[9079] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 2697 Volume: 8
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Fri May 22 21:07:46 1998
Date: Fri, 22 May 98 18:00:34 -0700
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Fri, 22 May 1998 Volume: 8 Number: 2697
Today's topics:
Re: .= food for thought? (Abigail)
A Perl starter question about rounding variables... <udo@puni.osf.lt>
Re: Can I interpolate Perl variables in POD output? <rootbeer@teleport.com>
Re: Clearly define "free software" <barmar@bbnplanet.com>
Re: Daemon code??? (Michael Fuhr)
Re: Daemon code??? <zenin@bawdycaste.org>
Does P5P exist on a read-only news server somewhere? dean@home.biol.sc.edu
error building perl, undefined reference to `herrno' (rev. bean amerika)
Re: Getting hex codes from string <rootbeer@teleport.com>
Re: Getting hex codes from string (brian d foy)
Re: GNU attacks on the open software community (Thomas Bushnell, n/BSG)
Re: GNU attacks on the open software community <recon@cavalry.com>
Re: GNU attacks on the open software community (Joe Buck)
Re: GNU attacks on the open software community (Greg Lindahl)
Re: GNU attacks on the open software community <barmar@bbnplanet.com>
Re: GNU attacks on the open software community <barmar@bbnplanet.com>
Re: GNU attacks on the open software community <barmar@bbnplanet.com>
Re: GNU attacks on the open software community <barmar@bbnplanet.com>
Re: GNU attacks on the open software community (John Stanley)
Re: I can't use any modules in FreeBSD! <zenin@bawdycaste.org>
Re: inheriting filehandles across exec <zenin@bawdycaste.org>
Re: inheriting filehandles across exec <rootbeer@teleport.com>
Re: More double standards out of the FSF <recon@cavalry.com>
Re: More double standards out of the FSF <hp@pobox.com>
Re: Perl indention formatter/standardizer <rootbeer@teleport.com>
Re: Quiet summary <recon@cavalry.com>
Re: Re-direct question <rootbeer@teleport.com>
Re: Re-direct question <rootbeer@teleport.com>
Re: replace line in file <ahdiii@webspan.net>
Sending mail with Perl- problems with '@' <sweiss@gslink.com>
Re: Sending mail with Perl- problems with '@' <rootbeer@teleport.com>
Re: SRC: Insertion-order hashes (Ken Williams)
Re: Tom Christiansen attacks the free software communit <barmar@bbnplanet.com>
Re: What's the right idiom? (Tad McClellan)
Re: wierd regex question (Tad McClellan)
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 8 Mar 97) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: 23 May 1998 00:10:10 GMT
From: abigail@fnx.com (Abigail)
Subject: Re: .= food for thought?
Message-Id: <6k5452$2a3$1@client3.news.psi.net>
Craig Berry (cberry@cinenet.net) wrote on MDCCXXV September MCMXCIII in
<URL: news:6k4u4r$q1a$2@marina.cinenet.net>:
++ Belg4mit (belg4mit@aol.com) wrote:
++ : >All of these could lead to syntactic ambiguities. For example, if I say
++ : >$a =.4;
++ : >do I mean to assign 0.4 to $a, or to append the string "4" to $a?
++ :
++ : no ambiguity, $a =. 4 vs $a = .4 (use spaces like you should)
++
++ But these spaces aren't required by the language as it stands. Adding
++ that requirement would break a lot of existing code.
There is no ambiguity in $a=.4 (if there would be a =. operator) for the
same reason there is no ambiguity in $a+++$b.
The problem of course is breaking old code.
Abigail
--
perl -MLWP::UserAgent -MHTML::TreeBuilder -MHTML::FormatText -wle'print +(HTML::FormatText -> new -> format (HTML::TreeBuilder -> new -> parse (LWP::UserAgent -> new -> request (HTTP::Request -> new ("GET", "http://work.ucsd.edu:5141/cgi-bin/http_webster?isindex=perl")) -> content)) =~ /(.*\))[-\s]+Addition/s) [0]'
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 02:27:21 +0300
From: "Mantvydas" <udo@puni.osf.lt>
Subject: A Perl starter question about rounding variables...
Message-Id: <35667ba4.0@news.lexicomp.net>
What functions from which modules are to be used for rounding variables?
I found somewhere mentioning floor(), ceil() and round()... But I don't have
the modules with their implementation...
Please help me find those modules... I'd be lucky if you send them to me...
Please warn me before sending... :)
BTW, everything's about ActiveState's Perl for Win32 (Build 316)
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 00:04:39 GMT
From: Tom Phoenix <rootbeer@teleport.com>
To: Quentin Fennessy <quentin@shaddam.amd.com>
Subject: Re: Can I interpolate Perl variables in POD output?
Message-Id: <Pine.GSO.3.96.980522165954.27323N-100000@user2.teleport.com>
On 22 May 1998, Quentin Fennessy wrote:
> Is it possible to include Perl variables within the POD section (such
> as $VERSION) and have that variable evaluated and printed as 1.17 (or
> whatever)?
There's no provision to do this in the POD specification. Thus the only
way to do this is to exploit bugs in the various POD translators. :-)
But there has been some talk about doing this kind of thing, for just the
reason you give. Stay tuned; a future version of Perl (or POD) may make
this possible. For now, it's probably best to say something like "The
version number of this module may be found ...."
Hope this helps!
