[29333] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 577 Volume: 11
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Mon Jun 25 21:09:58 2007
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 18:09:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Mon, 25 Jun 2007 Volume: 11 Number: 577
Today's topics:
...gulp...ummm... is Perl6 deceased ? <stuseven@hotmail.com>
Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6? usenet@DavidFilmer.com
Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6? <bik.mido@tiscalinet.it>
Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6? <savagebeaste@yahoo.com>
Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6? <savagebeaste@yahoo.com>
Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6? <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6? <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6? <bik.mido@tiscalinet.it>
Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6? <savagebeaste@yahoo.com>
Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6? <savagebeaste@yahoo.com>
Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6? <savagebeaste@yahoo.com>
Re: gcc help <sisyphus1@nomail.afraid.org>
Re: How can I overload the build in array type? <mjcarman@mchsi.com>
Re: strings with formatted characters in %ARGV <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Re: strings with formatted characters in %ARGV <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 16:24:04 -0700
From: "stuseven@hotmail.com" <stuseven@hotmail.com>
Subject: ...gulp...ummm... is Perl6 deceased ?
Message-Id: <1182813844.574919.297940@u2g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>
+ Since sometime two or three years ago, when the
big rage was discussing Perl6... I've been looking at the
Perl6 websites... and my question relates to this.
On the dev.perl.org site, where the column, "This week in Perl"
appears... there are no new postings listed since 16 months ago...
this to me is a somewhat familiar site on Sourceforge, where new
programs frequently stop development after an initial release...
but I wouldnt expect this of Perl.
... is it so... could perl development have stopped ? Or this a
misperception... perhaps it is the dev.perl.org site which is
defunct,
and not perl6 ?
Hey... I am all for it... but perl5 is fine with me :-)
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 22:25:04 -0000
From: usenet@DavidFilmer.com
Subject: Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6?
Message-Id: <1182810304.732001.34490@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com>
On Jun 25, 1:14 pm, "Clenna Lumina" <savagebea...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Tad McClellan wrote:
> > Clenna Lumina <savagebea...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > If some famous Perl guy would of jsut implemented a spell-correcting
> > 'bot, then things would of been a lot better around here...
>
> How is this relevant? So I speed typed. I'm sorry if I offended you,
I think you missed Tad's joke:
> > If some famous Perl guy would of jsut implemented
^^^^
Oh well, time to get working on that 'bot.
(kidding, kidding)
--
The best way to get a good answer is to ask a good question.
David Filmer (http://DavidFilmer.com)
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2007 00:47:11 +0200
From: Michele Dondi <bik.mido@tiscalinet.it>
Subject: Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6?
Message-Id: <r4h083lr8j41fr4g6foit39dssu4e8ja9l@4ax.com>
On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 13:29:02 -0700, "Clenna Lumina"
<savagebeaste@yahoo.com> wrote:
>That was her opinion, not an assertion as your miss-quote seems to
>imply. This is WHY one should take care not to completely obliterate any
>context. Especially if you are doing it to purposely slander someone.
Oh, C'mon! you may even be right in this particular point. But we're
talking 'bout moronzilla, so who cares?
>Well, using 'my' at the top of the main code page is effectively a
>global to anything coming after it, be it subs, or whatnot.
The english term "global" can have distinct acceptations in a Perl
context: don't forget we basically have two different variable
systems.
>> globals are bad and not good in any language. but you wouldn't
>> understand that anyhow. i write this for others to realize how little
>> you know.
>
>How are they bad? I fully disagree. I believe they have their place,
>just like anything else. One just needs to know when and how they are
>appropriate.
Rare enough to be almost exclusively an exception to Uri's general
"rule".
>> so leave the perl community already. no one wants you here but
>> yourself and you just bitch and moan. whining and stupidity are not
>> wanted here. learn python instead.
>
>Please do not speak for anyone other than yourself. Makes you look like
>an arrogant pusshog.
