[9124] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 2741 Volume: 8
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Wed May 27 21:07:29 1998
Date: Wed, 27 May 98 18:00:29 -0700
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Wed, 27 May 1998 Volume: 8 Number: 2741
Today's topics:
Re: Backquote problem? <David.Boyce@fmr.com>
Re: Backquote problem? (Charles DeRykus)
Re: Backquote problem? <tchrist@mox.perl.com>
Re: Clearly define "free software" <dformosa@st.nepean.uws.edu.au>
Re: Copylefting manuals <davew@gatsby.u-net.com>
Re: Don't Know how to decrypt using PERL (Kevin Buhr)
Re: Email address checker - comments welcome <lr@hpl.hp.com>
Re: Email address checker - comments welcome <tchrist@mox.perl.com>
Feature - Open Source Code <bcopper@interrod.com>
Re: file size with perl and win NT (Martien Verbruggen)
Re: Getting filesystem free space (Martien Verbruggen)
Re: Handling Dates Help Please (Martien Verbruggen)
Re: Job Postings (Martien Verbruggen)
Re: LABOR CRISIS: Perl SW Guru NEEDED MA Intranet Start (Pat Luther)
Re: list context: || vs or (Ilya Zakharevich)
Re: list context: || vs or (Martien Verbruggen)
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 8 Mar 97) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 18:51:32 -0400
From: David Boyce <David.Boyce@fmr.com>
Subject: Re: Backquote problem?
Message-Id: <356C98F4.76A1C0C4@fmr.com>
Jan Krynicky wrote:
> I think you wanted to use system() instead.
> perl -e 'system("cp /usr/bin/ls .") || die $!'
The underappreciated style 'system("/usr/bin/cp", "/usr/bin/ls", ".")'
is generally preferable, as it avoids exec-ing a shell. Running an
unnecessary shell is
1. Slower (proof left to the reader)
2. Less robust (e.g. if a filename has embedded whitespace or other
characters meaningful to the shell).
3. Less secure (opening the way to possible IFS or ENV attacks, for
instance).
None of these are terrible problems - usually - but when recommending
system() it's best to demo it in this form, IMHO.
-David
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 23:10:32 GMT
From: ced@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Charles DeRykus)
Subject: Re: Backquote problem?
Message-Id: <Etn1pL.9A7@news.boeing.com>
In article <356C6EC7.284DD0B3@detailsinc.com>,
Tom White <twhite@detailsinc.com> wrote:
> I'm having problems copying a file with perl.
>
> system: HPUX10.20 perl, version 5.004_01
>
> $ perl -e '`cp /usr/bin/ls .` || die "$!"'
> No such file or directory at -e line 1.
>
> Actually, the file is copied correctly. I just don't like the error I'm
> getting.
> Any ideas?
>
Hm, why not just use the shell without perl ? But, since you're
using perl, you've got to worry about the obligatory hiss for
backticks in a void context :)
But, it's a venial sin so you could just just cover your
ears and forge ahead:
perl -e '`cp /usr/bin/ls .`; die "$?\n"'
Then, if you don't see the output: "0 at -e line 1.",
something went wrong.
Of course, even though the backticks will be a tad more
inefficient, you can smile: you've saved several keystrokes.
Now slowly uncover your ears :)
--
Charles DeRykus
------------------------------
Date: 28 May 1998 00:02:53 GMT
From: Tom Christiansen <tchrist@mox.perl.com>
Subject: Re: Backquote problem?
Message-Id: <6ki9jd$b4j$1@csnews.cs.colorado.edu>
[courtesy cc of this posting sent to cited author via email]
In comp.lang.perl.misc,
ced@bcstec.ca.boeing.com (Charles DeRykus) writes:
:inefficient, you can smile: you've saved several keystrokes.
The benefits conferred by typing proficiency are difficult
to understate.
