[8910] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 2526 Volume: 8
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Thu May 7 10:17:20 1998
Date: Thu, 7 May 98 07:01:25 -0700
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Thu, 7 May 1998 Volume: 8 Number: 2526
Today's topics:
"use strict" doesn't like socket/handle, help needed <captain@pirate.de.nospam-delete-this>
Re: "use strict" doesn't like socket/handle, help neede <zenin@archive.rhps.org>
Re: Aaargh databases <fty@utk.edu>
beeping terminal with perl (PGS Fluendy)
Re: beeping terminal with perl (Steven Wayne)
Re: beeping terminal with perl <sguelich-@-asq.org>
Re: beeping terminal with perl <zenin@archive.rhps.org>
Best way to refresh a file? mig51@aol.com
Re: Bizarre problem with scalar .. operator? <boys@aspentech.com>
Re: Code works on Unix, and MacPerl. Why not Win32? <ludlow@us.ibm.com>
Re: CPAN & Module gripes (was Re: Ever Wonder...?) (Chris Nandor)
Re: CPAN & Module gripes (was Re: Ever Wonder...?) <davis@ca.uky.edu>
Re: CPAN & Module gripes (was Re: Ever Wonder...?) (Mitchell Morris)
Re: CPAN & Module gripes (was Re: Ever Wonder...?) (Matija Grabnar)
Re: editor? <webmaster@web-design.org.uk>
Re: Embedded systems programming (Matthew H. Gerlach)
Re: Embedded systems programming (John Porter)
Re: Ever Wonder Why Not Everyone Uses Modules? (Chris Nandor)
Re: Ever Wonder Why Not Everyone Uses Modules? <perlguy@inlink.com>
Re: Ever Wonder Why Not Everyone Uses Modules? <zenin@archive.rhps.org>
Re: Ever Wonder Why Not Everyone Uses Modules? (Stuart McDow)
Re: Ever Wonder Why Not Everyone Uses Modules? <tchrist@mox.perl.com>
Re: Ever Wonder Why Not Everyone Uses Modules? (Stuart McDow)
Re: how to pass argument? (Tina Marie Holmboe)
Re: how to pass argument? <ksiero@sgh.waw.pl>
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 8 Mar 97) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 14:42:18 +0200
From: Mark Seuffert <captain@pirate.de.nospam-delete-this>
Subject: "use strict" doesn't like socket/handle, help needed
Message-Id: <3551AC2A.3E12@pirate.de.nospam-delete-this>
Hi,
I don't know how to call an subroutine with a socket as argument,
while I "use strict". I tried different ways, but always get
error messages like:
Bareword "STDIN" not allowed while "strict subs" in use
Can't use string ("STDIN") as a symbol ref while "strict refs" in use
Question: How to call the subroutine "readline"? many many thx! :)
#!/usr/bin/perl
use strict;
$::line = &readline(STDIN,5);
print $::line;
# Grab a line without using buffered input
sub readline {
my ($rin, $win, $ein, $line, $nfound, @fhlist);
$rin = $win = $ein = '' ;
@fhlist = split(' ', $_[0]) ;
for (@fhlist) { vec($rin,fileno($_),1) = 1 }
$nfound = select ($rin, $win, $ein, $_[1]); #Set timeout and read
response
if($nfound>0) { sysread($_[0], $line, 1024) } #Read line if possible
return ($line);
}
--
/Mark (EMailadresse ab ".nospam" lvschen)
http://home.pages.de/~irc ~html ~unix
------------------------------
Date: 7 May 1998 13:42:20 GMT
From: Zenin <zenin@archive.rhps.org>
Subject: Re: "use strict" doesn't like socket/handle, help needed
Message-Id: <894548997.173474@thrush.omix.com>
Mark Seuffert <captain@pirate.de.nospam-delete-this> wrote:
: Question: How to call the subroutine "readline"? many many thx! :)
use strict;
use subs qw(readline);
my $line = readline (\*STDIN, 5);
print $line;
__END__
See the perlsub manpage for details.
