
> On Fri, Dec 16, 2016 at 6:24 AM, mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> to continue on something which I asked yesterday..
>>
>> we said that we can't have {'Iv} and {nuq} as part of noun-noun
>>
>
> We can't? I thought {nuq} and {'Iv} just go into whatever noun spot
> contains the missing information. Where is the rule that they can't be part
> of a noun-noun construction, I must have missed it?
>
> I would have expected the following to be grammatical:
>
> {tIn 'Iv Duj} - Who's ship is big?
> {Hab SoSwI' nuq} - My mother's what is smooth?
>
>
>> constructions. but can we have the {ghorgh} and {nuqDaq} existing next
>> to nouns ?
>>
>> for example can we say:
>>
>> {ghorgh DaSjaj mamej}
>> when do we depart on monday ?
>>
>> {DaSjaj ghorgh mamej}
>> on monday when do we depart
>>
>
> I would put {ghorgh} first (same with {chay'} and {qatlh}), so the
> listener knows right away that it's a question, although as with a lot of
> the chuvmey, they just "occur at the beginning of the sentence", and the
> specific order is down to personal preference most of the time.
>
>
>>
>> {nuqDaq tera'Daq mIl'oDmey tu'lu'}
>> where on earth someone finds bears ?
>>
>> {tera'Daq nuqDaq mIl'oDmey tu'lu'}
>> on earth where someone finds bears ?
>>
>
> Since {nuqDaq} is a locative phrase just like {tera'Daq}, they can go
> either way around, although I'd put it in the spot where's I'd expect the
> answer to be:
>
> tera'Daq nuqDaq mIl'oDmey tu'lu'? tera'Daq HuDaq mIl'oDmey tu'lu'.
>
> qurgh
>
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<p dir=3D"ltr">qurgh:<br>
> Where is the rule that they can't be part of a<br>
> noun-noun construction, I must have missed<br>
> it?=C2=A0</p>
<p dir=3D"ltr">SuStel wrote this a few days ago, at the "who shall cal=
l them from the twilight ?" thread.</p>
<p dir=3D"ltr">qunnoH jan puqloD<br>
ghoghwIj HablI'vo' vIngeHta'</p>
<div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 16 Dec 2016 2:=
21 pm, "qurgh lungqIj" <<a href=3D"mailto:qurgh@wizage.net">qu=
rgh@wizage.net</a>> wrote:<br type=3D"attribution"><blockquote class=3D"=
gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-=
left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_q=
uote">On Fri, Dec 16, 2016 at 6:24 AM, mayqel qunenoS <span dir=3D"ltr"><=
;<a href=3D"mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">mihkoun@gmail.com</=
a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0=
px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">t=
o continue on something which I asked yesterday..<br>
<br>
we said that we can't have {'Iv} and {nuq} as part of noun-noun<br>=
</blockquote><div><br></div><div>We can't? I thought {nuq} and {'Iv=
} just go into whatever noun spot contains the missing information. Where i=
s the rule that they can't be part of a noun-noun construction, I must =
have missed it?=C2=A0<br><br>I would have expected the following to be gram=
matical:<br><br>{tIn 'Iv Duj} - Who's ship is big?<br>{Hab SoSwI=
9; nuq} - My mother's what is smooth?</div><div>=C2=A0<br></div><blockq=
uote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1p=
x solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
constructions. but can we have the {ghorgh} and {nuqDaq} existing next<br>
to nouns ?<br>
<br>
for example can we say:<br>
<br>
{ghorgh DaSjaj mamej}<br>
when do we depart on monday ?<br>
<br>
{DaSjaj ghorgh mamej}<br>
on monday when do we depart<br></blockquote><div><br>I would put {ghorgh} f=
irst (same with {chay'} and {qatlh}), so the listener knows right away =
that it's a question, although as with a lot of the chuvmey, they just =
"occur at the beginning of the sentence", and the specific order =
is down to personal preference most of the time.=C2=A0<br>=C2=A0</div><bloc=
kquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:=
1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<br>
{nuqDaq tera'Daq mIl'oDmey tu'lu'}<br>
where on earth someone finds bears ?<br>
<br>
{tera'Daq nuqDaq mIl'oDmey tu'lu'}<br>
on earth where someone finds bears ?<br></blockquote><div><br>Since {nuqDaq=
} is a locative phrase just like {tera'Daq}, they can go either way aro=
und, although I'd put it in the spot where's I'd expect the ans=
wer to be:<br><br>tera'Daq nuqDaq mIl'oDmey tu'lu'? tera=
9;Daq HuDaq mIl'oDmey tu'lu'.<br><br>qurgh</div></div></div></d=
iv>
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