[12630] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 39 Volume: 9
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Wed Jul 7 03:47:22 1999
Date: Wed, 7 Jul 1999 00:37:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Wed, 7 Jul 1999 Volume: 9 Number: 39
Today's topics:
OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL? <perfecto@mail2.nai.net>
Re: OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL? (Andrew Allen)
Re: OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL? (Abigail)
Re: OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL? (Andrew Allen)
Re: OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL? (Abigail)
Re: OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL? <uri@sysarch.com>
Re: OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL? <perfecto@mail2.nai.net>
Re: OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL? <jll@skynet.be>
Obvious cookie problem? <thurley@globalnet.co.uk>
Re: Obvious cookie problem? (Abigail)
Re: Obvious cookie problem? (elephant)
Re: Obvious cookie problem? (Abigail)
Re: Obvious cookie problem? <swiftkid@bigfoot.com>
odbc access slmlambert@my-deja.com
odbc access slmlambert@my-deja.com
Re: odbc access (elephant)
Re: oh oh! Try this (Ronald J Kimball)
open() leaks file descriptors? (fwd) <david@coppit.org>
Re: open() leaks file descriptors? (fwd) (Abigail)
Re: open() leaks file descriptors? (fwd) (Bart Lateur)
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 1 Jul 99) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 03 Jul 1999 13:32:41 GMT
From: J Perry Fecteau <perfecto@mail2.nai.net>
Subject: OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL?
Message-Id: <377E1149.48D9AFB5@mail2.nai.net>
i read how it's not advised to have a deep inheritence tree but i'm if
there are any numbers indicating how deep you can go without
significantly hurting performance. also how many instantiated objects
at a time can perl realistically handle. right now i have a very
shallow and broad object model with alot of containment and that seems
to be okay but i like to object orient as much as possible. is this
okay in perl?
--
J Perry Fecteau, 5-time Mr. Internet.
http://w3.nai.net/~perfecto
Star Wars Review at:
http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Node/7160/episodeone.html
------------------------------
Date: 3 Jul 1999 18:52:31 GMT
From: ada@fc.hp.com (Andrew Allen)
Subject: Re: OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL?
Message-Id: <7llm5f$a41$4@fcnews.fc.hp.com>
J Perry Fecteau (perfecto@mail2.nai.net) wrote:
: i read how it's not advised to have a deep inheritence tree but i'm if
: there are any numbers indicating how deep you can go without
: significantly hurting performance. also how many instantiated objects
: at a time can perl realistically handle. right now i have a very
: shallow and broad object model with alot of containment and that seems
: to be okay but i like to object orient as much as possible. is this
: okay in perl?
It looks like you can have 101 levels:
sub p1::bob {print "hi";};
foreach(1..102){@{"p${\($_+1)}::ISA"}="p$_";}
(bless +{},"p102")->bob();
gives the error:
Recursive inheritance detected while looking for method 'bob' in package 'p1' at - line 3.
Recursive inheritance detected while looking for method 'DESTROY' in package 'p1'.
and perldiag says:
Recursive inheritance detected in package '%s'
(F) More than 100 levels of inheritance were used. Probably
indicates an unintended loop in your inheritance hierarchy.
Recursive inheritance detected while looking for method '%s' in package
(F) More than 100 levels of inheritance were encountered while
invoking a method. Probably indicates an unintended loop in your
inheritance hierarchy.
Andrew
------------------------------
Date: 3 Jul 1999 16:45:58 -0500
From: abigail@delanet.com (Abigail)
Subject: Re: OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL?
Message-Id: <slrn7nt143.31h.abigail@alexandra.delanet.com>
J Perry Fecteau (perfecto@mail2.nai.net) wrote on MMCXXXII September
MCMXCIII in <URL:news:377E1149.48D9AFB5@mail2.nai.net>:
;; i read how it's not advised to have a deep inheritence tree but i'm if
;; there are any numbers indicating how deep you can go without
;; significantly hurting performance.
I'd say about 2.5 metres. What is "significantly hurting performance"
anyway? And I bet I can have bad performance on a dual processor Pentium
where a Starfire doesn't.
;; also how many instantiated objects
;; at a time can perl realistically handle. right now i have a very
;; shallow and broad object model with alot of containment and that seems
;; to be okay but i like to object orient as much as possible. is this
;; okay in perl?
