[98430] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Multiple verb suffixes
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Felix Malmenbeck)
Tue Apr 15 19:28:38 2014
From: Felix Malmenbeck <felixm@kth.se>
To: "Bellerophon, modeler" <bellerophon.modeler@gmail.com>,
"tlhingan-hol@kli.org" <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2014 23:27:07 +0000
In-Reply-To: <CABSTb1ffdwCg+qvyzQm9sxzyyFHDmjNvk2Rr431dOvjtDsyYQw@mail.gmail.com>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@kli.org
{DaH jIbwIj vISay'nISmoH.} is one good example. Two others come from a News=
group posting:
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Since -moH is a
Type 4 suffix, if a suffix of Type 1, 2, or 3 is to be used (such as -chuq
"each other" [Type 1] or
-nIS "need" [Type 2]), it would precede the Type 4 -moH; for example,
pujchuqmoH "they weaken each other" or pujnISmoH "he/she needs to weaken
[somebody]."
[...]
Thus, finally and at long last, to answer your first
specific question, say vIchennISmoH for "I need to create
it."
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
For a more full discussion:
http://klingonska.org/canon/search/?file=3D1998-02-23-news.txt&get=3Dsource
It's worth noting that TKD 4.2.2. states
"[Type 2 verb suffixes] express how much choice the subject has about the a=
ction described or how predisposed the subject is to doing it."
A strict reading of this, assuming that we've got the right idea of what co=
nstitutes a "subject" in Klingon, would seem to indicate that a sentence su=
ch as {choHeghvIpmoH} could only ever mean "You're afraid to make me die.",=
and never "You make me fear death."
However, there is an apparent contradiction of this later in TKD 4.2.10.:
{HeghqangmoHlu'pu'} <it made him/her willing to die>
Then, in paq'batlh (paq'raD, Canto 7, Stanzas 6-7):
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
'ach luj molor
vangmo' molor HoSghajchoHqu' qeylIS
'ej SuvqangmoHbej
Suvchu'meH Suvchu'meH Suvchu'meH
ghaH SuvqangmoHchu'
molor
Instead, by doing so,
Kahless grew mighty and strong,
And it fueled his will to fight.
To the death, to the death, to the death,
It fueled his will to fight
To the death.
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
However, paq'batlh also contains an example that complies with TKD 4.2.2:
paq'yav, Canto 6, Stanza 2
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=91ej loDnI=92lI=92 yIjon
molor DaQapbe=92nISmoH
yIghoS yIghoS yIghoS
And get your brother,
Molor must be stopped
Go, go, go!
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
So, there do seem to be some contradictions in the canon. Errors? Exception=
s? "Adaptive syntax"?
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