[170207] in North American Network Operators' Group
RE: arin representation
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Naslund, Steve)
Mon Mar 24 23:26:50 2014
From: "Naslund, Steve" <SNaslund@medline.com>
To: John Curran <jcurran@arin.net>, Randy Bush <randy@psg.com>
Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2014 03:19:56 +0000
In-Reply-To: <0F69D091-BE68-4A69-8BD5-7E295F0AC27A@arin.net>
Cc: North American Network Operators' Group <nanog@nanog.org>
Errors-To: nanog-bounces+nanog.discuss=bloom-picayune.mit.edu@nanog.org
Randy,
I am not sure I understand the argument here. If you think that ARIN is no=
t representing the address space holders in proper fashion, how would we su=
ggest correcting that? If an address holder does not become a member (whic=
h is fairly easy to do if you care enough) how would we even know what thei=
r concerns or feelings are? It is like any electoral process, if you choos=
e not to represent yourself it is hard to complain about the outcomes. ARI=
N does work under a contract so I would assume if there were serious concer=
ns about their structure or conduct, there is some oversight being conducte=
d. =20
My earlier comments regarding legacy space holders and the number of addres=
s space holders goes to the heart of using those stats to make your asserti=
on. First of all, the number of /24s is not proportional to the total numb=
er of members Whether I hold 50 or 1000 /24s, I am still one member. I wo=
uld assumes that holders of large amounts of space (like service providers)=
are more likely to be members than the entity that holds one smaller alloc=
ation for their business purposes.
Given that the US Gov't holds a vast amount of the legacy space skews the r=
esults a lot. They might or might not be a "member" but they certainly hol=
d a lot of influence in ARINs operation as the one who controls the contrac=
t. If ARIN was to cross them the wrong way, they might not be holding that=
contract very long.
The reality of the Internet is that much of the policy and standard making =
comes from a small very technical minority of its users like us. Most user=
s of the Internet could care less about numbering policy and RFCs because t=
hey don't feel the impact of it, they just use and enjoy the technology. T=
hey just don't care about the wizards behind the curtain. Issues that look=
important inside our fishbowl do not mean much to the outside world. Just=
ask every person that uses an IP address where they came from an see how m=
any know or care.
If the general public was to feel much pain in the process they might ask m=
ore questions but it seems that in general they are sufficiently happy not =
to worry about the details. As a service provider I was more concerned wit=
h ARIN policy than I am now as a commercial entity holding a couple of bloc=
ks. When I was a provider I cared about allocation and process more becaus=
e I had a continuous need for more space for growth. Back then ARIN was ne=
w and the process changes were very fluid and hard to keep up with. As a c=
ommercial entity with enough space for the future and no major expansion pl=
ans I am less concerned about ARIN policy short of them trying to pull back=
my space (which they seem to be doing everything possible to avoid).
John may be too polite to say so but I think asking him for information pub=
licly on NANOG (which he very promptly responded to) and then publicly slam=
ming ARINs process does not seem very fair to me. ARIN has a process for h=
aving views like this to be heard and a process for taking the helm (or at =
least some of it) if you think enough people agree. If John cares enough t=
o monitor and respond to the community here on NANOG, I find it hard to bel=
ieve that they don't care about our concerns.
Steven Naslund
Chicago IL