--
-Zenin
zenin@archive.rhps.org
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 08:07:05 -0400
From: Jay Flaherty <fty@utk.edu>
To: Lee Sibbald <Lee@sibsoft.force9.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Aaargh databases
Message-Id: <3551A3E9.BDF7FF81@utk.edu>
Try:
http://www.perl.com/CPAN-local//modules/by-category/07_Database_Interfaces/DBI/
http://www.perl.com/CPAN-local//modules/by-category/07_Database_Interfaces/DBD/
When I have similar questions like yours the first thing I do is search CPAN.
Maybe you should start there also.
Hope this helped...jay
Lee Sibbald wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
> I'm attempting to convince my Uni Unix administrators that I really need
> a good Oracle DBI instead of the crappy one they wrote themselves. I
> originally went for MsqlPerl but that fell through the floor, so I'm
> wondering if there is a good Perl DBI for Oracle (other than OraPerl) which
> doesn't require a million changes to a University server and which can be
> implemented painlessly and quickly.
>
> Does anyone know of such a DBI or am I really away with the pixies?
>
> Cheers
>
> Lee Sibbald
--
**********************************************************************
Jay Flaherty fty@utk.edu
"Once in awhile you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if
you look at it right" - R. Hunter
**********************************************************************
------------------------------
Date: 7 May 1998 13:27:46 GMT
From: madf02@holyrood.ed.ac.uk (PGS Fluendy)
Subject: beeping terminal with perl
Message-Id: <6iscsi$sg5@scotsman.ed.ac.uk>
Is there a way to cause the terminal to beep using perl?
Thanks,
Paul
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 13:40:12 GMT
From: steven@amber.co.uk (Steven Wayne)
Subject: Re: beeping terminal with perl
Message-Id: <3551b91b.4177246@news.demon.co.uk>
madf02@holyrood.ed.ac.uk (PGS Fluendy) wrote:
>Is there a way to cause the terminal to beep using perl?
print "\a";
Steven.
--
We pray for one last landing, on the globe that gave us birth,
To rest our eyes on fleecy skies, and the cool green hills of Earth.
-- R.A. Heinlein
http://www.ambercomputing.demon.co.uk/
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 13:47:45 +0000
From: Scott Guelich <sguelich-@-asq.org>
Subject: Re: beeping terminal with perl
Message-Id: <3551BB81.D6AF873F@-asq.org>
PGS Fluendy wrote:
>
> Is there a way to cause the terminal to beep using perl?
>
print "\007";
should do it.
- Scott Guelich
sguelich-@-asq.org (remove the dashes when replying)
------------------------------
Date: 7 May 1998 13:48:04 GMT
From: Zenin <zenin@archive.rhps.org>
Subject: Re: beeping terminal with perl
Message-Id: <894549340.842487@thrush.omix.com>
PGS Fluendy <madf02@holyrood.ed.ac.uk> wrote:
: Is there a way to cause the terminal to beep using perl?
print "\a";
--
-Zenin
zenin@archive.rhps.org
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 04:53:20 -0600
From: mig51@aol.com
Subject: Best way to refresh a file?
Message-Id: <6is0af$5p5$1@nnrp1.dejanews.com>
I am writing a NT file-system-based client-server application using Perl.
The client side is not written by me, nor do I have any control over its
actions. The server side is my Perl code.
The client side periodically reads a file that is independently periodically
overwritten by my Perl server.
My problem is that randomly and inexplicably, the client program has problems
reading the file that my server is writing.
What is the best way that my server Perl code should write the file? For
example, should the server code: build the new file under another name (but
in the same directory as the target file), move the old file, then rename the
new file? Exact Perl code is appreciated due to the intracacies.
Two additional facts: 1) The file resides on another NT computer, accessible
by my server program over my local NT network. 2) The client is actually the
MS InternetInfoServer, which is asked to reload a web page by an
even-more-remote web browser.
