[31181] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 2426 Volume: 11
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Tue May 19 06:09:43 2009
Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 03:09:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Tue, 19 May 2009 Volume: 11 Number: 2426
Today's topics:
ampersand subroutine <someone@somewhere.nb.ca>
Re: ampersand subroutine <jurgenex@hotmail.com>
Re: ampersand subroutine <kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us>
Archive::Zip and correct extension (mixture of Word and <gcox@freeuk.com>
Re: Archive::Zip and correct extension (mixture of Word <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Re: Archive::Zip and correct extension (mixture of Word <gcox@freeuk.com>
Re: Archive::Zip and correct extension (mixture of Word <glex_no-spam@qwest-spam-no.invalid>
Re: beginner array of array... thank you all <uri@PerlOnCall.com>
Create and extract protected archive genomart@gmail.com
new CPAN modules on Tue May 19 2009 (Randal Schwartz)
Posting Guidelines for comp.lang.perl.misc ($Revision: tadmc@seesig.invalid
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 May 2009 23:38:37 -0300
From: "Guy" <someone@somewhere.nb.ca>
Subject: ampersand subroutine
Message-Id: <4a121bad$0$23761$9a566e8b@news.aliant.net>
I've seen some code that call user subroutines without the ampersand. I
didn't know you could do that.
"BTW, I went out and bought Learning Perl to help with my Intermediate
Perl."
So I read that you can omit the ampersand if "the compiler sees the
subroutine definition before invocation or..."
But instead of declaring all my subroutines at the begining of my script, or
ensuring they're located ahead of invocation, wouldn't it just be safer and
even easier to always have the ampersand? or are ampersand really a thing of
the past when not absolutely needed?
Guy
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 May 2009 21:21:26 -0700
From: Jürgen Exner <jurgenex@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: ampersand subroutine
Message-Id: <f2c4151o9rhr7od5bfgfgl5geii3om64ph@4ax.com>
"Guy" <someone@somewhere.nb.ca> wrote:
>I've seen some code that call user subroutines without the ampersand. I
>didn't know you could do that.
It has different semantics, so it depends upon what you want/need.
>So I read that you can omit the ampersand if "the compiler sees the
>subroutine definition before invocation or..."
>But instead of declaring all my subroutines at the begining of my script, or
>ensuring they're located ahead of invocation, wouldn't it just be safer and
>even easier to always have the ampersand? or are ampersand really a thing of
>the past when not absolutely needed?
You got the wrong idea. Actually several wrong ideas.
1: where if not at the beginning of your script do you define your subs?
You don't do that in the middle of the main body, do you?
2: as you wrote correctly the declaration has to be before the
invocation, while the definition of the sub can be anywhere, even
textually after its invocation
3: the ampersand is not "a thing of the past". It modifies the calling
semantic, such that
a) prototypes are overridden
b) @_ is visible to the called sub
(for details see perldoc perlsub).
If you want that semantic (which IMO is somewhat screwy) then use
ampersands. For normal programs it causes too many unwanted
dependencies, so I advise against using them. It is just easier not
having to deal with them.
jue
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 May 2009 21:29:42 -0700
From: Keith Keller <kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us>
Subject: Re: ampersand subroutine
Message-Id: <m6p9e6xno1.ln2@goaway.wombat.san-francisco.ca.us>
On 2009-05-19, Guy <someone@somewhere.nb.ca> wrote:
>
> But instead of declaring all my subroutines at the begining of my script, or
> ensuring they're located ahead of invocation, wouldn't it just be safer and
> even easier to always have the ampersand? or are ampersand really a thing of
> the past when not absolutely needed?
No, yes.
The ampersand bypasses prototypes (if you use them) and can allow
you to clobber the caller's @_ array. So you should only use the
ampersand if you need to do these things. Check out perldoc perlsub for
more details.
--keith
--
kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us
(try just my userid to email me)
AOLSFAQ=http://www.therockgarden.ca/aolsfaq.txt
see X- headers for PGP signature information
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 May 2009 23:20:58 +0100
From: Geoff Cox <gcox@freeuk.com>
Subject: Archive::Zip and correct extension (mixture of Word and PowerPoint files)?
Message-Id: <dan3151sjulca1fe3vt02d6vpotd524ers@4ax.com>
Hello,
I have almost 4000 zipped files, most of which contain a single MS
Word file.
The code below unzips each file and gives it the same name as the
zipped file except that it has a .doc extension.
That seemed fine until I remembered that about 170 of the zipped files
contain a single PowerPoint file so I need to give these files the
same name as the zipped file but with a .ppt extension!
I am not clear how the code below works but can it be altered so that
the Word files and the PowerPoint files are given the appropriate
extension?
I would be grateful if someone could explain how the codes works so
that I can undertand any alteration!