No. I seriously suggest to pick another language if you are serious
about object oriented programming. While there's a lot wrong with
Java, I'd pick it over Perl any time if it comes to OO.
Abigail
--
perl5.004 -wMMath::BigInt -e'$^V=Math::BigInt->new(qq]$^F$^W783$[$%9889$^F47]
.qq]$|88768$^W596577669$%$^W5$^F3364$[$^W$^F$|838747$[8889739$%$|$^F673$%$^W]
.qq]98$^F76777$=56]);$^U=substr($]=>$|=>5)*(q.25..($^W=@^V))=>do{print+chr$^V
%$^U;$^V/=$^U}while$^V!=$^W'
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------------------------------
Date: 3 Jul 1999 22:14:19 GMT
From: ada@fc.hp.com (Andrew Allen)
Subject: Re: OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL?
Message-Id: <7lm1vr$e9m$1@fcnews.fc.hp.com>
Abigail (abigail@delanet.com) wrote:
: J Perry Fecteau (perfecto@mail2.nai.net) wrote on MMCXXXII September
: MCMXCIII in <URL:news:377E1149.48D9AFB5@mail2.nai.net>:
: ;; also how many instantiated objects
: ;; at a time can perl realistically handle. right now i have a very
: ;; shallow and broad object model with alot of containment and that seems
: ;; to be okay but i like to object orient as much as possible. is this
: ;; okay in perl?
: No. I seriously suggest to pick another language if you are serious
: about object oriented programming. While there's a lot wrong with
: Java, I'd pick it over Perl any time if it comes to OO.
Why? While I wouldn't want to _learn_ OO in Perl (not nearly enough
B&D for a beginner ;) the language seems perfectly capable for
_implementing_ OO.
Andrew
------------------------------
Date: 3 Jul 1999 18:22:08 -0500
From: abigail@delanet.com (Abigail)
Subject: Re: OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL?
Message-Id: <slrn7nt6oe.31h.abigail@alexandra.delanet.com>
Andrew Allen (ada@fc.hp.com) wrote on MMCXXXII September MCMXCIII in
<URL:news:7lm1vr$e9m$1@fcnews.fc.hp.com>:
??
?? Why? While I wouldn't want to _learn_ OO in Perl (not nearly enough
?? B&D for a beginner ;) the language seems perfectly capable for
?? _implementing_ OO.
*boggle*
Perhaps. If you are into excessive punctuation and lack of implementation
hiding.
Abigail
--
perl -wlpe '}{$_=$.' file # Count the number of lines.
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------------------------------
Date: 03 Jul 1999 21:35:02 -0400
From: Uri Guttman <uri@sysarch.com>
Subject: Re: OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL?
Message-Id: <x7iu81yz7d.fsf@home.sysarch.com>
>>>>> "A" == Abigail <abigail@delanet.com> writes:
A> Andrew Allen (ada@fc.hp.com) wrote on MMCXXXII September MCMXCIII in
A> <URL:news:7lm1vr$e9m$1@fcnews.fc.hp.com>:
A> ??
A> ?? Why? While I wouldn't want to _learn_ OO in Perl (not nearly enough
A> ?? B&D for a beginner ;) the language seems perfectly capable for
A> ?? _implementing_ OO.
A> *boggle*
i figured you liked word games.
A> Perhaps. If you are into excessive punctuation and lack of implementation
A> hiding.
you should read object oriented perl by damian conway, published by
manning. oh, it isn't out yet but it is due later this summer, hopefully
before monterey. it has all the implementation hiding you want. even
tighter than others in some ways. it's a very good book.
uri
--
Uri Guttman ----------------- SYStems ARCHitecture and Software Engineering
uri@sysarch.com --------------------------- Perl, Internet, UNIX Consulting
Have Perl, Will Travel ----------------------------- http://www.sysarch.com
The Best Search Engine on the Net ------------- http://www.northernlight.com
"F**king Windows 98", said the general in South Park before shooting Bill.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 04 Jul 1999 15:29:43 GMT
From: J Perry Fecteau <perfecto@mail2.nai.net>
Subject: Re: OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL?