FWIW he's speaking for others other than himself. Of course it is much
less of a problem, because I've killfiled it long ago, as any person
in his or her sane state of mind would do. If Uri likes to play that
masochistic game, I cannot of course do anything to prevent him doing
so. But as I also recently wrote, it gets on my nerves for the echoes
eventually reaching me too...
Michele
--
{$_=pack'B8'x25,unpack'A8'x32,$a^=sub{pop^pop}->(map substr
(($a||=join'',map--$|x$_,(unpack'w',unpack'u','G^<R<Y]*YB='
.'KYU;*EVH[.FHF2W+#"\Z*5TI/ER<Z`S(G.DZZ9OX0Z')=~/./g)x2,$_,
256),7,249);s/[^\w,]/ /g;$ \=/^J/?$/:"\r";print,redo}#JAPH,
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 16:02:08 -0700
From: "Clenna Lumina" <savagebeaste@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6?
Message-Id: <5eavrlF37rcheU1@mid.individual.net>
usenet@DavidFilmer.com wrote:
> On Jun 25, 1:14 pm, "Clenna Lumina" <savagebea...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Tad McClellan wrote:
>>> Clenna Lumina <savagebea...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> If some famous Perl guy would of jsut implemented a spell-correcting
>>> 'bot, then things would of been a lot better around here...
>>
>> How is this relevant? So I speed typed. I'm sorry if I offended you,
>
>
> I think you missed Tad's joke:
>>> If some famous Perl guy would of jsut implemented
If you consider that a joke, then I'd urge neither of you to give up
your day jobs.
Anyhow, I still don't see what relevant baring it had on the topic.
--
CL
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 16:06:32 -0700
From: "Clenna Lumina" <savagebeaste@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6?
Message-Id: <5eb03uF37ge4hU1@mid.individual.net>
Michele Dondi wrote:
> On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 13:29:02 -0700, "Clenna Lumina"
> <savagebeaste@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Well, using 'my' at the top of the main code page is effectively a
>> global to anything coming after it, be it subs, or whatnot.
>
> The english term "global" can have distinct acceptations in a Perl
> context: don't forget we basically have two different variable
> systems.
Well I understand that. I think it's still a valid point that if you're
writting a single file script, "using 'my' at the top of the main code"
is effectively a global to the rest of the program. Having 'our' or 'my'
at the top makes no difference in simple scripts at least.
--
CL
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 17:32:24 -0500
From: Tad McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Subject: Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6?
Message-Id: <slrnf80gjo.r4s.tadmc@tadmc30.sbcglobal.net>
Clenna Lumina <savagebeaste@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Tad McClellan wrote:
>> Clenna Lumina <savagebeaste@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I have
>>> seen soem regualars reepatedly tell people not to reinvent whats
>>> already good and working and accepted.
>>
>>
>> Like acceptable spelling.
>>
>> If some famous Perl guy would of jsut implemented a spell-correcting
^^^^
>> 'bot, then things would of been a lot better around here...
^^^^^^^^
>
> How is this relevant?
From when your name was Al MacHonahey:
Message-ID: <56184210.0209031038.3b40a9ef@posting.google.com>
> I speed typed.
Yes, that is a characteristic of your posts that helps to
identify your persona-of-the-day.
(I included 2 of the most common ones in my reply above.)
> I'm sorry if I offended you,
No you're not.
--
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.noitatibaher\100cmdat/"
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 17:40:03 -0500
From: Tad McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Subject: Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6?
Message-Id: <slrnf80h23.r4s.tadmc@tadmc30.sbcglobal.net>
Clenna Lumina <savagebeaste@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Uri Guttman wrote:
>>>>>>> "PG" == Purl Gurl <purlgurl@purlgurl.net> writes:
>>
>>> surpassed what Perl 6 can provide. Perl 6 is a dinosaur.
>
> Why do you like to miss-quote?
Because mister quote is out of town?
--
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.noitatibaher\100cmdat/"
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2007 00:39:59 +0200
From: Michele Dondi <bik.mido@tiscalinet.it>
Subject: Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6?