Cheers
Geoff
use warnings;
use strict;
use File::Find;
use Archive::Zip;
my $dir = 'c:/a-temp2';
find( sub {
( my $name = $_ ) =~ s/\.zip$/.doc/i or return;
my $zip = Archive::Zip->new( $_ );
$zip->extractMember( ($zip->memberNames)[ 0 ], $name );
unlink $_ or warn "Cannot delete $_: $!";
}, $dir );
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 May 2009 19:49:22 -0500
From: Tad J McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Subject: Re: Archive::Zip and correct extension (mixture of Word and PowerPoint files)?
Message-Id: <slrnh140gi.uc2.tadmc@tadmc30.sbcglobal.net>
Geoff Cox <gcox@freeuk.com> wrote:
> The code below unzips each file and gives it the same name as the
> zipped file except that it has a .doc extension.
>
> That seemed fine until I remembered that about 170 of the zipped files
> contain a single PowerPoint file so I need to give these files the
> same name as the zipped file but with a .ppt extension!
To do that, you will need to figure out some way of telling
if the archived file is Word or PowerPoint...
... how could you do that?
How about by examining the filename extension in the archived filename?
So, you want to get the basename from the zip file and get the
extension from the archived file.
> I am not clear how the code below works
Which parts?
> but can it be altered so that
> the Word files and the PowerPoint files are given the appropriate
> extension?
>
> I would be grateful if someone could explain how the codes works
Which parts?
> so
> that I can undertand any alteration!
> use warnings;
That enable warnings.
perldoc warnings
> use strict;
That enables stricture.
perldoc strict
> use File::Find;
That pulls in the File::Find module.
perldoc File::Find.
Are we really expected to explain every single line?
> use Archive::Zip;
> my $dir = 'c:/a-temp2';
That stores the string c:/a-temp2 into the variable named $dir.
> find( sub {
> ( my $name = $_ ) =~ s/\.zip$/.doc/i or return;
Now there's one that actually deserves some explanation.
It is the "copy and modify" idiom. Make a copy, and then modify the copy.
It is the same as:
my $name = $_;
$name =~ s/\.zip$/.doc/i;
But now you need to get the archived extension before you
can determine the new name.
my($arch_ext) = ($zip->memberNames)[ 0 ];
$arch_ext =~ s/.*\.//; # strip all but the extension
my $basename = $_;
$basename =~ s/\..*//; # strip off the extension
> my $zip = Archive::Zip->new( $_ );
> $zip->extractMember( ($zip->memberNames)[ 0 ], $name );
$zip->extractMember( ($zip->memberNames)[ 0 ], "$basename.$arch_ext" );
> unlink $_ or warn "Cannot delete $_: $!";
> }, $dir );
--
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.noitatibaher\100cmdat/"
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 07:32:32 +0100
From: Geoff Cox <gcox@freeuk.com>
Subject: Re: Archive::Zip and correct extension (mixture of Word and PowerPoint files)?
Message-Id: <sik415p9hg33gmsf1m1ht0202vf4c11ghi@4ax.com>
On Mon, 18 May 2009 19:49:22 -0500, Tad J McClellan
<tadmc@seesig.invalid> wrote:
>Geoff Cox <gcox@freeuk.com> wrote:
>
>> The code below unzips each file and gives it the same name as the
>> zipped file except that it has a .doc extension.
>>
>> That seemed fine until I remembered that about 170 of the zipped files
>> contain a single PowerPoint file so I need to give these files the
>> same name as the zipped file but with a .ppt extension!
>
>
>To do that, you will need to figure out some way of telling
>if the archived file is Word or PowerPoint...
>
>... how could you do that?
>
>How about by examining the filename extension in the archived filename?
>
>So, you want to get the basename from the zip file and get the
>extension from the archived file.
>
>
>> I am not clear how the code below works
>
>
>Which parts?
Many thanks Tad - I'm working through your comments!
Cheers
Geoff
>
>
>> but can it be altered so that
>> the Word files and the PowerPoint files are given the appropriate
>> extension?
>>
>> I would be grateful if someone could explain how the codes works
>
>
>Which parts?
>
>
>> so
>> that I can undertand any alteration!
>
>> use warnings;
>
>
>That enable warnings.
>
> perldoc warnings
>
>
>> use strict;
>
>
>That enables stricture.
>
> perldoc strict
>
>
>> use File::Find;
>
>
>That pulls in the File::Find module.
>
> perldoc File::Find.
>
>Are we really expected to explain every single line?
>
>
>> use Archive::Zip;
>> my $dir = 'c:/a-temp2';
>
>
>That stores the string c:/a-temp2 into the variable named $dir.