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 11:50:12 +0100
From: Ian Boys <boys@aspentech.com>
Subject: Re: Bizarre problem with scalar .. operator?
Message-Id: <355191E4.1CFB@aspentech.com>
Yikes! Thanks for the answers everyone. I missed the very last
sentence of docs which explains the behaviour. Mea culpa.
Also, an arg seemingly doesn't have to be numeric literal, only an
expression which evaluates to a constant. For example (1+0) will still
be compared against $.
Ian
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 01 May 1998 12:39:54 -0500
From: James Ludlow <ludlow@us.ibm.com>
Subject: Re: Code works on Unix, and MacPerl. Why not Win32?
Message-Id: <354A08EA.E9141F6C@us.ibm.com>
Pamela Culpepper wrote:
>
> I am attempting to port Perl scripts that execute
> correctly using Perl on Solaris2 and MacPerl on the
> Mac to Win32 Perl.
>
[snip]
> sub glob_files
> {
> local($_) = @_;
> local(@a);
>
> @a = <${_}>;
> grep(-f, @a);
> }
>
You didn't say exactly what you thought your code was supposed to do,
but it looks like you're trying to return an array of filenames that
match your input expression.
If so, try this...
sub glob_files {
local @a = glob(shift);
return @a;
}
--
James Ludlow (ludlow@us.ibm.com)
This isn't tech support, and all opinions are my own.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 12:11:24 GMT
From: pudge@pobox.com (Chris Nandor)
Subject: Re: CPAN & Module gripes (was Re: Ever Wonder...?)
Message-Id: <pudge-0705980809320001@192.168.0.3>
In article <6iposl$5em$1@en1.engelschall.com>, sb@engelschall.com (Steffen
Beyer) wrote:
# Chris Nandor <pudge@pobox.com> wrote:
# > If they are clueless newbies, they wouldn't understand how to use it
# > anyway. They need to get baptized by a little fire before they can use it
# > anyway. Navigating CPAN is a good way to do it.
#
# This arrogance is infuriating.
#
# We all started as clueless newbies (myself included). Now I'm a Perl module
# author, too, a relatively clueful, I think.
#
# Nevertheless I don't think we should make it harder for newbies to access
# CPAN, or not improve CPAN when we see deficiencies, by saying, these
# deficiencies or difficulties are good to separate the Real Programmers from
# the clueless.
#
# Now I see that people who have been complaining about elitarism in c.l.p.misc
# have been right, here it is, in its full ugliness.
$you->get_off($high_horse);
First, I said not ONE WORD about making anything harder for anybody.
Don't misrpresent me.
Second, I said that CPAN can be improved, but the simple fact that
"clueless newbies" have a hard time navigating it is not one jot of a
reason to improve it, simply by virtue of the fact that clueless newbies
BY DEFINITION will always be unable to navigate CPAN.
# > Where did I say it did? I specifically said "clueless newbie", and while
# > I did not say it before, I will say it now: a clueless newbie is not a
# > programmer.
#
# Well, even a Real Programmer once was a clueless newbie.
#
# We should help clueless newbies to become clueful programmers AS FAST AS
# POSSIBLE, instead of throwing sticks into their spokes.
No threw any stick in anyone's spokes. But we aren't going to lower the
bar so they can jump over it, either. You are grossly misrpresenting what
I said.
# Maybe we should indeed rethink this material (FAQs and all) when we find
# out (as we seem to be doing right now) that this material is insufficient
# or too overwhelming.
If you want to spend your time doing that, be my guest. But I am
convinced that anyone who is intelligent enough to program usefully will
be able to figure CPAN out as-is with a minimal amount of thought and
effort. All they have to do is read the documents, browse around, and
maybe ask a question or two, politely. If they cannot do that, they
cannot program.
--
Chris Nandor mailto:pudge@pobox.com http://pudge.net/
MacPerl: Power and Ease (ISBN 1881957322), http://www.ptf.com/macperl/
%PGPKey = ('B76E72AD', [1024, '0824090B CE73CA10 1FF77F13 8180B6B6'])
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 09:19:24 -0400
From: Jeffrey Davis <davis@ca.uky.edu>
Subject: Re: CPAN & Module gripes (was Re: Ever Wonder...?)
