[6883] in APO Printshop
Re: training question
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Leonard H Tower Jr.)
Thu Sep 24 19:29:14 2015
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2015 19:29:10 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Leonard H Tower Jr." <tower@alum.mit.edu>
To: Ellen Kranzer <ccrazy@panix.com>
cc: Benazeer Noorani <benazeer@gmail.com>,
"apo-president@mit.edu" <apo-president@mit.edu>,
"apo-printshop-journeyman@mit.edu" <apo-printshop-journeyman@mit.edu>
In-Reply-To: <C365629E-B739-4775-9D92-37039E1BCD52@panix.com>
Ellen convinced me.
Let's open the shop again billing all jobs.
Any objections?
---
except maybe:
Some journeymen just have a trainee set their name centered, and run
it on scrap stock. Billing a trainee here for the Press Use Fees
involved seems counter-productive. OK to have the shop cover this
kind of Press Use Fee?
---
We discussed & made this change a half decade or so ago.
An active suggested it. The rationale was that it might encourage
more pledges/actives to train & qual.
---
I prefer a trainee print a simple useful job for themselves.
yiLFS -len
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2015 18:56:33 -0400
From: Ellen Kranzer <ccrazy@panix.com>
To: Leonard H Tower Jr. <tower@alum.mit.edu>
Cc: Benazeer Noorani <benazeer@gmail.com>,
"apo-president@mit.edu" <apo-president@mit.edu>,
"apo-printshop-journeyman@mit.edu" <apo-printshop-journeyman@mit.edu>
Subject: Re: training question
I pretty much agree with most of what Lem said here, other than the part about billing people when they do a personal job as a training or qualifying run. I'm pretty sure one of mine was a job for myself and I got to write up my own bill and was reminded that I couldn't take the job out of the shop until I had paid.
I actually think it is a bad idea not to charge someone. If they don't get charged then they don't learn how to write up an invoice. That is definitely an area where doing is better than having it explained to you for remembering the procedure
-- Ellen
Sent from my iPod
> On Sep 24, 2015, at 4:03 PM, Leonard H Tower Jr. <tower@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
>
> [I Cc:ed the apo-president mailing list as Maggie asked the question.]
>
> Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2015 13:43:10 -0400
> From: Benazeer Noorani <benazeer@gmail.com>
>
> Hi all,
>
> Maggie (the current chapter president) just asked me if it is possible to
> train two people on the press at the same time. I've never heard of such a
> thing, and my instinct is to say no, because so much of the learning is
> hands-on, and there's little space and, obviously, only one press. However,
> I thought I'd ask you folks if there's any precedence for this?
>
> YiS
>
> Benazeer
>
> I welcome other feedback on this.
>
> This is one of those ideas, that seem like a good idea, but didn't
> work out. (At his suggestion, Mitch and I tried this as an experiment
> in the past.) I don't recommend repeating it:
>
> * Benazeer points all turned out valid in practice.
>
> * We found when some of them went on to be qualified, that they all
> had learned significantly less during the training run, including
> safety of people, and taking care of the equipment. Enough less
> that we almost didn't qualify them, and was on-hand for their first
> few runs as new press-ops.
>
> The focus brought on just one trainee is important to each trainee
> becoming trained & qualified to use the shop safely, etc.
>
> * The entire training run takes longer, as both trainees have to do
> each of the hands on parts separately. (One press, one lock-up
> table, etc.) Which consume more of each active's time. (Yes,
> doing it one trainee at a time mean more journeyman time, which has
> been worth it to me to increase safe use of the shop.)
>
> * The shop is crowded with just two people in it. Even more so
> when two trainees are typesetting two different jobs.
>
> Also, Benazeer & Keshlam are just starting out as journeymen doing
> training runs, and it seems wise to me to not have them training more
> than one person at a time.
>
> I don't see any reason why they can't teach training runs together,
> though I don't remember this being done in the past. (Yes, we have
> had new journeymen observe training runs in the past-a good idea.) I
> look forward to feedback on how two-teacher training runs work out.)
>
> I also recommend that:
>
> * new press ops print in teams. This has worked out well in the
> past.
>
> * a journeyman try to be present for the first few runs, until the
> new press ops have gained experience. I've done this often over
> the years. Definitely for the two decades (not contiguous) I was
> lead journeyman. I distributed type, and sometimes read (and in
> recent decades: email and Internet).
>
> I found it best to hot "hover" over the new press-op, and wait for
> them to ask a question.
>
> I note that some trainees/qualifiers have done business or calling
> cards for themselves. We have in the past not charged them for stock
> or press use fees for either a training or qualifying run.
>
> yiLFS -len
>