--tom
--
And don't tell me there isn't one bit of difference between null and space,
because that's exactly how much difference there is. :-)
--Larry Wall in <10209@jpl-devvax.JPL.NASA.GOV>
------------------------------
Date: 27 May 1998 23:48:58 GMT
From: ? the platypus {aka David Formosa} <dformosa@st.nepean.uws.edu.au>
Subject: Re: Clearly define "free software"
Message-Id: <896312938.451699@cabal>
In <pudge-2705980817030001@dynamic265.ply.adelphia.net> pudge@pobox.com (Chris Nandor) writes:
>In article <u1hd8d0o46f.fsf@biohazard-cafe.MIT.EDU>, tb@mit.edu (Thomas
>Bushnell, n/BSG) wrote:
[...]
># I don't personally believe the theory,
># but it's got something in its credit--especially with regard to
># mathematical constructs--like, say, computer programs.
[...]
>A computer program is not a mathematical construct, it USES mathematical
>constructs (usually).
Then what about alogrithums? Where dose a mathimatical alogrythum become
a program?
--
I'm a perl programer; if you need perl programing, hire me.
Please excuse my spelling as I suffer from agraphia; see the url. Support NoCeM
http://www.cit.nepean.uws.edu.au/~dformosa/Spelling.html http://www.cm.org/
I'm sorry but I just don't consider 'because its yucky' a convincing argument
------------------------------
Date: 27 May 1998 18:54:43 +0000
From: David Wragg <davew@gatsby.u-net.com>
Subject: Re: Copylefting manuals
Message-Id: <jad8czk0i4.fsf@gatsby.u-net.com>
Sami Sandqvist <samiss@cc.tut.fi> writes:
> Paul Fisher <rao+usenet@oryxsoft.com> writes:
[Paul Fisher was posting on behalf on RMS]
> > Is it a good idea to permit using large examples in non-free programs
> > also? This is a complicated question, and I think the answer depends
> > on the details. Fairness says no; writing non-free programs is
> > refusing to cooperate with the free software community, so that
> > activity does not deserve any help from us. On the other hand, in
>
> I work as a programmer. In my country, if not otherwise agreed on, the
> employer gets the copyrights for my code. I can not GPL it. Would you
> not want to answer my questions about, for example, Perl? Am I evil?
> Do I "refuse to cooperate"?
I assume the first two questions are rhetorical.
Do you refuse to cooperate with the open source software community, by
working at a job where you cannot release your code under a open
source license? As an agent of your employer then you certainly are.
You may not be personally refusing to cooperate (you may produce open
source software in your spare time, for instance), but that is not
relevant when discussing your activities on behalf of your employer.
> [snip]
>
> When someone asks me a technical question, I answer it as well as I
> can, because I believe that this kind of information should be
> available to anyone. Am I wrong? What do you think I should do?
If someone asked me a question to which the answer had to be a
significant chunk of code, and I suspected that they would incorporate
that code into their work for their employer, I would be reluctant to
answer that question. I like helping people, but I won't do their jobs
for them (and I'm sure that you wouldn't either).
For those who consider that RMS was being restrictive in the paragraph
quoted above, please look at the copyright notices in most books
containing code examples - there is absolutely no permission to copy
the examples, so all readers (writing free or proprietry software)
have to rely on fair use.
--
Dave Wragg
------------------------------
Date: 27 May 1998 18:21:42 -0500
From: buhr@stat.wisc.edu (Kevin Buhr)
Subject: Re: Don't Know how to decrypt using PERL
Message-Id: <vbazpg347w9.fsf@mozart.stat.wisc.edu>
"Michael Yeung" <michaely@hills.alphanet.net.au> writes:
>
> Crypt function encrypts a string using DES algorithm, Right ?
Literally, yes. However, it doesn't encrypt the string you *give* it
using the DES algorithm. Instead, it (normally) encrypts a constant
string of 8 zeroes using the supplied string as a DES *key*.
> I have created some unreadable password using Crypt function with the salt
> like :
>
> result = crypt(plaintext , salt) ;
>
> I want to know if there is a way to decrypt the result and give back the
> plaintext !
What you call "plaintext" is actually the DES *key*. (The real
plaintext is the known string of 8 zeroes). There is no known "easy"
way to recover a DES key from such a small sample of ciphertext, even
when you know the plaintext, like you do here.
