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Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 3481 Volume: 11

daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Thu Aug 25 06:09:22 2011

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 03:09:05 -0700 (PDT)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)

Perl-Users Digest           Thu, 25 Aug 2011     Volume: 11 Number: 3481

Today's topics:
        DBI problem: Can't connect to MySQL server on 'localhos <r.ted.byers@gmail.com>
    Re: DBI problem: Can't connect to MySQL server on 'loca <uri@StemSystems.com>
    Re: DBI problem: Can't connect to MySQL server on 'loca (hymie!)
    Re: DBI problem: Can't connect to MySQL server on 'loca <r.ted.byers@gmail.com>
    Re: Illegal character in prototype for main <uri@StemSystems.com>
    Re: Illegal character in prototype for main <NoSpamPleaseButThisIsValid3@gmx.net>
    Re: Illegal character in prototype for main <cwilbur@chromatico.net>
    Re: Illegal character in prototype for main <tzz@lifelogs.com>
    Re: Illegal character in prototype for main <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
    Re: Illegal character in prototype for main <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
        Loading to Memory hillgoogle@charter.net
    Re: Loading to Memory <vilain@NOspamcop.net>
    Re: Loading to Memory <jurgenex@hotmail.com>
    Re: Loading to Memory <rvtol+usenet@xs4all.nl>
    Re: Script using LWP::UserAgent is sometimes failing wi <nomail2me@suddenlink.net>
    Re: Script using LWP::UserAgent is sometimes failing wi <rweikusat@mssgmbh.com>
    Re: Script using LWP::UserAgent is sometimes failing wi <nomail2me@suddenlink.net>
    Re: Script using LWP::UserAgent is sometimes failing wi <davidmichaelkarr@gmail.com>
    Re: Script using LWP::UserAgent is sometimes failing wi <davidmichaelkarr@gmail.com>
        test <bla.12@gmail.com>
        Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 15:06:50 -0700 (PDT)
From: Ted Byers <r.ted.byers@gmail.com>
Subject: DBI problem: Can't connect to MySQL server on 'localhost' (10061
Message-Id: <ef189623-4897-488b-9631-bcefa9dd9961@r12g2000vbe.googlegroups.com>

I know this arises from time to time, and yes, I have tried everything
mentioned in the MySQL reference manual

I know the server (MySQL 5.1.50) is running.  All of the following
work perfectly:

mysql -h localhost --port=33066 -u MyUID -pMyPassword merchants2
mysql -h 127.0.0.1 --port=33066 -u MyUID -pMyPassword merchants2
mysql -h 192.168.2.8 --port=33066 -u MyUID -pMyPassword merchants2

All the above connect and let me run any SQL statement.

But the following scriptlet dies on the last statement with the error:
DBI connect('database=merchants2;host=localhost','rejbyers',...)
failed: Can't connect to MySQL server on 'localhost' (10061)

use strict;
use DBI;
my $db='merchants2';
my $hostname = 'localhost';
my $port = '33066';
my $user = 'MyUID';
my $dbpwd = 'MyPassword';

my $dbh = DBI->connect("DBI:mysql:database=$db;host=$hostname",
                    $user, $dbpwd, {RaiseError => 1});


The is especially frustrating since precisely the same perl code works
perfectly on all my other machines (that are running the same MySQL
server version and using the same perl - 64 bit Activestate Perl 5.12.

I am at a loss to know why.

Is there a way to have DBI provide more information about WHY it can't
connect?

