[102057] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] tlhIngan cursing
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (lojmIt tI'wI' nuv 'utlh)
Sun Nov 8 18:16:38 2015
From: lojmIt tI'wI' nuv 'utlh <lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 8 Nov 2015 18:16:20 -0500
To: tlhIngan Hol mailing list <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
In-Reply-To: <2127389840.2603262.1447017411843.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com>
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Likely the glosses we are given for curses are sufficient to explain =
appropriate use. Any actual meaning the words once had have no =
relevance.=20
Take the English =E2=80=9CF=E2=80=9D word. If it has an actual meaning, =
it is probably related to the act of having sex, though that has nothing =
to do with the intent of a person who follows it with =E2=80=9Cyou!=E2=80=9D=
, or with the use of it as a general amplifier with =E2=80=9C-ing=E2=80=9D=
added, as in =E2=80=9CThat=E2=80=99s one f-ing big nose you=E2=80=99ve =
got there!=E2=80=9D or the generic =E2=80=9CI don=E2=80=99t like the =
following=E2=80=9D meaning in =E2=80=9CThis f-ing jerk f-ing insulted my =
mother=E2=80=99s forehead!=E2=80=9D Sex also has nothing to do with the =
equivalent of =E2=80=9CThe gig is up!=E2=80=9D statement, =E2=80=9CWe=E2=80=
=99re f-ed.=E2=80=9D
Sex has nothing to do with the phrase, =E2=80=9CDon=E2=80=99t f with =
me,=E2=80=9D or =E2=80=9CDon=E2=80=99t f with that lawn mower.=E2=80=9D
Sex has nothing to do with =E2=80=9CThe meter of this poem is all f-ed =
up=E2=80=9D or =E2=80=9CThe tip of this screwdriver is all f-ed up."
Sex has nothing to do with the single word the mechanic utters when he =
drops his wrench down the silo onto the nuclear warhead, setting off a =
spark that ignites the leaking hydrogen fuel tank.
So, understanding that the f word refers to the act of having sex =
won=E2=80=99t help you understand most of the ways the word is used. =
Likely, Klingon curse words are like that.
lojmIt tI=E2=80=99wI=E2=80=99 nuv =E2=80=98utlh
Door Repair Guy, Retired Honorably
> On Nov 8, 2015, at 4:16 PM, Fiat Knox <fiat_knox@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>=20
> For all we know, what Klingons consider curse words could well be =
acceptable idioms to us.
> Hu'tegh could well be how one could describe the discovery of a =
tribble nursery, and Qovpatlh could well be Today is a day of sweet =
rainbows and fluffy clouds. A toDSaH could well be someone who goes out =
of his way to help others, but we know that a taHqeq's lies are =
despicable, which is why it is so insulting to call someone that - =
perhaps nice guy could be the translation for that.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> On Friday, 6 November 2015, 18:26, qunnoQ HoD <mihkoun@gmail.com> =
wrote:
>=20
>=20
> interesting information !
>=20
> ..and since we are on the subject of cursing,I would like to take the =
opportunity and say that my two favorite klingon curses are
>=20
> 1. Hab SoSlI' Quch
> 2. verengan Ha'DIbaH
>=20
> although I would never say the "your mother has a smooth =
forehead",because I believe that anyone's mother is a sacred figure not =
to be insulted under any circumstances..
> on the other hand though,the ''ferengi dog'' is one of the most =
beautiful things to say to someone who pisses you off ! it is a short =
phrase,said easily when angered,and it somehow "flows out'' of your =
lips.. it can also be said either with extreme anger,or with a =
slow,nearly silent contemptuous voice. it's perfect !
>=20
> cpt qunnoQ
>=20
> On Fri, Nov 6, 2015 at 7:38 PM, nIqolay Q <niqolay0@gmail.com =
<mailto:niqolay0@gmail.com>> wrote:
> If I recall correctly, most of the Klingon curses are just gibberish =
from the shows, especially the epithets, and MO just transliterated them =
into Klingon spelling.=20
>=20
> There's been a few attempts at "folk etymologies" for the curse words, =
based on similar-sounding words, but nothing definitely authoritative. =
Maltz thinks the word {taHqeq} is related to the expression =
{bItaHrup'a'} "Do you want to continue?", which is used defiantly before =
escalating an argument to the next level (punches or curse warfare). And =
I think one of the footnotes in paq'batlh suggests that {petaQ} is =
derived from {petaQ} meaning "you (plural) be weird!", though I think =
that footnote was not written by Okrand himself. I think there may also =
be some reluctance on Okrand's part to get too deep into the R-rated =
language, so there's no definite association to actual objectionable =
topics.
>=20
> For the most part I think you can just translate the curse words to =
the nearest equivalent in the given language based on the context it's =
been used in before. {petaQ}, for instance, seems to be roughly =
equivalent to "asshole, dumbass, bastard", and I think {ghuy'} was =
translated as "Damn!" in a line written for Star Trek 5.