Of course, brute force attacks are possible. You would not want to
implement one in Perl, however, since it would run far too slowly.
Kevin <buhr@stat.wisc.edu>
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 17:15:25 -0700
From: "Larry Rosler" <lr@hpl.hp.com>
Subject: Re: Email address checker - comments welcome
Message-Id: <6kiaan$j5j@hplntx.hpl.hp.com>
Michael J Gebis wrote in message <6ki3ou$rhv@mozo.cc.purdue.edu>...
...
>It is, of course, possible to reject things that can't possibly work.
...
The following simple regex falls in that category. It makes very few
assumptions about what precedes the '@' and requires a Fully Qualified
Domain Name (liberally defined) after the '@'. The shortest string that
matches it is 'w@x.yz'. Comments welcome.
/^ [^\s@?]+ @ (?: \w[^\s.]* \. )+ \w\w+ $/x
--
Larry Rosler
Hewlett-Packard Laboratories
lr@hpl.hp.com
------------------------------
Date: 28 May 1998 00:49:23 GMT
From: Tom Christiansen <tchrist@mox.perl.com>
Subject: Re: Email address checker - comments welcome
Message-Id: <6kicaj$d2q$1@csnews.cs.colorado.edu>
[courtesy cc of this posting sent to cited author via email]
In comp.lang.perl.misc,
"Larry Rosler" <lr@hpl.hp.com> writes:
:assumptions about what precedes the '@' and requires a Fully Qualified
:Domain Name (liberally defined) after the '@'. The shortest string that
:matches it is 'w@x.yz'. Comments welcome.
My comment is that w@x.yz is not a valid mail address. :-)
Proof follows.
--tom
The original message was received at Wed, 27 May 1998 18:47:33 -0600
from localhost [127.0.0.1]
----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors -----
<w@x.yz>
----- Transcript of session follows -----
550 <w@x.yz>... Host unknown (Name server: x.yz: host not found)
----- Original message headers follow -----
Return-Path: <tchrist@jhereg.perl.com>
Received: from jhereg (localhost [127.0.0.1])
by jhereg.perl.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA02587
for <w@x.yz>; Wed, 27 May 1998 18:47:33 -0600
Message-Id: <199805280047.SAA02587@jhereg.perl.com>
To: w@x.yz
Subject: testing
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 18:47:33 -0500
From: Tom Christiansen <tchrist@jhereg.perl.com>
--
"I just hope I'm never promoted to the level of my incontinence."
--Larry Wall
------------------------------
Date: 27 May 1998 23:19:15 GMT
From: "BCopper" <bcopper@interrod.com>
Subject: Feature - Open Source Code
Message-Id: <01bd89c5$bb8414c0$65cb169d@mbecker.bannerfoundry.com>
When Netscape made its browser code public, the issue of the pros and cons
of open source code policies by software developers and manufacturers was
brought abruptly into the mainstream. CMPNet is running a special series
on the subject of open source code that brings together three separate
viewpoints on this issue. In the feature you will find interviews with
Linus Torvalds; the originator of LINUX, Jeff Papows; the CEO of Lotus and
Eric Raymond; open source code advocate and Fetchmail programmer.
In addition to these interviews you will find several articles on the
subject of open source code that examines issues such as the impact of free
software on the Internet's development. The article entitled Free
Software's Quiet Influence includes insightful commentary from Richard
Stallman, the found of the Free Software Foundation.
Here is the URL
http://www.cmpnet.com/special/0598spotlight.html?ls=oN527
__________________________
CMPnet
http://www.cmpnet.com
Your Online Technology Resource
------------------------------
Date: 27 May 1998 23:02:55 GMT
From: mgjv@comdyn.com.au (Martien Verbruggen)
Subject: Re: file size with perl and win NT
Message-Id: <6ki62v$p6r$2@comdyn.comdyn.com.au>
In article <356adaa6.11460019@news.club-internet.fr>,
vasile@club-internet.fr (Vasile CALMATUI) writes:
> Hello
>
> I have also a problem with big files under Win95.
