[31162] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 2407 Volume: 11
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Sun May 10 21:10:51 2009
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 18:10:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Sun, 10 May 2009 Volume: 11 Number: 2407
Today's topics:
Re: Console output (or anything) on Win32? <nospam-abuse@ilyaz.org>
Re: Console output (or anything) on Win32? <j.asenjo@asenjo.nl.invalid>
Re: Console output (or anything) on Win32? <RedGrittyBrick@SpamWeary.foo>
Re: Console output (or anything) on Win32? <ben@morrow.me.uk>
Re: Console output (or anything) on Win32? <nospam-abuse@ilyaz.org>
Re: Finding domain and subdomains from host name <hjp-usenet2@hjp.at>
Re: Finding domain and subdomains from host name <noreply@gunnar.cc>
Re: Finding domain and subdomains from host name <mvdwege_public@myrealbox.com>
Re: IO::Socket::INET on OSX or TCP stack problem derykus@gmail.com
OOP to standard <someone@somewhere.nb.ca>
Re: OOP to standard <1usa@llenroc.ude.invalid>
Re: OOP to standard <ben@morrow.me.uk>
Re: OOP to standard <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Re: OOP to standard <someone@somewhere.nb.ca>
standard and OOP together <someone@somewhere.nb.ca>
Re: standard and OOP together <1usa@llenroc.ude.invalid>
Re: standard and OOP together <cartercc@gmail.com>
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 18:38:01 GMT
From: Ilya Zakharevich <nospam-abuse@ilyaz.org>
Subject: Re: Console output (or anything) on Win32?
Message-Id: <slrnh0e7o9.g6s.nospam-abuse@chorin.math.berkeley.edu>
On 2009-05-08, Ben Morrow <ben@morrow.me.uk> wrote:
>> Is it possible to use `binmode($fh, SOMETHING)' in Win32 to get "the
>> expected console-like behaviour" on the handle? Something other API?
> I don't think so. There doesn't appear to be any way to call
> WriteConsoleW from perl without wrapping it yourself: AFAICT,
> Win32::Console only allows you to call WriteConsoleA, which won't do
> what you want.
I knew already that the win32 port of Perl cannot read command-line
arguments, cannot get contents of directories, or open files (as in
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.perl.misc/msg/1fc326742ab7deb2).
Now it is also that it cannot even output to terminal...
I would say that this is a strange state for a >10-years old
commertially-supported port...
Pity,
Ilya
P.S.
> The pipe/file part is obviously easy: just use Win32::Console::OutputCP
> to get the encoding and binmode($fh, ":encoding(cp$CP)") to encode the
> data.
Without correct console output, this does not make any sense... How
it would be better than utf8 output?
------------------------------
Date: 10 May 2009 19:09:06 GMT
From: "J.I. Asenjo" <j.asenjo@asenjo.nl.invalid>
Subject: Re: Console output (or anything) on Win32?
Message-Id: <4a072652$0$183$e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl>
On 2009-05-10, Ilya Zakharevich <nospam-abuse@ilyaz.org> wrote:
> I knew already that the win32 port of Perl cannot read command-line
> arguments, cannot get contents of directories, or open files (as in
> http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.perl.misc/msg/1fc326742ab7deb2).
> Now it is also that it cannot even output to terminal...
o please. Give the full thread then:
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.perl.misc/browse_thread/thread/
0d0080974d220e38/1fc326742ab7deb2?#1fc326742ab7deb2
I do not know what you're talking about, but this smells like a déjà vu ...
--
Groeten,
J.I.Asenjo
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 22:03:01 +0100
From: RedGrittyBrick <RedGrittyBrick@SpamWeary.foo>
Subject: Re: Console output (or anything) on Win32?
Message-Id: <dKydnYAgJq6T3JrXnZ2dnUVZ8q2dnZ2d@bt.com>
(Followup set)
Ilya Zakharevich wrote:
> On 2009-05-08, Ben Morrow <ben@morrow.me.uk> wrote:
>>> Is it possible to use `binmode($fh, SOMETHING)' in Win32 to get "the
>>> expected console-like behaviour" on the handle? Something other API?