Message-Id: <3551B4DC.1830@ca.uky.edu>
Steffen Beyer wrote:
> I personally think that the latter is the case: There is so much information
> available that someone who just starts using Perl doesn't know where to start
> reading. So we should keep that in mind and adapt all material accordingly,
> as good as we can.
Not only is there a lot of information available, it seems to breed like
rabbits. If you're like me and tried to learn Perl "by the book" there's
a very good chance that the book you learned from was way behind the
curve on where Perl is today. Perl has grown from being a very good
scripting language into something like a cross between a universal
solvent and an open-ended Mandarin where new ideograms are invented
hourly.
--
Jeffrey Davis <davis@ca.uky.edu> Lots Available
------------------------------
Date: 7 May 1998 12:57:56 GMT
From: mgm@unpkhswm04.bscc.bls.com (Mitchell Morris)
Subject: Re: CPAN & Module gripes (was Re: Ever Wonder...?)
Message-Id: <slrn6l3buk.88a.mgm@unpkhswm04.bscc.bls.com>
On Thu, 07 May 1998 12:11:24 GMT, Chris Nandor <pudge@pobox.com> wrote:
[snip]
>If you want to spend your time doing that, be my guest. But I am
>convinced that anyone who is intelligent enough to program usefully will
>be able to figure CPAN out as-is with a minimal amount of thought and
>effort. All they have to do is read the documents, browse around, and
>maybe ask a question or two, politely. If they cannot do that, they
>cannot program.
>
>--
>Chris Nandor mailto:pudge@pobox.com http://pudge.net/
>MacPerl: Power and Ease (ISBN 1881957322), http://www.ptf.com/macperl/
>%PGPKey = ('B76E72AD', [1024, '0824090B CE73CA10 1FF77F13 8180B6B6'])
I was going to abstain from posting to this thread. Really, I was.
However, we as a programming community find this user-unfriendly behavior
completely unacceptable in every other aspect of our professional lives. Why
would we want to hold it up as the model of interaction when it comes to perl?
In almost every other situation where we need to find our way about a mass
of information, we provide search tools. In those cases where there aren't
any, we write them. We, as an Internet using community, have specified through
our continued behavior that we expect to be able to do keyword searching on
just about everything.
I pose the analogy that CPAN is like Amazon.com ... both are full of far
more information than any human can use in a single lifetime. Both represent
the distilled wisdom and work of large numbers of people. The difference is
that I can go to Amazon.com and look for books about gardening by typing
"gardening" and pressing the search button. There will almost assuredly be
hits that do not have "gardening" in the title, but the submitter included that
as a searchable keyword. There is no equivalent operation in CPAN: the best I
can do is "perl -MCPAN -e shell", type "i /gardening/" and hope that the
module author used the word somewhere in the title of the module and/or the
distribution. Alternately, I can search the CPAN.html file, but I know that
this is maintained by a single human, who is by definition time constrained.
Consequently, I can't depend on the CPAN.html file being up-to-date with
respect to the modules it purports to document.
As an example, where in the documentation is the process of creating a
"Bundle" described? I can find many references to creating modules, objects,
XSUBs, etc. If there were a keyword search facility, I could quickly and
easily assure myself that there is no such beast in CPAN. As it is, I can
only suspect that it isn't there. If the information is in there somewhere,
then I am unable to recognize it as such. If that makes me not a programmer,
it becomes rather difficult to explain the continued presence of my paycheck
and job responsibilities. (As an aside, it is simple enough to take an
existing "Bundle" distribution and reverse-engineer the Bundle/*.pm file:
I would expect a programmer to be able to perform this task). Since this
appears to be an important structure in dealing with module dependencies,
some description of how to create one would be in order I would think.