>
> The problem is that I can read only the first 4-5 Mb from the file
> (total length is 25 Mb).
You don't mention HOW you are reading them. Are you trying to read all
of it into memory? Are you processing the files line by line? Is it a
binary file?
In any of these cases: If you have enough memory, then perl shouldn't
have any problem with files of these sizes at all.
> It works well by splitting the file in some little files of 4 Mb.
>
> Is this a Perl limitation ? Or Win95 ? On Perl under Win95 ?
None of the above, as far as I know..
The only thing I can think of is that you might be treating a binary
file as a text file, which will make life hard on Win32 platforms.
Martien
--
Martien Verbruggen |
Webmaster www.tradingpost.com.au | Inside every anarchy lurks an old boy
Commercial Dynamics Pty. Ltd. | network - Mitchell Kapor
NSW, Australia |
------------------------------
Date: 27 May 1998 23:29:10 GMT
From: mgjv@comdyn.com.au (Martien Verbruggen)
Subject: Re: Getting filesystem free space
Message-Id: <6ki7k6$pdi$1@comdyn.comdyn.com.au>
In article <356C25CA.510ABCFD@esoc.esa.de>,
Niall O Broin <nobroin@esoc.esa.de> writes:
> How do I do the above ? I'm sure I saw mention of a Perl statfs once
> upon a day, but I've looked everywhere (grepped the entire source,
> DejaNews, CPAN) to no avail. I know that I can simply grab the output of
> a df command, but I'd like a cleaner solution if there is one. I'd
> appreciate CC'ed replies to me.
There was a thread about this quite a while ago. You might be able to
find it on dejanews (It probably is in the old archive, try
"~g comp.lang.perl.misc & ~s space & ~s free")
The short answer is:
There is no platform independent way. On a unix system it's probably
easiest to parse the output of a df command, or one of the df
commands. I'll include a little script I wrote a while ago that checks
a bunch of file systems against some values, run from crontab:
#!/usr/local/bin/perl -w
# Make sure the line above points to the right version of perl
use strict;
use Mail::Internet;
# This defines when to warn.
#
# The key has to be the exact name of the mounted file system
#
# The value can be either of three:
#
# 1) A negative number: Will be compared against the 'avail' field.
# 2) A positive number: Will be compared against the 'used' field.
# 3) A percentage: Will be compared against the 'capacity' field.
#
# 2) and 3) give a maximum value, 1) gives a minimum
# Absolute values are in MBytes
my %warn = (
# System file systems
'/var' => -10,
'/export/home' => -50,
'/opt' => -20,
# Local dev
'/pro' => '50%',
# Remote dev
'/net/fileserver/usr2' => 800,
);
# Which people to send email to
my @recipients = qw( );
my $progname = $0;
$progname =~ s|.*/||; # Get basename only
$progname =~ s|\.\w*$||; # strip extension if any
# The next one will hold the actual data
# This can be don more efficiently, using references, but it's stored
# in two separate arrays for clarity.
my %df_used = ();
my %df_avail = ();
my %df_percent = ();
# The command to use. Since /usr/ucb/df returns the usage in kbytes by
# default, that is our choice.
my $df_cmd = "/usr/ucb/df";
# This array will hold all the warning that were issued, and will be
# mailed to the recipients
my @warnings = ();
# Get all the current disk usage stats, remove the first line, and all
# the newlines at the end.
my @df_lines = `$df_cmd`;
shift @df_lines;
chomp(@df_lines);
######
#
# Change this to parse the output of your df command correctly
#
# My lines look like:
#
# /dev/dsk/c0t0d0s0 45711 19371 26295 43% /
#
######
# Parse the lines
foreach (@df_lines)
{
my @f = split;
# @f now contains
#
# 0 1 2 3 4 5
# filesystem size used avail capacity mount
#
# We will only use 2, 3, 4 and 5
# get rid of this percent sign
$f[4] =~ s/%$//;
# And store it in Mbytes
$df_used{$f[5]} = int($f[2]/1000);
$df_avail{$f[5]} = int($f[3]/1000);
$df_percent{$f[5]} = $f[4];
}
# Now check what we just got against the wanted stuff
CHECK:
foreach (keys %warn)
{
if (!exists($df_avail{$_}))
{
push @warnings, "Cannot check $_: not mounted\n";
next CHECK;
}
my $chk = $warn{$_};
if ($chk =~ /%$/)
{
# It ends in a percent sign, lets check for that
$chk =~ s/%$//;
push @warnings,
"Mount $_ exceeds capacity: " .
