[8681] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 2298 Volume: 8
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Sat Apr 11 07:07:19 1998
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 98 04:00:25 -0700
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Sat, 11 Apr 1998 Volume: 8 Number: 2298
Today's topics:
Re: Bill Gates should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free So <ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk>
Re: Bill Gates should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free So <rra@stanford.edu>
Re: Bill Gates should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free So <ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk>
Re: Bill Gates should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free So <ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk>
Re: Bill Gates should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free So <ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk>
Re: Bill Gates should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free So <rra@stanford.edu>
Re: Bill Gates should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free So <rra@stanford.edu>
Book: Perl Modules (Chris Winters)
Can't open a file for writing - again... blr@mail.alarmix.net
Can't open a file for writing - again... blr@mail.alarmix.net
Re: General Rudeness, e.g. Re: Need a web login script <flavell@mail.cern.ch>
Re: If "=~" means match what is doesn't match? <samiss@cc.tut.fi>
Re: Numeric validation (Craig Berry)
Re: Perl code to generate MS Excel and Access files ? (Chris Winters)
Re: perl win 32 : asterisk on command line (Excession)
Re: Perl/Cgi Problem (Abigail)
question about Perl on Linux connecting to ODBC databas (Charles Ragan)
Re: RMS should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software (Michael Talbot-Wilson)
sort and uniq in Perl <hui.tang@tus.ssi1.com>
Re: sort and uniq in Perl (Michael Fuhr)
Re: unique string/integer from string variable? md5? (Craig Berry)
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 8 Mar 97) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 10:14:17 +0100
From: Ben Bullock <ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Bill Gates should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software Summit" (was Re: RMS should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software Summit")
Message-Id: <352F3469.7254DCFF@hayamasa.demon.co.uk>
Russ Allbery wrote:
>
> In gnu.misc.discuss, ben <ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk> writes:
>
> > What I was refering to was taking something such as source code which is
> > freely redistributable and turning it into something proprietory, which
> > is quite a large part of O'Reilly's business.
>
> Perhaps you'd like to supply an example? I've never heard of any such
> thing.
I can supply several examples, but if you only want one,
try the X windows documentation which I mentioned in the
original message (with the current title) on this thread.
I think that the X windows books by themselves are a major part
of o'Reilly's business.
--
Ben Bullock
------------------------------
Date: 11 Apr 1998 02:31:42 -0700
From: Russ Allbery <rra@stanford.edu>
Subject: Re: Bill Gates should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software Summit" (was Re: RMS should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software Summit")
Message-Id: <m3ra34r9fl.fsf@windlord.Stanford.EDU>
In comp.lang.perl.misc, Ben Bullock <ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk> writes:
> Russ Allbery wrote:
>> In gnu.misc.discuss, ben <ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk> writes:
>>> What I was refering to was taking something such as source code which
>>> is freely redistributable and turning it into something proprietory,
>>> which is quite a large part of O'Reilly's business.
>> Perhaps you'd like to supply an example? I've never heard of any such
>> thing.
> I can supply several examples, but if you only want one, try the X
> windows documentation which I mentioned in the original message (with
> the current title) on this thread.
You just switched from source code to documentation. I think that's a
very different sort of thing. Books are inherently proprietary in some
senses, since even if one is given permission to copy them, doing so is so
much hassle that people generally won't. The FSF prints manuals from
their info pages and sells them, and I've never heard anyone complaining
they're taking free documentation and making it proprietary.
If this is X documentation, presumably it was originally released under
the standard X license, which means the documentation is still free.
O'Reilly is charging people for editing and presentation in a form much
more convenient for reference, and I really fail to understand why people
would have a problem with that. The relationship between the
documentation distributed with Perl and the documentation O'Reilly
publishes about Perl is fairly similar to that, and the same people even
work on both (and the distributed documentation is superior to the books
in many respects).
Perhaps you have a better example that actually deals with source code?
That one wasn't very persuasive.