Message-Id: <3kg0831oq60fe57akojhd3g7ras7lnofrs@4ax.com>
On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 13:14:42 -0700, "Clenna Lumina"
<savagebeaste@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> If some famous Perl guy would of jsut implemented a spell-correcting
>> 'bot, then things would of been a lot better around here...
>
>How is this relevant? So I speed typed. I'm sorry if I offended you,
>your royal majesty.
Funny that you can write as if in a sane state of mind when giving
names to someone who routinely contributes in a constructive manner to
the group whereas you seemed not to when you were compelled to "speed
type" your own "original contribution"... of... er... well... NINE
lines of text... Also funny to notice you're surprised you offended
someone -not only your respondent, BTW- given that appearently you
rate the recipients of what you wrote as not even deserving a
re-reading of the text you just typed. If your time is *SO* precious,
then perhaps you may consider not losing it at all with such
nullities...
Michele
--
{$_=pack'B8'x25,unpack'A8'x32,$a^=sub{pop^pop}->(map substr
(($a||=join'',map--$|x$_,(unpack'w',unpack'u','G^<R<Y]*YB='
.'KYU;*EVH[.FHF2W+#"\Z*5TI/ER<Z`S(G.DZZ9OX0Z')=~/./g)x2,$_,
256),7,249);s/[^\w,]/ /g;$ \=/^J/?$/:"\r";print,redo}#JAPH,
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 16:42:12 -0700
From: "Clenna Lumina" <savagebeaste@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6?
Message-Id: <5eb26pF370tvkU1@mid.individual.net>
Tad McClellan wrote:
> Clenna Lumina <savagebeaste@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > Tad McClellan wrote:
> > > Clenna Lumina <savagebeaste@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > I have
> > > > seen soem regualars reepatedly tell people not to reinvent whats
> > > > already good and working and accepted.
> > >
> > >
> > > Like acceptable spelling.
> > >
> > > If some famous Perl guy would of jsut implemented a
> > > spell-correcting
> ^^^^
> > > 'bot, then things would of been a lot better around here...
> ^^^^^^^^
> >
> > How is this relevant?
>
>
> From when your name was Al MacHonahey:
>
> Message-ID: 56184210.0209031038.3b40a9ef@posting.google.com
Ok, I'll bite. Took a look at that link, and took a look at it's
headers. I fail to see how you could of possibly connected me with that
ID. I only have one ID, and your trollish flame bait is meaningless, so
once again I hope your day job is secure.
> > I speed typed.
>
>
> Yes, that is a characteristic of your posts that helps to
> identify your persona-of-the-day.
>
> (I included 2 of the most common ones in my reply above.)
One of which was your own. Looking up through the thread I only
miss-spelled "soem", tell me how this some how translates into a
"persona-of-the-day" ?
> > I'm sorry if I offended you,
>
>
> No you're not.
That was sarcasm. I was poking fun at your idoicy.
--
CL
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 16:44:17 -0700
From: "Clenna Lumina" <savagebeaste@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6?
Message-Id: <5eb2amF37c510U1@mid.individual.net>
Tad McClellan wrote:
> Clenna Lumina <savagebeaste@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Uri Guttman wrote:
>>>>>>>> "PG" == Purl Gurl <purlgurl@purlgurl.net> writes:
>>>
>>>> surpassed what Perl 6 can provide. Perl 6 is a dinosaur.
>>
>> Why do you like to miss-quote?
>
>
> Because mister quote is out of town?
Apparently mister decency is too.
> --
> Tad McClellan
> email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.noitatibaher\100cmdat/"
I must admit that is a clever way of disclosing one's email without
actually disclosing it.
--
CL
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 16:52:24 -0700
From: "Clenna Lumina" <savagebeaste@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: FAQ 1.6 What is perl6?
