[102729] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Aspect, etc
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (lojmIt tI'wI' nuv 'utlh)
Tue Dec 1 22:12:19 2015
From: lojmIt tI'wI' nuv 'utlh <lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 1 Dec 2015 22:12:04 -0500
To: "tlhingan-hol@kli.org" <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
In-Reply-To: <BAY179-W52CE6411FA2203F2EE678DAA0E0@phx.gbl>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@kli.org
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Don=E2=80=99t forget Worf=E2=80=99s advice on the Conversational Klingon =
tape:
=E2=80=9CA Klingon may be inaccurate, but he is NEVER approximate!=E2=80=9D=
In other words, it is okay to give an exact specification for a time =
stamp and be quite wrong. If anyone calls you on it, you don=E2=80=99t =
have to apologize. Just fight; it=E2=80=99s one of those win/win =
situations.
lojmIt tI=E2=80=99wI=E2=80=99 nuv =E2=80=98utlh
Door Repair Guy, Retired Honorably
> On Dec 1, 2015, at 8:53 PM, Rohan Fenwick <qeslagh@hotmail.com> wrote:
>=20
> ghItlhpu' QISta', jatlh:
> > Also, in regards to "time-stamps", I see that one can say "a year =
ago"
> > and such, but how would one express that something happened at some
> > unspecified time in the past (or in the future, for that matter)?
>=20
> The safe way of doing it is as SuStel has noted, with constructions =
like {'op ben} "some years ago", {leS puS} "a few days from now", and so =
forth.
>=20
> There's been some conjecture as to whether {ret} and {pIq} can be used =
on their own as sorts of general adverbials of time reference - in the =
Klingon subtitles I did for "Star Trek: First Contact", I at first =
rendered Picard's statement of "they must have done it in the past" as =
{ret lurInmoHba'ta'} - but we have no canon evidence of whether this is =
really possible.
>=20
> (Also, note that I used {ret} explicitly for "[at some point] in the =
past", standing in addition to, not merely in place of, the tense/aspect =
reference of "they must have done it". I wouldn't accept bare {ret} and =
{pIq} being used as general tense markers and I don't think many other =
speakers would accept them in that sense either.)
>=20
> jang SuStel, jatlh:
> > I believe paq'batlh has {'op ben} for "some years ago."
>=20
> It also has the formally compounded {'opleS} "someday (in the future)" =
(paq'batlh: paq'yav 2.8, 2.11-12).
>=20
> taH:
> > You can also say {ben law'} "many years ago"
>=20
> ...HoD Huj vIqIH. :)
>=20
> QeS 'utlh
> _______________________________________________
> Tlhingan-hol mailing list
> Tlhingan-hol@kli.org <mailto:Tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
> http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol =
<http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol>
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D""><div class=3D"">Don=E2=80=99t forget Worf=E2=80=99s advice on =
the Conversational Klingon tape:</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">=E2=80=9CA Klingon may be inaccurate, =
but he is NEVER approximate!=E2=80=9D</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">In other words, it is okay to give an =
exact specification for a time stamp and be quite wrong. If anyone calls =
you on it, you don=E2=80=99t have to apologize. Just fight; it=E2=80=99s =
one of those win/win situations.</div><br class=3D""><div class=3D"">
<div class=3D""><div class=3D"">lojmIt tI=E2=80=99wI=E2=80=99 nuv =
=E2=80=98utlh</div><div class=3D"">Door Repair Guy, Retired =
Honorably</div></div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline">
</div>
<br class=3D""><div><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On Dec 1, 2015, at 8:53 PM, Rohan Fenwick <<a =
href=3D"mailto:qeslagh@hotmail.com" class=3D"">qeslagh@hotmail.com</a>>=
wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div =
dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-family: Calibri; font-size: 16px; font-style: =
normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: =
normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=3D"">ghItlhpu' QISta', =
jatlh:<br class=3D"">> Also, in regards to "time-stamps", I see that =
one can say "a year ago"<br class=3D""><div class=3D"">> and such, =
but how would one express that something happened at some<br =
class=3D"">> unspecified time in the past (or in the future, for that =
matter)?<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">The safe way of doing it is as =
SuStel has noted, with constructions like {'op ben} "some years ago", =
{leS puS} "a few days from now", and so forth.<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">There's been some conjecture as to whether {ret} and {pIq} =
can be used on their own as sorts of general adverbials of time =
reference - in the Klingon subtitles I did for "Star Trek: First =
Contact", I at first rendered Picard's statement of "they must have done =
it in the past" as {ret lurInmoHba'ta'} - but we have no canon evidence =
of whether this is really possible.<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">(Also, =
note that I used {ret} explicitly for "[at some point] in the past", =
standing in addition to, not merely in place of, the tense/aspect =
reference of "they must have done it". I wouldn't accept bare {ret} and =
{pIq} being used as general tense markers and I don't think many other =
speakers would accept them in that sense either.)<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">jang SuStel, jatlh:<br class=3D"">> I believe paq'batlh =
has {'op ben} for "some years ago."<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">It also =
has the formally compounded {'opleS} "someday (in the future)" =
(paq'batlh: paq'yav 2.8, 2.11-12).<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">taH:<br =
class=3D"">> You can also say {ben law'} "many years ago"<br =
class=3D""><br class=3D"">...HoD Huj vIqIH. :)<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">QeS 'utlh<br class=3D""></div></div><span style=3D"font-family:=
Calibri; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; =
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: =
start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: =
none; display: inline !important;" =
class=3D"">_______________________________________________</span><br =
style=3D"font-family: Calibri; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: =
none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-family: =
Calibri; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; =
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: =
start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: =
none; display: inline !important;" class=3D"">Tlhingan-hol mailing =
list</span><br style=3D"font-family: Calibri; font-size: 16px; =
font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; =
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0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; =
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=3D""><a =
href=3D"mailto:Tlhingan-hol@kli.org" style=3D"font-family: Calibri; =
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ockquote></div><br class=3D""></body></html>=
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