[101320] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Star Trek VI The Undiscovered Country Klingon
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (HoD qunnoQ)
Fri Oct 9 14:20:40 2015
In-Reply-To: <001b01d102b2$aa9fab00$ffdf0100$@flyingstart.ca>
Date: Fri, 9 Oct 2015 21:20:07 +0300
From: HoD qunnoQ <mihkoun@gmail.com>
To: Robyn Stewart <robyn@flyingstart.ca>
Cc: tlhIngan Hol mailing list <tlhIngan-Hol@kli.org>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@kli.org
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Human jIH
(I picked an easy one..)
qunnoQ
On Fri, Oct 9, 2015 at 7:50 PM, Robyn Stewart <robyn@flyingstart.ca> wrote:
> Not really. You=E2=80=99re within wa=E2=80=99 netlh qelI=E2=80=99qam (~2=
0,000 km) of every
> Klingon speaker there is, and thanks to the internet you can communicate
> with all of us within microseconds. It takes very little Klingon to have =
a
> conversation, and once you have that first conversation, you will have
> established a beachhead from which to conquer the language.
>
>
>
> Here=E2=80=99s the first thing I taught the beginners at qep=E2=80=99a=E2=
=80=99: how to say =E2=80=9CI am
> a ____=E2=80=9D. It is =E2=80=9C____ jIH.=E2=80=9D
>
> jIH is a member of the chuvmey class of words. It acts as the prounoun
> =E2=80=9CI=E2=80=9D and also means =E2=80=9CI am.=E2=80=9D
>
> tlhIngan jIH =3D I am a Klingon
> =E2=80=98orwI=E2=80=99 jIH =3D I am a pilot
>
> tera=E2=80=99ngan jIH =3D I am an Earther
>
> Look up a word (has to be a noun) that you are, and tell me you are that.
>
> Instead of looking at the Klingon language as a massive challenge you hav=
e
> to be someone special to meet, or psyche yourself up to begin, just learn
> one thing at a time until qaSta=E2=80=99! You have learned it.
>
>
>
> - Qov
>
> *From:* HoD qunnoQ [mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* October 9, 2015 4:43
> *To:* Robyn Stewart
> *Cc:* tlhIngan Hol mailing list
>
> *Subject:* Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Star Trek VI The Undiscovered Country
> Klingon Dialogue
>
>
>
> >Regardless, I will be delighted to converse with you in
> intelligibly-spoken Klingon, no matter what your spit range might be.
>
> I would be delighted too,but unfortunately i'm light years away from bein=
g
> able to actually converse with someone in Klingon..
>
> qunnoQ
>
>
>
> On Fri, Oct 9, 2015 at 1:16 AM, Robyn Stewart <robyn@flyingstart.ca>
> wrote:
>
> Different languages _*are*_ spoken in different ways. Klingon does have
> to be spoken somewhat forcefully to distinguish between some of the raspy
> consonants. The rhythm of Italian helps to distinguish between doubled an=
d
> single consonants. Russian declarative sentences are said with a kind of
> monotone, falling off at the end. If I were to speak Russian fluently an=
d
> with the peppy little rises and falls of my native language, it wouldn=E2=
=80=99t
> sound right. I=E2=80=99m still weirded out by the instruction that it is=
incorrect
> to speak Cree with emotion in my voice, that the old western stereotype o=
f
> the Indian guide saying =E2=80=9Call my family die=E2=80=9D in the same f=
lat tone as =E2=80=9Csoon
> will rain=E2=80=9D is based in truth. I had a Korean student who knew Eng=
lish quite
> well, with reasonable pronunciation but was really hard to understand
> because he used the rhythm of his own language. When I tried to get him t=
o
> put longer pauses in so an examiner could understand, he protested that h=
e
> didn=E2=80=99t want to sound stupid. This was before YouTube, so I had t=
o get him
> to take my word for it that great speeches in English show that its skill=
ed
> speakers SLOW DOWN to sound smart.
>
> Speaking Klingon with the fluent rhythm of English is probably as wrong a=
s
> speaking it with the rhythm of Italian or Japanese. The =E2=80=98native=
=E2=80=99 Klingon
> speakers we hear tend to speak in a staccato manner, yet Azetbur manages =
to
> do it without overly chewing the scenery. Perhaps it=E2=80=99s because of=
her
> gender, or is an affectation. Regardless, I will be delighted to converse
> with you in intelligibly-spoken Klingon, no matter what your spit range
> might be.
>
>
>
> - Qov
>
>
>
> *From:* HoD qunnoQ [mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* October 8, 2015 13:06
> *To:* Lieven
> *Cc:* tlhingan-hol@stodi.digitalkingdom.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Star Trek VI The Undiscovered Country
> Klingon Dialogue
>
>
>
> indeed.. if i ever managed to become proficient in Klingon,so as to speak
> it like i speak my native language,then this is the way i would like to
> speak it ; mildly and relaxed. i don't know why,but this manner of speaki=
ng
> appeals to me as more instinctive and natural.
>
> qunnoQ
>
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 9:46 PM, Lieven <levinius@gmx.de> wrote:
>
> Am 08.10.2015 um 17:54 schrieb HoD qunnoQ:
>
> nuqneH
>
> i made this observation...