"$df_percent{$_}% > $chk%\n"
if ($df_percent{$_} > $chk);
}
elsif ($chk < 0)
{
$chk *= -1;
push @warnings,
"Mount $_ doesn't have enough space: " .
"$df_avail{$_} MB < $chk MB\n"
if ($df_avail{$_} < $chk);
}
else
{
push @warnings,
"Mount $_ is using too much space: " .
"$df_used{$_} MB > $chk MB\n"
if ($df_avail{$_} > $chk);
}
}
if (@warnings)
{
if (@recipients)
{
my $mail = new Mail::Internet;
$mail->head->add('X-automaton', $progname);
$mail->head->add('Subject',
"$progname : " . scalar(@warnings) . " Warning(s)");
$mail->body(\@warnings);
$mail->head->add('To', join(',', @recipients));
$mail->smtpsend();
}
else
{
foreach(@warnings)
{
print "$_";
}
}
}
__END__
Martien
--
Martien Verbruggen |
Webmaster www.tradingpost.com.au | Very funny Scotty, now beam down my
Commercial Dynamics Pty. Ltd. | clothes.
NSW, Australia |
------------------------------
Date: 27 May 1998 23:13:41 GMT
From: mgjv@comdyn.com.au (Martien Verbruggen)
Subject: Re: Handling Dates Help Please
Message-Id: <6ki6n5$p6r$5@comdyn.comdyn.com.au>
In article <356C2220.7220B248@ral1.zko.dec.com>,
John Chambers <jc@ral1.zko.dec.com> writes:
> How about localtime(time-86400)?
>
> 86400 is 24*60*60, a useful number to memorize if you ever need to do
> date/time calculations.
If you ever have to do date and time calculations where the time
matters as well as the day, you might consider Daylight Savings Time
in your calculations as well.
Martien
--
Martien Verbruggen |
Webmaster www.tradingpost.com.au | Inside every anarchy lurks an old boy
Commercial Dynamics Pty. Ltd. | network - Mitchell Kapor
NSW, Australia |
------------------------------
Date: 27 May 1998 23:41:36 GMT
From: mgjv@comdyn.com.au (Martien Verbruggen)
Subject: Re: Job Postings
Message-Id: <6ki8bg$pdi$2@comdyn.comdyn.com.au>
In article <6ki0u4$mho$1@ns1.arlut.utexas.edu>,
smcdow@arlut.utexas.edu (Stuart McDow) writes:
> comdog@computerdog.com (brian d foy) writes:
>>
>> print "okay to post" if $newsgroup =~ m/\.jobs?\./;
> print "okay to post" if $newsgroup =~ m/\.jobs?\./ || readers_curious_about_perl_jobs() > 0;
if (readers_curious_about_perl_jobs() > 0)
{
foreach (@reader_capj)
{
$_->read_newsgroups(match_newsgroups(\.jobs?\.))
}
}
:)
Martien
--
Martien Verbruggen |
Webmaster www.tradingpost.com.au | Make it idiot proof and someone will
Commercial Dynamics Pty. Ltd. | make a better idiot.
NSW, Australia |
------------------------------
Date: 27 May 1998 16:48:03 -0700
From: t_patl@qualcomm.com (Pat Luther)
Subject: Re: LABOR CRISIS: Perl SW Guru NEEDED MA Intranet Start-up 80K+>+Equity
Message-Id: <t_patl.896312358@gano>
Eric Bohlman <ebohlman@netcom.com> writes:
>[dead comp.lang.perl removed, followups restricted to c.l.p.m]
>scott@softbase.com wrote:
>: You wanna know why there's a so-called "labor crisis"?! Here it is:
>[snip]
>: Holy smokes! This ad is so specific and detailed what are the odds
>: it will ever be filled? The "labor crisis" is a big hoax.