Message-Id: <5eb2puF37gqmjU1@mid.individual.net>
Michele Dondi wrote:
> On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 13:14:42 -0700, "Clenna Lumina"
> <savagebeaste@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>> If some famous Perl guy would of jsut implemented a spell-correcting
>>> 'bot, then things would of been a lot better around here...
>>
>> How is this relevant? So I speed typed. I'm sorry if I offended you,
>> your royal majesty.
>
> Funny that you can write as if in a sane state of mind when giving
> names to someone who routinely contributes in a constructive manner to
> the group whereas you seemed not to when you were compelled to "speed
> type" your own "original contribution"... of... er... well... NINE
> lines of text... Also funny to notice you're surprised you offended
> someone -not only your respondent, BTW- given that appearently you
> rate the recipients of what you wrote as not even deserving a
> re-reading of the text you just typed. If your time is *SO* precious,
> then perhaps you may consider not losing it at all with such
> nullities...
......................for the love of perls and heavenly grace, it was a
typo. Not exactly what I would declare a worthy candidate for the
Spanish Inquisition. It happens. "Speed type" doesn't necessary mean I
was trying type 2 million wpm, but rather a simple typographical error.
I was just conveying that I just -may have- pressed keys a wee bit too
quickly and didn't catch it. Had I realized that I would be escorted to
the gallows for such a shallow crime I might of checked a weeeeeee bit
better. Bah.
/me sits back down, kicking the soapbox aside.
--
CL
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2007 09:35:17 +1000
From: "Sisyphus" <sisyphus1@nomail.afraid.org>
Subject: Re: gcc help
Message-Id: <46805119$0$24864$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au>
<rogv24@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1182801260.342589.195890@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
.
.
>
> thanks for the website. After I download gcc what needs to be done?
>
Once you've got gcc installed and working, download the perl source from
http://www.perl.org/ and build according to the instructions in the
'INSTALL' file.
Cheers,
Rob
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2007 00:07:14 GMT
From: Michael Carman <mjcarman@mchsi.com>
Subject: Re: How can I overload the build in array type?
Message-Id: <SMYfi.804$Fc.297@attbi_s21>
On 6/24/2007 9:41 PM, Ilias Lazaridis wrote:
> On Jun 24, 6:14 pm, Michael Carman wrote:
>>
>> you could probably write a source filter
>
> ok, thank you!
>
> I assume the source filter would just replace the "[<construction
> data>]" with "My::Array->new(<construction data>).
>
> Thus a perl "source filter" is something like a "custom preprocessor"
> or "custom macro".
Yep.
> No problem, I could use such a construct (if no other is available).
Nope. We're already invoking the deep magic here.
> Are there any technical(!) negative issues with "source filters" ?
Do you mean aside from confusing the hell out of anyone trying to maintain your
code? By using a source filter you're writing in your own dialect of Perl.
You're using a preprocessor in a language where most other programmers think
that none exists. They will be *completely* unprepared for encountering such
code. It will make maintenance more difficult/costly.
The drawbacks are probably worth it if you're extending the language in order to
create a better way to express your algorithm. For example, the Switch module
adds "switch" and "case" keywords to enable a different paradigm for flow control.
What you're talking about doing isn't extending the language, it's changing it.
Even experienced programmers won't expect "$x = []" to do anything other than
assign a standard anonymous array reference to $x. Source filters like that make
an amusing exercise (for an extreme example see Lingua::Romana::Perligata) but I
don't recommend using them in production code.
-mjc
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 18:05:11 -0500
From: Tad McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Subject: Re: strings with formatted characters in %ARGV
Message-Id: <slrnf80ih7.r4s.tadmc@tadmc30.sbcglobal.net>
mfrost8@gmail.com <mfrost8@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jun 25, 2:51 pm, mfro...@gmail.com wrote:
> Whoops. I meant to say that I'd tried
>
> my $foo = $ARGV[0];
> eval { $foo =~ s/(\\n)/$1/eeg };
> print $foo;
>
> and that didn't yield anything different.