>
>> I don't think so. There doesn't appear to be any way to call
>> WriteConsoleW from perl without wrapping it yourself: AFAICT,
>> Win32::Console only allows you to call WriteConsoleA, which won't do
>> what you want.
>
> I knew already that the win32 port of Perl cannot read command-line
> arguments, cannot get contents of directories, or open files (as in
> http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.perl.misc/msg/1fc326742ab7deb2).
Didn't Sinan answer that?
I find the Win32 port I use does all those things (if I understand
correctly):
C:\> mkdir t
C:\> cd t
C:\t> echo aaa > a.txt
C:\t> echo bbb > b.txt
C:\t> perl -e "print qq(ARGV[0] is '$ARGV[0]'\n)" a.txt
ARGV[0] is 'a.txt'
C:\t> perl -e "opendir $d, '.'; @f = readdir($d); print join ' ', @f"
. .. a.txt b.txt
C:\t> perl -e "open $fh, '<', $ARGV[0]; while(<$fh>) {print}" a.txt
aaa
What have I missed?
> Now it is also that it cannot even output to terminal...
>
> I would say that this is a strange state for a >10-years old
> commertially-supported port...
>
One of your goals was to get "full Unicode text on the console", do you
mean this sort of thing:
C:\> chcp 65001
Active code page: 65001
C:\> perl -e "binmode(STDOUT, ':utf8'); print qq(abc\x{2116}def\n)"
abc№def
Or do the terms "terminal" and "console" mean something different to
"Command prompt Window" in Vista (which Is what I am using)?
Sorry if I've badly misunderstood.
--
RGB
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 23:53:17 +0100
From: Ben Morrow <ben@morrow.me.uk>
Subject: Re: Console output (or anything) on Win32?
Message-Id: <tf2kd6-108.ln1@osiris.mauzo.dyndns.org>
Quoth RedGrittyBrick <RedGrittyBrick@SpamWeary.foo>:
> (Followup set)
>
> Ilya Zakharevich wrote:
> > On 2009-05-08, Ben Morrow <ben@morrow.me.uk> wrote:
> >>> Is it possible to use `binmode($fh, SOMETHING)' in Win32 to get "the
> >>> expected console-like behaviour" on the handle? Something other API?
> >
> >> I don't think so. There doesn't appear to be any way to call
> >> WriteConsoleW from perl without wrapping it yourself: AFAICT,
> >> Win32::Console only allows you to call WriteConsoleA, which won't do
> >> what you want.
> >
> > I knew already that the win32 port of Perl cannot read command-line
> > arguments, cannot get contents of directories, or open files (as in
> > http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.perl.misc/msg/1fc326742ab7deb2).
>
> Didn't Sinan answer that?
>
>
> I find the Win32 port I use does all those things (if I understand
> correctly):
>
> C:\> mkdir t
> C:\> cd t
> C:\t> echo aaa > a.txt
> C:\t> echo bbb > b.txt
>
> C:\t> perl -e "print qq(ARGV[0] is '$ARGV[0]'\n)" a.txt
> ARGV[0] is 'a.txt'
>
> C:\t> perl -e "opendir $d, '.'; @f = readdir($d); print join ' ', @f"
> . .. a.txt b.txt
>
> C:\t> perl -e "open $fh, '<', $ARGV[0]; while(<$fh>) {print}" a.txt
> aaa
>
> What have I missed?
None of those files have names that require Unicode. Try it again with
some that do, including names with characters not in your current
codepage.
> > Now it is also that it cannot even output to terminal...
> >
> > I would say that this is a strange state for a >10-years old
> > commertially-supported port...
> >
>
> One of your goals was to get "full Unicode text on the console", do you
> mean this sort of thing:
>
> C:\> chcp 65001
> Active code page: 65001
>
> C:\> perl -e "binmode(STDOUT, ':utf8'); print qq(abc\x{2116}def\n)"
> abc№def
>
>
> Or do the terms "terminal" and "console" mean something different to
> "Command prompt Window" in Vista (which Is what I am using)?
