[110093] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [tlhIngan Hol] My list of 19 new words revisited
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Jesse Manoogian)
Thu Jul 27 23:27:48 2017
X-Original-To: tlhingan-hol@lists.kli.org
Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2017 03:27:41 +0000 (UTC)
From: Jesse Manoogian <boyfromtheabyss@yahoo.com>
To: "tlhingan-hol@kli.org" <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
Reply-To: tlhingan-hol@kli.org, Jesse Manoogian <boyfromtheabyss@yahoo.com>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@lists.kli.org
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Thanks for the welcome back!
Steven Boozer wrote:
>1. For glasses we already have a word from ?TalkNow! Klingon? (TNK): {mIn =
QanwI' nguv}=20
>?sunglasses? (i.e., ?dark eye protectors?) ? which implies {mIn QanwI'} fo=
r regular eyeglasses. If=20
>you really want to be specific, you could say {mIn QanwI? Dem} ?uncolored =
glasses? using the new=20
>verb {Dem} ?be clear, transparent, uncolored? from qepHom 2016.
OK, cool. I knew the word "mIn QanwI' nguv", but I didn't imagine it could =
be turned into a word for vision-correcting glasses.
>2. For tank top, don?t forget {yIvbeH}:
>
>(KGT 57f.):=C2=A0 the traditional warrior's tunic ({yIvbeH}) was made of a=
material (what it was is now=20
>unknown) resistant to puncture, just to add a little protection. Accompany=
ing sleeves ({tlhaymey}),=20
>originally not parts of the tunic itself, were generally made of animal pe=
lts ({veDDIrmey}) ? (In=20
>modern usage, the word {yIvbeH} in most places means any shirt, with or wi=
thout sleeves.)
>(KGT 29f.):=C2=A0 In the Vospeg ({voSpegh}) region, on the other hand, {yI=
vbeH} refers only to a=20
>sleeveless shirt (thus retaining much of the word's original meaning, a sl=
eeveless protective garment=20
>worn by warriors), {wep} means a shirt with sleeves, and any jacket or coa=
t is a {cheSvel}, a word >that elsewhere refers to a specific style of coat=
associated with, not surprisingly, the Vospeg region.
Thanks for this information. I don't own a copy of _Klingon for the Galacti=
c Traveler_. I didn't know what a yIvbeH *was* exactly.
>3. For teenagers and adolescents ? as you know from KGT we have:
>
>nen=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 grow=
th, maturation (n)
>nen=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 be m=
ature, be grown-up, be adult (v)
>nenchoH=C2=A0 mature, grow up (v)
>
>*{nenHa?} would be a good way to refer to someone immature, not grown-up; =
in other words, an=20
>adolescent or teenager.=C2=A0 That being said, Okrand - or is it Maltz? - =
usually refers to them as=20
>?younger Klingons?, ?younger people?, ?younger speakers?, ?the younger gen=
eration?, etc.=C2=A0 E.g.
>
>(KGT 138):=C2=A0 the characteristic patterns of younger people's speech, i=
f noticed and commented upon,=20
>are more likely to be judged sloppy or careless rather than wrong.
>
>(KGT 141):=C2=A0 Despite this debatable advantage, and despite the slow bu=
t ongoing spread of the=20
>practice among younger speakers, most Klingons still consider the ambiguou=
s use of {yI-} an error.
>
>So {tlhInganpu? Qan}, {nuv Qan}, {jatlhwI?pu? Qan}, {puq poH Qan}, etc.
Qan? The word for "to protect"?=20
I can't seem to find information on how to translate comparatives when ther=
e is no stanfard. There are "law'" and "puS" for constructions like "pal Qu=
p law' pIyta Qup puS" for "Paul is younger than Peter", but how would one s=
ay "younger generation"?