Current research suggests that the most effective information gathering tool
is an experienced librarian or researcher. That is, it is usually faster to
find a human with some experience in the field and ask him to find your
desired information than it is to find the information yourself and cull the
resulting wheat from the chaff of false hits. In the context of this
discussion, the most "expert" expert we have available is the submission's
author. Could we not, as a community, ask the author to please include some
keywords and/or short descriptions?
--
Mitchell Morris
mmorris@mindspring.com
Rocky's Lemma of Innovation Prevention
Unless the results are known in advance, funding agencies will
reject the proposal.
------------------------------
Date: 7 May 1998 13:57:45 GMT
From: matija@rzenik.arnes.si (Matija Grabnar)
Subject: Re: CPAN & Module gripes (was Re: Ever Wonder...?)
Message-Id: <6isekp$pfd$1@kanja.arnes.si>
In article <pudge-0705980809320001@192.168.0.3>,
Chris Nandor <pudge@pobox.com> wrote:
>If you want to spend your time doing that, be my guest. But I am
>convinced that anyone who is intelligent enough to program usefully will
>be able to figure CPAN out as-is with a minimal amount of thought and
>effort. All they have to do is read the documents, browse around, and
>maybe ask a question or two, politely. If they cannot do that, they
>cannot program.
I am not a clueless newbie (in fact, I have a module on CPAN myself), but
let's not pretend that everything on CPAN works smoothly.
I wanted to install the Expect module. I knew it existed, because I read
the announcement on c.l.p.a. However, when looking for it in modules/by-module,
I couldn't find it. And I couldn't find it in 00modlist.long.html, either.
Fortunately, I had saved a copy of the announcement and finaly managed to find
the module in authors/Austin_Schutz - clearly not something every newbie would
think of doing.
As if that wasn't enough, the Expect module installed silently, without
tests, and without telling me that it required the IO::Pty module. I searched
the IO directory, and could find nothing. I did a 'find' across the CPAN tree,
and nothing with 'Pty' in it's name that turned up was relevant. Finaly,
the FAQ for Expect.pm suggested looking in Graham Barr's directory, where I
found it, in a file called IO-Tty (NOT Pty). It turns out Tty also contains
Tty, but that is not evident anywhere. BTW: the PTY module is listed in
00modlist.long.html, but there is no hint as to it's curious location.
Once IO-Pty was installed, Expect.pm still refused to run. Guess what,
it required another module, IO::Stty, found in the curiously named
IO-Stty-.02.tar.gz (note the dot immediately after the dash). Fortunately,
I'd already found that module in my search for IO::Pty, so I installed it
without too much further pain.
Note that I LOVE Expect.pm and intend to use it a LOT. And I love the idea
of CPAN, and most of the time it's organization. But installing Expect.pm
was a royal pain and obviously, CPAN needs some improvements.
--
"My name is Not Important. Not to friends.
But you can call me mr. Important" - Not J. Important
Matija.Grabnar@arnes.si
------------------------------
Date: 7 May 1998 13:55:38 GMT
From: "Webmaster" <webmaster@web-design.org.uk>
Subject: Re: editor?
Message-Id: <01bd79bf$6f337680$6f9999c0@watson.colloquium.co.uk>
Try notepad
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 13:35:24 GMT
From: gerlach@netcom.com (Matthew H. Gerlach)
Subject: Re: Embedded systems programming
Message-Id: <gerlachEsL9r0.1Du@netcom.com>
>nor is it going to be the language of choice for number-crunching!
Well I've done a small bit of number crunching in perl, and was
quite amazed at how fast it is. In particular, I had some perl
scripts that would collect data from various pieces of equipment. In
the past I would ship the data off to a college who ran the data
through MathLab. Since he was doing basic statical analysis, I wrote
the couple of routines in perl. It took about 15 minutes to write the
routines, we got the same numbers as MathLab and perl took about the
same amount of time to munch the numbers, about 2 seconds.
We ended up just using perl to avoid the moving of the data between
a UNIX machine and PC MathLab.
I recommend using perl's math power when it makes sense.