Message-Id: <377F7E37.92C77FCA@mail2.nai.net>
Andrew Allen wrote:
> Why? While I wouldn't want to _learn_ OO in Perl (not nearly enough
> B&D for a beginner ;) the language seems perfectly capable for
> _implementing_ OO.
i learned oo in c++ and delphi. it does seem to do pretty well at it
except for privacy. i was just wondering because i read advice saying
not to go too deep.
--
J Perry Fecteau, 5-time Mr. Internet.
http://w3.nai.net/~perfecto
Star Wars Review at:
http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Node/7160/episodeone.html
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 04 Jul 1999 22:02:35 +0200
From: Jean-Louis Leroy <jll@skynet.be>
Subject: Re: OBJECT THRESHOLD OF PERL?
Message-Id: <VA.000003ae.00880891@enterprise>
In article <377F7E37.92C77FCA@mail2.nai.net>, J Perry Fecteau wrote:
> i learned oo in c++ and delphi. it does seem to do pretty well at it
> except for privacy.
Privacy-enforcing features are overplayed IMO. Nothing stops you from hacking
the header and making a private member public or adding a friend declaration.
But you avoid it as much as possible if you're a clean sort of programmer. But
then comments plus coding conventions will do the job as well.
Jean-Louis Leroy
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/jl_leroy/
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 5 Jul 1999 22:13:13 +0100
From: "Thurley" <thurley@globalnet.co.uk>
Subject: Obvious cookie problem?
Message-Id: <7lr781$b5$1@gxsn.com>
This will probably seem like a stupid question to most of you, but if I call
a CGI script from a web page using, for example, <img
src=whatever.cgi?jdslafjds>, and then try to output cookies in the header
(using the CGI module), will they work.
It seems to me that they wouldn't, as the actual header for the page has
already been read, but I'm hoping that they will. If they don't, is there
any way to do this without SSI?
Thanks,
James.
------------------------------
Date: 5 Jul 1999 18:21:20 -0500
From: abigail@delanet.com (Abigail)
Subject: Re: Obvious cookie problem?
Message-Id: <slrn7o2fer.h6v.abigail@alexandra.delanet.com>
Thurley (thurley@globalnet.co.uk) wrote on MMCXXXIV September MCMXCIII in
<URL:news:7lr781$b5$1@gxsn.com>:
// This will probably seem like a stupid question to most of you, but if I call
// a CGI script from a web page using, for example, <img
// src=whatever.cgi?jdslafjds>, and then try to output cookies in the header
// (using the CGI module), will they work.
Yes, they might. Of course any conforming browser might have already
barfed on seeing the IMG tag.
// It seems to me that they wouldn't, as the actual header for the page has
// already been read, but I'm hoping that they will. If they don't, is there
// any way to do this without SSI?
Please get a clue on how HTTP works. But not in this group.
Followups set.
Abigail
--
perl5.004 -wMMath::BigInt -e'$^V=Math::BigInt->new(qq]$^F$^W783$[$%9889$^F47]
.qq]$|88768$^W596577669$%$^W5$^F3364$[$^W$^F$|838747$[8889739$%$|$^F673$%$^W]
.qq]98$^F76777$=56]);$^U=substr($]=>$|=>5)*(q.25..($^W=@^V))=>do{print+chr$^V
%$^U;$^V/=$^U}while$^V!=$^W'
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 09:15:51 +1000
From: e-lephant@b-igpond.com (elephant)
Subject: Re: Obvious cookie problem?
Message-Id: <MPG.11ebe7b2a1f958f1989afd@news-server>
Thurley writes ..
>It seems to me that they wouldn't, as the actual header for the page has
>already been read, but I'm hoping that they will. If they don't, is there
>any way to do this without SSI?
you are correct .. it will not work because the headers have already been
passed to the browser
two choices (as I see it)
1) code up the entire page as a perl script and send the headers with
your cookie (NB: you can read it all in from the HTML file and just
output it with the appropriate headers and whatever change to the image
that you want)
2) you can rely on client side scripting to be executed in the onload
method of the BODY tag of the document to set the cookie .. but in this
example you will have to output the BODY tag anyway .. so you're halfway
along the path of '1' .. so do it
--
jason - remove all hyphens for email reply -
------------------------------
Date: 5 Jul 1999 18:46:17 -0500
From: abigail@delanet.com (Abigail)
Subject: Re: Obvious cookie problem?