>
>
>> find( sub {
>> ( my $name = $_ ) =~ s/\.zip$/.doc/i or return;
>
>
>Now there's one that actually deserves some explanation.
>
>It is the "copy and modify" idiom. Make a copy, and then modify the copy.
>
>It is the same as:
>
> my $name = $_;
> $name =~ s/\.zip$/.doc/i;
>
>But now you need to get the archived extension before you
>can determine the new name.
>
> my($arch_ext) = ($zip->memberNames)[ 0 ];
> $arch_ext =~ s/.*\.//; # strip all but the extension
>
> my $basename = $_;
> $basename =~ s/\..*//; # strip off the extension
>
>
>> my $zip = Archive::Zip->new( $_ );
>> $zip->extractMember( ($zip->memberNames)[ 0 ], $name );
>
>
> $zip->extractMember( ($zip->memberNames)[ 0 ], "$basename.$arch_ext" );
>
>
>> unlink $_ or warn "Cannot delete $_: $!";
>> }, $dir );
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 May 2009 17:48:24 -0500
From: "J. Gleixner" <glex_no-spam@qwest-spam-no.invalid>
Subject: Re: Archive::Zip and correct extension (mixture of Word and PowerPoint files)?
Message-Id: <4a11e5b9$0$89865$815e3792@news.qwest.net>
Geoff Cox wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I have almost 4000 zipped files, most of which contain a single MS
> Word file.
>
> The code below unzips each file and gives it the same name as the
> zipped file except that it has a .doc extension.
>
> That seemed fine until I remembered that about 170 of the zipped files
> contain a single PowerPoint file so I need to give these files the
> same name as the zipped file but with a .ppt extension!
>
> I am not clear how the code below works but can it be altered so that
> the Word files and the PowerPoint files are given the appropriate
> extension?
You have most of your project already given to you, and now you're
asking for more?
>
> I would be grateful if someone could explain how the codes works so
> that I can undertand any alteration!
What, specifically don't you understand?
Try reading through the documentation, on your own time, to
learn.
perldoc File::Find
perldoc Archive::Zip
perldoc -f unlink
perldoc -f warn
A few 'print' statements, placed in the anonymous sub,
can help you see the values of various variables as it's running.
> use warnings;
> use strict;
>
> use File::Find;
> use Archive::Zip;
> my $dir = 'c:/a-temp2';
> find( sub {
> ( my $name = $_ ) =~ s/\.zip$/.doc/i or return;
> my $zip = Archive::Zip->new( $_ );
> $zip->extractMember( ($zip->memberNames)[ 0 ], $name );
> unlink $_ or warn "Cannot delete $_: $!";
> }, $dir );
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 18 May 2009 18:46:11 -0400
From: "Uri Guttman" <uri@PerlOnCall.com>
Subject: Re: beginner array of array... thank you all
Message-Id: <87pre6f2rw.fsf@quad.sysarch.com>
>>>>> "G" == Guy <someone@somewhere.nb.ca> writes:
G> I didn't know that push would push the reference of the split's
G> anonymous array. I thought that push would add the new fields of
G> the split at the end of @records, creating a long array like:
split doesn't have an anonymous array. be clear in what you are saying
or asking. these records are made from splitting a line by spaces and
putting those fields into an anon array. THAT array reference (which has nothing
to do with split but holds its results) is pushed (as a single scalar
value) onto the @records array.
G> Also, I appreciate the hash advise. It would probably make the
G> script easier to understand, in the future at least. But it's
G> really a small script, I'm not sure if it would be necessary, but
G> I'll keep that in mind??
you should learn it now. indexing fields by number and not name is prone
to bugs and misunderstanding later. this will bite you one day for sure
so learn hashes now.
uri
--
Uri Guttman ------ uri@stemsystems.com -------- http://www.sysarch.com --
----- Perl Code Review , Architecture, Development, Training, Support ------
--------- Free Perl Training --- http://perlhunter.com/college.html ---------
--------- Gourmet Hot Cocoa Mix ---- http://bestfriendscocoa.com ---------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 00:34:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: genomart@gmail.com
Subject: Create and extract protected archive
Message-Id: <4985b1cb-07c7-406d-b606-b1e98de87daf@e20g2000vbc.googlegroups.com>
Dear,
Which modules can I use to create an archive as zip or tar.gz with a
protected password. In the same idea, I would want to uncompressed
this archive always in Perl.
I am using Archive::Zip and Archive::Extract, but it not seem working.
Thank you.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 04:42:27 GMT
From: merlyn@stonehenge.com (Randal Schwartz)
Subject: new CPAN modules on Tue May 19 2009
Message-Id: <KJvJqr.11LC@zorch.sf-bay.org>
The following modules have recently been added to or updated in the
Comprehensive Perl Archive Network (CPAN). You can install them using the
instructions in the 'perlmodinstall' page included with your Perl
distribution.