--
#!/usr/bin/perl -- Russ Allbery, Just Another Perl Hacker
$^=q;@!>~|{>krw>yn{u<$$<[~||<Juukn{=,<S~|}<Jwx}qn{<Yn{u<Qjltn{ > 0gFzD gD,
00Fz, 0,,( 0hF 0g)F/=, 0> "L$/GEIFewe{,$/ 0C$~> "@=,m,|,(e 0.), 01,pnn,y{
rw} >;,$0=q,$,,($_=$^)=~y,$/ C-~><@=\n\r,-~$:-u/ #y,d,s,(\$.),$1,gee,print
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 11:00:26 +0100
From: Ben Bullock <ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Bill Gates should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software Summit" (was Re: RMS should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software Summit")
Message-Id: <352F3F3A.798C10DF@hayamasa.demon.co.uk>
Rodger Donaldson wrote:
>
> On Thu, 09 Apr 1998 12:07:32 -0600, ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk
> <ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> [Rantings of "they have too killed free software, I just can't tell you what
> it is, snipped. Since there are no examples, it would be as pointless to
> refute them]
In fact since you have blatantly distorted what I said I don't see
how you could possibly `refute' it.
> The point of the LDP license is to make sure no one gets shut out. Other
> people can print out copies of the book, and no one will blame you if you
> get one of those copies."
>
> You clearly do not have a clue what you are are talking about. Kindly fuck
> off and don't come back until you do.
I unlike you am not a liar and do not distort what other people have
said.
I suggest that you learn some honesty.
--
Ben Bullock
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 11:01:24 +0100
From: Ben Bullock <ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Bill Gates should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software Summit" (was Re: RMS should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software Summit")
Message-Id: <352F3E93.5DC81B50@hayamasa.demon.co.uk>
Donovan Rebbechi wrote:
>
> ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk wrote:
> Hmmmm... still no examples. Of course, they distribute the Linux network
> administrators guide, which is an LDP doc, but they didn't take the
> copyright, and it is still public domain.
I've provided several examples but it seems that some people
don't bother reading my messages.
(.. praise of O'Reilly's books snipped...)
I am not discussing whether or not O'Reilly make good books:
I'm discussing whether or not they are a free
software company.
Some people on this discussion don't seem to be too well
aware of free software issues: maybe some of these
people are posting from the Perl group rather than gnu.misc.discuss,
which is where I'm reading this.
I'm happy to discuss free software issues, but a lot of people
in this discussion seem to think that `O'Reilly does make exceedingly
good books about free software - therefore they are a pro-free software
company'. I don't agree with this analysis. Free software is
about freedom - not about whether a book is good or not.
--
Ben Bullock
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 11:15:16 +0100
From: Ben Bullock <ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Bill Gates should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software Summit" (was Re: RMS should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software Summit")
Message-Id: <352F42B4.1F047176@hayamasa.demon.co.uk>
Quentin Fennessy wrote:
> Ben, can you explain this further? What documentation project
> died due to the existence of O'Reilly products?
> This claim does not make sense to me.
Perhaps you mean `I don't agree with this claim'. If it
doesn't make sense to you, please tell me more specifically
what parts you don't understand and I can try to explain myself
more clearly.
> Perhaps my favorite example is:
>
> a2p.1 perldelta.1 perlfunc.1 perlsyn.1
> c2ph.1 perldiag.1 perlguts.1 perltie.1
> h2ph.1 perldoc.1 perlipc.1 perltoc.1
> h2xs.1 perldsc.1 perllocale.1 perltoot.1
> lwp-download.1 perlembed.1 perllol.1 perltrap.1
> lwp-mirror.1 perlfaq.1 perlmod.1 perlvar.1
> lwp-request.1 perlfaq1.1 perlmodlib.1 perlxs.1
> lwp-rget.1 perlfaq2.1 perlobj.1 perlxstut.1
> perl.1 perlfaq3.1 perlop.1 pl2pm.1
> perlapio.1 perlfaq4.1 perlpod.1 pod2html.1
> perlbook.1 perlfaq5.1 perlre.1 pod2man.1
> perlbot.1 perlfaq6.1 perlref.1 pstruct.1
> perlbug.1 perlfaq7.1 perlrun.1 s2p.1
> perlcall.1 perlfaq8.1 perlsec.1 splain.1
> perldata.1 perlfaq9.1 perlstyle.1 tkweb.1
> perldebug.1 perlform.1 perlsub.1 xsubpp.1
I should say that the perl FAQ does not meet several free software
criteria.
>
> About 60,000 lines of docs. Free. Despite the existence of
> O'Reilly Perl books. Linux has some free docs too, I understand. :-)
Development of some linux free docs such as the Network guide
apparently died off after the O'Reilly version came out.