Matthew
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 13:43:10 GMT
From: jdporter@min.net (John Porter)
Subject: Re: Embedded systems programming
Message-Id: <MPG.fbb85dc582c16199896a8@news.min.net>
On Mon, 04 May 1998 19:49:11 -0500,
in article <354E6207.28E1@cse.unl.edu>,
mrazzak@cse.unl.edu (Mohammad Razzak) wrote:
> Hi!
> Can anybody enlighten me on the concept of Embedded systems programming?
> Some explanations with examples would be appreciated.
I have one word for you: STFW. (search the web)
John Porter
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 07 May 1998 12:26:30 GMT
From: pudge@pobox.com (Chris Nandor)
Subject: Re: Ever Wonder Why Not Everyone Uses Modules?
Message-Id: <pudge-0705980824380001@192.168.0.3>
In article <894531613.87925@thrush.omix.com>, Zenin
<zenin@archive.rhps.org> wrote:
# If you've got broken systems like MacOS, NT et al to deal with then
# your code needs an if/else block to detect them and thus use the
# much less portable and reliable SMTP or whatever methods to deliver
# it.
#
# Why throw all chance of reliability and portability out the window
# for Unix systems just to avoid an if/else statement for the lesser
# systems? NT and MacOS are expected to be unreliable, Unix is not.
# Please don't ruin this correct perception of Unix for the sake of
# lesser systems when it takes a whooping 5 minutes of work to avoid
# it.
Ah. Mac OS is broken because it does not include sendmail? There's a
gem. Flawless logic.
Did you write that Mail-Sendmail-1.10.tar.gz you posted about? If so, I
know I would not trust it, or anything you have to say about sendmail or
SMTP, because you didn't even know the name of the protocol a couple of
days ago.
I am not trying to bag on you, I just think it odd that you speak so
authoritatively, yet repeatedly called the protocol "SNTP". It wasn't a
spelling mistake, it was a lack of knowledge about what you are talking
about.
# Raise your hand if you or more likely your sysadmin would
# even remotely think about recompiling libnet whenever your
# mail/news/pop3/etc server gets moved to another machine. Hmm, not
# to many hands went up.
Why recompile libnet?? Why not just go into the config file and change a
few strings?
It is obvious you don't know what you are talking about. I am done
talking with you about this. You have no clue what you are talking about,
or you are lying. Simply stating that one has to recompile anything to
change a host in Net::Config is either clueless or lying, it is that
simple.
--
Chris Nandor mailto:pudge@pobox.com http://pudge.net/
MacPerl: Power and Ease (ISBN 1881957322), http://www.ptf.com/macperl/
%PGPKey = ('B76E72AD', [1024, '0824090B CE73CA10 1FF77F13 8180B6B6'])
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 13:03:54 GMT
From: Brent Michalski <perlguy@inlink.com>
Subject: Re: Ever Wonder Why Not Everyone Uses Modules?
Message-Id: <3551B13A.783067E0@inlink.com>
No
------------------------------
Date: 7 May 1998 13:31:15 GMT
From: Zenin <zenin@archive.rhps.org>
Subject: Re: Ever Wonder Why Not Everyone Uses Modules?
Message-Id: <894548332.192479@thrush.omix.com>
Chris Nandor <pudge@pobox.com> wrote:
: Ah. Mac OS is broken because it does not include sendmail? There's a
: gem. Flawless logic.
It's a broken OS if it doesn't include common reliable access to
commonly used systems. Lack of any real mail delivery system is
only one of many shortcomings. But I digress, this is a topic
for AHW (Another Holly War).
: Did you write that Mail-Sendmail-1.10.tar.gz you posted about?
Yep.
: If so, I
: know I would not trust it, or anything you have to say about sendmail or
: SMTP, because you didn't even know the name of the protocol a couple of
: days ago.
Even without a glace at the code...whatever... First he attacks
typos because he has no ground to stand on, now he attacks code THAT
HE HASN'T EVEN BOTHERD TO LOOK AT. What a maroon. You crack me
up, you really do. Go play with Matt's code and let the real
designers do there job.