--
Tom Phoenix Perl Training and Hacking Esperanto
Randal Schwartz Case: http://www.rahul.net/jeffrey/ovs/
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 00:59:27 GMT
From: Barry Margolin <barmar@bbnplanet.com>
Subject: Re: Clearly define "free software"
Message-Id: <Pbp91.27$hF2.165182@cam-news-reader1.bbnplanet.com>
In article <6k4fjm$2f8@mozz.unh.edu>, Paul A Sand <pas@unh.edu> wrote:
>So--fine--they've defined their term via a three-pronged test. And we
>could quibble endlessly over why *those* three criteria, why not two,
>or four, or a different three, etc. Let's not. I only want to make the
I hope this isn't considered a quibble, but I think it's safe to say that
those criteria were used because they're the kinds of things RMS wants to
be able to do with software, thinks that many others would also want to do,
and are often prohibited by traditional software distribution means.
>And let's also make the observation that ``FSF-free'' is defined
>entirely in terms of the users' freedoms, nothing about that of the
>creators'. Or, put more precisely, the creators have no special
>freedoms with respect to their FSF-free software that nobody else has.
Except that they have the right to make non-free versions, if the work is
entirely of their own creation.
>And that's no accident; see RMS's essay ``Why Software Should Not Have
>Owners'' at http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/why-free.html.
In RMS's ideal world, people wouldn't feel the need to own software, so
they wouldn't consider the above right an interesting thing to have. Just
as 200 years ago slavery was considered normal by many people, but now it's
considered abhorent. RMS wishes for a society in which intellectual
property is considered as wrong as human property.
>I'd suggest using ``unownable software'' instead; it's not as pretty,
>but it's more accurate and honest in reflecting FSF goals.
That's probably the best suggestion I've heard in a long time.
--
Barry Margolin, barmar@bbnplanet.com
GTE Internetworking, Powered by BBN, Cambridge, MA
*** DON'T SEND TECHNICAL QUESTIONS DIRECTLY TO ME, post them to newsgroups.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 23:07:05 GMT
From: mfuhr@dimensional.com (Michael Fuhr)
Subject: Re: Daemon code???
Message-Id: <6k50en$jdj@flatland.dimensional.com>
braunb@my-dejanews.com writes:
> I'm looking for code to implement a UNIX daemon in perl. I searched the
> perl.com references but couldn't find anything there. I could always
> implement W. Richard Steven's Unix Network Programming code example, but,
> I'd rather not re-invent the wheel.
>
> Any leads would be appreciated.
Searching the Perl FAQ for "daemon" produces a few hits. There are
also a few modules on CPAN with the word "daemon" in their name.
> -----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
> http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
Searching Deja News for "perl" and "daemon" produces a LOT of hits :-)
Not all of them may be useful, but some probably are.
--
Michael Fuhr
http://www.dimensional.com/~mfuhr/
------------------------------
Date: 22 May 1998 23:44:10 GMT
From: Zenin <zenin@bawdycaste.org>
Subject: Re: Daemon code???
Message-Id: <895881097.508559@thrush.omix.com>
braunb@my-dejanews.com wrote:
: I'm looking for code to implement a UNIX daemon in perl. I searched the
: perl.com references but couldn't find anything there. I could always
: implement W. Richard Steven's Unix Network Programming code example, but,
: I'd rather not re-invent the wheel.
C is really close to Perl here. Use the POSIX module to get
setsid(). The rest is standard Unix system programming so Steven's
"Advanced Programming in the UNIX environment" will probably have
better examples then his Networking books.
--
-Zenin
zenin@archive.rhps.org
------------------------------
Date: 22 May 1998 18:19:46 -0400
From: dean@home.biol.sc.edu
Subject: Does P5P exist on a read-only news server somewhere?
Message-Id: <m34syiymm5.fsf@home.biol.sc.edu>
I recall that some time ago there was a news server somewhere in
NetLand that offered a read-only version of the p5p list. I'm not
sufficiently involved to have the actual email sent to me, but I did
enjoy dipping into the news version on occasion.
Does that exist anywhere? Or do I have to subscribe to the mailing
list and bite the bullet to finally figure out how to read news with
Gnus...?
Thanks!
-Dean
------------------------------
Date: 22 May 1998 20:30:44 -0400
From: hermes@xochipilli.com (rev. bean amerika)
Subject: error building perl, undefined reference to `herrno'
Message-Id: <kybtspq157.fsf_-_@nova.li.com>
i'm trying to build perl5.004 (or 5.004_04, same error) under linux.
it breaks here:
cc -L/usr/local/lib -o miniperl miniperlmain.o libperl.a -lndbm -lgdbm -ldbm -ldb -ldl -lm -lc
libperl.a(pp_sys.o): In function `Perl_pp_ghostent':
pp_sys.o(.text+0x6fe3): undefined reference to `herrno'
using dejanews i found the error mentioned twice in this group over
the last few years, but no responses, and no info in any of the docs.
any help would be appreciated.
bean
--
o oo "I EXPLODED MY BUSINESS WITH EMAIL"
oo oo ooo oo o o -spammer's subject line
o o oo o o o o rev. bean
o o o http://xochipilli.com/people/hermes
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 23:51:09 GMT
From: Tom Phoenix <rootbeer@teleport.com>
To: Kevin Reid <kpreid@ibm.net>
Subject: Re: Getting hex codes from string
Message-Id: <Pine.GSO.3.96.980522165024.27323K-100000@user2.teleport.com>
On Fri, 22 May 1998, Kevin Reid wrote:
> open FILE;
Even when your script is "just an example" (and perhaps especially in that
case!) you should _always_ check the return value after opening a file.
