[118905] in Cypherpunks
Re: Inferno: The Constitution & Gun Rights: It's bigger than
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Sean Roach)
Sun Oct 10 00:14:51 1999
Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19991009225753.00857510@mail.intplsrv.net>
Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 22:57:53 -0500
To: cypherpunks@algebra.com
From: Sean Roach <roach_s@mail.intplsrv.net>
In-Reply-To: <199910100017.TAA12012@einstein.ssz.com>
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Reply-To: Sean Roach <roach_s@mail.intplsrv.net>
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At 07:17 PM 10/9/99 -0500, Jim Choate wrote:
>
>
>I would like to append this email to the original document on my
>webpage. Please send me a email if you object to this since it
>includes your quotes.
I have no problem with this if you feel it useful. I put it to a
public venue, I can't expect to put it back in the bottle, lamp or
ring.
>> However, it is not my place to say that they would have done this
>> had they had the chance.
>
>If you're a citizen of the US not only is it your place it's your
>duty.
>
>> Too many of our regulations are based on this belief that our
>> founding fathers would have seen things "my" way. I hate that
>> the intent of the constitution is ignored so blatently, but
>> judging intent is like proving opinion.
>
>To quote Jefferson:
>
>The earth belonds to the living, not the dead.
let me clarify. The way I see it, a great deal of our problems stem
from various interpretations of the constitution which differ greatly
from what I perceive to be the original intent. Assumptions and
interpretations which I do not always agree with, (nor do I always
disagree with either. Public schools and the constitution covering
the states for two. I don't remember public schools being mentioned,
and states weren't covered by the limits until sometime in the 1800's
as I recall.) I, as one who recognizes my limitations with respect
to history and government, do not feel that I am qualified to make
those decisions. Which makes me for one, glad that I don't hold any
office or beaurocratic position. I have no problem stating my
opinions and beliefs, when qualified as such, but don't feel that
what I say should be taken as fact unless I have those facts to
support it.
>> I'd like to see something more like the swiss have. Everyone gets
>> basic. Perhaps as part of grades 11-12. Some few can stay on in
>> administrative roles throughout. And rely entirely on the draft,
>> but only for threats on home ground.
>
>I don't believe in the draft, it is coersion and is contrary to the
>tenets of the Constitution. An army made of people who don't *want*
>to fight for their country will lose. An army of peoples who will
>die rather than surrender their liberty will always win, even if
>they are all killed they deny the oppressor their goals.
>
>One does not give up democracy to protect democracy.
I should have been more clear here too. I feel that if you gave 20
guys guns, where all had wives and children, most had real-estate, or
at least a little bit invested in something that they could liquidate
later, then at least 19 of them would stand up, on some level, to
fight an invading enemy. This assumes that all 20 guys felt that
they, or their children, would be more free in the existing country
as opposed to that which would be implemented by the invaders. I
also feel that, without training or organization, 18 of those 20
would die quickly, 1 would hide out or turn to save his own skin, and
1 would learn how best to fight. Although I said draft, I did not
mean a manditory conscription. What I meant, although I don't have
the proper word to describe it, was a call to arms under a common
banner with that logistics support, and tactical planning that a
formal military would be better able to provide. I have read that
geurilla warefare can not by itself win wars. That, to me, means
that the surviving 5% of an unorganized resistance, would not
succeed, but that 95% percent of a male population, fighting for
their homes and family, under experts with training in tactics would.
I love my country. I disagree with its leaders more often than not,
but I still love what it remains, what it was, and what it
represents. Would I stand up to fight for my homeland? I have been
fortunate enough never to have had to find out, and I hope that I
never do. But if I had to, I'd rather do so under someone who knew
how to keep most of his, or her, soldiers alive and still win the
day.
Sean Roach
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