>
>
> That's a very good observation, and it's more important than what most
> people would believe it to be.
>
> Indeed, I guess it's simply the actor who speaks a bit differently than
> others. Perhabs it was even done intentional, because Azetbur was sad?
> Maybe it's because she's a woman. I don't know, compare to Valkris or
> Uhura (although she's not klingon, so maybe she doesn't count)
>
> Anyhow, I love showing this scene to my students because it makes clear
> that one can speak klingon in a very natural way, as opposed to what many
> people believe is that you need to shout and bark klingon all the time.
>
> Klingon can be spoken like a natural language, and Azetbur has proven thi=
s
> quite well in that scene.
>
>
> --
> Lieven L. Litaer
> aka Quvar valer 'utlh
> Grammarian of the KLI
> http://www.facebook.com/Klingonteacher
> http://www.klingonwiki.net
>
> _______________________________________________
> Tlhingan-hol mailing list
> Tlhingan-hol@kli.org
> http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Tlhingan-hol mailing list
> Tlhingan-hol@kli.org
> http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Tlhingan-hol mailing list
> Tlhingan-hol@kli.org
> http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol
>
>
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div>Human jIH=C2=A0 <br><br>(I picked an easy one..)<br><=
br></div><div>qunnoQ<br></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div cla=
ss=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Oct 9, 2015 at 7:50 PM, Robyn Stewart <span dir=
=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:robyn@flyingstart.ca" target=3D"_blank">roby=
n@flyingstart.ca</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote"=
style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><d=
iv link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" lang=3D"EN-CA"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal=
"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","san=
s-serif";color:#1f497d">Not really.=C2=A0 You=E2=80=99re within wa=E2=
=80=99 netlh qelI=E2=80=99qam (~20,000 km) of every Klingon speaker there i=
s, and thanks to the internet you can communicate with all of us within mic=
roseconds. It takes very little Klingon to have a conversation, and once yo=
u have that first conversation, you will have established a beachhead from =
which to conquer the language.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNorma=
l"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sa=
ns-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",&q=
uot;sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Here=E2=80=99s the first thing I taught=
the beginners at qep=E2=80=99a=E2=80=99: how to say =E2=80=9CI am a ____=
=E2=80=9D.=C2=A0 It is =E2=80=9C____ jIH.=E2=80=9D<br><br>jIH =C2=A0is a me=
mber of the chuvmey class of words. It acts as the prounoun =E2=80=9CI=E2=
=80=9D and also means =E2=80=9CI am.=E2=80=9D<br><br>tlhIngan jIH =3D I am =
a Klingon<br>=E2=80=98orwI=E2=80=99 jIH =3D I am a pilot<u></u><u></u></spa=
n></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&q=
uot;Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">tera=E2=80=99ngan j=
IH =3D I am an Earther<br><br>Look up a word (has to be a noun) that you ar=
e, and tell me you are that.<br><br>Instead of looking at the Klingon langu=
age as a massive challenge you have to be someone special to meet, or psych=
e yourself up to begin, just learn one thing at a time until qaSta=E2=80=99=
! You have learned it.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span=
style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif=
";color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"=
><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans=
-serif";color:#1f497d">- Qov<br><br><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma&=
quot;,"sans-serif"" lang=3D"EN-US">From:</span></b><span style=3D=
"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"" la=
ng=3D"EN-US"> HoD qunnoQ [mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com" targe=
t=3D"_blank">mihkoun@gmail.com</a>] <br><b>Sent:</b> October 9, 2015 4:43<b=
r><b>To:</b> Robyn Stewart<br><b>Cc:</b> tlhIngan Hol mailing list</span></=
p><div><div class=3D"h5"><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Star Trek V=
I The Undiscovered Country Klingon Dialogue<u></u><u></u></div></div><p></p=
><div><div class=3D"h5"><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><div=
><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">><span =
style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif&=
quot;;color:#1f497d">Regardless, I will be delighted to converse with you i=
n intelligibly-spoken Klingon, no matter what your spit range might be.</sp=
an><u></u><u></u></p></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12=
.0pt"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","=
;sans-serif";color:#1f497d">I would be delighted too,but unfortunately=
i'm light years away from being able to actually converse with someone=
in Klingon..</span><u></u><u></u></p></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif&qu=
ot;;color:#1f497d">qunnoQ</span><u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Fri, Oct 9,=
2015 at 1:16 AM, Robyn Stewart <<a href=3D"mailto:robyn@flyingstart.ca"=
target=3D"_blank">robyn@flyingstart.ca</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p><di=
v><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&=
quot;Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Different language=
s _<i>are</i>_ spoken in different ways. Klingon does have to be spoken som=
ewhat forcefully to distinguish between some of the raspy consonants. The r=
hythm of Italian helps to distinguish between doubled and single consonants=
.=C2=A0 Russian declarative sentences are said with a kind of monotone, fal=
ling off at the end.=C2=A0 If I were to speak Russian fluently and with the=