[[The Network guide missed slightly the free software criteria
in that it was not modifiable as far as I know.]]
I think that the Matt Welsh book was based on a free document
and then died off after that as well.
I know that one book `Understanding Japanese Information Processing'
killed off a free version. As far as I remember (and I could
be wrong) I think the author tried asking people to actually
remove the free version from ftp sites after the O'Reilly book
came out.
In some cases the free version might have been just a half-written
book that the author wanted to get debugged and then turn proprietory,
such as the Tcl/Tk book by Ousterhout (no, it's not an O'Reilly book)
instead of an actual free project, but in my opinion that's just
as bad.
--
Ben Bullock
------------------------------
Date: 11 Apr 1998 03:10:28 -0700
From: Russ Allbery <rra@stanford.edu>
Subject: Re: Bill Gates should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software Summit" (was Re: RMS should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software Summit")
Message-Id: <m3ogy8r7mz.fsf@windlord.Stanford.EDU>
In comp.lang.perl.misc, Ben Bullock <ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk> writes:
> I'm happy to discuss free software issues, but a lot of people in this
> discussion seem to think that `O'Reilly does make exceedingly good books
> about free software - therefore they are a pro-free software company'.
> I don't agree with this analysis. Free software is about freedom - not
> about whether a book is good or not.
I submit that having a book written about it, particularly a book by a
company with the profile of O'Reilly, legitimizes a free software package
in corporate eyes, and that lack of perceived legitimacy is one of the
biggest barriers to the general acceptance of free software. Perl, which
is most certainly free software by any definition, has benefited greatly
by being heavily documented both in the distribution *and* in print.
Furthermore, taking into account that O'Reilly is paying Larry Wall to
work on, among other things, free software products, and after listening
to both Larry and Tim O'Reilly discuss the subject at the last Perl
Conference, I think that O'Reilly's corporate direction is definitely in
favor of free software.
I don't think that O'Reilly is a free software company. I do think that
it's a *pro*-free software company. Or at least one very sympathetic to
the concept. O'Reilly isn't a software company at all; they're a book
publisher. But their publishing direction has helped free software
greatly and I believe will continue to do so.
--
#!/usr/bin/perl -- Russ Allbery, Just Another Perl Hacker
$^=q;@!>~|{>krw>yn{u<$$<[~||<Juukn{=,<S~|}<Jwx}qn{<Yn{u<Qjltn{ > 0gFzD gD,
00Fz, 0,,( 0hF 0g)F/=, 0> "L$/GEIFewe{,$/ 0C$~> "@=,m,|,(e 0.), 01,pnn,y{
rw} >;,$0=q,$,,($_=$^)=~y,$/ C-~><@=\n\r,-~$:-u/ #y,d,s,(\$.),$1,gee,print
------------------------------
Date: 11 Apr 1998 03:16:12 -0700
From: Russ Allbery <rra@stanford.edu>
Subject: Re: Bill Gates should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software Summit" (was Re: RMS should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software Summit")
Message-Id: <m3lntcr7df.fsf@windlord.Stanford.EDU>
In comp.lang.perl.misc, Ben Bullock <ben@hayamasa.demon.co.uk> writes:
> I should say that the perl FAQ does not meet several free software
> criteria.
Starting with the really major problem that it's not software....
--
#!/usr/bin/perl -- Russ Allbery, Just Another Perl Hacker
$^=q;@!>~|{>krw>yn{u<$$<[~||<Juukn{=,<S~|}<Jwx}qn{<Yn{u<Qjltn{ > 0gFzD gD,
00Fz, 0,,( 0hF 0g)F/=, 0> "L$/GEIFewe{,$/ 0C$~> "@=,m,|,(e 0.), 01,pnn,y{
rw} >;,$0=q,$,,($_=$^)=~y,$/ C-~><@=\n\r,-~$:-u/ #y,d,s,(\$.),$1,gee,print
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 21:03:40 GMT
From: cwinters@intes.net (Chris Winters)
Subject: Book: Perl Modules
Message-Id: <352f88d6.593357132@news.cais.com>
Has anyone checked out the book _Perl Modules_ by Eric Foster Johnson?