Message-Id: <slrn7o2gtl.h6v.abigail@alexandra.delanet.com>
elephant (e-lephant@b-igpond.com) wrote on MMCXXXIV September MCMXCIII in
<URL:news:MPG.11ebe7b2a1f958f1989afd@news-server>:
^^ Thurley writes ..
^^ >It seems to me that they wouldn't, as the actual header for the page has
^^ >already been read, but I'm hoping that they will. If they don't, is there
^^ >any way to do this without SSI?
^^
^^ you are correct .. it will not work because the headers have already been
^^ passed to the browser
Utterly bollocks. Some be an HTTP transaction that doesn't involve headers.
Please get a clue how thing work.
Abigail
--
sub A::TIESCALAR{bless\my$x=>A};package B;@q=qw/Hacker Another
Perl Just/;use overload'""'=>sub{pop @q};sub A::FETCH{bless\my
$y=>B}; tie my $shoe => 'A';print "$shoe $shoe $shoe $shoe\n";
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 11:13:41 +0500
From: "Faisal Nasim" <swiftkid@bigfoot.com>
Subject: Re: Obvious cookie problem?
Message-Id: <7lta3v$coh8@news.cyber.net.pk>
Thurley <thurley@globalnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:7lr781$b5$1@gxsn.com...
> This will probably seem like a stupid question to most of you, but if I
call
> a CGI script from a web page using, for example, <img
> src=whatever.cgi?jdslafjds>, and then try to output cookies in the header
> (using the CGI module), will they work.
> It seems to me that they wouldn't, as the actual header for the page has
> already been read, but I'm hoping that they will. If they don't, is there
> any way to do this without SSI?
You mean setting cookie by <img won't work?
It will work! (new copy of headers are parsed by browser in this case)
And you think that you can set cookie by a SSI include?
It won't! (the header has been sent once! I still am not sure
why don't they push all the 'include' returned headers to top!
Apache support said cookie by 'include' is not possible).
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 11:22:27 GMT
From: slmlambert@my-deja.com
Subject: odbc access
Message-Id: <7lq4hd$hi0$1@nnrp1.deja.com>
Hi,
I am having a little trouble getting my head around ODBC and NT with
perl. What I want to do is to connect to a sybase database using the
ODBC interface. I have been trying the "$db=new Win32::ODBC($DSN)"
method, but I get a little confused - how does one specify a username
and password?
Am I heading in the right direction, or am I going about this the wrong
way. Oh what I would give to get back my old SGI, sniff sniff...
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 11:22:41 GMT
From: slmlambert@my-deja.com
Subject: odbc access
Message-Id: <7lq4hs$hi4$1@nnrp1.deja.com>
Hi,
I am having a little trouble getting my head around ODBC and NT with
perl. What I want to do is to connect to a sybase database using the
ODBC interface. I have been trying the "$db=new Win32::ODBC($DSN)"
method, but I get a little confused - how does one specify a username
and password?
Am I heading in the right direction, or am I going about this the wrong
way. Oh what I would give to get back my old SGI, sniff sniff...
Cheers,
Simon.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 00:16:53 +1000
From: e-lephant@b-igpond.com (elephant)
Subject: Re: odbc access
Message-Id: <MPG.11eb6965d633658f989aec@news-server>
slmlambert@my-deja.com writes ..
>I am having a little trouble getting my head around ODBC and NT with
>perl. What I want to do is to connect to a sybase database using the
>ODBC interface. I have been trying the "$db=new Win32::ODBC($DSN)"
>method, but I get a little confused - how does one specify a username
>and password?
I'd say that your lack of understanding is in how DSNs work (they're a
bit tricky when you first come across them) .. it's a string that
contains optional settings for the database connection .. two of these
options are username and password
your instantiation may look something like this with a username and
password
#--begin
my $db = new Win32::ODBC("dsn=FOO;UID=BAR;PWD=FUBAR");
#--end
you may want to check out http://www.roth.net/perl/odbc/ for more
documentation
--
jason - remove all hyphens for email reply -
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 5 Jul 1999 21:20:11 -0400
From: rjk@linguist.dartmouth.edu (Ronald J Kimball)
Subject: Re: oh oh! Try this
Message-Id: <1duhixj.3gjg1h19uu6lrN@p21.block2.tc2.state.ma.tiac.com>
cabney <cabney@cyberpass.net> wrote:
> Forgive me if this is a FAQ, or a 'feature', but it looks like
> assignments aren't being carried out inside the 'x ? y : z'
> thinger. Is this a bug?