Acme-POE-Acronym-Generator-1.18
http://search.cpan.org/~bingos/Acme-POE-Acronym-Generator-1.18/
Generate random POE acronyms.
----
Acme-SuperCollider-Programming-0.01
http://search.cpan.org/~adamk/Acme-SuperCollider-Programming-0.01/
Representing the Community for SuperCollider Programming
----
Acme-SuperCollider-Programming-0.02
http://search.cpan.org/~adamk/Acme-SuperCollider-Programming-0.02/
Representing the Community for SuperCollider Programming
----
Algorithm-BestChoice-0.01
http://search.cpan.org/~rkrimen/Algorithm-BestChoice-0.01/
Choose the best
----
Any-Moose-0.08
http://search.cpan.org/~sartak/Any-Moose-0.08/
use Moose or Mouse modules
----
App-Framework-0.90
http://search.cpan.org/~sdprice/App-Framework-0.90/
A framework for creating applications
----
Aspect-0.16
http://search.cpan.org/~adamk/Aspect-0.16/
Aspect-oriented programming (AOP) for Perl
----
Aspect-Library-Profiler-0.16
http://search.cpan.org/~adamk/Aspect-Library-Profiler-0.16/
reusable method call profiling aspect
----
Aspect-Library-Trace-0.16
http://search.cpan.org/~adamk/Aspect-Library-Trace-0.16/
Aspect-oriented function call tracing
----
Astro-0.71
http://search.cpan.org/~cphil/Astro-0.71/
----
Audio-Ecasound-Multitrack-0.9972
http://search.cpan.org/~ganglion/Audio-Ecasound-Multitrack-0.9972/
Perl extensions for multitrack audio processing
----
Audio-Ecasound-Multitrack-0.9973
http://search.cpan.org/~ganglion/Audio-Ecasound-Multitrack-0.9973/
Perl extensions for multitrack audio processing
----
Bot-BasicBot-Pluggable-Module-Retort-1.000000
http://search.cpan.org/~wazzuteke/Bot-BasicBot-Pluggable-Module-Retort-1.000000/
Witty statements and replies to English word stems.
----
Brackup-1.09
http://search.cpan.org/~bradfitz/Brackup-1.09/
Flexible backup tool. Slices, dices, encrypts, and sprays across the net.
----
CPANPLUS-Dist-Build-0.30
http://search.cpan.org/~bingos/CPANPLUS-Dist-Build-0.30/
CPANPLUS plugin to install packages that use Build.PL
----
Catalyst-Plugin-Authentication-Store-LDAP-0.0602
http://search.cpan.org/~karman/Catalyst-Plugin-Authentication-Store-LDAP-0.0602/
Authentication from an LDAP Directory **DEPRECATED**
----
Catalyst-Runtime-5.80004
http://search.cpan.org/~flora/Catalyst-Runtime-5.80004/
The Catalyst Framework Runtime
----
Catalyst-View-Component-jQuery-0.03
http://search.cpan.org/~converter/Catalyst-View-Component-jQuery-0.03/
Add a JavaScript::Framework::jQuery object to TT Views
----
Config-AutoConf-0.12_1
http://search.cpan.org/~ambs/Config-AutoConf-0.12_1/
A module to implement some of AutoConf macros in pure perl.
----
DBIx-Class-Preview-1.000001
http://search.cpan.org/~lsaunders/DBIx-Class-Preview-1.000001/
----
Devel-Optrace-0.03
http://search.cpan.org/~gfuji/Devel-Optrace-0.03/
Traces opcodes which are running now
----
EAFDSS-0.80
http://search.cpan.org/~hasiotis/EAFDSS-0.80/
Electronic Fiscal Signature Devices Library
----
EdgeExpressDB_0.953h
http://search.cpan.org/~jms/EdgeExpressDB_0.953h/
----
Elive-0.19
http://search.cpan.org/~warringd/Elive-0.19/
Elluminate Live (c) client library
----
Env-Sanctify-1.04
http://search.cpan.org/~bingos/Env-Sanctify-1.04/
Lexically scoped sanctification of %ENV
----
File-ChangeNotify-0.05
http://search.cpan.org/~drolsky/File-ChangeNotify-0.05/
Watch for changes to files, cross-platform style
----
File-LibMagic-0.95
http://search.cpan.org/~fitzner/File-LibMagic-0.95/
Perlwrapper for libmagic (file-4.x or file-5.x)
----
Finance-NASDAQ-Quote-0.05
http://search.cpan.org/~iank/Finance-NASDAQ-Quote-0.05/
Fetch real time stock quotes from nasdaq.com
----
JSON-CPAN-Meta-7.000
http://search.cpan.org/~rjbs/JSON-CPAN-Meta-7.000/
replace META.yml with META.json
----
LWP-UserAgent-Mockable-1.01
http://search.cpan.org/~mmorgan/LWP-UserAgent-Mockable-1.01/
Permits recording, and later playing back of LWP requests.