Amazon says it was published in March and that:
"There are hundreds, if not thousands, of Perl modules. This book
covers the most used and useful and also teaches how to write your
own. The CD-ROM includes complete source code for Perl 5, executables
for Perl for Windows 95 and NT, and every Perl module covered in the
book. "
Chris Winters
(cwinters@intes.net)
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 02:51:19 -0600
From: blr@mail.alarmix.net
Subject: Can't open a file for writing - again...
Message-Id: <6gn7dm$t9s$1@nnrp1.dejanews.com>
Thanks the answers, I localised the problem, and it's very misteryous:
I created a sub:
sub createfile { #fname
open(TCF,">$HOMEDIR/var/@_[0]") || return "Can't create @_[0]";
close(TCF);
return "@_[0] created";
}
I tried to call the sub, and I got a very unexpected result:
First try:
warn &createfile('anything');
Second try:
$var='anything';
warn &createfile($var);
If I put the filename to $var, the sub can't create the file, and the script
halted at the open command.
The debugging is very difficulty, because this is part of a CGI script, but
i've tried it with root suid, the problem is the same, so I had write access
to the specified directory.
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 02:54:19 -0600
From: blr@mail.alarmix.net
Subject: Can't open a file for writing - again...
Message-Id: <6gn7ja$ta5$1@nnrp1.dejanews.com>
Thanks the answers, I localised the problem, and it's very misteryous:
I created a sub:
sub createfile { #fname
open(TCF,">$HOMEDIR/var/@_[0]") || return "Can't create @_[0]";
close(TCF);
return "@_[0] created";
}
I tried to call the sub, and I got a very unexpected result:
First try:
warn &createfile('anything');
Second try:
$var='anything';
warn &createfile($var);
If I put the filename to $var, the sub can't create the file, and the script
halted at the open command.
The debugging is very difficulty, because this is part of a CGI script, but
i've tried it with root suid, the problem is the same, so I had write access
to the specified directory.
blr@mail.alarmix.net
PS: Please mail the answers, because my news server halted.
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 11:20:56 +0200
From: "Alan J. Flavell" <flavell@mail.cern.ch>
Subject: Re: General Rudeness, e.g. Re: Need a web login script
Message-Id: <Pine.A41.3.95a.980411111034.87100B-100000@rsplus11.cern.ch>
On Sat, 11 Apr 1998, Tom Mornini wrote:
> My point is that complete silence on the off-topic posts will be easier
> on bandwidth, will add no noise to the list, and perhaps be more effective.
You're entitled to your opinion, of course. But my experience, from
another group on a topic where I think I _can_ claim enough expertise,
is that when the regulars have tried studiously disregarding off-topic
posts, then some wannabe-gurus will pop up with their own misleading
answers, and, far from "adding no noise to the list", ends up with far
more noise, what with people posting yet more misleading answers trying
to correct the misleading answers that have been posted.
I'd suggest the best compromise is to allow those who advocate complete
silence to follow their own principles, and allow those who believe that
the appropriate thing is to post a brusque indication of the correct
forum, to do so without repeatedly contradicting them (unless, of
course, their advice was unsound).
all the best
------------------------------
Date: 11 Apr 1998 12:30:07 +0300
From: Sami Sandqvist <samiss@cc.tut.fi>
Subject: Re: If "=~" means match what is doesn't match?
Message-Id: <m3sonkvh7k.fsf@ehdo.ton.tut.fi>
stvhoof@netvision.net.il writes:
> In article <Pine.BSI.3.96.980406073817.7640A-100000@pentagon.io.com>,
> Chocolate <poohba@io.com> wrote:
>
> > if($line =~ "Phone:") {
>
> The above line is where your error is...it should be
>
> if($line =~ /Phone:/) {
>
> You need to use slashes (or the "m" operator) to do pattern
> matching...quotes would not work. You should be able to just use a
> regular "else" to handle the case of there being no phone number.
That is what I thought before I tried it:
----
ehdo:[~] % cat test.pl
#!/bin/perl -w
$a = "1234567890";
if($a =~ '3\d\d'){
print $&,"\n";
}
if($a =~ "345"){
print $&,"\n";
}
ehdo:[~] % ./test.pl
345
345
ehdo:[~] % perl -v
This is perl, version 5.004_04 built for i586-linux
----
Of course using, for example, "3\d\d" won't work.