peppy little rises and falls of my native language, it wouldn=E2=80=99t so=
und right.=C2=A0 I=E2=80=99m still weirded out by the instruction that it i=
s incorrect to speak Cree with emotion in my voice, that the old western st=
ereotype of the Indian guide saying =E2=80=9Call my family die=E2=80=9D in =
the same flat tone as =E2=80=9Csoon will rain=E2=80=9D is based in truth. I=
had a Korean student who knew English quite well, with reasonable pronunci=
ation but was really hard to understand because he used the rhythm of his o=
wn language. When I tried to get him to put longer pauses in so an examiner=
could understand, he protested that he didn=E2=80=99t want to sound stupid=
.=C2=A0 This was before YouTube, so I had to get him to take my word for it=
that great speeches in English show that its skilled speakers SLOW DOWN to=
sound smart.</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D=
"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";co=
lor:#1f497d">Speaking Klingon with the fluent rhythm of English is probably=
as wrong as speaking it with the rhythm of Italian or Japanese. The =E2=80=
=98native=E2=80=99 Klingon speakers we hear tend to speak in a staccato man=
ner, yet Azetbur manages to do it without overly chewing the scenery. Perha=
ps it=E2=80=99s because of her gender, or is an affectation. Regardless, I =
will be delighted to converse with you in intelligibly-spoken Klingon, no m=
atter what your spit range might be.</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",&q=
uot;sans-serif";color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri&qu=
ot;,"sans-serif";color:#1f497d">- Qov</span><u></u><u></u></p><p =
class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calib=
ri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u><=
/p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&q=
uot;Tahoma","sans-serif"" lang=3D"EN-US">From:</span></b><sp=
an style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-seri=
f"" lang=3D"EN-US"> HoD qunnoQ [mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:mihkoun@gmail=
.com" target=3D"_blank">mihkoun@gmail.com</a>] <br><b>Sent:</b> October 8, =
2015 13:06<br><b>To:</b> Lieven<br><b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:tlhingan-ho=
l@stodi.digitalkingdom.org" target=3D"_blank">tlhingan-hol@stodi.digitalkin=
gdom.org</a><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Star Trek VI The Undisco=
vered Country Klingon Dialogue</span><u></u><u></u></p><div><div><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" sty=
le=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">indeed.. if i ever managed to become proficient=
in Klingon,so as to speak it like i speak my native language,then this is =
the way i would like to speak it ; mildly and relaxed. i don't know why=
,but this manner of speaking appeals to me as more instinctive and natural.=
<u></u><u></u></p></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">qunnoQ<u></u><u></u></p></di=
v><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class=3D"MsoN=
ormal">On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 9:46 PM, Lieven <<a href=3D"mailto:leviniu=
s@gmx.de" target=3D"_blank">levinius@gmx.de</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p=
><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Am 08.10.2015 um 17:54 schrieb HoD qunnoQ:<u></u><u=
></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">nuqneH<br><br>i made this observation...<u>=
</u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br>That's a very good observatio=
n, and it's more important than what most people would believe it to be=
.<br><br>Indeed, I guess it's simply the actor who speaks a bit differe=
ntly than others. Perhabs it was even done intentional, because Azetbur was=
sad?<br>Maybe it's because she's a woman. I don't know, compar=
e to Valkris or Uhura (although she's not klingon, so maybe she doesn&#=
39;t count)<br><br>Anyhow, I love showing this scene to my students because=
it makes clear that one can speak klingon in a very natural way, as oppose=
d to what many people believe is that you need to shout and bark klingon al=
l the time.<br><br>Klingon can be spoken like a natural language, and Azetb=
ur has proven this quite well in that scene.<span style=3D"color:#888888"><=
br><br><br>-- <br>Lieven L. Litaer<br>aka Quvar valer 'utlh<br>Grammari=
an of the KLI<br><a href=3D"http://www.facebook.com/Klingonteacher" target=
=3D"_blank">http://www.facebook.com/Klingonteacher</a><br><a href=3D"http:/=
/www.klingonwiki.net" target=3D"_blank">http://www.klingonwiki.net</a><br><=
br>_______________________________________________<br>Tlhingan-hol mailing =
list<br><a href=3D"mailto:Tlhingan-hol@kli.org" target=3D"_blank">Tlhingan-=
hol@kli.org</a><br><a href=3D"http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan=
-hol" target=3D"_blank">http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol</=
a></span><u></u><u></u></p></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u=
></p></div></div></div></div></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-b=
ottom:12.0pt"><br>_______________________________________________<br>Tlhing=
an-hol mailing list<br><a href=3D"mailto:Tlhingan-hol@kli.org" target=3D"_b=
lank">Tlhingan-hol@kli.org</a><br><a href=3D"http://mail.kli.org/mailman/li=
stinfo/tlhingan-hol" target=3D"_blank">http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo=
/tlhingan-hol</a><u></u><u></u></p></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=
=A0<u></u></p></div></div></div></div></div><br>___________________________=
____________________<br>
Tlhingan-hol mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Tlhingan-hol@kli.org">Tlhingan-hol@kli.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol" rel=3D"norefe=
rrer" target=3D"_blank">http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol</=
a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>
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