----
Lingua-EN-Nickname-1.15
http://search.cpan.org/~brianl/Lingua-EN-Nickname-1.15/
Genealogical nickname matching (Liz=Beth)
----
Locale-Maketext-Utils-0.13
http://search.cpan.org/~dmuey/Locale-Maketext-Utils-0.13/
Adds some utility functionality and failure handling to Local::Maketext handles
----
Mail-DKIM-0.33_8
http://search.cpan.org/~jaslong/Mail-DKIM-0.33_8/
Signs/verifies Internet mail with DKIM/DomainKey signatures
----
MooseX-Types-IO-0.03
http://search.cpan.org/~fayland/MooseX-Types-IO-0.03/
IO related constraints and coercions for Moose
----
Nagios-Plugin-OverHTTP-0.06
http://search.cpan.org/~dougdude/Nagios-Plugin-OverHTTP-0.06/
Nagios plugin to check over the HTTP protocol.
----
Net-GitHub-0.16
http://search.cpan.org/~fayland/Net-GitHub-0.16/
Perl Interface for github.com
----
Net-GitHub-0.17
http://search.cpan.org/~fayland/Net-GitHub-0.17/
Perl Interface for github.com
----
Net-SRCDS-Queries-0.0.1
http://search.cpan.org/~masanorih/Net-SRCDS-Queries-0.0.1/
Perl interface to Source Server Queries
----
Object-Simple-0.01_01
http://search.cpan.org/~kimoto/Object-Simple-0.01_01/
Very simple framework for Object Oriented Perl.
----
Object-Simple-Constraint-0.01_01
http://search.cpan.org/~kimoto/Object-Simple-Constraint-0.01_01/
Constraint functions for Object::Simple;
----
Object-Simple-Error-0.01_01
http://search.cpan.org/~kimoto/Object-Simple-Error-0.01_01/
Error object for Object::Simple
----
Outline-Lua-0.03
http://search.cpan.org/~altreus/Outline-Lua-0.03/
Run Lua code from a string, rather than embedded.
----
POE-Component-Client-DNS-Recursive-1.00
http://search.cpan.org/~bingos/POE-Component-Client-DNS-Recursive-1.00/
A recursive DNS client for POE
----
POE-Component-Github-0.04
http://search.cpan.org/~bingos/POE-Component-Github-0.04/
A POE component for the Github API
----
POE-Component-RemoteTail-0.01007
http://search.cpan.org/~miki/POE-Component-RemoteTail-0.01007/
tail to remote server's access_log on ssh connection.
----
Padre-Plugin-AcmePlayCode-0.09
http://search.cpan.org/~fayland/Padre-Plugin-AcmePlayCode-0.09/
Acme::PlayCode Plugin for Padre
----
Padre-Plugin-Alarm-0.05
http://search.cpan.org/~fayland/Padre-Plugin-Alarm-0.05/
Alarm Clock in Padre
----
Padre-Plugin-CSS-0.06
http://search.cpan.org/~fayland/Padre-Plugin-CSS-0.06/
Padre and CSS
----
Scalar-List-Utils-1.21
http://search.cpan.org/~gbarr/Scalar-List-Utils-1.21/
----
Storable-2.20
http://search.cpan.org/~ams/Storable-2.20/
persistence for Perl data structures
----
String-Perl-Warnings-1.02
http://search.cpan.org/~bingos/String-Perl-Warnings-1.02/
Determine if a string looks like a perl warning
----
Sub-Attribute-0.02
http://search.cpan.org/~gfuji/Sub-Attribute-0.02/
Reliable subroutine attribute handlers
----
Sys-CPU-0.51
http://search.cpan.org/~mkoderer/Sys-CPU-0.51/
Perl extension for getting CPU information. Currently only number of CPU's supported.
----
TAP-DOM-0.04
http://search.cpan.org/~schwigon/TAP-DOM-0.04/
TAP as document data structure.
----
TaskForest-1.26
http://search.cpan.org/~enoor/TaskForest-1.26/
A simple but expressive job scheduler that allows you to chain jobs/tasks and create time dependencies. Uses text config files to specify task dependencies.
----
Time-Simple-0.055
http://search.cpan.org/~lgoddard/Time-Simple-0.055/
A simple, light-weight ISO 8601 time object.
----
Time-Simple-0.055b
http://search.cpan.org/~lgoddard/Time-Simple-0.055b/
A simple, light-weight ISO 8601 time object.