Thanks!
--
Tom Phoenix Perl Training and Hacking Esperanto
Randal Schwartz Case: http://www.rahul.net/jeffrey/ovs/
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 20:06:37 -0400
From: comdog@computerdog.com (brian d foy)
Subject: Re: Getting hex codes from string
Message-Id: <comdog-ya02408000R2205982006370001@news.panix.com>
Keywords: from just another new york perl hacker
In article <Pine.GSO.3.96.980522165024.27323K-100000@user2.teleport.com>, Tom Phoenix <rootbeer@teleport.com> posted:
>On Fri, 22 May 1998, Kevin Reid wrote:
>
>> open FILE;
>
>Even when your script is "just an example" (and perhaps especially in that
>case!) you should _always_ check the return value after opening a file.
not to mention choosing something to open()! :)
--
brian d foy <comdog@computerdog.com>
CGI Meta FAQ <URL:http://computerdog.com/CGI_MetaFAQ.html>
Comprehensive Perl Archive Network (CPAN) <URL:http://www.perl.com>
Perl Mongers T-shirts! <URL:http://www.pm.org/tshirts.html>
------------------------------
Date: 22 May 1998 11:38:13 -0400
From: tb@mit.edu (Thomas Bushnell, n/BSG)
Subject: Re: GNU attacks on the open software community
Message-Id: <u1hzpgaxqmy.fsf@ten-thousand-dollar-bill.MIT.EDU>
Tom Christiansen <tchrist@mox.perl.com> writes:
> I beg to differ with you. You are hurting our community. Please stop
> the lies.
Your rhetoric is, once again, getting you carried away. Take a
breather, Tom. Go sit under at tree and watch some clouds.
> I once again point out that there exist more than 1,000 printed pages of
> free Perl documentation. This the FSF or anyone is welcome to use on a
> duplex printer, make a 500-page book, and give it away for free or for
> their costs, and thus do the community a service. No one is stopping you.
But they are not free to sell it at a profit, and they are not free to
distribute a modified copy at all. Within the meaning of the free
software community, this is not libre at all. It's better than
nothing, but it's not as good as libre.
> But you aren't going to allowed to lie about work created by others,
> to steal things and claim them as your own and deny their authors due
> copyright recognition. Moreover, there's a significant social contract
> that you break in doing so. If that's the FSF's idea of freedom, then
> let us part company now, this very eve.
Nobody, absolutely nobody wants to remove credit from anybody.
Thomas
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 17:11:56 -0600
From: Bill Anderson <recon@cavalry.com>
Subject: Re: GNU attacks on the open software community
Message-Id: <3566063C.E705BF8D@cavalry.com>
David Kastrup wrote:
>
> Olof Oberg <millNO@SPAMludd.luth.se> writes:
>
> > David Kastrup wrote:
> > > Mercedes will acknowledge the importance Bosch plays for their cars.
> > > Still they would object to Bosch calling Mercedes cars Bosch/Mercedes
> > > or a variant Bosch car.
> > >
> > > The whole credit issue could have been managed much much more sanely.
> > > Choosing the "brand name" for the attack was pretty stupid.
> > Another example. Ford Cosworth. Put the Cosworth engine (and
> > probably some addtional tweaks of braking systems etc) into
> > a Ford and you get a Ford Cosworth. Put the Linux kernel into
> > a mainly GNU system than you have a GNU/Linux system :).
>
> Only that there was no GNU system. There were a lot of excellent and
> versatile parts useful for all kinds of cars, and quite a few missing
> parts as well, and all had to be assembled into one coherent system.
Linux: OPERATING system
--
Bill Anderson Cyberhighway Internet Services, SYCON
"Pluralitas non est ponenda sine neccesitate."
Plurality should not be assumed without neccesity.
------------------------------
Date: 22 May 1998 16:28:54 -0700
From: jbuck@best.com (Joe Buck)
Subject: Re: GNU attacks on the open software community
Message-Id: <6k51nm$n1h$1@shell17.ba.best.com>
Tom Christiansen <tchrist@mox.perl.com> wrote:
> [courtesy cc of this posting sent to cited author via email]
>
>In comp.lang.perl.misc,
> robert havoc pennington <hp@pobox.com> writes:
>:the free docs will never be as good
>:as the regular ones.
>
>Please, please stop repeating this miscarriage of truth.
Please stop claiming that this is a miscarriage of truth.
>The Perl documentation are free. They always have been.
>They always will be.
If they come with restrictions that violate the Open Source Guidelines,
then they aren't free enough.
--
-- Joe Buck
work: jbuck@synopsys.com, otherwise jbuck@welsh-buck.org or jbuck@best.net
http://www.welsh-buck.org/
------------------------------
Date: 22 May 1998 23:08:31 GMT
From: lindahl@pbm.com (Greg Lindahl)
Subject: Re: GNU attacks on the open software community
Message-Id: <6k50hf$4sl@news1.newsguy.com>
abigail@fnx.com (Abigail) writes:
> I'm not saying the entry is an insult to the books about Perl. It's
> an insult to the amount of free documentation (many of which is made
> by the authors of the books) available for Perl. I don't get as much
> documentation with a C compiler as I get with Perl. Not by a long shot.