Thanks

Ted


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 18:17:27 -0400
From: "Uri Guttman" <uri@StemSystems.com>
Subject: Re: DBI problem: Can't connect to MySQL server on 'localhost' (10061
Message-Id: <87y5yibgjs.fsf@quad.sysarch.com>

>>>>> "TB" == Ted Byers <r.ted.byers@gmail.com> writes:

  TB> mysql -h localhost --port=33066 -u MyUID -pMyPassword merchants2
  TB> mysql -h 127.0.0.1 --port=33066 -u MyUID -pMyPassword merchants2
  TB> mysql -h 192.168.2.8 --port=33066 -u MyUID -pMyPassword merchants2

  TB> my $port = '33066';

  TB> my $dbh = DBI->connect("DBI:mysql:database=$db;host=$hostname",
  TB>                     $user, $dbpwd, {RaiseError => 1});

i don't see $port in the connect call. dunno if mysql uses that value
for the default port but all your mysql commands set it but not the dbi
connect.

uri

-- 
Uri Guttman  --  uri AT perlhunter DOT com  ---  http://www.perlhunter.com --
------------  Perl Developer Recruiting and Placement Services  -------------
-----  Perl Code Review, Architecture, Development, Training, Support -------


------------------------------

Date: 25 Aug 2011 01:51:49 GMT
From: hymie@lactose.homelinux.net (hymie!)
Subject: Re: DBI problem: Can't connect to MySQL server on 'localhost' (10061
Message-Id: <4e55aab5$0$16800$a8266bb1@newsreader.readnews.com>

In our last episode, the evil Dr. Lacto had captured our hero,
  Ted Byers <r.ted.byers@gmail.com>, who said:

>mysql -h localhost --port=33066 -u MyUID -pMyPassword merchants2
>mysql -h 127.0.0.1 --port=33066 -u MyUID -pMyPassword merchants2
>mysql -h 192.168.2.8 --port=33066 -u MyUID -pMyPassword merchants2

33066 is not the default mysql port.

>my $port = '33066';
>
>my $dbh = DBI->connect("DBI:mysql:database=$db;host=$hostname",
>                    $user, $dbpwd, {RaiseError => 1});

You define $port but never use it.

--hymie!    http://lactose.homelinux.net/~hymie    hymie@lactose.homelinux.net
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 20:16:12 -0700 (PDT)
From: Ted Byers <r.ted.byers@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: DBI problem: Can't connect to MySQL server on 'localhost' (10061
Message-Id: <975f8a6e-5098-4615-94f0-11c6483fb074@u20g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>

On Aug 24, 6:06=A0pm, Ted Byers <r.ted.by...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I know this arises from time to time, and yes, I have tried everything
> mentioned in the MySQL reference manual
>
> I know the server (MySQL 5.1.50) is running. =A0All of the following
> work perfectly:
>
> mysql -h localhost --port=3D33066 -u MyUID -pMyPassword merchants2
> mysql -h 127.0.0.1 --port=3D33066 -u MyUID -pMyPassword merchants2
> mysql -h 192.168.2.8 --port=3D33066 -u MyUID -pMyPassword merchants2
>
> All the above connect and let me run any SQL statement.
>
> But the following scriptlet dies on the last statement with the error:
> DBI connect('database=3Dmerchants2;host=3Dlocalhost','rejbyers',...)
> failed: Can't connect to MySQL server on 'localhost' (10061)
>
> use strict;
> use DBI;
> my $db=3D'merchants2';
> my $hostname =3D 'localhost';
> my $port =3D '33066';
> my $user =3D 'MyUID';
> my $dbpwd =3D 'MyPassword';
>
> my $dbh =3D DBI->connect("DBI:mysql:database=3D$db;host=3D$hostname",
> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 $user, $dbpwd, {RaiseError =3D> 1=
});
>
> The is especially frustrating since precisely the same perl code works
> perfectly on all my other machines (that are running the same MySQL
> server version and using the same perl - 64 bit Activestate Perl 5.12.
>
> I am at a loss to know why.
>
> Is there a way to have DBI provide more information about WHY it can't
> connect?
>
> Thanks
>
> Ted

Thanks Uri and Hymie.

That was it.

Changing :

my $dbh =3D DBI->connect("DBI:mysql:database=3D$db;host=3D$hostname",
                    $user, $dbpwd, {RaiseError =3D> 1});


To:

my $dbh =3D DBI->connect("DBI:mysql:database=3D$db;host=3D$hostname;port=3D
$port",
                    $user, $dbpwd, {RaiseError =3D> 1});

Fixes things.