No, Ilya's aim was to get full Unicode output on the console *without*
changing the codepage. This is possible by calling WriteConsoleW, but
perl doesn't provide any way to call that.
Ben
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 May 2009 00:45:32 GMT
From: Ilya Zakharevich <nospam-abuse@ilyaz.org>
Subject: Re: Console output (or anything) on Win32?
Message-Id: <slrnh0et9c.imk.nospam-abuse@chorin.math.berkeley.edu>
On 2009-05-10, J.I. Asenjo <j.asenjo@asenjo.nl.invalid> wrote:
> On 2009-05-10, Ilya Zakharevich <nospam-abuse@ilyaz.org> wrote:
>
>> I knew already that the win32 port of Perl cannot read command-line
>> arguments, cannot get contents of directories, or open files (as in
>> http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.perl.misc/msg/1fc326742ab7deb2).
>> Now it is also that it cannot even output to terminal...
>
> o please. Give the full thread then:
??? There is a "view thread" button on the URL I gave...
Ilya
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 22:37:38 +0200
From: "Peter J. Holzer" <hjp-usenet2@hjp.at>
Subject: Re: Finding domain and subdomains from host name
Message-Id: <slrnh0eeoi.phs.hjp-usenet2@hrunkner.hjp.at>
On 2009-05-10 17:46, Gunnar Hjalmarsson <noreply@gunnar.cc> wrote:
> John wrote:
>> But, my original problem which is to locate all domains using a single IP
>> address remains.
>> My recent searching throws up 'reverse IP' as maybe the term I should be
>> looking at to find all domains on a single IP.
>
> No. All domains resolve to an IP,
No. Many domains don't have A records. Some have NS or MX or SRV or TXT
records, some don't have any records at all and serve only as containers
for their subdomains. And that's without considering specialized domains
like in-addr.arpa.
> but the other way around only works accationally.
Right. There is no way to find all domains which contain an A record
with a specific IP address. The only way to do that would be to walk
recursively through the complete domain name space, but most name
servers don't allow that any more.
"Reverse lookups" typically return only the canonical name of the
interface. It is rare that a PTR lookup returns more than one result
(try "dig -x 143.130.20.2" for an example)
hp
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 22:55:55 +0200
From: Gunnar Hjalmarsson <noreply@gunnar.cc>
Subject: Re: Finding domain and subdomains from host name
Message-Id: <76otbkF1dm737U1@mid.individual.net>
Peter J. Holzer wrote:
> On 2009-05-10 17:46, Gunnar Hjalmarsson <noreply@gunnar.cc> wrote:
>> John wrote:
>>> But, my original problem which is to locate all domains using a single IP
>>> address remains.
>>> My recent searching throws up 'reverse IP' as maybe the term I should be
>>> looking at to find all domains on a single IP.
>>
>> No. All domains resolve to an IP,
>
> No. Many domains don't have A records. Some have NS or MX or SRV or TXT
> records, some don't have any records at all and serve only as containers
> for their subdomains. And that's without considering specialized domains
> like in-addr.arpa.
Okay, maybe I was too quick there, but NS and MX domains normally
resolve to IP addresses. Why else would they be there?
--
Gunnar Hjalmarsson
Email: http://www.gunnar.cc/cgi-bin/contact.pl
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 23:12:20 +0200
From: Mart van de Wege <mvdwege_public@myrealbox.com>
Subject: Re: Finding domain and subdomains from host name
Message-Id: <86y6t4oe6j.fsf@gareth.avalon.lan>
Gunnar Hjalmarsson <noreply@gunnar.cc> writes:
> Peter J. Holzer wrote:
>> On 2009-05-10 17:46, Gunnar Hjalmarsson <noreply@gunnar.cc> wrote:
>>> John wrote:
>>>> But, my original problem which is to locate all domains using a
>>>> single IP address remains.
>>>> My recent searching throws up 'reverse IP' as maybe the term I
>>>> should be looking at to find all domains on a single IP.
>>>
>>> No. All domains resolve to an IP,
>>
>> No. Many domains don't have A records. Some have NS or MX or SRV or TXT
>> records, some don't have any records at all and serve only as containers
>> for their subdomains. And that's without considering specialized domains
>> like in-addr.arpa.