Uh, you don't even know if that Tasks entry is about anything other
than professional Perl books... maybe it isn't talking about the free
documentation. In that case, Tom's remarks look pretty childish, don't
they?
-- g
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 23:51:36 GMT
From: Barry Margolin <barmar@bbnplanet.com>
Subject: Re: GNU attacks on the open software community
Message-Id: <cco91.22$hF2.165182@cam-news-reader1.bbnplanet.com>
In article <6k45ri$kef$1@Mars.mcs.net>, Leslie Mikesell <les@MCS.COM> wrote:
>Yes it does, if your work consists of making GPL code and non-GPL
>code interoperate. The GPL takes away your right to share such
>code under any circumstances. You can write it for yourself, you
And I say that it's the non-free program program that takes away your right
to share the code, since it doesn't allow you to include the source code
and/or transfer the sharing right to the recipient.
Or it's neither and both taking away your right to share. The two original
codes each have their own licenses for redistribution, so the combination
has to be redistributed under terms compatible with both. If the licenses
have mutually-exclusive requirements, this is not possible. Neither one is
solely responsible; if you claim so, it's only due to your personal biases
(you were happy to abide by the terms of one license, so it must be the
other one's fault).
>can use it, someone can hire you to write such code for their own
>use, but you can't give them a copy.
If someone hires you to write it, it's a "work for hire", and it's owned by
the employer, so giving it to him is not making a copy. He probably can't
let you take a copy with you when you're done, though!
--
Barry Margolin, barmar@bbnplanet.com
GTE Internetworking, Powered by BBN, Cambridge, MA
*** DON'T SEND TECHNICAL QUESTIONS DIRECTLY TO ME, post them to newsgroups.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 23:55:25 GMT
From: Barry Margolin <barmar@bbnplanet.com>
Subject: Re: GNU attacks on the open software community
Message-Id: <Nfo91.23$hF2.165182@cam-news-reader1.bbnplanet.com>
In article <6k3mag$or5$1@tanglefoot.lunatech.com>,
Bart Schuller <schuller@tanglefoot.lunatech.net> wrote:
>In article <Bw891.110$152.1043244@cam-news-reader1.bbnplanet.com>,
>Barry Margolin <barmar@bbnplanet.com> wrote:
>>Hmm, do people think they don't have to pay for Pepsi Free?
>>
>>Actually, it's interesting: if it were called Free Pepsi, they probably
>>would. What a difference Meta-t makes!
>
>Here in Holland, we have a large chain of record stores called the
>"Free Record Shop". You have to pay for your CDs there and because it's
>a large chain, I wouldn't even call it "libre".
And isn't there a Frije (Free) University in the Netherlands? I'll bet it
isn't cheap to go there. I'm not sure what it's free of or from.
--
Barry Margolin, barmar@bbnplanet.com
GTE Internetworking, Powered by BBN, Cambridge, MA
*** DON'T SEND TECHNICAL QUESTIONS DIRECTLY TO ME, post them to newsgroups.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 00:23:48 GMT
From: Barry Margolin <barmar@bbnplanet.com>
Subject: Re: GNU attacks on the open software community
Message-Id: <oGo91.24$hF2.165182@cam-news-reader1.bbnplanet.com>
In article <3565B905.DC80058C@mindspring.com>,
Keith G. Murphy <keithmur@mindspring.com> wrote:
>I must confess partiality to "freed", as someone else suggested. It's
>short, and nicely conveys the idea that the freedom was conferred upon
>the software, and has permanence. Just like a freed slave.
But "freed" implies that it was once not free. A freed slave is a person
who was once a slave, but had his slavery terminated. Someone who has
always been free is not freed. And in general, free software is born free,
it is not usually proprietary software that has since had its freedom.
There are a few exceptions, though: Mozilla would be an example of freed
software (it was born as the proprietary Netscape).
--
Barry Margolin, barmar@bbnplanet.com
GTE Internetworking, Powered by BBN, Cambridge, MA
*** DON'T SEND TECHNICAL QUESTIONS DIRECTLY TO ME, post them to newsgroups.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 00:31:37 GMT
From: Barry Margolin <barmar@bbnplanet.com>
Subject: Re: GNU attacks on the open software community
Message-Id: <JNo91.25$hF2.165182@cam-news-reader1.bbnplanet.com>
In article <6k4eks$o4c$1@client3.news.psi.net>,
Abigail <abigail@fnx.com> wrote:
>Now, I don't see anything mentioned about free on the page except for
>the point about perl. And its context is
>
> "There are proprietary books, but these are no good, because
> they are being withheld from our community by their owners."
>
>Which is exactly what made me angry. It doesn't point the the existing
>manuals. It points to books. It strongly suggests there are no good
>manuals except for the books. And that is a terrible lie.
Did these non-book manuals exist 5 years ago, when the line you quote was
written? I'm not accusing you of trying to bend the truth, I truly don't
know, and believe that you may not have been aware of the full context of
the quote. If these manuals didn't exist then, the worst RMS can be blamed
for is not bothering to update the task list, not lying. I suspect that
wordsmithing the task list is probably way down on everyone's priority list
(although maybe this flamefest will push it up -- I've never seen this much
volume in gnu.misc.discuss before).