>=20
> On Fri, Nov 6, 2015 at 10:46 AM, qunnoQ HoD <mihkoun@gmail.com =
<mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com>> wrote:
> I was just reading the tlhIngan epithets and general invectives on the =
subject of cursing. I read the following epithets =
{petaQ,toDSaH,taHqeq,yIntagh,Qovpatlh} and the invectives (va'/Qu'vatlh, =
ghay'cha', baQa', Hu'tegh, QI'yaH, ghuy'cha')
>=20
> I didn't see anywhere though,any given meaning or translation of the =
aforementioned epithets/invectives..
>=20
> does this mean that all these epithets/invectives cannot be translated =
?
>=20
> cpt. qunnoQ
>=20
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> _______________________________________________
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<http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol>
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> http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D""><div class=3D"">Likely the glosses we are given for curses =
are sufficient to explain appropriate use. Any actual meaning the words =
once had have no relevance. </div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Take the English =E2=80=9CF=E2=80=9D =
word. If it has an actual meaning, it is probably related to the act of =
having sex, though that has nothing to do with the intent of a person =
who follows it with =E2=80=9Cyou!=E2=80=9D, or with the use of it as a =
general amplifier with =E2=80=9C-ing=E2=80=9D added, as in =E2=80=9CThat=E2=
=80=99s one f-ing big nose you=E2=80=99ve got there!=E2=80=9D or the =
generic =E2=80=9CI don=E2=80=99t like the following=E2=80=9D meaning in =
=E2=80=9CThis f-ing jerk f-ing insulted my mother=E2=80=99s forehead!=E2=80=
=9D Sex also has nothing to do with the equivalent of =E2=80=9CThe gig =
is up!=E2=80=9D statement, =E2=80=9CWe=E2=80=99re f-ed.=E2=80=9D</div><div=
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Sex has nothing to do =
with the phrase, =E2=80=9CDon=E2=80=99t f with me,=E2=80=9D or =
=E2=80=9CDon=E2=80=99t f with that lawn mower.=E2=80=9D</div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Sex has nothing to do =
with =E2=80=9CThe meter of this poem is all f-ed up=E2=80=9D or =E2=80=9CT=
he tip of this screwdriver is all f-ed up."</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Sex has nothing to do with the single =
word the mechanic utters when he drops his wrench down the silo onto the =
nuclear warhead, setting off a spark that ignites the leaking hydrogen =
fuel tank.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">So, =
understanding that the f word refers to the act of having sex won=E2=80=99=
t help you understand most of the ways the word is used. Likely, Klingon =
curse words are like that.</div><br class=3D""><div class=3D"">
<div class=3D""><div class=3D"">lojmIt tI=E2=80=99wI=E2=80=99 nuv =
=E2=80=98utlh</div><div class=3D"">Door Repair Guy, Retired =
Honorably</div></div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline">
</div>
<br class=3D""><div><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On Nov 8, 2015, at 4:16 PM, Fiat Knox <<a =
href=3D"mailto:fiat_knox@yahoo.co.uk" =
class=3D"">fiat_knox@yahoo.co.uk</a>> wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-family: 'Courier =
New', courier, monaco, monospace, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" =
class=3D""><div id=3D"yui_3_16_0_1_1447017009522_2840" class=3D""><span =
id=3D"yui_3_16_0_1_1447017009522_2948" class=3D"">For all we know, what =
Klingons consider curse words could well be acceptable idioms to =
us.</span></div><div id=3D"yui_3_16_0_1_1447017009522_2840" dir=3D"ltr" =
class=3D""><b class=3D"">Hu'tegh</b> could well be how one could =
describe the discovery of a tribble nursery, and <b =
id=3D"yui_3_16_0_1_1447017009522_3042" class=3D"">Qovpatlh</b> could =
well be <i id=3D"yui_3_16_0_1_1447017009522_3075" class=3D"">Today =
is a day of sweet rainbows and fluffy clouds</i>. A <b =
class=3D"">toDSaH</b> could well be <i =
id=3D"yui_3_16_0_1_1447017009522_3076" class=3D"">someone who goes out =
of his way to help others</i>, but we know that a <b =
class=3D"">taHqeq</b>'s lies are despicable, which is why it is so =
insulting to call someone that - perhaps <i class=3D"">nice =
guy</i> could be the translation for that.</div> <br class=3D""><div=
class=3D"qtdSeparateBR"><br class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"yahoo_quoted" style=3D"display: block;"> <div =
style=3D"font-family: Courier New, courier, monaco, monospace, =
sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" class=3D""> <div style=3D"font-family: =
HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, =
Sans-Serif; font-size: 16px;" class=3D""> <div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""> =
<font size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial" class=3D""> On Friday, 6 November 2015, =
18:26, qunnoQ HoD <<a href=3D"mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com" =
class=3D"">mihkoun@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br class=3D""> </font> =
</div> <blockquote style=3D"border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); =
margin-left: 5px; margin-top: 5px; padding-left: 5px;" class=3D""> <br =
class=3D""><br class=3D""> <div class=3D"y_msg_container"><div =
id=3D"yiv2748084470" class=3D""><div class=3D""><div dir=3D"ltr" =
class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div =
class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D"">interesting information !<br =
clear=3D"none" class=3D""><br clear=3D"none" class=3D""></div>..and =
