[101866] in tlhIngan-Hol
[Tlhingan-hol] Comment on transliteration WAS: Defiant
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Brent Kesler)
Tue Nov 3 10:43:35 2015
Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2015 10:43:19 -0500
From: Brent Kesler <brent.of.all.people@gmail.com>
To: "tlhingan-hol@kli.org" <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@kli.org
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On Mon, Nov 2, 2015 at 1:56 PM, Doug Henning <likethemagician@gmail.com>
wrote:
> Sticking to only Klingon syllable structure, you would probably
> transliterate the name as *DIvay'enIt*, to avoid a consonant cluster
> without a vowel. Elision of the vowel *'It*, turning C*I*C into CC, seems
> to be a common alternate pronunciation of Klingon names, as in *wo'rIv* >
> "Worf".
>
I don't mean to pick on Mr. Henning (or anyone else), but I have a strong
opinion on this subject, and I want to give it.
It seems that Klingonists have preference for trying to make non-Klingon
words fit Klingon phonology. This isn't necessarily a bad thing--it's a
good exercise to put yourself in someone else's place and imagine how
something normal to us would sound strange to them.
But sometimes I think we take it too far, as if Klingons would never enjoy
the challenge of moving their tongues in strange ways to make strange
sounds that make sense to strange people.
We have some evidence that they're not entirely hostile to foreign speech
patterns: janluq pIqarD.
Of course, if you're trying to translate something, it is *your*
translation, and you can choose whichever strategy makes the most sense to
you. A couple years ago when I was writing weekly news summaries in
Klingon, I deliberately chose a midway strategy: try to stick close to the
original, but don't make it too difficult for a hypothetical Klingon to
make sense of. So "Gaza" became {ghaSa} rather than {gha'Sa'}. Both are
fine choices, but I wanted to emphasize the foreignness of the name.
In the end how you transliterate something is your choice, but I just
wanted to offer something to think about when you make that choice.
bI'reng
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><br><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quo=
te">On Mon, Nov 2, 2015 at 1:56 PM, Doug Henning <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:likethemagician@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">likethemagician@=
gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><di=
v style=3D"color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:times new roman,new=
york,times,serif;font-size:16px"><div dir=3D"ltr"><span>Sticking to only K=
lingon syllable structure, you would probably transliterate the name as <b>=
DIvay'enIt</b>, to avoid a consonant cluster without a vowel. Elision o=
f the vowel <b>'It</b>,=C2=A0turning C<b>I</b>C=C2=A0into CC, seems to =
be a common alternate pronunciation of Klingon names, as in <b>wo'rIv</=
b> > "Worf".</span></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></d=
iv><div><br></div><div>I don't mean to pick on Mr. Henning (or anyone e=
lse), but I have a strong opinion on this subject, and I want to give it.</=
div><div><br></div><div>It seems that Klingonists have preference for tryin=
g to make non-Klingon words fit Klingon phonology. This isn't necessari=
ly a bad thing--it's a good exercise to put yourself in someone else=
9;s place and imagine how something normal to us would sound strange to the=
m.</div><div><br></div><div>But sometimes I think we take it too far, as if=
Klingons would never enjoy the challenge of moving their tongues in strang=
e ways to make strange sounds that make sense to strange people.</div><div>=
<br></div><div>We have some evidence that they're not entirely hostile =
to foreign speech patterns: janluq pIqarD.</div><div><br></div><div>Of cour=
se, if you're trying to translate something, it is *your* translation, =
and you can choose whichever strategy makes the most sense to you. A couple=
years ago when I was writing weekly news summaries in Klingon, I deliberat=
ely chose a midway strategy: try to stick close to the original, but don=
9;t make it too difficult for a hypothetical Klingon to make sense of. So &=
quot;Gaza" became {ghaSa} rather than {gha'Sa'}. Both are fine=
choices, but I wanted to emphasize the foreignness of the name.<br></div><=
div><br></div><div>In the end how you transliterate something is your choic=
e, but I just wanted to offer something to think about when you make that c=
hoice.</div><div><br></div><div>bI'reng</div></div></div></div>
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