--
Barry Margolin, barmar@bbnplanet.com
GTE Internetworking, Powered by BBN, Cambridge, MA
*** DON'T SEND TECHNICAL QUESTIONS DIRECTLY TO ME, post them to newsgroups.
------------------------------
Date: 23 May 1998 00:46:29 GMT
From: stanley@skyking.OCE.ORST.EDU (John Stanley)
Subject: Re: GNU attacks on the open software community
Message-Id: <6k5695$32b$1@news.NERO.NET>
In article <7E52F4A23A745FA1.E65BA4FCC2AFC606.09B10913222F282F@library-proxy.airnews.net>,
le Fant me <fantome/@/usa/./net> wrote:
>You are mistaken. The PerlFAQ is available on CDs -- legally so.
>Because the people who are putting it on the CDs are not charging
>extra because they are putting the PerlFAQ on the CDs.
>
>What cannot happen is that a German publisher cannot take the PerlFAQ
>and publish a book from it and not give Mr. Christiansen his due
>royalties -- unless the book is sold at base cost. What cannot happen
>is that a Ukrainian CD-ROM presser cannot take the PerlFAQ and produce
>a CD with the PerlFAQ on it and charge $20 because the PerlFAQ is on
>the CD.
So let me ask a hypothetical question.
Suppose a book publisher wants to sell a book about computers. He hasn't
decided what will be in it yet, but he sets a target list price of $120.
He comes accross the Perl documentation. "Wow", he says, "look at all
this great stuff. It will make people want to buy my book." He copies it
all and puts it all in the book. Ahhh, but the licensing in the material
(as interpreted here) means he can't charge more for the book because he
did it, so he leaves the price at $120. There's so much perl stuff, he
can't fit anything else into the book, so it goes to print.
This is legal, right? He didn't charge any extra for the book just
because the perl docs were in it. Here's the reason it is legal:
>You are mistaken. The PerlFAQ is available on CDs -- legally so.
>Because the people who are putting it on the CDs are not charging
>extra because they are putting the PerlFAQ on the CDs.
------------------------------
Date: 22 May 1998 23:24:25 GMT
From: Zenin <zenin@bawdycaste.org>
Subject: Re: I can't use any modules in FreeBSD!
Message-Id: <895879913.66036@thrush.omix.com>
[posted & mailed]
Tom Christiansen <tchrist@mox.perl.com> wrote:
: In comp.lang.perl.misc, mfuhr@dimensional.com (Michael Fuhr) writes:
: :/usr/bin/perl is Perl 4 on most FreeBSD systems
:
: That's dumb.
Yes, but there is good (although belated) reasoning behind it.
Perl is considered a system tool on FreeBSD as many system utilities
use it. Therefor it must be buildable by make world. To do that,
it must build under bmake. No one has yet to offer to port the
perl5 build to bmake as it's likely a very time consuming task. The
fact that 'cd /usr/ports/lang/perl5; make install' is already very
simple, no one has seen that giving such time to the task
meaningful. -I'm pretty sure the perl5 port replaces /usr/bin/perl
by default anyway. No system tools have "perl5 incompatibilities",
so that's not even an issue. Since the ports are not part of the
OS core, it can't be considered for make world.
Because of all this, the FreeBSD team has found that it's been much
simpler to patch the copy of perl4 when problems come up, then to
move perl5 to bmake. This also meens FreeBSD has one of the best
supported copies of perl4 around. :-)
Being buildable via bmake is the only issue holding up Perl5 in the
FreeBSD core, according to Jordan Hubbard (FreeBSD core team).
--
-Zenin
zenin@archive.rhps.org
------------------------------
Date: 22 May 1998 23:29:58 GMT
From: Zenin <zenin@bawdycaste.org>
Subject: Re: inheriting filehandles across exec
Message-Id: <895880245.921256@thrush.omix.com>
matthew d. p. k. lanier <lanier@shell6.ba.best.com> wrote:
: can filehandles be inherited by an exec'd process?
stdin, stdout, and stderr. That's it pretty much it. You might
be able to get stuff to pass fd's < 2 by using fdopen() of the
IO::Handle class. Maybe...
All descriptors are inherited by fork()ed children however, if you
can get away with not needing to exec().
--
-Zenin
zenin@archive.rhps.org
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 23:56:20 GMT
From: Tom Phoenix <rootbeer@teleport.com>
To: "matthew d. p. k. lanier" <lanier@shell6.ba.best.com>
Subject: Re: inheriting filehandles across exec
Message-Id: <Pine.GSO.3.96.980522165532.27323L-100000@user2.teleport.com>
On Fri, 22 May 1998, matthew d. p. k. lanier wrote:
> can filehandles be inherited by an exec'd process?
Yes; see $^F in perlvar. Hope this helps!
--
Tom Phoenix Perl Training and Hacking Esperanto
Randal Schwartz Case: http://www.rahul.net/jeffrey/ovs/
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 16:58:09 -0600
From: Bill Anderson <recon@cavalry.com>
Subject: Re: More double standards out of the FSF
Message-Id: <35660301.E599E06D@cavalry.com>
Abigail wrote:
>
> robert havoc pennington (hp@pobox.com) wrote on MDCCXXV September
> MCMXCIII in <URL: news:wsnzpga7qsq.fsf@harper.uchicago.edu>:
> ++
> ++ I am not sure what else one expects RMS[1] to do. He has his values
> ++ and goals; he puts on his task list what he thinks needs to be done in
> ++ order to achieve them. It's not like he mentioned Tom personally, he
> ++ just said "we need some free[2] Perl docs." Just like he says "we need
> ++ a free version of Motif," or "we need a free Qt," or whatever it may
> ++ be. Perl docs didn't get singled out, and neither did Tom C. Yet Tom
> ++ C. is the only person here flaming.