Thanks for pointing out something I ought to have seen.


------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2011 18:46:49 -0400
From: "Uri Guttman" <uri@StemSystems.com>
Subject: Re: Illegal character in prototype for main
Message-Id: <874o17oiee.fsf@quad.sysarch.com>

>>>>> "h" == hillgoogle  <hillgoogle@charter.net> writes:

  h> On Aug 23, 4:41 pm, Rainer Weikusat <rweiku...@mssgmbh.com> wrote:
  >> "Uri Guttman" <u...@StemSystems.com> writes:
  >> >>>>>> "h" == hillgoogle  <hillgoo...@charter.net> writes:
  >> 
  >> [...]
  >> 
  >> >   h> &SendMail($eml,$mail_text,$mail_sub);
  >> 
  >> > don't use & for calling subs.
  >> 
  >> At least not when calling them with arguments. &something is useful in
  >> subroutines performing some 'auxiliary task' and then 'forwarding' the
  >> call to another routine: It means 'invoke something and use the
  >> current @_ as argument list'. Semantically, this is (mostly)
  >> equivalent to something(@_) except that it is shorter and the overhead
  >> of creating a new @_ whose content is identical to the present @_ is
  >> avoided.

  h> OK ... then it should be:

  h> ******************************************************************
  h> &SendMail($eml,$mail_text,$mail_sub);

no.

  h> sub SendMail($$$)

and no again.

drop both the & and the prototype. one disables the other and the
prototype is useless to you here. it is not a good feature in general
and has only a few very narrow uses.

uri

-- 
Uri Guttman  --  uri AT perlhunter DOT com  ---  http://www.perlhunter.com --
------------  Perl Developer Recruiting and Placement Services  -------------
-----  Perl Code Review, Architecture, Development, Training, Support -------


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 01:00:01 +0200
From: Wolf Behrenhoff <NoSpamPleaseButThisIsValid3@gmx.net>
Subject: Re: Illegal character in prototype for main
Message-Id: <4e5430f1$0$6566$9b4e6d93@newsspool3.arcor-online.net>

Am 23.08.2011 23:46, schrieb hillgoogle@charter.net:
> On Aug 23, 4:41 pm, Rainer Weikusat <rweiku...@mssgmbh.com> wrote:
>> "Uri Guttman" <u...@StemSystems.com> writes:
>>>>>>>> "h" == hillgoogle  <hillgoo...@charter.net> writes:
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>>   h> &SendMail($eml,$mail_text,$mail_sub);
>>
>>> don't use & for calling subs.
>>
>> At least not when calling them with arguments. &something is useful in
>> subroutines performing some 'auxiliary task' and then 'forwarding' the
>> call to another routine: It means 'invoke something and use the
>> current @_ as argument list'. Semantically, this is (mostly)
>> equivalent to something(@_) except that it is shorter and the overhead
>> of creating a new @_ whose content is identical to the present @_ is
>> avoided.
> 
> OK ... then it should be:
> 
> ******************************************************************
> &SendMail($eml,$mail_text,$mail_sub);
> 
> sub SendMail($$$)

No! Re-read what has been written. Using the & overrides possible
prototypes - and in addition (and that's what Rainer's comment was
about) it passes all current arguments to the sub if you don't use
parameters.

Maybe an example can explain this better:

sub foo {
    print "Foo: @_";
}
sub bar { &foo }
bar("Hello", 42);

Here you're calling bar with two parameters. bar then calls foo. Since &
has a special meaning, the program will output Foo: Hello 42. Try
removing the & here!

To summarise: don't use & if you don't know what it is for.


