[111038] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [tlhIngan Hol] Spoils of war
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Felix Malmenbeck)
Sat Sep 16 04:42:59 2017
X-Original-To: tlhingan-hol@lists.kli.org
From: Felix Malmenbeck <felixm@kth.se>
To: "tlhingan-hol@kli.org" <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
Date: Thu, 14 Sep 2017 17:59:20 +0000
In-Reply-To: <CAP7F2cKGO6CfYV4bHnP5yfzPHtmr_7+hEVWjkmx5OHJ70hieQQ@mail.gmail.com>
Reply-To: tlhingan-hol@kli.org
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Presumably, yes, hence the "[sic]"; this means that there is an error in th=
e quoted material :)
//loghaD
14 sep. 2017 kl. 19:57 skrev mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun@gmail.com<mailto:mihko=
un@gmail.com>>:
> popwIj 'oH nach
Isn't here an {-'e'} on {nach} missing ?
qunnoq
On Sep 14, 2017 8:53 PM, "Felix Malmenbeck" <felixm@kth.se<mailto:felixm@kt=
h.se>> wrote:
I'm thinking <pop> (or <veS popmey>) might work. In paq'batlh, Kahless says=
to Morath (on the subject of a targ that Kahless slew):
loDnI'wI' bIHoHta'be'
popwIj 'oH nach [sic]
juHDaq porgh Daqem
My brother you failed to kill,
The head is my reward,
You bring the carcass home.
So, here <pop> is used in the sense of a reward that is claimed, rather tha=
n one that is willingly given. Whether or not this usage is metaphorical, I=
cannot say.
//loghaD
14 sep. 2017 kl. 17:41 skrev SuStel <sustel@trimboli.name<mailto:sustel@tri=
mboli.name>>:
On 9/14/2017 11:27 AM, nIqolay Q wrote:
On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:00 AM, mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun@gmail.com<mailto:=
mihkoun@gmail.com>> wrote:
Are you serious ? Do you really expect this kind of arguments to be taken s=
eriously ?
If you're going to be "in-character" and treat Klingon culture as if it's a=
real thing, then you also have to treat the Klingon language as something =
we only know about from the incomplete information told to us by a single g=
rouchy Klingon.
It's one thing to wonder in-character why no one's ever asked Maltz about s=
poils or why Maltz has never brought them up, but acting like there is some=
major deficiency in the depiction of Klingon culture simply because Marc O=
krand hasn't worked his way through every entry in Merriam-Webster strikes =
me as incredibly stupid.
You have to learn to speak mayqel-ese. I took his initial post to mean, not=
"Klingon culture and language is stupid because they don't have a word for=
spoils," but "Klingons obviously have to have a word for spoils, don't the=
y?"
--
SuStel
http://trimboli.name
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<div>Presumably, yes, hence the "[sic]"; this means that there is=
an error in the quoted material :)<br>
<br>
//loghaD</div>
<div><br>
14 sep. 2017 kl. 19:57 skrev mayqel qunenoS <<a href=3D"mailto:mihkoun@g=
mail.com">mihkoun@gmail.com</a>>:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type=3D"cite">
<div>
<div dir=3D"auto"><span style=3D"font-family:sans-serif;font-size:13.696px"=
>> popwIj 'oH nach</span>
<div dir=3D"auto"><span style=3D"font-family:sans-serif;font-size:13.696px"=
><br>
</span></div>
<div dir=3D"auto"><span style=3D"font-family:sans-serif;font-size:13.696px"=
>Isn't here an {-'e'} on {nach} missing ?</span></div>
<div dir=3D"auto"><span style=3D"font-family:sans-serif;font-size:13.696px"=
><br>
</span></div>
<div dir=3D"auto"><span style=3D"font-family:sans-serif;font-size:13.696px"=
>qunnoq</span></div>
</div>
<div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sep 14, 2017 8:53 PM, "Felix Malmenbeck&=
quot; <<a href=3D"mailto:felixm@kth.se">felixm@kth.se</a>> wrote:<br =
type=3D"attribution">
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir=3D"auto">
<div>I'm thinking «pop» (or «veS popmey») might wor=
k. In paq'batlh, Kahless says to Morath (on the subject of a targ that Kahl=
ess slew):</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>loDnI'wI' bIHoHta'be'</div>
<div>popwIj 'oH nach [sic]</div>
<div>juHDaq porgh Daqem</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>My brother you failed to kill,</div>
<div>The head is my reward,</div>
<div>You bring the carcass home.<br>
<br>
<div>So, here «pop» is used in the sense of a reward that is cl=
aimed, rather than one that is willingly given. Whether or not this usage i=
s metaphorical, I cannot say.</div>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>//loghaD<br>
<div><br>
<br>
</div>
14 sep. 2017 kl. 17:41 skrev SuStel <<a href=3D"mailto:sustel@trimboli.n=
ame" target=3D"_blank">sustel@trimboli.name</a>>:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type=3D"cite">
<div>
<div class=3D"m_-4900309378614937698moz-cite-prefix">On 9/14/2017 11:27 AM,=
nIqolay Q wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type=3D"cite">On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:00 AM, mayqel qunenoS =
<span dir=3D"ltr">
<<a href=3D"mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">mihkoun@gmail.co=
m</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<div class=3D"gmail_extra">
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir=3D"auto">Are you serious ? Do you really expect this kind of argum=
ents to be taken seriously ?<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote"><br>
</div>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">If you're going to be "in-character" a=
nd treat Klingon culture as if it's a real thing, then you also have to tre=
at the Klingon language as something we only know about from the incomplete=
information told to us by a single grouchy
Klingon.</div>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote"><br>
</div>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">It's one thing to wonder in-character why no one=
's ever asked Maltz about spoils or why Maltz has never brought them up, bu=
t acting like there is some major deficiency in the depiction of Klingon cu=
lture simply because Marc Okrand hasn't
worked his way through every entry in Merriam-Webster strikes me as incred=
ibly stupid.
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p>You have to learn to speak mayqel-ese. I took his initial post to mean, =
not "Klingon culture and language is stupid because they don't have a =
word for
<i>spoils,</i>" but "Klingons obviously have to have a word for <=
i>spoils,</i> don't they?"<br>
</p>
<pre class=3D"m_-4900309378614937698moz-signature" cols=3D"72">--=20
SuStel
<a class=3D"m_-4900309378614937698moz-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"http://tri=
mboli.name" target=3D"_blank">http://trimboli.name</a></pre>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type=3D"cite">
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