>Actually, the odds are great that it will be filled, soon. The usual
>reason an employer places an extremely specific and detailed ad is that
>they already have a specific candidate in mind, but there's some policy
>or legal reason that they have to advertise the position anyway
I disagree with this.
I make my living as a contractor, and usually respond to very highly specific
ads.
For my last three contracts, I was the only person considered for the job, but
hadn't ever talked to the company before I (or a contracting agent) saw the ad.
That's an agent's job: looking at people's (highly specific) resumes, and companies'
highly specific ads and matching them up and letting them know about each other...
Odds are, somewhere, there is a person with 5+ years of experience with Perl who
wouldn't mind living in the NH/MA area in exchange for a salary + equity and the
chance to get in on the ground floor of a relatively new company....
Now, the one that made me *really* laugh was a while back when I saw a company in San
Diego asking for a Software Configuration Management specialist who had 10+ years
of experience in the industry, including 5 years of programming and 5 of windows 95, and
was offering $30K for this person :-)
??pat
--
--
Pat Luther t_patl@qualcomm.com
The opinions expressed herein are probably not those of Qualcomm.
We don't really agree on all that much....
------------------------------
Date: 27 May 1998 23:15:23 GMT
From: ilya@math.ohio-state.edu (Ilya Zakharevich)
Subject: Re: list context: || vs or
Message-Id: <6ki6qb$ho5$1@mathserv.mps.ohio-state.edu>
[A complimentary Cc of this posting was sent to Nathan Torkington
<gnat@frii.com>],
who wrote in article <5q67irmmtl.fsf@prometheus.frii.com>:
> "Set" is a mathematical term. Mathematically, sets are not arrays.
>
> Then again, mathematicians appear to have stolen all the good terms
> that you could describe an array in, e.g. "group". I guess we're left
> to say that a scalar is a single thing, an array is a bunch of things
> accessed by position in the array, and a hash is a bunch of things
> accessed by name.
Both arrays and hashes are just functions.
> (waiting for those twin swine Orwant and mjd to tell me about the
> number theoretic term "bunch" ...)
Then you may relax.
Ilya
------------------------------
Date: 27 May 1998 22:56:51 GMT
From: mgjv@comdyn.com.au (Martien Verbruggen)
Subject: Re: list context: || vs or
Message-Id: <6ki5nj$p6r$1@comdyn.comdyn.com.au>
In article <Pine.GSO.3.96.980527072919.13639J-100000@user2.teleport.com>,
Tom Phoenix <rootbeer@teleport.com> writes:
> [ I know that Martien understands this stuff; most of this is for the
> benefit of other readers of this newsgroup. ]
Actually, I was posting too fast. I forgot the perlsub documentation
that explains the mechanism in which explains how values are returned
from subroutines: in a single flat list. (as Tom Christiansen pointed
out in a cc to a post that I haven't seen show up yet)
My fault here was to rely too heavily on the accuracy of the
documentation (second time in a few weeks :)), and assuming that for
builtins this mechanism might not be valid. I'm glad that work is
being done to upgrade the documentation.
Since this question, or rather the confusion about the difference
between lists and arrays, comes up regularly, maybe this should become
an entry in the faq?
Martien
--
Martien Verbruggen |
Webmaster www.tradingpost.com.au | Hi, Dave here, what's the root
Commercial Dynamics Pty. Ltd. | password?
NSW, Australia |
------------------------------
Date: 8 Mar 97 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
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Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 8 Mar 97)
Message-Id: <null>
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weekly in the group, but is not distributed in the digest.
For other requests pertaining to the digest, send mail to
perl-users-request@ruby.oce.orst.edu. Do not waste your time or mine
sending perl questions to the -request address, I don't have time to
answer them even if I did know the answer.
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End of Perl-Users Digest V8 Issue 2741
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