since we are on the subject of cursing,I would like to take the =
opportunity and say that my two favorite klingon curses are<br =
clear=3D"none" class=3D""><br clear=3D"none" class=3D""></div>1. Hab =
SoSlI' Quch<br clear=3D"none" class=3D""></div>2. verengan Ha'DIbaH<br =
clear=3D"none" class=3D""><br clear=3D"none" class=3D""></div>although I =
would never say the "your mother has a smooth forehead",because I =
believe that anyone's mother is a sacred figure not to be insulted under =
any circumstances..<br clear=3D"none" class=3D""></div>on the other hand =
though,the ''ferengi dog'' is one of the most beautiful things to say to =
someone who pisses you off ! it is a short phrase,said easily when =
angered,and it somehow "flows out'' of your lips.. it can also be said =
either with extreme anger,or with a slow,nearly silent contemptuous =
voice. it's perfect !<br clear=3D"none" class=3D""><br clear=3D"none" =
class=3D""></div>cpt qunnoQ<br clear=3D"none" class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"yiv2748084470gmail_extra"><br clear=3D"none" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"yiv2748084470yqt1725314072" id=3D"yiv2748084470yqtfd57672"><div =
class=3D"yiv2748084470gmail_quote">On Fri, Nov 6, 2015 at 7:38 PM, =
nIqolay Q <span dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a rel=3D"nofollow" =
shape=3D"rect" ymailto=3D"mailto:niqolay0@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank" =
href=3D"mailto:niqolay0@gmail.com" =
class=3D"">niqolay0@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br clear=3D"none" =
class=3D""><blockquote class=3D"yiv2748084470gmail_quote" =
style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc =
solid;padding-left:1ex;"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><div class=3D"">If =
I recall correctly, most of the Klingon curses are just gibberish from =
the shows, especially the epithets, and MO just transliterated them into =
Klingon spelling. <br clear=3D"none" class=3D""><br clear=3D"none" =
class=3D"">There's been a few attempts at "folk etymologies" for the =
curse words, based on similar-sounding words, but nothing definitely =
authoritative. Maltz thinks the word {taHqeq} is related to the =
expression {bItaHrup'a'} "Do you want to continue?", which is used =
defiantly before escalating an argument to the next level (punches or =
curse warfare). And I think one of the footnotes in paq'batlh suggests =
that {petaQ} is derived from {petaQ} meaning "you (plural) be weird!", =
though I think that footnote was not written by Okrand himself. I think =
there may also be some reluctance on Okrand's part to get too deep into =
the R-rated language, so there's no definite association to actual =
objectionable topics.<br clear=3D"none" class=3D""><br clear=3D"none" =
class=3D""></div>For the most part I think you can just translate the =
curse words to the nearest equivalent in the given language based on the =
context it's been used in before. {petaQ}, for instance, seems to be =
roughly equivalent to "asshole, dumbass, bastard", and I think {ghuy'} =
was translated as "Damn!" in a line written for Star Trek 5.<br =
clear=3D"none" class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"yiv2748084470gmail_extra"><br clear=3D"none" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"yiv2748084470gmail_quote"><div class=3D""><div =
class=3D"yiv2748084470h5">On Fri, Nov 6, 2015 at 10:46 AM, qunnoQ HoD =
<span dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a rel=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" =
ymailto=3D"mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank" =
href=3D"mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com" =
class=3D"">mihkoun@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br clear=3D"none" =
class=3D""></div></div><blockquote class=3D"yiv2748084470gmail_quote" =
style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc =
solid;padding-left:1ex;"><div class=3D""><div =
class=3D"yiv2748084470h5"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><div class=3D""><div=
class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D"">I was just reading the =
tlhIngan epithets and general invectives on the subject of cursing. I =
read the following epithets {petaQ,toDSaH,taHqeq,yIntagh,Qovpatlh} and =
the invectives (va'/Qu'vatlh, ghay'cha', baQa', Hu'tegh, QI'yaH, =
ghuy'cha')<br clear=3D"none" class=3D""><br clear=3D"none" =
class=3D""></div>I didn't see anywhere though,any given meaning or =
translation of the aforementioned epithets/invectives..<br clear=3D"none" =
class=3D""><br clear=3D"none" class=3D""></div>does this mean that all =
these epithets/invectives cannot be translated ?<br clear=3D"none" =
class=3D""><br clear=3D"none" class=3D""></div>cpt. qunnoQ<br =
clear=3D"none" class=3D""></div></div>
<br clear=3D"none" =
class=3D""></div></div>_______________________________________________<br =
clear=3D"none" class=3D"">
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<br clear=3D"none" class=3D""></blockquote></div><br clear=3D"none" =
class=3D""></div>
<br clear=3D"none" =
class=3D"">_______________________________________________<br =
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<br clear=3D"none" class=3D""></blockquote></div><br clear=3D"none" =
class=3D""></div></div></div></div><br class=3D""><div =
class=3D"yqt1725314072" =
id=3D"yqtfd31537">_______________________________________________<br =
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</blockquote> </div> </div> =
</div></div></div>_______________________________________________<br =
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