Please use this:

SendMail($eml,$mail_text,$mail_sub);

sub SendMail {
    ...
}


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 12:17:13 -0400
From: Charlton Wilbur <cwilbur@chromatico.net>
Subject: Re: Illegal character in prototype for main
Message-Id: <87bovehjhy.fsf@new.chromatico.net>

>>>>> "u" == Uri Guttman <uri@StemSystems.com> writes:

    u> drop the prototype.

    u> sub SendMail {

    u> and most put the opening { on the sub line.

Don't make me get my torch and pitchfork.

Charlton


-- 
Charlton Wilbur
cwilbur@chromatico.net


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 12:39:38 -0500
From: Ted Zlatanov <tzz@lifelogs.com>
Subject: Re: Illegal character in prototype for main
Message-Id: <8739gq6751.fsf@lifelogs.com>

On Tue, 23 Aug 2011 17:55:19 -0400 "Uri Guttman" <uri@StemSystems.com> wrote: 

UG> not completely but better. this is how i would do it. note ALL the
UG> little changes like whitespace and name fixes.

send_mail( $eml, $mail_text, $mail_sub );

sub send_mail {

	my( $to, $msg, $subject ) = @_;

	my $from = 'me@somecompany.com';

	my $msg = MIME::Lite->new(
                To      => $to,
                From    => $from,
                Subject => $subject,
                Type    => 'text/html',
                Data    => $msg
	);

	$msg->send() ;
}

(end Uri's example)

I wanted to suggest something perhaps more generally useful, where all
the parameters you pass to your function will simply become hash key
overrides.  Also note the warning at the end.

Ted

#+begin_src perl

#!/usr/bin/perl

use warnings;
use strict;
use Data::Dumper;
use MIME::Lite;

send_mail( From => 'me@somecompany.com', To => "you", Data => "message data", Subject => "subject you want" );

sub send_mail {

    my %settings = (
                    To      => "Default Recipient",
                    From    => "Default Sender",
                    Subject => "Default Subject",
                    Type    => 'text/html',
                    Data    => "Default Message Text"
                   );

    my %overrides = @_;

    $settings{$_} = $overrides{$_} foreach sort keys %overrides;

    my $msg = MIME::Lite->new(%settings);
    $msg->send() if defined $msg;
    warn "Could not use settings to create message " . Dumper(\%settings)
     unless defined $msg;
}

#+end_src


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 12:56:38 -0500
From: Tad McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Subject: Re: Illegal character in prototype for main
Message-Id: <slrnj5ae9p.m5c.tadmc@tadbox.sbcglobal.net>

Charlton Wilbur <cwilbur@chromatico.net> wrote:
>>>>>> "u" == Uri Guttman <uri@StemSystems.com> writes:
>
>    u> drop the prototype.
>
>    u> sub SendMail {
>
>    u> and most put the opening { on the sub line.
>
> Don't make me get my torch and pitchfork.


There is only "One True Brace Style".

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indent_style#Variant:_1TBS


> Charlton


Heretic!


-- 
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.liamg\100cm.j.dat/"
The above message is a Usenet post.
I don't recall having given anyone permission to use it on a Web site.


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 13:04:17 -0500
From: Tad McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Subject: Re: Illegal character in prototype for main
Message-Id: <slrnj5aeo3.m5c.tadmc@tadbox.sbcglobal.net>

Ted Zlatanov <tzz@lifelogs.com> wrote:

> I wanted to suggest something perhaps more generally useful, where all
> the parameters you pass to your function will simply become hash key
> overrides.


I would generalize it even further, as below.


> send_mail( From => 'me@somecompany.com', To => "you", Data => "message data", Subject => "subject you want" );
>
> sub send_mail {
>
>     my %settings = (
>                     To      => "Default Recipient",
>                     From    => "Default Sender",
>                     Subject => "Default Subject",
>                     Type    => 'text/html',
>                     Data    => "Default Message Text"
>                    );
>
>     my %overrides = @_;
>
>     $settings{$_} = $overrides{$_} foreach sort keys %overrides;


I often start out my subroutines thusly:

    sub send_mail {
        my %args = (
                     To      => "Default Recipient",
                     From    => "Default Sender",
                     Subject => "Default Subject",
                     Type    => 'text/html',
                     Data    => "Default Message Text",
                     @_
                   );

        ...