----
Tk-Clock-0.27
http://search.cpan.org/~hmbrand/Tk-Clock-0.27/
Clock widget with analog and digital display
----
ZConf-GUI-0.1.0
http://search.cpan.org/~vvelox/ZConf-GUI-0.1.0/
A GUI backend chooser.
----
ZConf-Runner-1.0.0
http://search.cpan.org/~vvelox/ZConf-Runner-1.0.0/
Run a file using a choosen methode, desktop entry or mimetype.
----
gherkin-0.1
http://search.cpan.org/~steveha/gherkin-0.1/
----
xcruciate-016
http://search.cpan.org/~melonman/xcruciate-016/
If you're an author of one of these modules, please submit a detailed
announcement to comp.lang.perl.announce, and we'll pass it along.
This message was generated by a Perl program described in my Linux
Magazine column, which can be found on-line (along with more than
200 other freely available past column articles) at
http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/LinuxMag/col82.html
print "Just another Perl hacker," # the original
--
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
<merlyn@stonehenge.com> <URL:http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.vox.com/ for Smalltalk and Seaside discussion
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 07:14:37 GMT
From: tadmc@seesig.invalid
Subject: Posting Guidelines for comp.lang.perl.misc ($Revision: 1.9 $)
Message-Id: <x%sQl.17079$%54.10737@nlpi070.nbdc.sbc.com>
Outline
Before posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
Must
- Check the Perl Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
- Check the other standard Perl docs (*.pod)
Really Really Should
- Lurk for a while before posting
- Search a Usenet archive
If You Like
- Check Other Resources
Posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
Is there a better place to ask your question?
- Question should be about Perl, not about the application area
How to participate (post) in the clpmisc community
- Carefully choose the contents of your Subject header
- Use an effective followup style
- Speak Perl rather than English, when possible
- Ask perl to help you
- Do not re-type Perl code
- Provide enough information
- Do not provide too much information
- Do not post binaries, HTML, or MIME
Social faux pas to avoid
- Asking a Frequently Asked Question
- Asking a question easily answered by a cursory doc search
- Asking for emailed answers
- Beware of saying "doesn't work"
- Sending a "stealth" Cc copy
Be extra cautious when you get upset
- Count to ten before composing a followup when you are upset
- Count to ten after composing and before posting when you are upset
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Posting Guidelines for comp.lang.perl.misc ($Revision: 1.9 $)
This newsgroup, commonly called clpmisc, is a technical newsgroup
intended to be used for discussion of Perl related issues (except job
postings), whether it be comments or questions.
As you would expect, clpmisc discussions are usually very technical in
nature and there are conventions for conduct in technical newsgroups
going somewhat beyond those in non-technical newsgroups.
The article at:
http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
describes how to get answers from technical people in general.
This article describes things that you should, and should not, do to
increase your chances of getting an answer to your Perl question. It is
available in POD, HTML and plain text formats at:
http://www.rehabitation.com/clpmisc.shtml
For more information about netiquette in general, see the "Netiquette
Guidelines" at:
http://andrew2.andrew.cmu.edu/rfc/rfc1855.html
A note to newsgroup "regulars":
Do not use these guidelines as a "license to flame" or other
meanness. It is possible that a poster is unaware of things
discussed here. Give them the benefit of the doubt, and just
help them learn how to post, rather than assume that they do
know and are being the "bad kind" of Lazy.
A note about technical terms used here:
In this document, we use words like "must" and "should" as
they're used in technical conversation (such as you will
encounter in this newsgroup). When we say that you *must* do
something, we mean that if you don't do that something, then
it's unlikely that you will benefit much from this group.
We're not bossing you around; we're making the point without
lots of words.
Do *NOT* send email to the maintainer of these guidelines. It will be
discarded unread. The guidelines belong to the newsgroup so all
discussion should appear in the newsgroup. I am just the secretary that
writes down the consensus of the group.
Before posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
Must
This section describes things that you *must* do before posting to
clpmisc, in order to maximize your chances of getting meaningful replies
to your inquiry and to avoid getting flamed for being lazy and trying to
have others do your work.
The perl distribution includes documentation that is copied to your hard
drive when you install perl. Also installed is a program for looking
things up in that (and other) documentation named 'perldoc'.
You should either find out where the docs got installed on your system,
or use perldoc to find them for you. Type "perldoc perldoc" to learn how
to use perldoc itself. Type "perldoc perl" to start reading Perl's
standard documentation.
Check the Perl Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
Checking the FAQ before posting is required in Big 8 newsgroups in
general, there is nothing clpmisc-specific about this requirement.
You are expected to do this in nearly all newsgroups.
You can use the "-q" switch with perldoc to do a word search of the
questions in the Perl FAQs.