This is of course explained in the documentation. (man perlop, Binding
Operators)
Sami
--
#!/bin/perl -w
$_="17601114363329121422010036040100073622335669010008"; $a=q #Magic?#;
grep/Perl!/,sort("J".."h");print"Sami Sandqvist - samiss@cc.tut.fi";s/k/u/g;
@b=split//,$a; s/(\d\d)/$b[$1]/eg;print"$_\n";
------------------------------
Date: 11 Apr 1998 07:52:41 GMT
From: cberry@cinenet.net (Craig Berry)
Subject: Re: Numeric validation
Message-Id: <6gn7ga$a3i$1@marina.cinenet.net>
ppp-support (ppp-support@canelle.telecom.uqam.ca) wrote:
: Because I dont understand the FAQ!! Thats why i post here.
: Well, how do i use this stuff, if i want to check if the content of $num is
: or not numeric. Call me stupid if you want, but i will still dont get it :-)
What don't you understand? The faq provides patterns for such testing,
using numerous definitions of 'numeric'. Pick the one you mean, and use
it. What's unclear about that?
: The faq4 say...
[snip]
: warn "not a whole number" unless /^\d+$/;
: warn "not an integer" unless /^-?\d+$/; # reject +3
: warn "not an integer" unless /^[+-]?\d+$/;
[snip]
My guess is you want one of these.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
| Craig Berry - cberry@cinenet.net
--*-- Home Page: http://www.cinenet.net/users/cberry/home.html
| Member of The HTML Writers Guild: http://www.hwg.org/
"Every man and every woman is a star."
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 21:00:15 GMT
From: cwinters@intes.net (Chris Winters)
Subject: Re: Perl code to generate MS Excel and Access files ?
Message-Id: <352e87a7.593054327@news.cais.com>
[posted and emailed]
On Mon, 06 Apr 1998 17:05:34 GMT, ron@farmworks.com (Ronald L. Parker)
wrote:
>You could also consider using the ODBC module for DBI. That's
>probably the more supported way of doing things with databases, though
>I doubt there's an ODBC driver for XLS files.
Actually, there is an ODBC driver for XLS files, and at least
Win32::ODBC works with it just fine. There are some funky excelisms --
each sheet is its own table (no problem) but when you put the
sheetname in a SQL statement you must format it "sheetname$"
(including the quotes). Weird.
Another thing you might think about: DBD::XBase can create dBase files
on the fily, which both Excel and Access can (for now) read easily.
Chris Winters
(cwinters@intes.net)
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 08:34:20 GMT
From: daclay@NOSPAMzip.com.au (Excession)
Subject: Re: perl win 32 : asterisk on command line
Message-Id: <352f1e93.2237112@news.zip.com.au>
drummj@mail.mmc.org (Jeffrey R. Drumm) detumesced:
>(much snippage)
Yeah, like 296 lines in answer to 125 lines, which in turn was 50% quoted
material. Wharra liar! (this response is about 100 lines shorter than
your own bloated rhetoric)
>>Try using * as an argument to a CMD file, and see what happens, Mr Perfect.
>
>Name calling, now, Mr. Excession?
Your love of pedantry becomes you.
>>Are you familiar with the term ' it's easy to criticise, it's difficult to
>>create'?
>I'm quite familiar with the phrase you quoted.
Yet you choose to ignore the aphorism, and blaze away.
>applications and interfaces. When the world I create _in_ makes my life more
>difficult, I complain about it. Other folks may benefit from not having to
>travel down the road I mistakenly took.
One wonders why you choose to stay on the road using an engine that you
seemingly despise so much.
>Furthermore, I don't understand what automobiles, hardware, public transport,
You could just put a period after 'understand'. I'd understand.
>Since I spend half of my development life in Unix and the other half in NT, I,
>personally, find working with NT brain-addling, and I'm not shy about sharing
>that experience with others. Your posts won't make me stop.
I don't intend to be a censor, my original post in this topic wasn't about
being a censor, it was about saying 'hey, calling NT names is pointless'.
You continually choose to say 'well, I reckon NT is braindead because ...';
Pointlessness personified. "Oh, well we all know NT is braindead because
..." coupled with "I use NT in my very important working life." If you
don't like bashing your head against the rough surface of an operating
system you don't like, then STOP DOING IT.
Masochism is YOUR choice. Now, would you care to tell everyone in CLPM why
you CHOOSE to use NT when you are so adamant that NT is beneath contempt?