: I am not trying to bag on you, I just think it odd that you speak so
: authoritatively, yet repeatedly called the protocol "SNTP". It wasn't a
: spelling mistake, it was a lack of knowledge about what you are talking
: about.
No, it was a typeo(sp?). Sorry to disappoint you. It's one I make
all the time for some lame reason that I can't seem to understand
myself. If you want to play acronym wars do it with someone that
cares.
: Why recompile libnet?? Why not just go into the config file and change a
: few strings?
Two reasons.
First, you're assuming (danger!) that the sysadmin would even think
about this for a nano-second when moving a mail/news/whatever machine.
He won't. It's not his job to. It's his job to make sure the system
mailer knows "the right thing to do". That's it. That's all.
That's because it's not your application's job to know this, it's
the system mailer and *nothing* else. You're expecting him/her to
not only know about the issues with Net::Config, but know the exact
file to modify to affect the change...This is still assuming (danger!)
that the admin would care, which is vary unlikely because once again,
it's not his job too. Think about it, when was the last time you
saw an admin ponder, "Hmm, I'm moving my mail server, maybe I should
make sure all the header files in my copy of gcc don't need to be
adjusted to point to it, and tcl, and everything else on my system".
You live in a rose tinted world...
Second, any and all manuall changes to Net::Config are lost at the
next upgrade of libnet:
# WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING
# WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING
#
# Below this line is auto-generated, *ANY* changes will be lost
Remember this little bit from Net::Config? Didn't think so.
Still doesn't matter, because no one is going to know or care
about updating it when they move the mail hub. No one. And
why should they? THE DAMN THING ISN'T EVEN CLOSE TO BEING
IN /etc FOR PEET'S SAKE. You're asking an admin to know to
modify a *random perl library* for configuration data for a system
that an application programmer shouldn't be trying to use
anyway... Hell, if I was the admin I'd set everything in
Net::Config to undef, save maybe for the news host (pulled out
of $ENV{NNTPSERVER} which should be defined in /etc/profile and
is expected).
: It is obvious you don't know what you are talking about.
Hehe, silly human. You'll learn...as soon as it bites you in the
ass.
: I am done
: talking with you about this. You have no clue what you are talking about,
: or you are lying. Simply stating that one has to recompile anything to
: change a host in Net::Config is either clueless or lying, it is that
: simple.
Anyone that thinks someone moving a mail server is going to bother
thinking for a nano-second that some random, non-standard release
library for a misc programming language is going to need updating
has "no clue" what will happen in the real world, or is simply
"lying" to themself.
--
-Zenin
zenin@archive.rhps.org
------------------------------
Date: 7 May 1998 13:27:51 GMT
From: smcdow@arlut.utexas.edu (Stuart McDow)
Subject: Re: Ever Wonder Why Not Everyone Uses Modules?
Message-Id: <6iscsn$lli$1@ns1.arlut.utexas.edu>
ilya@math.ohio-state.edu (Ilya Zakharevich) writes:
>
> *Most* unportability of Perl comes from *nix. Read Configure if you
> do not believe.
Oh, I've read Configure, and I agree that supporting all the different
flavors is very difficult. You'll get no argument from me on that
issue.
> Porting would be easier by *tons* if there were no *nix around.
That's probably true, but I really can't speak to it. But, if there
were no *nix around, there'd be no Perl. Nor would there be a need for
Perl, IMO.
--
Stuart McDow Applied Research Laboratories
smcdow@arlut.utexas.edu The University of Texas at Austin
"It is obvious that about 750,000 people ago, Austin was a wonderful City."
------------------------------
Date: 7 May 1998 13:38:59 GMT
From: Tom Christiansen <tchrist@mox.perl.com>
Subject: Re: Ever Wonder Why Not Everyone Uses Modules?