Check the other standard Perl docs (*.pod)
The perl distribution comes with much more documentation than is
available for most other newsgroups, so in clpmisc you should also
see if you can find an answer in the other (non-FAQ) standard docs
before posting.
It is *not* required, or even expected, that you actually *read* all of
Perl's standard docs, only that you spend a few minutes searching them
before posting.
Try doing a word-search in the standard docs for some words/phrases
taken from your problem statement or from your very carefully worded
"Subject:" header.
Really Really Should
This section describes things that you *really should* do before posting
to clpmisc.
Lurk for a while before posting
This is very important and expected in all newsgroups. Lurking means
to monitor a newsgroup for a period to become familiar with local
customs. Each newsgroup has specific customs and rituals. Knowing
these before you participate will help avoid embarrassing social
situations. Consider yourself to be a foreigner at first!
Search a Usenet archive
There are tens of thousands of Perl programmers. It is very likely
that your question has already been asked (and answered). See if you
can find where it has already been answered.
One such searchable archive is:
http://groups.google.com/advanced_search
If You Like
This section describes things that you *can* do before posting to
clpmisc.
Check Other Resources
You may want to check in books or on web sites to see if you can
find the answer to your question.
But you need to consider the source of such information: there are a
lot of very poor Perl books and web sites, and several good ones
too, of course.
Posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
There can be 200 messages in clpmisc in a single day. Nobody is going to
read every article. They must decide somehow which articles they are
going to read, and which they will skip.
Your post is in competition with 199 other posts. You need to "win"
before a person who can help you will even read your question.
These sections describe how you can help keep your article from being
one of the "skipped" ones.
Is there a better place to ask your question?
Question should be about Perl, not about the application area
It can be difficult to separate out where your problem really is,
but you should make a conscious effort to post to the most
applicable newsgroup. That is, after all, where you are the most
likely to find the people who know how to answer your question.
Being able to "partition" a problem is an essential skill for
effectively troubleshooting programming problems. If you don't get
that right, you end up looking for answers in the wrong places.
It should be understood that you may not know that the root of your
problem is not Perl-related (the two most frequent ones are CGI and
Operating System related), so off-topic postings will happen from
time to time. Be gracious when someone helps you find a better place
to ask your question by pointing you to a more applicable newsgroup.
How to participate (post) in the clpmisc community
Carefully choose the contents of your Subject header
You have 40 precious characters of Subject to win out and be one of
the posts that gets read. Don't waste them. Take care while
composing them, they are the key that opens the door to getting an
answer.
Spend them indicating what aspect of Perl others will find if they
should decide to read your article.
Do not spend them indicating "experience level" (guru, newbie...).
Do not spend them pleading (please read, urgent, help!...).
Do not spend them on non-Subjects (Perl question, one-word
Subject...)
For more information on choosing a Subject see "Choosing Good
Subject Lines":
http://www.cpan.org/authors/id/D/DM/DMR/subjects.post
Part of the beauty of newsgroup dynamics, is that you can contribute
to the community with your very first post! If your choice of
Subject leads a fellow Perler to find the thread you are starting,
then even asking a question helps us all.
Use an effective followup style
When composing a followup, quote only enough text to establish the
context for the comments that you will add. Always indicate who
wrote the quoted material. Never quote an entire article. Never
quote a .signature (unless that is what you are commenting on).
Intersperse your comments *following* each section of quoted text to
which they relate. Unappreciated followup styles are referred to as
"top-posting", "Jeopardy" (because the answer comes before the
question), or "TOFU" (Text Over, Fullquote Under).
Reversing the chronology of the dialog makes it much harder to
understand (some folks won't even read it if written in that style).
For more information on quoting style, see:
http://web.presby.edu/~nnqadmin/nnq/nquote.html
Speak Perl rather than English, when possible
Perl is much more precise than natural language. Saying it in Perl
instead will avoid misunderstanding your question or problem.
Do not say: I have variable with "foo\tbar" in it.
Instead say: I have $var = "foo\tbar", or I have $var = 'foo\tbar',
or I have $var = <DATA> (and show the data line).
Ask perl to help you
You can ask perl itself to help you find common programming mistakes
by doing two things: enable warnings (perldoc warnings) and enable
"strict"ures (perldoc strict).
You should not bother the hundreds/thousands of readers of the
newsgroup without first seeing if a machine can help you find your
problem. It is demeaning to be asked to do the work of a machine. It
will annoy the readers of your article.
You can look up any of the messages that perl might issue to find
out what the message means and how to resolve the potential mistake
(perldoc perldiag). If you would like perl to look them up for you,
you can put "use diagnostics;" near the top of your program.
Do not re-type Perl code
Use copy/paste or your editor's "import" function rather than
attempting to type in your code. If you make a typo you will get
followups about your typos instead of about the question you are
trying to get answered.