Oh, but I temporarily forgot -- you weaseled out of any onus to reply, by
pleading to the masses and apologising for being a pompous proselytising
prig.
"Apology Accepted!"
>Stop taking this OS thing so personally.
Trust me, old chap, when I state that I don't -really- give a toss whether
you or several million others go on an NT bashing discourse which causes
the collapse of USEnet (imminent demise of net predicted ...) I made my
point about operating system bigotry in my first post, and I stupidly got
into a pissing contest with a master piss-artiste. Nobody to blame but
myself.
>>The 'simple opinion' was merely another example of the wider motif; "if
>>someone mentions NT then denigrate, denigrate, denigrate!" It was a
>>catalyst for my rant.
>Well, I guess we differ on our definition of the term "bigotry."
Yep. Lets look it up, since of course ever single argument ever put forth
in news has rotated around percieved definitions of single words:
Bigot: n. One who is INTOLERANT of ANY ideas OTHER than his OWN.
Bigotry: n. The attitudes, behaviour, or way of thinking of a bigot,
prejudice, intolerance.
What did you *think* that the term 'bigotry' meant? No, don't bother
answering, I've already clued you in.
>Apparently negative comments about your personal favorite operating system are "bigoted."
My personal favourite operating system was NEWDOS80/V2 for the ancient and
unspeakably lame TRS/80. I use NT/95 at work, and 95 at home. Work
because we're a Microsoft shop, home because it's convenient, and it works
for what I want it to do. I could go into paroxysms of flammage about my
run-ins with various broken features of Linux (circa late 1995) but most of
the problems that bit me then, have since been fixed. C'est la vie. Your
presumptions and assumptions are again shown to be so much posing.
>Tell the truth . . . if I had made the same comment about AmigaOS, VMS, CP/M,
>or OS/2, just _what_ would your contribution to this thread have been?
I'd have probably ignored your item. I did stress in previous articles
that your item was a catalyst for my rant; but obviously you chose to
forget that factlet.
>As I mentioned previously, I work in _both_ the NT and Unix environments. My
Yes, how gratuitous of you to reiterate that point.
>>You won't find me going around saying 'Linux sucks because it won't run
>>Starcraft'. Yet if NT can't do something that Linux can, then it's "NT is
>>braindead, it can't do FWVM". Swings and roundabouts.
>Well, if you couldn't play your video games on Linux, I guess you'd have a
>right to be upset, and I sure wouldn't get my panties all in a bunch if you
>whined. You see, even YOU have a right to an opinion . . .
The point wasn't that I could make some allegation about Linux failing
where 95 succeeded -- the point was that I don't go out of my way to make
snide allegations about other operating systems. The religious war aspect
of Un*x/Lin*x/Dos/NT is rather too overpowering to enable the matter to be
discussed rationally. It is the unthinking overbearing 'NT is broken' as
a response to questions in CLPM, that irritates me, personally. But not
that much. As you intimate, if I hadn't seen "NT" in your posting at all,
I wouldn't have commented. It isn't overwhelmingly important to me. The
point does seem to be very important to you though, for all your attempts
to be rigorously informed, you still strive to prove that other people's
opinions are perhaps misguided, whereas yours gleam with the inner light of
complete and utter righteousness. It must be nice for you, to be so
convincingly deluded that 'the Unix way is the only way'. And who am I to
attempt do deprive you of your various crutches?
>>Funnily enough, NT isn't Unix. :-)
>That was my point.
No, your point was to state 'NT doesn't have these features which Unix
does'. My point was that NT isn't Unix. A world of difference.
>>For alarm() I'd have to think about it, for fork() I'd use spawn() and
>Well, when you've thought about it enough, provide us all with a reasonable
>alarm() for Perl on NT. Oh, and where would I find the documentation for Perl's
>spawn() function? This was, after all, a post and reply about Perl's
>peculiarities in the NT environment; let's stick to Perl, OK?
spawn() is the Windows C function I'd have thought that the Perl porters
would have used as an alternative to fork(). Perhaps there are good
reasons why spawn() isn't equivalent to fork()? I don't claim to understand
why or how Perl does what it does.
