[109459] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [tlhIngan Hol] Klingon Word of the Day: lorbe'
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (SuStel)
Mon Apr 17 11:33:35 2017
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To: tlhingan-hol@lists.kli.org
From: SuStel <sustel@trimboli.name>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2017 11:33:02 -0400
In-Reply-To: <746678235.1804715.1492439634314@mail.yahoo.com>
Reply-To: tlhingan-hol@kli.org
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On 4/17/2017 10:33 AM, Terrence Donnelly wrote:
> This always gives me so much trouble! Let me see if I've got this right.
>
> So far as a {lor} is concerned, can you distill it down to the rule
> that the {lor} is the child of an opposite-sex sibling?
> your mother's brother has a {lor}, your father's sister has a {lor},
> if you are a male, your sister has a {lor}, if you are female, your
> brother has a {lor}?
> This applies to children of the siblings of you or your parents.
>
> (And {tey'} is used for the children of same-sex siblings).
>
> Correct?
*
*
There are two words related to your father's family: *tennuS* /father's
brother/ and *'e'mam*/father's sister./ The first refers to men; the
second to women. The spouses of these get the same words with *-nal*
suffixed to them, keeping the maleness and femaleness appropriate: your
*tennuS*'s wife is your *'e'mamnal,* while your *'e'mam*'s husband is
your *tennuSnal.*
There are two words related to your mother's family: *'IrneH*/mother's
brother/ and *me'*/mother's sister.**/The first refers to men; the
second to women. The spouses of these get the same words with *-nal*
suffixed to them, keeping the maleness and femaleness appropriate: your
*'IrneH*'s wife is your *me'nal,* while your *me'*'s husband is your
*'IrneHnal.*
The child of one of your parents' opposite-sex siblings (either *'e'mam*
or *'IrneH*) is your *lor;* the child of one of your parents' same-sex
siblings (either *tennuS* or *me'*) is your *tey'.* Both *lor* and
*tey'* can specify whether they are male or female by adding *loD* or *be'*.
But *lor* and *tey'* also refer to nieces and nephews. *lor* means the
child of your sibling the opposite sex as you; *tey'* means the child of
your sibling the same sex as you. They can still take *loD* and *be'* to
distinguish their sexes.
To distinguish between aunts/uncles and nieces/nephews, just explain the
relationship (e.g., *loDnI' puq*). You normally do not distinguish if
the information is not important.
A group of *lor* and *tey'* are *vInpu';* the singular *vIn* is only
used to refer to an individual in a group of *vInpu'.*
A more distant uncle/aunt/niece/nephew relation is generally called a
*yur.* A group of *yurpu' *might include some *lor* or *tey',* but you
wouldn't use *yurpu'* if the group consisted /only/ of *lor* and *tey'.*
*'e'nal* is someone married into the family whose relationship isn't
specified.
So to summarize:
Your father's family uses the words *tennuS* and *'e'mam.* Your mother's
family uses the words *'IrneH* and *me'.* *lor* are traced through
opposite-sex siblings; *tey'* are traced through same-sex siblings.
*vInpu'* are a group of *lor* and *tey'.* A *yur* is a more distant
relation through siblings. An *'e'nal* married into the family but
doesn't say to whom.
--
SuStel
http://trimboli.name
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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 4/17/2017 10:33 AM, Terrence
Donnelly wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:746678235.1804715.1492439634314@mail.yahoo.com"
type="cite">
<div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff;
font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande,
sans-serif;font-size:13px">
<div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1492438444463_10491">This always
gives me so much trouble! Let me see if I've got this right. <br>
</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1492438444463_10494"><br>
</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1492438444463_10493">So far as a
{lor} is concerned, can you distill it down to the rule that
the {lor} is the child of an opposite-sex sibling? <br>
</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1492438444463_10511">your mother's
brother has a {lor}, your father's sister has a {lor}, <br>
</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1492438444463_10542">if you are a
male, your sister has a {lor}, if you are female, your brother
has a {lor}? <br>
</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1492438444463_10561">This applies to
children of the siblings of you or your parents.<br>
</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1492438444463_10508"><br>
</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1492438444463_10509">(And {tey'} is
used for the children of same-sex siblings).</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1492438444463_10477"><br>
</div>
<div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1492438444463_10478">Correct?</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<b><br>
</b>
<p>There are two words related to your father's family: <b>tennuS</b>
<i>father's brother</i> and <b>'e'mam</b><i> father's sister.</i>
The first refers to men; the second to women. The spouses of these
get the same words with <b>-nal</b> suffixed to them, keeping the
maleness and femaleness appropriate: your <b>tennuS</b>'s wife is
your <b>'e'mamnal,</b> while your <b>'e'mam</b>'s husband is
your <b>tennuSnal.</b></p>
<p>There are two words related to your mother's family: <b>'IrneH</b><i>
mother's brother</i> and <b>me'</b><i> mother's sister.<b> </b></i>The
first refers to men; the second to women. The spouses of these get
the same words with <b>-nal</b> suffixed to them, keeping the
maleness and femaleness appropriate: your <b>'IrneH</b>'s wife is
your <b>me'nal,</b> while your <b>me'</b>'s husband is your <b>'IrneHnal.</b></p>
<p>The child of one of your parents' opposite-sex siblings (either <b>'e'mam</b>
or <b>'IrneH</b>) is your <b>lor;</b> the child of one of your
parents' same-sex siblings (either <b>tennuS</b> or <b>me'</b>)
is your <b>tey'.</b> Both <b>lor</b> and <b>tey'</b> can
specify whether they are male or female by adding <b>loD</b> or <b>be'</b>.</p>
<p>But <b>lor</b> and <b>tey'</b> also refer to nieces and
nephews. <b>lor</b> means the child of your sibling the opposite
sex as you; <b>tey'</b> means the child of your sibling the same
sex as you. They can still take <b>loD</b> and <b>be'</b> to
distinguish their sexes.</p>
<p>To distinguish between aunts/uncles and nieces/nephews, just
explain the relationship (e.g., <b>loDnI' puq</b>). You normally
do not distinguish if the information is not important.</p>
<p>A group of <b>lor</b> and <b>tey'</b> are <b>vInpu';</b> the
singular <b>vIn</b> is only used to refer to an individual in a
group of <b>vInpu'.</b></p>
<p>A more distant uncle/aunt/niece/nephew relation is generally
called a <b>yur.</b> A group of <b>yurpu' </b>might include
some <b>lor</b> or <b>tey',</b> but you wouldn't use <b>yurpu'</b>
if the group consisted <i>only</i> of <b>lor</b> and <b>tey'.</b></p>
<p><b>'e'nal</b> is someone married into the family whose
relationship isn't specified.</p>
<p>So to summarize:</p>
<p>Your father's family uses the words <b>tennuS</b> and <b>'e'mam.</b>
Your mother's family uses the words <b>'IrneH</b> and <b>me'.</b>
<b>lor</b> are traced through opposite-sex siblings; <b>tey'</b>
are traced through same-sex siblings. <b>vInpu'</b> are a group
of <b>lor</b> and <b>tey'.</b> A <b>yur</b> is a more distant
relation through siblings. An <b>'e'nal</b> married into the
family but doesn't say to whom.<br>
</p>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
SuStel
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://trimboli.name">http://trimboli.name</a></pre>
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