[28] in peace2
Re: WTO movement and peace
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (The Macomber Family)
Mon Jan 17 20:29:41 2000
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Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 18:15:19 -0700
From: The Macomber Family <artmacom@micron.net>
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To: James in Cambridge <tompaine@hotmail.com>
Cc: karens@MIT.EDU, jlewey@brandeis.edu, peace2@MIT.EDU
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James, you must be in the Peace2 group.
And, I have a family here, but no industrial group, sorry to say. :-)
-Art
-------
James in Cambridge wrote:
> I'm not sure how I got this email message?
> Can you/anyone explain?
> And btw: Who -- or what -- is the "Macomber" family, anyway?
> Some sort of industrial group?
>
> jw
>
> >From: The Macomber Family <artmacom@micron.net>
> >Reply-To: artmacom@micron.net
> >To: Karen Sachs <karens@MIT.EDU>
> >CC: jennifer lewey <jlewey@brandeis.edu>, peace2@MIT.EDU
> >Subject: Re: WTO movement and peace
> >Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 06:41:14 -0700
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> >From artmacom@micron.net Mon Jan 17 05:47:00 2000
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> >References: <200001141705.MAA27606@m56-129-21.mit.edu>
> >
> >Karen, it is clear that you have no knowledge of economics, but instead of
> >holding
> >that against you, I would like to give you some simple reading. One book
> >you would
> >enjoy is the "Road to Serfdom", by F.A. Hayek and another, I can't remember
> >the
> >author now, is called "The Incredible Bread Machine."
> >
> >Both of these books echo the basics of economics, not from the government's
> >view or
> >some rich, white boy - as you so fondly call us - no matter how "Black or
> >Hispanic
> >or Asian" my true experience may be, but they outline the actual goings-on
> >of folks
> >who are trying to better their own lives. So, they are ground-level texts,
> >easy to
> >read and fun too, regardless of someone's alleged race (as seen from the
> >outside...).
> >
> >It is interesting to me that the people of the less-developed countries
> >(economically speaking, that is...) appear to want to advance economically
> >but
> >don't have the financial wherewithal to jump right in at the level of the
> >average
> >American, i.e., with all the worker protections, OSHA saftey regs, and
> >minimum
> >wages etc that we can afford today. From my limited perspective, it would
> >appear
> >that the protestors in Seattle wanted to stop third world development
> >unless they
> >could force development to happen according to some quite unrealistic and
> >costly
> >methods. I think the bottom line of the protests is that the protestors
> >are
> >saying, "You can't have it unless you do it our way," which is incredibly
> >imperialistic to me. Talk about cultural hegemony!
> >
> >Now, I understand that the traditional Left in America believe that "there
> >is
> >enough money and resources to go around", but there is no simple way to
> >accomplish
> >this allocation unless you do it at the point of a gun, like Mao, who
> >killed
> >millions to get the economic structure just the way he wanted it - and
> >China is
> >still trying to figure out how to remove itself from his visions with some
> >sembalance of "face." Besides, it should be clear by now, unless you
> >missed the
> >past one hundred years, that the peaceful exercise of private property
> >rights is
> >the best way to guarantee rising economic standards of living (and health
> >too!) and
> >when private property is blocked, then living standards go down. I could
> >cite
> >Russia as a start, with their losing ideas of collectivism, or go directly
> >to Cuba,
> >which is still a relative backwater even after decades of subsidies from
> >Russia, or
> >China, North Korea, or many others who frown on private property and
> >liberty for
> >their citizens. Also, for environmental degradation, try Eastern Europe,
> >China,
> >sub-Saharan Africa, or others areas where capitalism has been shunned for
> >more
> >"enlightened" philosophies wherein the government alleges to know the best
> >way to
> >manage natural resources - even tho' they have nothing to lose when they
> >trash the
> >place!!
> >
> >You know, the third world WANTS capitalism, because they see it works.
> >Now, as a
> >codicil, I must say that I am not supporting WTO here, in fact, they are
> >merely a
> >governmental club, just as unionists are, in that they are protectionists
> >of their
> >interests - and want to make that into law, instead of allowing free people
> >to
> >trade freely, they want trade agreements, which end up dictating how, when,
> >where,
> >at what price to trade. In this I agree with you, that they are a club
> >against the
> >little guy.
> >
> >-Art
> >
> >BTW, Sinclair and Zin are both very radical Leftists with a 1930's vision
> >of
> >economic equality, Sinclair having been there and Zin being more a creature
> >of the
> >Sixties, ideologically, that is. If you want to find out economies really
> >work, at
> >the human level, better to read the two books I recommended above, they are
> >more
> >free, but not completely free, of the ideological language and more to the
> >point of
> >what real people do when they get up in the morning to handle their
> >choices.
> >--------------------------------
> >
> >Karen Sachs wrote:
> >
> > > hi jennifer-
> > >
> > > i have no knowledge of economics, but it is clear to me that the problem
> >with
> > > the wto is NOT that it attmepts globalization. it does not. it
> >attempts to
> > > structure world trade in such a way that would best serve huge
> >corporations,
> > > and "best serve" for them translates into no concern for worker's or
> > > childern's rights, no concern for the environment.
> > >
> > > this is why their agreements had to be made behind closed doors.
> > >
> > > i see it as american rich boys saying hey, why shouldn't we hook up not
> >only
> > > with each other, but with all the other rich boys in the world- then
> >we'll
> > > make even more millions.
> > >
> > > thw wto agreements have a "profit first" philosophy (obviously, since
> >it's
> > > structured by people serving these huge corporations), and so they crush
> >human
> > > and environmental rights.
> > >
> > > a different wto that adresses world trade while also addressing
> >humanitary
> > > issues could be a trully wonderful and unifying thing, a true attempt at
> > > globalization.
> > >
> > > out of seattle comes a slightly different (though related) issue- one
> >of
> > > centrallization of power and the regard for citizen's rights in america.
> > at
> > > the meeting last night, the man sitting stage left (whose name i
> >missed),
> > > refering to the "disappearance" of one of the speakers, said something
> >to the
> > > effect of: in another country, this man's disappearance would have been
> >for
> > > good.
> > >
> > > how strongly we hold to the notion of our country being inherently
> >different
> > > from the others! after witnessing unprovoked officers of the law
> >brutillizing
> > > unprotected people, officers who will never be brought to justice,
> >people who
> > > may suffer permanent damage... can we still believe that in our country
> >human
> > > rights are somehow protected?
> > >
> > > if people are arrested and beaten in the jails, and all that interests
> >the
> > > government is the pr, how far away are we from "disappearances"?
> > >
> > > wake up and smell the stench of the government. as long as the masses
> >don't
> > > know, they do what they choose.
> > >
> > > and where's the media in all of this? busy watching a few people break
> > > windows.
> > >
> > > i recently read Upton Sinclair's "The Jungle", describing the horrors of
> > > industrial giants' complete disregard for anything but profit, and the
> > > horrible resulting squalor of the workers' lives. one hundred years
> >later, we
> > > feel that real progress has been made. meanwhile the industrial giants
> >are
> > > there, working hard for a great leap backwards.
> > >
> > > on this optimistic note, i highly recommend to you howard zin's "a
> >people's
> > > history of the US" and "you can't stay neutral on a moving train", also
> >by zin.
> > >
> > > as long as people care and are willing to sacrifice, i believe things
> >can
> > > change in the right direction.
> > >
> > > hats off to the three who came and spoke to us last night, and to all
> >the
> > > thousands who were with them.
> > >
> > > karen
> >
>
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