Provide enough information
If you do the things in this item, you will have an Extremely Good
chance of getting people to try and help you with your problem!
These features are a really big bonus toward your question winning
out over all of the other posts that you are competing with.
First make a short (less than 20-30 lines) and *complete* program
that illustrates the problem you are having. People should be able
to run your program by copy/pasting the code from your article. (You
will find that doing this step very often reveals your problem
directly. Leading to an answer much more quickly and reliably than
posting to Usenet.)
Describe *precisely* the input to your program. Also provide example
input data for your program. If you need to show file input, use the
__DATA__ token (perldata.pod) to provide the file contents inside of
your Perl program.
Show the output (including the verbatim text of any messages) of
your program.
Describe how you want the output to be different from what you are
getting.
If you have no idea at all of how to code up your situation, be sure
to at least describe the 2 things that you *do* know: input and
desired output.
Do not provide too much information
Do not just post your entire program for debugging. Most especially
do not post someone *else's* entire program.
Do not post binaries, HTML, or MIME
clpmisc is a text only newsgroup. If you have images or binaries
that explain your question, put them in a publically accessible
place (like a Web server) and provide a pointer to that location. If
you include code, cut and paste it directly in the message body.
Don't attach anything to the message. Don't post vcards or HTML.
Many people (and even some Usenet servers) will automatically filter
out such messages. Many people will not be able to easily read your
post. Plain text is something everyone can read.
Social faux pas to avoid
The first two below are symptoms of lots of FAQ asking here in clpmisc.
It happens so often that folks will assume that it is happening yet
again. If you have looked but not found, or found but didn't understand
the docs, say so in your article.
Asking a Frequently Asked Question
It should be understood that you may have missed the applicable FAQ
when you checked, which is not a big deal. But if the Frequently
Asked Question is worded similar to your question, folks will assume
that you did not look at all. Don't become indignant at pointers to
the FAQ, particularly if it solves your problem.
Asking a question easily answered by a cursory doc search
If folks think you have not even tried the obvious step of reading
the docs applicable to your problem, they are likely to become
annoyed.
If you are flamed for not checking when you *did* check, then just
shrug it off (and take the answer that you got).
Asking for emailed answers
Emailed answers benefit one person. Posted answers benefit the
entire community. If folks can take the time to answer your
question, then you can take the time to go get the answer in the
same place where you asked the question.
It is OK to ask for a *copy* of the answer to be emailed, but many
will ignore such requests anyway. If you munge your address, you
should never expect (or ask) to get email in response to a Usenet
post.
Ask the question here, get the answer here (maybe).
Beware of saying "doesn't work"
This is a "red flag" phrase. If you find yourself writing that,
pause and see if you can't describe what is not working without
saying "doesn't work". That is, describe how it is not what you
want.
Sending a "stealth" Cc copy
A "stealth Cc" is when you both email and post a reply without
indicating *in the body* that you are doing so.
Be extra cautious when you get upset
Count to ten before composing a followup when you are upset
This is recommended in all Usenet newsgroups. Here in clpmisc, most
flaming sub-threads are not about any feature of Perl at all! They
are most often for what was seen as a breach of netiquette. If you
have lurked for a bit, then you will know what is expected and won't
make such posts in the first place.
But if you get upset, wait a while before writing your followup. I
recommend waiting at least 30 minutes.
Count to ten after composing and before posting when you are upset
After you have written your followup, wait *another* 30 minutes
before committing yourself by posting it. You cannot take it back
once it has been said.
AUTHOR
Tad McClellan and many others on the comp.lang.perl.misc newsgroup.
--
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.noitatibaher\100cmdat/"
------------------------------
Date: 6 Apr 2001 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
From: Perl-Users-Request@ruby.oce.orst.edu (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01)
Message-Id: <null>
Administrivia:
#The Perl-Users Digest is a retransmission of the USENET newsgroup
#comp.lang.perl.misc. For subscription or unsubscription requests, send
#the single line:
#
# subscribe perl-users
#or:
# unsubscribe perl-users
#
#to almanac@ruby.oce.orst.edu.
NOTE: due to the current flood of worm email banging on ruby, the smtp
server on ruby has been shut off until further notice.
To submit articles to comp.lang.perl.announce, send your article to
clpa@perl.com.
#To request back copies (available for a week or so), send your request
#to almanac@ruby.oce.orst.edu with the command "send perl-users x.y",
#where x is the volume number and y is the issue number.
#For other requests pertaining to the digest, send mail to
#perl-users-request@ruby.oce.orst.edu. Do not waste your time or mine
#sending perl questions to the -request address, I don't have time to
#answer them even if I did know the answer.
------------------------------
End of Perl-Users Digest V11 Issue 2426
***************************************