As for alarm -- I guess I'd have to think about it some more. :-)
>>binmode() just *is* (For a unix-centric example, look at FTP. How many
>>times have people stumbled over the arrant nonsense inherent in having to
>>know what TYPE of file you were trying to send or recieve?)
>
>What the *HELL* are you talking about?
Sorry if it's difficult for you to understand.
>In the Unix world, you DON'T have to specify what type of file you're
>transferring with ftp.
Uh-uh. So you never ever had your FTP client default to ASCII instead of
BINARY. What a charmed life you must lead. Everything that doesn't turn
out just so, must appear to be totally brutal. No wonder you have such an
apparent problem with the hideously un-unix-like Windows NT!
>(apologies to my fellow Perlers for the noise . . . this is my last public post
>on this particular subject)
Standard news flame tactic number 4. Appeal to your audience for
temperance, whilst putting the boot in as much as possible.
Perhaps invoking Godwins law would assist?
Till next time, Jeffrey.
Dac
---
David Andrew Clayton # Please remove NO_SPAM when
dac@NOSPAM.pcug.org.au # sending email replies.
I post therefore I am. #
------------------------------
Date: 11 Apr 1998 08:05:14 GMT
From: abigail@fnx.com (Abigail)
Subject: Re: Perl/Cgi Problem
Message-Id: <6gn87q$81t$2@client3.news.psi.net>
Adam Carden (adam@pacific-artists.demon.co.uk) wrote on MDCLXXXIV
September MCMXCIII in <URL: news:892269934.8405.0.nnrp-01.c2de97e4@news.demon.co.uk>:
++ I was ask to build a script which display a series of banners in sequence
++ with one being shown each time the user loads the page. They had wanted it
++ so when they write the html they can just put the tag in so I decided to
++ create a script that was called by SSI, Unfortunately their hosting
++ company(bitwise) does not support SSI.
Djee, wouldn't it have been a smart idea to see in what kind of
environment the thing is going to run?
++ company(bitwise) does not support SSI. I have read odd snippets that suggest
++ you can call a script via an image tag so long as the script only outputs
++ the data which is applicable to the script.
++
++ Is this possible, I have tried it but cannot get it to work
++ see example:
++
++ <a href="/cgi-bin/bannerad.pl?hyper"><img src="/cgi-bin/bannerad.pl?img">
++
++ If the script is called with the hyper agument the script outputs the header
++ and the following line:
++ http://www.sensormatic.com
++
++ if the script is called with the img agument the script outputs the header
++ and the following line:
++ http://www.infosecnews.com/banners/ro343.gif or similar
++
++ Can Anyone Help?
So, what is the Perl question you have? It seems you have mastered
the print statement, so that can't be your question.
Abigail
--
perl -wle '$_ = 1; (1 x $_) !~ /^(11+)\1+$/ && print while $_ ++'
------------------------------
Date: 11 Apr 1998 02:03:43 EDT
From: raganNOSPAM@idetix.com (Charles Ragan)
Subject: question about Perl on Linux connecting to ODBC database on NT
Message-Id: <6gn13v$agr@examiner.concentric.net>
I was wondering if anyone out there has gotten a similar setup like mine
stated in the subject line (question about Perl on Linux connecting to ODBC
database on NT) to successfully work. And if so, how?
I have two databases on an NT machine (Access and Sybase) with their
respective OBDC DSN's created and tested.
I have downloaded (read the readme's and FAQ's) and installed the DBI module
on the Linux box. I also downloaded the DBD::ODBC module, or driver as it is
called but the readme for the module is confusing in the sense that it askes
for the location of where the "driver manager" is installed (a directory
path). The documentation for the modules make no mention of what the "driver
manager" is or where it can be found. I assumed the driver manager was the
DBD::ODBC module itself, but why would the install script ask for where it is
already installed?
Even when I do get the ODBC driver installed and working, is it possible to
make ODBC calls across TCP/IP with these modules to another machine?
Perhaps I am just too tired and am overlooking something obvious. Either way I
can't get it to work and any hints/pointers would be much appreciated.