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<html><head></head><body><div style=3D"color:#000; background-color:#fff; f=
ont-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font=
-size:13px"><div id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5098">Thanks for the=
welcome back!<br><br>Steven Boozer wrote:</div><div id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_=
1_1501212322058_5227"><br></div><div id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_=
5130" dir=3D"ltr">>1. For glasses we already have a word from ?TalkNow! =
Klingon? (TNK): {mIn QanwI' nguv} <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_16=
_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5239">>?sunglasses? (i.e., ?dark eye protectors?=
) ? which implies {mIn QanwI'} for regular eyeglasses. If <br></div><div di=
r=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5238">>you really want t=
o be specific, you could say {mIn QanwI? Dem} ?uncolored glasses? using the=
new <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5240"=
>>verb {Dem} ?be clear, transparent, uncolored? from qepHom 2016.<br id=
=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5191"><br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_15012=
12322058_5192">OK, cool. I knew the word "mIn QanwI' nguv", but I didn't im=
agine it could be turned into a word for vision-correcting glasses.<br id=
=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5193"><br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_15012=
12322058_5194">>2. For tank top, don?t forget {yIvbeH}:<br id=3D"yui_3_1=
6_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5195">><br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_150121232205=
8_5196">>(KGT 57f.): the traditional warrior's tunic ({yIvbeH}) wa=
s made of a material (what it was is now <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"y=
ui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5241">>unknown) resistant to puncture, ju=
st to add a little protection. Accompanying sleeves ({tlhaymey}), <br></div=
><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5256">>originall=
y not parts of the tunic itself, were generally made of animal pelts ({veDD=
Irmey}) ? (In <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322=
058_5257">>modern usage, the word {yIvbeH} in most places means any shir=
t, with or without sleeves.)<br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5197"=
>>(KGT 29f.): In the Vospeg ({voSpegh}) region, on the other hand,=
{yIvbeH} refers only to a <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19=
_1_1501212322058_5258">>sleeveless shirt (thus retaining much of the wor=
d's original meaning, a sleeveless protective garment <br></div><div dir=3D=
"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5259">>worn by warriors), {w=
ep} means a shirt with sleeves, and any jacket or coat is a {cheSvel}, a wo=
rd >that elsewhere refers to a specific style of coat associated with, n=
ot surprisingly, the Vospeg region.<br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_150121232205=
8_5199"><br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5200">Thanks for this inf=
ormation. I don't own a copy of _Klingon for the Galactic Traveler_. I didn=
't know what a yIvbeH *was* exactly.<br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_15012123220=
58_5201"><br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5202">>3. For teenage=
rs and adolescents ? as you know from KGT we have:<br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19=
_1_1501212322058_5203">><br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5204">=
>nen g=
rowth, maturation (n)<br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5205">>ne=
n be matu=
re, be grown-up, be adult (v)<br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5206=
">>nenchoH mature, grow up (v)<br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_15012123=
22058_5207">><br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5208">>*{nenHa=
?} would be a good way to refer to someone immature, not grown-up; in other=
words, an <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058=
_5260">>adolescent or teenager. That being said, Okrand - or is it=
Maltz? - usually refers to them as <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_=
16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5268">>?younger Klingons?, ?younger people?, ?=
younger speakers?, ?the younger generation?, etc. E.g.<br id=3D"yui_3=
_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5209">><br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322=
058_5210">>(KGT 138): the characteristic patterns of younger peopl=
e's speech, if noticed and commented upon, <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D=
"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5269">>are more likely to be judged slo=
ppy or careless rather than wrong.<br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058=
_5211">><br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5212">>(KGT 141):&n=
bsp; Despite this debatable advantage, and despite the slow but ongoing spr=
ead of the <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058=
_5274">>practice among younger speakers, most Klingons still consider th=
e ambiguous use of {yI-} an error.<br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058=
_5213">><br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5214">>So {tlhIngan=
pu? Qan}, {nuv Qan}, {jatlhwI?pu? Qan}, {puq poH Qan}, etc.<br id=3D"yui_3_=
16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5215"><br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5=
216">Qan? The word for "to protect"? <br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322=
058_5217"><br id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1501212322058_5218">I can't seem to f=
ind information on how to translate comparatives when there is no stanfard.=
There are "law'" and "puS" for constructions like "pal Qup law' pIyta Qup =
puS" for "Paul is younger than Peter", but how would one say "younger gener=
ation"?<br></div></div></body></html>
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