No. This is a precedence issue. RTFM.
perlop (5.005_02):
Conditional Operator
[...]
Because this operator produces an assignable result, using
assignments without parentheses will get you in trouble. For
example, this:
$a % 2 ? $a += 10 : $a += 2
Really means this:
(($a % 2) ? ($a += 10) : $a) += 2
Rather than this:
($a % 2) ? ($a += 10) : ($a += 2)
--
_ / ' _ / - aka -
( /)//)//)(//)/( Ronald J Kimball rjk@linguist.dartmouth.edu
/ http://www.tiac.net/users/chipmunk/
"It's funny 'cause it's true ... and vice versa."
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 3 Jul 1999 14:41:04 -0400
From: David Coppit <david@coppit.org>
Subject: open() leaks file descriptors? (fwd)
Message-Id: <Pine.GSO.4.05.9907031440450.9480-100000@mamba.cs.Virginia.EDU>
If a Perl script open()s a file, and then is killed before it has a chance to
close() the file, it leaks file descriptors, right? See
http://perl.apache.org/guide/porting.html#Memory_leakage
I've heard that using File::IO or FileHandle will fix this problem. Is this
true?
Thanks,
David
_________________________________________________________________________
David Coppit - Graduate Student david@coppit.org
The University of Virginia http://coppit.org/
"Yes," said Piglet, "Rabbit has Brain." There was a long silence.
"I suppose," said Pooh, "that that's why he never understands anything."
------------------------------
Date: 3 Jul 1999 16:47:24 -0500
From: abigail@delanet.com (Abigail)
Subject: Re: open() leaks file descriptors? (fwd)
Message-Id: <slrn7nt16q.31h.abigail@alexandra.delanet.com>
David Coppit (david@coppit.org) wrote on MMCXXXII September MCMXCIII in
<URL:news:Pine.GSO.4.05.9907031440450.9480-100000@mamba.cs.Virginia.EDU>:
() If a Perl script open()s a file, and then is killed before it has a chance to
() close() the file, it leaks file descriptors, right?
That sounds like an OS bug to me.
Abigail
--
%0=map{reverse+chop,$_}ABC,ACB,BAC,BCA,CAB,CBA;$_=shift().AC;1while+s/(\d+)((.)
(.))/($0=$1-1)?"$0$3$0{$2}1$2$0$0{$2}$4":"$3 => $4\n"/xeg;print#Towers of Hanoi
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------------------------------
Date: Sat, 03 Jul 1999 22:09:18 GMT
From: bart.lateur@skynet.be (Bart Lateur)
Subject: Re: open() leaks file descriptors? (fwd)
Message-Id: <377f8719.1467705@news.skynet.be>
David Coppit wrote:
>If a Perl script open()s a file, and then is killed before it has a chance to
>close() the file, it leaks file descriptors, right? See
>
> http://perl.apache.org/guide/porting.html#Memory_leakage
Hmmm... I think you're pointing to the wrong place. This looks more like
it:
http://perl.apache.org/guide/porting.html#Filehandlers_and_locks_leakages
or maybe even
http://perl.apache.org/guide/obvious.html#Handling_the_User_pressed_Stop_
And this page is for mod_perl only. Anyway. As far as I understand the
concept of mod_perl (I could be wrong), mod_perl is pretty much like a
Perl script that keeps running forever, and in which other "CGI" scripts
are compiled and run. That means that open files stay open, unless they
are closed (implicitely or explicitely), global data structures keep
their value, allocated memory stays allocated. Apart from the memory
allocation (perl will NEVER return memory to the OS untill the whole
script quits), all this can be solved by variables going out of scope.
>I've heard that using File::IO or FileHandle will fix this problem. Is
>this true?
According to the second URL I gave, yes. Provided that you use my() on
the scalar holding the filehandle. Reason is that, when the variable is
destroyed, the file is closed anyway.
Bart.
------------------------------
Date: 1 Jul 99 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
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Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 1 Jul 99)
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End of Perl-Users Digest V9 Issue 39
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