[9337] in Commercialization & Privatization of the Internet
Re: Cost vs benefit of internet services
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Matthew Kaufman)
Wed Dec 29 17:23:10 1993
Date: Wed, 29 Dec 1993 14:12:04 -0800
From: matthew@echo.com (Matthew Kaufman)
To: com-priv@uu.psi.com, smd@fish.com
> re From: Sean Doran <smd@fish.com>
> In msg <199312292029.MAA16172@echo.com> Matthew Kaufman writes:
>
>
> | And then find that since you want AUP-free routing, your little
> | effort has to join the CIX, so you're out another $10,000 / year.
> | Oops. Ran out of money.
>
> For a cooperative of ten people that's only $84/month each. Hardly
> earth-shatteringly expensive.
>
It is if you're trying to do 14.4kbps SLIP/PPP connections for $70/month,
which is about what dividing the cost of the phone lines and
line to an IP provider and charges from that IP provider 10 ways.
The EXTRA $84/month, which isn't in fact mandated by any REAL
CIX agreement paperwork, but is enforced by tacit agreement among
all CIX members, makes that $70/month jump to $154/month.
> | Wouldn't it be nice if there weren't such artifically-constructed
> | barriers to entry to IP resale, so that you really COULD get
> | together with your small number of friends and get a line and
> | share it?
>
> Firstly, there is nothing stopping you from setting up a small
> organization with a small network of machines which is connected
> via a network service provider. I doubt there is a network service
> provider out there who would bat an eyelid about who and what used
> those machines, provided that the traffic travelling up and down
> the pipe was originated on or destined to a machine owned by that
> organization.
>
> The "artificial barrier to entry" shot is not only cheap, it's
> meaningless. The biggest expense involved in providing IP service of
> any kind is generally technical support, and this is especially true
> when new customers buy bandwidth for the first time, and customers
> who resell connectivity.
>
> Before spouting on about what you think IP services should cost,
> try being (or working for) a network service provider for a while.
> You may find some of your attitudes changed by the experience.
>
Actually, I _AM_ a network service provider. Thanks.
I find the unwritten policies of the CIX, and the cost/benefit
ratio of being a CIX member, to be quite offensive.
I would be much LESS offended if the actual CIX agreement
just came out and said that you couldn't provide resellers
who aren't CIX members with CIX routing, when in fact it
says just the opposite:
(from the CIX agreement, paragraph 9)
9. Members shall cooperate and coordinate their
activities to facilitate the broadest practical opportunity for
interconnectivity among the direct customers of each Member and
participating OSPNSP's. A Member shall not in a discriminatory manner (as
between other Members) or without reasonable justification decline to offer
CIX interconnectivity to its direct customers. Provided, however, that
notwithstanding any of the foregoing, any Member shall be able to offer
virtual private networks, to administer traffic and/or access restrictions
for particular networks where requested or if required to provide special
services, to offer other special services subject to specified limitations,
to enter into separate interconnectivity agreements with other Members, to
allow interconnectivity between indirect customers through CIX or other
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
networks, and otherwise to comply with requests from customers or users for
restrictions or limitations on the receipt, routing or delivery of
messages.
All the agreement says is that you MUST NOT decline to offer CIX
interconnectivity to direct customers. It doesn't say that you
MUST decline to offer CIX interconnectivity to indirect (subsidiary)
customers... it says you CAN do that if you want to.
But if you ask Bill Washburn, you'll get a different answer.
Something along the lines of him not knowing the actual legal
aspects of the agreement, but how no, members can't just let
subsidiary network providers get CIX access for free.
I would ALSO be much less offended if the CIX, and other network
service providers, acknowledged that there is a place for
SMALL IP resale operations. Mom & Pop network providers, which
are the only practical way to really spread IP connectivity to
everywhere anyway.
-matthew kaufman
