[11183] in Public-Access_Computer_Systems_Forum
Re: Clifford Lynch; Scientific American (March)
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Public-Access Computer Systems For)
Thu Apr 3 20:25:19 1997
Date: Thu, 03 Apr 1997 12:49:09 -0600 (CST)
From: Public-Access Computer Systems Forum <LIBPACS@UHUPVM1.UH.EDU>
To: Multiple recipients of list PACS-L <PACS-L@UHUPVM1.UH.EDU>
Reply-To: Public-Access Computer Systems Forum <PACS-L@UHUPVM1.UH.EDU>
2 Messages; 163 Lines
*-----
From: Dan Lester <DLESTER@bsu.idbsu.edu>
Replies to two other pieces....from the "curmudgeon" who
isn't going to retire that soon.....
From: Edward Summers <esummers@uiuc.edu>
Subject: Clifford Lynch, Scientific American (March) -- a
NARROW view!
Jim Warren said:
"* A used computer with modem can easily be had for less
than the price of one of the several TVs that are in most
homes -- even the most desitute homes.
* Learning to "drive" the net is an order-of-magnitude easier
than, say, learning to drive a car ... perhaps on the order of
learning difficulty of the byzantine welfare system, though
with much less need to wander all over town to grovel before
bureaucracies."
There is certainly a growing abundance of used pcs on the
market. However I think you are minimizing the amount of
background knowledge it takes to successfully set up the
software & hardware to navigate the net (especially when you
are dealing with used pcs!)
---------------------------------------
Actually, I don't see it as much different from the continuing
car analogy. Many people can quickly learn to change the
oil or plugs, at least on an older car. But keeping the car in
good running condition quickly gets into serious learning,
tools, and technology, even on an older car. Part of that is
literacy, whether the manuals are coming from the public
library or elsewhere.
=================================
We are not just talking about English Language Literacy here
(which has problems of its own) but computer literacy as
well--which is a particular problem for populations who did not
grow up playing arcade games, or did not receive adequate
exposure to technologies in their education.
-----------------------------------
Again, no different from the cars. Just a different technology,
not necessarily a more complicated one. Remember, to get
the computer running you do NOT have to know the
intricacies of designing chips or even working with circuit
boards. Try to buy an unknown and indescribably part that
has been broken down at the local auto parts store. Good
luck. You have to know a lot and have learned it somewhere.
Just as many learn to be computer whizzes with no formal
training, the same is true of automotive geniuses working in
good garages and shops.
==================================
(see: "Lost in byteworld. (buying a computer requires one to
navigate a sea of jargon)" by Russell Baker. The New York
Times,
March 15, 1997 v146 p19, col 6.)
---------------------------------------------
Well, quoting Baker is hardly a useful thing to do. Sure,
there will always be those who can't (or more likely WON'T)
learn jargon of computers....but same is true of jargon of
cars. Go down to an autoshop or racetrack (local, not
NASCAR) and get a taste of it. Their language is as arcane
as ours.
========================
It would be great to hear you razor sharp wit, and enthusiasm
for freedom on the net turned to the defense of the
information have nots (that most assuredly exist), instead of
minimizing a very serious problem--especially in light of the
US Government's move towards publishing exclusively in an
electronic medium and leaving paper behind.
---------------------------------
Yes, information has always had a price. In the past it was
subsidized by the govt giving out zillions of pamphlets for a
nickel about growing strawberries, killing aphids on your
roses, and so forth. Now that the govt is getting out of that
(and that is a political decision that I don't think all of us
collectively marching on washington would or could change
at this date), the answer is that the states and cities need to
start putting more money into information provision, by
supporting their libraries. This is same as many other
federally supported things being passed down to the states
and cities. We don't have to like it, but I think we have to
accept it....the WPA and the GPO and FDR are all long
gone....at least as they once were.
===========================
From: "Theodore Morris 513-558-0177 - ted.morris@uc.edu"
<Theodore.Morris@UC.Edu>
Subject: Re: Clifford Lynch, Scientific American (March) -- a
NARROW view!
Jim Warren noted, "Except *possibly* for a few rural areas, I
propose that there are FEW "information have nots" ...
except those who are
'information WANT nots.'"
I think that, unfortunately, that's not a "few" rural areas but
"most" rural areas, even today. We don't tend to notice it,
but even "heavily" populated states such as Ohio and
Pennsylvania are primarily _rural_, with a few big cities
separated by lots of wide open spaces (and/or mountains, in
the case of PA!). For example, just one or two counties
away from Cincinnati are areas that don't even have digital
dialing services, let alone internet service providers. I know
that one example here and there doesn't make an effective
argument, but nevertheless this is not as uncommon as
those of us living in metropolitan areas might think. It was
quite a surprise to me when I started working in electronic
outreach services, how isolated one could be while
seemingly so close to areas of advanced telecomm
infrastructure.
-----------------------------------------
You are right that there are more than a few, though at least
in Idaho far from many, folks without adequate information
access. Yes, we can debate forever what is adequate. IF
we all get cable modems in a few years, for example, that
may still not help the guy with a satellite dish, and won't help
the guy without electricity. But, at least in Idaho, over 90
percent of the population, including many in VERY rural
areas, have local dialup access to an ISP. We may be
better served than many states, and there are still holes. For
example, my stepson and his family live in a little town some
25 miles from Boise, but can't get local access because no
ISP in his right mind would go in to deal with the "Horseshoe
Bend Telephone Company" which serves inadequately some
500 customers. Towns well beyond it, but with service from
USWest, have local calls to Boise and quality lines. So,
sure, there will always be exceptions. But it isn't impossible
if you have some entrepreneurial ISPs.
dan
Dan Lester, Network Information Coordinator
Boise State University Library, Boise, Idaho, 83725 USA
voice: 208-385-1235 fax: 208-385-1394
dlester@bsu.idbsu.edu OR alileste@idbsu.idbsu.edu
Cyclops' Internet Toolbox: http://cyclops.idbsu.edu
"How can one fool make another wise?" Kansas, 1979.
*-----
From: "Robert E. Maas" <rem@one-o.com>
Organization: One-O, Inc., Mountain View, CA
Subject: Re: Clifford Lynch, Scientific American (March)
To: Multiple recipients of list PACS-L <PACS-L@UHUPVM1.UH.EDU>
In-Reply-To: <PACS-L%97033118010648@UHUPVM1.UH.EDU>
----------------------------Original message----------------------------
I agree. I think the government should provide funds for people who
set up public-access facilities where they teach newcomers how to use
topputers for connecting to the net, and provide some actual access
until such time as they have their own computer able to connect to the
net. For example, I wish either the Community Service Agency, or the
Public Library, here in Mountain View, would set up public access
services, especially for the many homeless people in this area. It'd
be especially nice if the homeless could be taught to use computers to
browse the net, then those same homeless could earn money teaching
others likewise, and some eventually have enough money to be able to
afford a place to live. At the least the government should provide
money to pay for a security guard, so the equipment doesn't get stolen
or vandalized, and for insurance (liability and computer-damage).