Message-Id: <6isdhj$3aq$1@csnews.cs.colorado.edu>
[courtesy cc of this posting sent to cited author via email]
In comp.lang.perl.misc,
smcdow@arlut.utexas.edu (Stuart McDow) writes:
:That's probably true, but I really can't speak to it. But, if there
:were no *nix around, there'd be no Perl. Nor would there be a need for
:Perl, IMO.
Gotta love them JCL and ini dot bat dot bad dot doo dah files.
--tom
--
"There is no reason for people to have computers in their homes."
-- Ken Olsen, president of Digital, 1977
------------------------------
Date: 7 May 1998 13:49:30 GMT
From: smcdow@arlut.utexas.edu (Stuart McDow)
Subject: Re: Ever Wonder Why Not Everyone Uses Modules?
Message-Id: <6ise5a$p3j$1@ns1.arlut.utexas.edu>
sb@engelschall.com (Steffen Beyer) writes:
>
> Maybe the maintainers of the Perl 5 Module List should change this
> to a more explicit incitation to name all dependencies, especially
> other modules that will be needed?
I agree. But let's not forget required tools for building. The
original poster (if I remember correctly) had a problem with gcc (or
was it cpp) not being found. That's a show stopper. I'm thinking that
maybe a script (rather than just a file) might be needed so it can do
things like
use Config;
print <<EOF
To build this module you will need the following tools. These tools
were used in building the installation of Perl that resides on this
system, and using the same tools is the best chance for sucess:
$Config{make}
$Config{cc}
$Config{cpp}
...
$Config{yadda yadda yadda}
etc.
EOF
... as well as identifying module/distribution dependencies. Or
instead of printing this stuff, the script could go out and try to
find the tools (and module depenencies), and flag if they aren't
found.
Some kind of convention could be used to identify these
thingies. Maybe a DEPEND.pl file that could be included in module
distributions, and a ExtUtils::Dependecies module to help out. Hell,
the whole thing could be just rolled up into Makefile.pl.
Just a thought.
--
Stuart McDow Applied Research Laboratories
smcdow@arlut.utexas.edu The University of Texas at Austin
"It is obvious that about 750,000 people ago, Austin was a wonderful City."
------------------------------
Date: 7 May 1998 10:07:37 GMT
From: tina@scandinaviaonline.se (Tina Marie Holmboe)
Subject: Re: how to pass argument?
Message-Id: <6is159$jjs$5@news1.sol.no>
In article <Pine.GSO.3.96.980507104842.24653A-100000@akson.sgh.waw.pl>,
Krzysztof Sierota <ksiero@sgh.waw.pl> writes:
> Could anyone tell me how to pass an argument to a perl script ?
Certainly - if you regard the manuals that come with perl as "anyone",
you'll find it in perlvar, under @ARGV.
Good luck!
--
Tina Marie Holmboe
Application Developer (Geeks'R'Us) [tina@tech.scandinaviaonline.se]
Scandinavia Online AB Development Dept. (+46) 08 587 81000 (switchboard)
(+46) 08 587 81189 (direct)
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 7 May 1998 14:54:43 +0200
From: Krzysztof Sierota <ksiero@sgh.waw.pl>
Subject: Re: how to pass argument?
Message-Id: <Pine.GSO.3.96.980507145412.8822A-100000@akson.sgh.waw.pl>
Thank You for help :)
On Thu, 7 May 1998 kzal@pol.pl wrote:
> Krzysztof Sierota wrote:
> >
> > Hello
> > Could anyone tell me how to pass an argument to a perl script ?
> >
> > thank you
>
> An array @ARGV keeps all arguments.
>
> example:
>
> $username = $ARGV[0];
>
> or
>
> $username = shift;
>
> if you use shift without arguments it assumes it's @ARGV.
>
> A number of arguments passed is equal:
>
> $args = $#ARGV + 1;
>
>
>
> Krzysztof
>
>
------------------------------
Date: 8 Mar 97 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
From: Perl-Request@ruby.oce.orst.edu (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 8 Mar 97)
Message-Id: <null>
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