>
> Okay, maybe I was too quick there, but NS and MX domains normally
> resolve to IP addresses. Why else would they be there?
Erm.
They usually resolve to FQDNs. In case of e.g. an MX record, one
resolves the FQDN to get to the A record of the actual mail server,
which then gives the actual IP address to connect to on port 25 to
deliver the mail.
Mart
--
"We will need a longer wall when the revolution comes."
--- AJS, quoting an uncertain source.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 16:12:46 -0700 (PDT)
From: derykus@gmail.com
Subject: Re: IO::Socket::INET on OSX or TCP stack problem
Message-Id: <b6d6799c-90a9-4aad-b64d-73f3cc2c3f39@c18g2000prh.googlegroups.com>
On May 8, 2:05=A0pm, Stuart Gall <stu...@otenet.gr> wrote:
> On 2009-05-07 23:03:16 +0300, dery...@gmail.com said:
>
> ...
> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 print $socket $COMMAND;
> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 $socket->read($r,6); =A0 =A0#5th byte is the length byte =
=A0 =A0 *****
> This is one place that it hangs with repeated retries
Any possibility of a timeout as a workaround:
eval { local $SIG{ALRM} =3D sub { die 'socket t/o';
alarm(...);
$socket->read($r, 6) };
alarm(0);
};
if ( $@ =3D~ m{socket t/o} and not $socket->connected ) {
... reopen socket etc.
}
--
Charles DeRykus
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 16:02:06 -0300
From: "Guy" <someone@somewhere.nb.ca>
Subject: OOP to standard
Message-Id: <4a07249a$0$23768$9a566e8b@news.aliant.net>
What would be the standard way of writing the following object oriented perl
code?
use CGI;
$CGI::DISABLE_UPLOADS = 1;
$CGI::POST_MAX=102_400; # 100KB ex: 1024 x 100
And why is there an underscore in 102_400?
Guy
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 21:11:46 GMT
From: "A. Sinan Unur" <1usa@llenroc.ude.invalid>
Subject: Re: OOP to standard
Message-Id: <Xns9C07AEFC491DCasu1cornelledu@127.0.0.1>
"Guy" <someone@somewhere.nb.ca> wrote in
news:4a07249a$0$23768$9a566e8b@news.aliant.net:
> What would be the standard way of writing the following object
> oriented perl code?
>
> use CGI;
> $CGI::DISABLE_UPLOADS = 1;
> $CGI::POST_MAX=102_400; # 100KB ex: 1024 x 100
use CGI;
$CGI::DISABLE_UPLOADS = 1;
$CGI::POST_MAX = 100 * 1024; # no need for the silly comment.
> And why is there an underscore in 102_400?
That is just a convenient way of formatting numbers in Perl.
See "Scalar value constructors" in perldoc perldata.
In fact, it looks like you should read all of the FAQ and most of the
other documents bundled with Perl before writing any more code.
Sinan
--
A. Sinan Unur <1usa@llenroc.ude.invalid>
(remove .invalid and reverse each component for email address)
comp.lang.perl.misc guidelines on the WWW:
http://www.rehabitation.com/clpmisc/
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 23:55:19 +0100
From: Ben Morrow <ben@morrow.me.uk>
Subject: Re: OOP to standard
Message-Id: <nj2kd6-108.ln1@osiris.mauzo.dyndns.org>
Quoth "Guy" <someone@somewhere.nb.ca>:
> What would be the standard way of writing the following object oriented perl
> code?
>
> use CGI;
> $CGI::DISABLE_UPLOADS = 1;
> $CGI::POST_MAX=102_400; # 100KB ex: 1024 x 100
What makes you think this code is object-oriented? (Hint: it isn't.)
> And why is there an underscore in 102_400?
Perl allows underscores in numeric literals, for legibility.
Ben
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 18:12:40 -0500
From: Tad J McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Subject: Re: OOP to standard
Message-Id: <slrnh0enr8.ctk.tadmc@tadmc30.sbcglobal.net>
Guy <someone@somewhere.nb.ca> wrote:
> What would be the standard way of writing the following object oriented perl
> code?
