[173145] in North American Network Operators' Group
Re: Inevitable death, was Re: Verizon Public Policy on Netflix
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Jared Mauch)
Thu Jul 17 08:18:47 2014
X-Original-To: nanog@nanog.org
From: Jared Mauch <jared@puck.nether.net>
In-Reply-To: <37C5AE02-85A7-4DDC-ABF6-A7C3ABC5B780@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2014 08:19:09 -0400
To: George Herbert <george.herbert@gmail.com>
Cc: "nanog@nanog.org" <nanog@nanog.org>
Errors-To: nanog-bounces@nanog.org
On Jul 15, 2014, at 9:48 PM, George Herbert <george.herbert@gmail.com> =
wrote:
>> On Jul 15, 2014, at 5:02 PM, Brett Glass <nanog@brettglass.com> =
wrote:
>>=20
>> At 05:10 PM 7/15/2014, George Herbert wrote:
>>=20
>>> Layer3 runs right through Laramie. With a redundant run slightly =
south. What conversations have you had with them?...
>>=20
>> At first, Level3 completely refused us. Then, they quoted us a rate =
several times higher than either of our existing upstreams for =
bandwidth. Even at that price, they refused to let us link to them via =
wireless (requiring us to either buy easements or buy land adjacent to =
their building, which sits on rented land).
>=20
> Local fiber provider? How does everyone else tie in to Layer3 in =
Laramie?
>=20
> And, find a Layer3 reseller who can handle the cost problem. There =
are a bunch. I can recommend one privately if you can't find one.
>=20
> Buying retail markups from the vendor who wants to sell wholesale only =
does not scale.
The problem is partly a technological one. If you have a fiber span =
from east<-> west it doesn't make sense to OEO when you can just plop in =
a bidi amplifier. That OEO cost isn't "very high", but hitting every =
city like that becomes expensive quickly. This is why your 10G from =
EQUINIX-SJ to EQUNIX-ASH costs the same as the 10G loop from the DC to =
your local office. The cost is the OEO ends. If you're not in a fiber =
rich environment you are screwed. I have at&t fiber less than 1200 feet =
from me but they do not offer any non-dialtone services in my area. I'm =
all-poles to the end of the new comcast segment as well but due to a =
mid-part that doesn't have the density required to meet their metrics =
there continue to be only fixed wireless choices here.
Others have suggested the UBNT gear. I'm using it myself, but I'll =
say.. it still leaves a lot to be desired. It's mostly meant for use in =
less developed countries. Their latest 5Ghz access gear often takes =
6-12 months to get FCC certified to operate in the full 5ghz band. With =
the recent opening all the way down to 5.1 this spring with the FCC that =
certification process restarted. They are great for hopping short =
distances at high speeds in the US, but are very susceptible to =
interference. (The NanoBeam, now PowerBeam is a bit better).
my backhaul is 3 miles and works well for my use case. Cheaper than the =
T1 before and higher speeds. There's a lot of people in wispa around =
the edges you can find doing things, and many others doing it that =
aren't in wispa. Most are small businesses (Some are larger) and suffer =
from poor business choices, but the biggest problem I see is lack of =
ability to get high speed access as Brett is commenting. Prices may be =
low at the major DCs but out in these areas expect $10/Mb or more, =
sometimes not including loop.
- Jared=