See below ....
>
> The exact quote is:
>
> > We very urgently need documentation for some parts of the system that
> > already exist.
> >
> > * A good free manual for Perl. (There are proprietary books, but
> > these are no good, because they are being withheld from our
> > community by their owners.)
>
> Stepping over the (for me surprising) case that Perl is considered
> part of the GNU system, it suggest the only good manuals for Perl are
> the books. That is a LIE. A very bad LIE. It's ok to say that you don't
> think the license of the documentation isn't free enough, but that is
> not what the page says. It's is strongly suggesting there is no good
> manual but books available.
>
> Abigail
Not to mention it was/is (as of this writing) the *only* one with that
parenthetical.
If there exists a need for x, that would imply there is no x. non of the
other requests for manuals included that tag. As an example, there are
proprietary manuals for 'writing apps in for the X-window system'. but
you do not see the above parenthetical applied to the request for
FSF-approved manuals for doing so.
I believe this is what likely set Tom off. It readily appears perl was
singled out.
--
Bill Anderson Cyberhighway Internet Services, SYCON
"Pluralitas non est ponenda sine neccesitate."
Plurality should not be assumed without neccesity.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 23:45:14 GMT
From: robert havoc pennington <hp@pobox.com>
Subject: Re: More double standards out of the FSF
Message-Id: <wsniumx27lh.fsf@harper.uchicago.edu>
Bill Anderson <recon@cavalry.com> writes:
>
> Not to mention it was/is (as of this writing) the *only* one with that
> parenthetical.
> If there exists a need for x, that would imply there is no x. non of the
> other requests for manuals included that tag. As an example, there are
> proprietary manuals for 'writing apps in for the X-window system'. but
> you do not see the above parenthetical applied to the request for
> FSF-approved manuals for doing so.
>
> I believe this is what likely set Tom off. It readily appears perl was
> singled out.
>
Only thing is that this isn't what he was complaining about. It does
appear that there's a jab at ORA, and it does appear to imply
that there are no non-book docs. (though the latter is probably simple
cluelessness rather than intentional, or they may well consider all
those man pages a "book.")
However, Tom C. went off on a whole really weird thing about not
receiving credit and people "stealing" his work, which was quite
irrelevant; and he kept talking about how his docs were "free" (of
cost) when the contrast made in the FSF comment is clearly "free"
vs. "proprietary." Both of those things were pretty random and
off-base, which made me at least pretty unreceptive to the possibly
correct things he had to say.
It's hard to see how this task list item alone == unspeakable evil or
whatever he said.
I think it's clear that there are some personal squabbles between Tom
C. and the FSF that go way beyond the web page comment. I bet he is
was just looking for an excuse to go off, and the real root of the
anger lies elsewhere. Not to say that the FSF doesn't reciprocate the
anger. There seems to be some real personal bitterness between the FSF
and the ORA/Perl leaders, and it will be in the interests of everyone
if they can make up, or at least take it behind closed doors.
Havoc Pennington ==== http://pobox.com/~hp
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 23:58:15 GMT
From: Tom Phoenix <rootbeer@teleport.com>
To: Dwight <dwight95_remove@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Perl indention formatter/standardizer
Message-Id: <Pine.GSO.3.96.980522165719.27323M-100000@user2.teleport.com>
On Fri, 22 May 1998, Dwight wrote:
> Tom Phoenix wrote in message ...
> >On 22 May 1998, Tim Furlong wrote:
> >
> >> I'm looking for a utility, preferably a perl script, that will correct
> >> the indention in a perl script....
> >
> >Yes, it's hidden in the FAQ. :-) Search for "formatter". Hope this helps!
> >
> Actually, I tried that, & it don't work!
Perhaps you were looking in an old version of the FAQ? Try the version
which comes with current versions of Perl. Cheers!
--
Tom Phoenix Perl Training and Hacking Esperanto
Randal Schwartz Case: http://www.rahul.net/jeffrey/ovs/
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 17:06:07 -0600
From: Bill Anderson <recon@cavalry.com>
Subject: Re: Quiet summary
Message-Id: <356604DF.4FFAE757@cavalry.com>
Olof Oberg wrote:
>
> Tom Christiansen wrote:
> > In comp.lang.perl.misc, lindahl@pbm.com (Greg Lindahl) writes:
> > :And this
> > :member of the Perl community knows full well that rms has a very
> > :particular definition of "free".
> >
> > The word you are looking for there is not "particular", but "peculiar:
> > one's own; belonging solely or especially to an individual; not possessed
> > by others; of private, personal, or characteristic possession and use;
> > not owned in common or in participation."
>
> From http://www.perl.com/opensource.html
> One of the key decisions reached by this group was to promote the
> term "Open Source" software in place of "free software."
> So "free software" and "open source software" is interchangable.
> Lets go to http://www.opensource.org for a correct definition.
