[20429] in APO-L
Re: APO using scout camps
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Thomas W. Strong Jr.)
Wed Apr 7 09:53:21 1999
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 09:43:27 -0400
Reply-To: "Thomas W. Strong Jr." <strong@DEMENTIA.ORG>
From: "Thomas W. Strong Jr." <strong@DEMENTIA.ORG>
To: APO-L@LISTSERV.IUPUI.EDU
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990407000356.009dd660@maileast.citlink.net>
On Wed, 7 Apr 1999, Chris Rock wrote:
> I am the sponsor for the petitioning group at Concord College in West
> Virginia. They are in the process of planning their first CPPC. At my
> suggestion, they looked into using a local scout camp. I was rather
> surprised when the Fellowship VP informed me today that they would be
> allowed to use the camp if they demonstrated they had liability insurance.
>
> <aside> For anyone who isn't aware, as a national organization we do not
> carry liability insurance. When a chapter has an event that is not covered
> by the school's policy, they must purchase event insurance. The cost
> varies widely depending on the location, but I understand an average cost
> would be approximately $100.<end aside>
Are you sure that the event wouldn't be covered byt he school's policy?
If you haven't checked, you may be suprised. I've seen several schools
that cover any activity an organization does, no matter where they do it
(with exceptions for various "dangerous" activities, but it's the
activity that mattered there, not the location)
> What surprised me about the situation was that a BSA camp was requiring an
> APO group to have insurance. This was the first I had heard of it. APO
> has been using scout camps for these kinds of events virtually since day
> one, and as far as I knew, without cost. When I investigated from our side,
> I discovered this requirement is becoming increasingly common. This leads
> me to my questions for the rest of you.
My answers here don't quite fit a chapter, as I'm answering for both
Section 62 and several chapters within it.
> 1) Does your chapter use a scout camp?
APO in the Pittsburgh area has a very good relationship with the local
BSA councils. We have used several nearby camps, often for free, but
occasionally for money.
> 2) Are you required to have liability insurance or pay some other fee?
>
> 2a) If yes, what do you do?
The only recent time that we had to pay was when we held our fall
sectional conference at a camp. Since we were taking over the entire camp
for the weekend, we had to pay for the facilities we had reserved. (we
were keeping other paying attendees out, so somebody had to pay for the
camp) Since several chapters locally have chartered Venturing Crews, we
were able to receive a heavily discounted rate.
There has never been any mention of insurance, whether because of the BSA
connection or because they just assume we have it I don't know, but it's
never come up.
> 2b) If no, is it just that the camp doesn't require it or that you've
> gotten around it some way? If so, how?
Groups have also used the camps for other smaller purposes, often for
free. In general, if the group is going for the purpose of doing a
service project in the camp, we've usually been able to use any vacant
facility while we were there, although we generally couldn't count on any
being available becuase of advance bookings.
We've also come up on short notice to use some of the camp buildings for
meetings and day-long retreats, generally under the understanding that we
were only there for free because nobody had booked that area for hte
weekend.
If the space is open, and not likely to be booked by a scout group, quite
often the camp ranger will unofficially allow you to use camp facilities
in exchange for help around the camp, either on the same trip, or as an
ongoing cooperation.
Give the camp ranger a call and offer the group's assistance in doign
whatever he needs done for half the day. He'll probably be willing to
let you use a vacant building or shelter for a CPPC afterward.
> 3) Why has this requirement come about? Is it related to the severing of
> legal ties between BSA and APO because of the recent suits against BSA for
> it's membership policies?
Just as every chapter is different, every BSA Council is also different.
THere's even a pretty large variation between camps in the same council,
or between the answers you'll get from two different professionals in the
same council. If one of the professionals there (or better yet, the camp
ranger) just happens to be (one of) the group's scouting advisor(s), try
placing the request through them.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Thomas W. Strong Jr. strong@dementia.org
----------------- http://www.dementia.org/~strong -----------------