--
Charles Ragan, ragan@idetix.com
------------------------------
Date: 11 Apr 98 09:47:09 GMT
From: talmg@atom.forensic.sa.gov.au (Michael Talbot-Wilson)
Subject: Re: RMS should be invited to O'Reilly's "Free Software Summit"
Message-Id: <slrn6iuf6p.evi.talmg@atom.forensic.sa.gov.au>
In article <6gk5mc$8km$1@mathserv.mps.ohio-state.edu>, Ilya Zakharevich wrote:
>[A complimentary Cc of this posting was sent to Jeremy Allison
><jeremy@netcom.com>],
>who wrote in article <jeremyEr63Eu.3tv@netcom.com>:
>> You can still serve MS clients with it - you can sell it, you
>> can even add a proprietary GUI front end (people have). The
>> only thing you can't do is make proprietary changes. How does
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>> this hurt you ?
>
>As far as you explain, nobody in his mind would use this any better
>than Win0.95, which bugs you also have no legal right to fix.
>
>But I hope that you misstated the license policy, it cannot be *that*
>bad. Most probably I can modify it for private use, can I?
As I understand the licence you can modify it for private use
and you can modify it for business use. Jeremy said that the
changes can't be proprietary, i.e. you can't own them. You
don't own the original source and you don't own the modifications -
if you distribute them to others, for money or any other consideration,
the GPL applies to them.
He didn't exactly misstate it, but that is a very obscure way of
stating it. He means, I think, that you can distribute a modified
version if you distribute the modified source code or otherwise
ensure that it is accessible to your customers. He may be saying
more, but that is all the GPL says.
You mention bug fixes. You surely don't want to retain ownership
of the bug fixes for someone else's software? The sane thing to
do is send diffs to the author, and put a note in your distribution
saying where the source code (with your diffs) can be obtained.
That is all that is required by the licence.
You hope he misstated the license policy? Don't you know what it is,
or if he did? You hope? Jeremy was responding to your denunciation of
it, and now you tell us you don't even know what it is?
You have condemned the GPL without attempting to understand it. It
isn't hard to understand. To all appearances you are driven by some
prejudice against it which makes the facts irrelevant.
--Mike
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 14:19:51 -0700
From: Hui Tang <hui.tang@tus.ssi1.com>
Subject: sort and uniq in Perl
Message-Id: <352D3B77.1FA6@tus.ssi1.com>
Hi, all,
Is there any simple way to get the functions of shell commands "sort"
and "uniq" in Perl?
Thanks.
------------------------------
Date: 11 Apr 1998 04:18:11 -0600
From: mfuhr@dimensional.com (Michael Fuhr)
Subject: Re: sort and uniq in Perl
Message-Id: <6gng13$sld@flatland.dimensional.com>
Hui Tang <hui.tang@tus.ssi1.com> writes:
> Is there any simple way to get the functions of shell commands "sort"
> and "uniq" in Perl?
Take a look through the Perl documentation, either on your system
or at:
http://language.perl.com/info/documentation.html
I'd suggest looking searching for "sort" and "unique" in the perlfunc
manual page and in the FAQ.
--
Michael Fuhr
http://www.dimensional.com/~mfuhr/
------------------------------
Date: 11 Apr 1998 08:01:14 GMT
From: cberry@cinenet.net (Craig Berry)
Subject: Re: unique string/integer from string variable? md5?
Message-Id: <6gn80a$a3i$2@marina.cinenet.net>
Otis Gospodnetic (otis@POPULUS.net) wrote:
: Problem:
: I have a variable that contains a string (the string is actually a
: URL). Is there an algorithm, or better yet, a module, that can take
: my string variable and 'convert' it to some shorter string or
: integer?
: Something that will be unique, so that no two URL strings end up
: having the same value once I convert them to this shorter string or
: int.
Assume urls (with possible duplicates) are in @urls:
my $ix = 0;
my %url2ix = ();
my @ix2url = ();
foreach my $url (@urls) {
next if exists $url2ix{$url};
$url2ix{$url} = $ix;
$ix2url[$ix] = $url;
$ix++;
}
This results in the hash %url2ix mapping from url strings to their
numeric index, and the array @ix2url being a list of the unique urls,
each at its appropriate index position.
HTH!
---------------------------------------------------------------------
| Craig Berry - cberry@cinenet.net
--*-- Home Page: http://www.cinenet.net/users/cberry/home.html
| Member of The HTML Writers Guild: http://www.hwg.org/
"Every man and every woman is a star."
------------------------------
Date: 8 Mar 97 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
From: Perl-Request@ruby.oce.orst.edu (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 8 Mar 97)
Message-Id: <null>
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