> (open source is the marketing name for free software according
> to the FAQ here)
> 1. Free Redistribution
> 3. Derived Works
> The mere ability to read source isn't enough to support
> independent peer review and rapid evolutionary selection.
> For rapid evolution to happen, people need to be able to
> experiment with and redistribute modifications.
> 6. No Discrimination Against Fields of Endeavor
> The major intention of this clause is to prohibit license
> traps that prevent open source from being used commercially.
> We want commercial users to join our community, not feel
> excluded from it. [from the explanation]
>
> From the PerlFAQ
> Any commercial use of any portion of this document without
> prior written authorization by its authors will be subject
> to appropriate action.
>
> My conclusion is that the Perl documentation is not open source
> and therefore not free either. Free of charge yes, but not free
> as defined above.
>
documentation is not software.
--
Bill Anderson Cyberhighway Internet Services, SYCON
"Pluralitas non est ponenda sine neccesitate."
Plurality should not be assumed without neccesity.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 23:40:01 GMT
From: Tom Phoenix <rootbeer@teleport.com>
To: Larry Rosler <lr@hpl.hp.com>
Subject: Re: Re-direct question
Message-Id: <Pine.GSO.3.96.980522163839.27323I-100000@user2.teleport.com>
On Fri, 22 May 1998, Larry Rosler wrote:
> if ($host =~ /\Q$res_dom\E$) { # If they are coming from Varian
So, you'd treat connections from notvarian.com and
varian.com.haha.students.bedrock.edu as coming from varian? Hmmm... I
think there's a better way to identify a domain. :-)
--
Tom Phoenix Perl Training and Hacking Esperanto
Randal Schwartz Case: http://www.rahul.net/jeffrey/ovs/
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 23:41:17 GMT
From: Tom Phoenix <rootbeer@teleport.com>
To: Christoph Wernli <cwernli@dwc.ch>
Subject: Re: Re-direct question
Message-Id: <Pine.GSO.3.96.980522164014.27323J-100000@user2.teleport.com>
On Fri, 22 May 1998, Christoph Wernli wrote:
> if ($host =~ m/$res_dom/){ # $host could be 'foo.varian.com'
Or perhaps varianxcom.anybody-else.com, right? I think there's a better
way to identify the domain. :-)
--
Tom Phoenix Perl Training and Hacking Esperanto
Randal Schwartz Case: http://www.rahul.net/jeffrey/ovs/
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 19:13:43 -0400
From: Arthur Dardia <ahdiii@webspan.net>
To: Ryan McGuigan <ryan@mail.ramresearch.com>
Subject: Re: replace line in file
Message-Id: <356606A6.9BFC2FF3@webspan.net>
I just finished writing a Perl script (CGI) that when a form is filled out
and sent to the .pl, it'll automatically update the news. This saves me
loads of time instead of editing the .html and re-uploading it. So, here is
my Perl script (edited for your reasons) for you to use. I hope you like
it.
---- start ----
#!c:/progra~1/perl/bin/perl
sub error {
($message) = @_;
print("ERROR:\n",
$message);
exit(0);
}
open OLDFILE, "<../htdocs/test/news.html" or &error("Cannot open file..");
open NEWFILE, ">../htdocs/test/temp.html" or &error("Cannot open temporary
file.");
while (<OLDFILE>) {
print NEWFILE $_;
if ($_ eq $search) {
print NEWFILE "WHATEVERTOADD";
}
}
close(OLDFILE);
close(NEWFILE);
unlink("../htdocs/test/news.html");
rename "../htdocs/test/temp.html", "../htdocs/test/news.html";
print "File succesfully updated. ($curdate)";
---- end ----
Remember to change the first line (#!c:/progra~1...) and to change the paths
to the files.
I didn't test this code, and it's heavily modified from my version, so I'm
unsure if the while loop will work. However, all I did was change two
things. Good luck.
Arthur Dardia
Ryan McGuigan wrote:
> I need to replace a single line in a text file, I'd like to be able to
> open it in read/write mode, read down to the correct line and replace it
> with something else. The problem is, if the line I'm overwriting is
> longer than the new line, it doesn't overwrite the whole line.
>
> for example, if I try to replace testing with kill, I'll end up with
> killing.
>
> here's a small bit of code
> open TEST, '+<testfile' or die "can't open it. $!\n";
> while (<TEST>) {
> if ($_ =~ /$search/) {
> print TEST "kill";
> }
> }
> close TEST;
>
> thanks,
> Ryan
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 20:12:30 -0400
From: Steve Weiss <sweiss@gslink.com>
Subject: Sending mail with Perl- problems with '@'
Message-Id: <3566146D.835BEBCF@gslink.com>
Hi,
I'm hoping someone can help me with this problem. I'm trying to read in
a list of email addresses from a file, each line in the file has a one
list of addresses, like this:
me@here.com you@there.com him@where.com
After I read in the string I send it to 'sendmail' (this is running on a
DEC box) along with the body of the message. The mail ends up bouncing
and if you look at the addresses, most of the @'s have been changed to
%'s. The last address in the line seems to go through alright though. Is
Perl reading in the lines and assuming the @'s are declaring arrays and
then converting them to hashes or something? I tried using \@ in all the
addresses, but that didn't work either. I've also tried enclosing the
whole line in quotes (single and double) and enclosing each address in
quotes (double) but none of those worked either.
Any help would be much appreciated.
Thanks in advance,
-Steve
--
"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more
violent.