There is no need to explicitly hashify and overwrite, I just let the
usual "last one wins" behavior of a list assignment to a hash 
handle all of that for me.


-- 
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.liamg\100cm.j.dat/"
The above message is a Usenet post.
I don't recall having given anyone permission to use it on a Web site.


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 15:49:49 -0700 (PDT)
From: hillgoogle@charter.net
Subject: Loading to Memory
Message-Id: <4c2d7943-9828-4e4e-affa-8da9de18b0c1@18g2000yqu.googlegroups.com>

On my unix box I want to load some data into memory using one program
and then retrieve it using another.

Anyone have any examples of how I can load that to my unix machine
memory?

Mike


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 16:25:41 -0700
From: Michael Vilain <vilain@NOspamcop.net>
Subject: Re: Loading to Memory
Message-Id: <vilain-6B9349.16254124082011@news.individual.net>

In article 
<4c2d7943-9828-4e4e-affa-8da9de18b0c1@18g2000yqu.googlegroups.com>,
 hillgoogle@charter.net wrote:

> On my unix box I want to load some data into memory using one program
> and then retrieve it using another.
> 
> Anyone have any examples of how I can load that to my unix machine
> memory?
> 
> Mike

In Unix, you have to create a shared region of memory and coordinate 
access to it somehow.  Oracle does this with their SGA.  There may be a 
way to do this using a CPAN module but it all depends on how much memory 
you're talking about.  Oracle requires special OS configuration, at 
least on Solaris, to allow the OS to permit an application to allocate 
shared memory in the GB range.  Don't know how you'd do this in Linux.  
How you coordinate access the the shared memory once it's created is 
something you'll have to work out.  This is a rather advanced 
programming topic.  You'll have to do a lot of reading and trial coding 
to get something you want.  Perl may not be the best tool for this.

The modules I got when I searched the CPAN library span are for using 
shared memory for persistence between sessions.  Not really what you're 
looking for since it's being used to implement sessions.

-- 
DeeDee, don't press that button!  DeeDee!  NO!  Dee...
[I filter all Goggle Groups posts, so any reply may be automatically ignored]




------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 16:46:57 -0700
From: Jürgen Exner <jurgenex@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Loading to Memory
Message-Id: <t93b57tovcramgail3lk5gcghihcfk01sd@4ax.com>

hillgoogle@charter.net wrote:
>On my unix box I want to load some data into memory using one program
>and then retrieve it using another.
>
>Anyone have any examples of how I can load that to my unix machine
>memory?

Just an idea: you may want to search for IPC (interprocess
communication) using shared memory. Maybe this will get you some
pointers.

jue


------------------------------

Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 11:01:34 +0200
From: "Dr.Ruud" <rvtol+usenet@xs4all.nl>
Subject: Re: Loading to Memory
Message-Id: <4e560f6e$0$2475$e4fe514c@news2.news.xs4all.nl>

On 2011-08-25 00:49, hillgoogle@charter.net wrote:

> On my unix box I want to load some data into memory using one program
> and then retrieve it using another.
>
> Anyone have any examples of how I can load that to my unix machine
> memory?

What do you need to do exactly? Any good OS cleverly caches the file 
system, so maybe you can just use a file?

-- 
Ruud


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 02:24:53 -0400
From: Jim <nomail2me@suddenlink.net>
Subject: Re: Script using LWP::UserAgent is sometimes failing with  500 error, although server reports 200
Message-Id: <a46957tn554nifv6rpjjach8m8pem6avq8@4ax.com>

On Tue, 23 Aug 2011 11:11:08 -0700 (PDT), David Karr
<davidmichaelkarr@gmail.com> wrote:

>So far we've discovered that the URL I'm using is going through an F5 to the web server, and if I change the test to go directly to the web server, it doesn't fail.  Going through the F5 I get one random failure after it's been running for a while (the script exits on the first failure).  So far the network engineer hasn't found any obvious configuration details on the F5 that might cause this.  Note that my requests are not using SSL.
>
>It's pretty clear this isn't really a Perl problem, but something about how it works in my script is making the race condition surface.