Let's analyse how that happened.
The first 'e' has this code to evaluate:
$1
so it replaces the variable name with the variable's value, leaving
this for the second 'e' to evaluate:
\n
That is a bareword string, it evaluates to itself.
Then the outer eval sees a 3 (the return value from s/// is the
number of substitutions it did), and so is useless here.
--
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.noitatibaher\100cmdat/"
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 17:56:22 -0500
From: Tad McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Subject: Re: strings with formatted characters in %ARGV
Message-Id: <slrnf80i0m.r4s.tadmc@tadmc30.sbcglobal.net>
mfrost8@gmail.com <mfrost8@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jun 25, 12:50 pm, "Jürgen Exner" <jurge...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> mfro...@gmail.com wrote:
>> > I'm trying to pass one or more formatted (i.e. with '\n' in it)
>> > strings to a perl program and have them print with the formatting.
>>
>> '\n' has nothing to do with formatting. It is a representation of a
>> character, that otherwise could not by typed.
>>
>> > Now if I run the program as follows:
>> > $ ./x.pl "FOO\n\n\n"
>>
>> > I get
>> > FOO\n\n\n$
>>
>> > which I don't understand. If I set a scalar string within the program
>> > similarly:
>> > my $foo = "FOO\n\n\n";
>> > print $foo;
>>
>> > I get what I'd expect.
>>
>> > What am I missing here?
A fundamental tenant of computer science, namely the difference
between what is "code" and what is "data".
"code" and "data" are treated differently.
Perl source is "code" while command line arguments are "data".
>> > special characters when used from the command line?
Because those 2 characters are NOT special in "data".
>> You are confusing program text and data.
Oh. Jürgen has already pointed out what you are missing here. :-)
> I would have thought that
> representations of special characters like '\n' would be treated
> differently.
If they are in "data", then they are not "special".
> My assumption here would be that when running using a function like
> print that kind of assumes it's working with strings
print 10;
no string there (until perl makes it into one).
> that it would
> interpret that 2-character sequence when it was invoked.
Interpreting backslash escapes such as \n is not related to
print, or any other, function.
Interpreting backslash escapes is related to double quoted
strings in "code".
> So then this means that I have to parse out all the 2-character
> sequences myself and replace them?
Yes.
> I read the FAQ entry that the
> previous poster sent and it seemed to use a regex to do substitutions
> on the string which then replaced the same string with itself. I
> didn't have much success bending that FAQ to do my bidding. I tried a
> few things, but the last thing I tried was simply
>
> my $foo = $ARGV[0];
> $foo =~ s/(\\n)/$1/g;
> print $foo;
>
> Which didn't seem to change anything.
It changed it to be what it already was.
> What do I need to do to make this work the way I expect it to?
$foo =~ s/\\n/\n/g;
--
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.noitatibaher\100cmdat/"
------------------------------
Date: 6 Apr 2001 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
From: Perl-Users-Request@ruby.oce.orst.edu (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01)
Message-Id: <null>
Administrivia:
#The Perl-Users Digest is a retransmission of the USENET newsgroup
#comp.lang.perl.misc. For subscription or unsubscription requests, send
#the single line:
#
# subscribe perl-users
#or:
# unsubscribe perl-users
#
#to almanac@ruby.oce.orst.edu.
NOTE: due to the current flood of worm email banging on ruby, the smtp
server on ruby has been shut off until further notice.
To submit articles to comp.lang.perl.announce, send your article to
clpa@perl.com.
#To request back copies (available for a week or so), send your request
#to almanac@ruby.oce.orst.edu with the command "send perl-users x.y",
#where x is the volume number and y is the issue number.
#For other requests pertaining to the digest, send mail to
#perl-users-request@ruby.oce.orst.edu. Do not waste your time or mine
#sending perl questions to the -request address, I don't have time to
#answer them even if I did know the answer.
------------------------------
End of Perl-Users Digest V11 Issue 577
**************************************