It takes a touch of genius, and a lot of courage - to move in the
opposite direction." - Albert Einstein
Steve Weiss
http://www.gslink.com/~sweiss
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 00:32:22 GMT
From: Tom Phoenix <rootbeer@teleport.com>
To: Steve Weiss <sweiss@gslink.com>
Subject: Re: Sending mail with Perl- problems with '@'
Message-Id: <Pine.GSO.3.96.980522172725.27323U-100000@user2.teleport.com>
On Fri, 22 May 1998, Steve Weiss wrote:
> I'm trying to read in a list of email addresses from a file, each line
> in the file has a one list of addresses, like this:
>
> me@here.com you@there.com him@where.com
>
> After I read in the string I send it to 'sendmail' (this is running on a
> DEC box) along with the body of the message. The mail ends up bouncing
> and if you look at the addresses, most of the @'s have been changed to
> %'s. The last address in the line seems to go through alright though.
I'd guess that sendmail thinks you're sending to one address - the last
one on the line - and it's trying to change the others as needed. Maybe
you need commas between them?
> Is Perl reading in the lines and assuming the @'s are declaring arrays
Certainly not. Perl knows the difference between data and code! :-)
If you're still having troubles, don't have Perl send anything directly to
sendmail. Instead, write the mail to a file, then (if the file looks
correct) feed it to sendmail "manually". That way, it's easy to see what's
a Perl problem and what's a sendmail problem. Good luck!
--
Tom Phoenix Perl Training and Hacking Esperanto
Randal Schwartz Case: http://www.rahul.net/jeffrey/ovs/
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 20:43:41 -0400
From: ken@forum.swarthmore.edu (Ken Williams)
Subject: Re: SRC: Insertion-order hashes
Message-Id: <ken-2205982043410001@news.swarthmore.edu>
In article <6k3v7j$r1l$5@csnews.cs.colorado.edu>, tchrist@mox.perl.com
(Tom Christiansen) wrote:
>Tired of your hashes not being in insertion order?
>Use the CPAN Tie::IxHash module!
>
> ........
$Plug = <<EOP;
Or, use the Tie::LLHash module - I uploaded it a couple of days ago.
EOP
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 00:42:00 GMT
From: Barry Margolin <barmar@bbnplanet.com>
Subject: Re: Tom Christiansen attacks the free software community (was: Re: GNU attacks on the open software community)
Message-Id: <sXo91.26$hF2.165182@cam-news-reader1.bbnplanet.com>
In article <EtDI64.Jv7@echelon.nl>, Kees Hendrikse <kees@echelon.nl> wrote:
>I just compared what The Concise Oxford has to say about 'free' to what
>Van Dale (comparable Dutch dictionary) has to say about 'vrij'. It turns
>out 'vrij' has as many meanings as 'free', most of them related to unbonded,
>unrestricted, loose etc, but many meanings are close to or directly related
>to "gratis".
I believe the reason this happens is because in many instances, free means
"unfettered", and the thing that it's unfettered from is the requirement to
pay.
A horse can be free because he's unfettered by a stable wall, or because
he's unfettered by a requirement to pay to own him. Coffee can be free of
caffeine or free of price.
--
Barry Margolin, barmar@bbnplanet.com
GTE Internetworking, Powered by BBN, Cambridge, MA
*** DON'T SEND TECHNICAL QUESTIONS DIRECTLY TO ME, post them to newsgroups.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 18:04:48 -0500
From: tadmc@flash.net (Tad McClellan)
Subject: Re: What's the right idiom?
Message-Id: <ga05k6.ard.ln@localhost>
Paul Joslin (paul.joslin@sdrc.com) wrote:
: Suppose you're trying to read a directory and act on each entry:
: opendir ( HANDLE, $path ) || die ( "$me: cannot opendir $path: $?" );
: File: while ( $file = readdir ( HANDLE ) ) {
: next File if ($file eq '.' || ($file eq '..'));
: printf "$path/$file\n" if -d $path . '/' . $file;
: # do something here....
: }
: closedir ( HANDLE );
: }
: This works great until you have a file or directory named "0". So you need
: File: while (($file = readdir(HANDLE)) || (defined $file)) {
: or an equivalent. What is the best 'equivalent'?
while ( defined($file = readdir(HANDLE)) ) {
--
Tad McClellan SGML Consulting
tadmc@metronet.com Perl programming
Fort Worth, Texas
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 18:12:14 -0500
From: tadmc@flash.net (Tad McClellan)
Subject: Re: wierd regex question
Message-Id: <eo05k6.sud.ln@localhost>
thonge@my-dejanews.com wrote:
: is there
: any way to read a regex into a $calar and then compare the contents of a field
: against it?
Yes, there's a way:
$test = '\d{3}-\d{2}-\d{4}';
if ($in =~ /$test/) {
...
: like this (command line version) (now, please tell me if my
: pattern is right to match a social security number)
Nope.
Your regex thinks that 1234567890-12-4567890 is a good SSN.
$test = '^\d{3}-\d{2}-\d{4}$';
^ ^
^ ^
Better add anchors for the front and back of the string...
--
Tad McClellan SGML Consulting
tadmc@metronet.com Perl programming
Fort Worth, Texas
------------------------------
Date: 8 Mar 97 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
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Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 8 Mar 97)
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------------------------------
End of Perl-Users Digest V8 Issue 2697
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