Another headbanger gotcha is a bad network card. Or a loose connector
- I've had both of those in the same situation.


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 16:51:22 +0100
From: Rainer Weikusat <rweikusat@mssgmbh.com>
Subject: Re: Script using LWP::UserAgent is sometimes failing with  500 error, although server reports 200
Message-Id: <87bovelsed.fsf@sapphire.mobileactivedefense.com>

David Karr <davidmichaelkarr@gmail.com> writes:
> If it matters, we've now ported the entire script to a Solaris VM,
> and it does not display this symptom, so there's something about
> Perl in Cygwin and Windows, combined with the F5, that is causing
> this symptom.

As the abundance of links returned by the Google search request I
posted should have told you, 'software caused connection abort' on
Windows means 'Winsock decided to kill the connection for some
reason'. If you're interested in what happened there, try a traffic
capture 'between' the Windows machine and its counterpart. But the
results of that are (with a very high probability) 'for educational
purposes only'. Practically, this just means when the software needs
to work reliably despite Windows being used, it needs to be able to
deal with essentially gratuitous connection aborts. A sensible
strategy would be to retry the request a couple of times with some
delay between the retries (using exponential backoff in order to cope
with problems a la 'someone disconnected a cable' might make sense).



------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 18:00:36 -0400
From: Jim <nomail2me@suddenlink.net>
Subject: Re: Script using LWP::UserAgent is sometimes failing with  500 error, although server reports 200
Message-Id: <uhsa57d6i60ngv3pi86a30d5f1loof69ei@4ax.com>

On Wed, 24 Aug 2011 08:08:56 -0700 (PDT), David Karr
<davidmichaelkarr@gmail.com> wrote:

>I understand, but this test is running on my laptop, which I use heavily every single day.  I suppose it's entirely possible there's a problem in the network card, but I've never seen any particular issue with network connections on this box.

Having watched the thread, it appeared you had been connected to one
server for development, then another for testing (that became flakey).

It really does look like something lower in the communications stack
than the running Perl code  -- something closer to the SMTP or IP
layer..  I used to see this when tuning mail systems, and it was
always either hardware, or handshake timing, external to the
application code (once it was debugged of course), somewhere in the
communications or protocol layers.


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 08:08:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: David Karr <davidmichaelkarr@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Script using LWP::UserAgent is sometimes failing with  500 error, although server reports 200
Message-Id: <9823f9c2-a483-4b47-8559-d865a5317cd2@glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com>

I understand, but this test is running on my laptop, which I use heavily every single day.  I suppose it's entirely possible there's a problem in the network card, but I've never seen any particular issue with network connections on this box.


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 08:07:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: David Karr <davidmichaelkarr@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Script using LWP::UserAgent is sometimes failing with  500 error, although server reports 200
Message-Id: <41875578-bdda-41ee-9b34-70b527b22490@glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com>

If it matters, we've now ported the entire script to a Solaris VM, and it does not display this symptom, so there's something about Perl in Cygwin and Windows, combined with the F5, that is causing this symptom.


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 20:50:52 +0200
From: bla bla <bla.12@gmail.com>
Subject: test
Message-Id: <4e55480c$0$24661$c3e8da3$efbdef2c@news.astraweb.com>

ignore


------------------------------

Date: 6 Apr 2001 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
From: Perl-Users-Request@ruby.oce.orst.edu (Perl-Users-Digest Admin) 
Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01)
Message-Id: <null>


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------------------------------
End of Perl-Users Digest V11 Issue 3481
***************************************


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