>
> use CGI;
> $CGI::DISABLE_UPLOADS = 1;
> $CGI::POST_MAX=102_400; # 100KB ex: 1024 x 100
There is no object orientation in any of that code.
If you think that there is, then you have a conceptual misunderstanding
somewhere.
If you can explain why you think that that code is object-oriented
then we could probably help to clear up your misunderstanding.
So, why do you think that the above is object-oriented?
> And why is there an underscore in 102_400?
Why is there a comma in 102,400?
You really must get a better grasp on fundamentals before proceeding.
Reading about Perl's data types before writing Perl programs
would be a Really Good Idea:
perldoc perldata
... You are allowed to use underscores ...
--
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.noitatibaher\100cmdat/"
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 21:37:50 -0300
From: "Guy" <someone@somewhere.nb.ca>
Subject: Re: OOP to standard
Message-Id: <4a077348$0$23742$9a566e8b@news.aliant.net>
"Tad J McClellan" <tadmc@seesig.invalid> wrote ...:
slrnh0enr8.ctk.tadmc@tadmc30.sbcglobal.net...
> Guy <someone@somewhere.nb.ca> wrote:
>> What would be the standard way of writing the following object oriented
>> perl
>> code?
>>
>> use CGI;
>> $CGI::DISABLE_UPLOADS = 1;
>> $CGI::POST_MAX=102_400; # 100KB ex: 1024 x 100
>
>
> There is no object orientation in any of that code.
>
> If you think that there is, then you have a conceptual misunderstanding
> somewhere.
>
> If you can explain why you think that that code is object-oriented
> then we could probably help to clear up your misunderstanding.
>
> So, why do you think that the above is object-oriented?
>
I was refering to O'Reilly's "CGI Programming with Perl 2e", by Guelich...,
p87 says:
CGI.pm like Perl is powerful yet flexible.
It supports two styles of usage:
a standard interface
and an OO interface...
further on p88:
Here is an example. The OO syntax:
use strict;
use CGI;
my $q = new CGI;
my $name = $q->param( "name" );
print $q->header( "text/html" );
The standard Syntax looks like this:
use strict;
use CGI qw ( :standard );
my $name = param( "name" );
print header( "text/html" );
So I just figured that when you have [use CGI;] instead of [use CGI qw(
:standard )] it meant it was OO. I guess that's not quite right.
Guy
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 16:14:09 -0300
From: "Guy" <someone@somewhere.nb.ca>
Subject: standard and OOP together
Message-Id: <4a07276d$0$23751$9a566e8b@news.aliant.net>
I completed my Perl script in Notepad and it's only 22KBytes in size. It
works but it's ugly, and I'm going to rewrite it. If I decide to use the OO
interface of CGI.pm such as...
use CGI;
my $q = new CGI;
my $name = $q->param( "name" );
...could I still write the rest of my application in a standard way? I mean
what else would have to change?
Guy
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 21:09:47 GMT
From: "A. Sinan Unur" <1usa@llenroc.ude.invalid>
Subject: Re: standard and OOP together
Message-Id: <Xns9C07AEA64A447asu1cornelledu@127.0.0.1>
"Guy" <someone@somewhere.nb.ca> wrote in
news:4a07276d$0$23751$9a566e8b@news.aliant.net:
> I completed my Perl script in Notepad and it's only 22KBytes in size.
> It works but it's ugly, and I'm going to rewrite it. If I decide to
> use the OO interface of CGI.pm such as...
>
> use CGI;
> my $q = new CGI;
> my $name = $q->param( "name" );
The CGI.pm docs annoy me by calling the CGI object 'query' and using the
indirect object syntax.
my $cgi = CGI->new;
> ...could I still write the rest of my application in a standard way? I
> mean what else would have to change?
You need to call methods on the $cgi object thus created.
If you want to enforce the pure OO nature of the $cgi object, you might
want to use CGI::Simple (and move all HTML generation to
HTML::Template).
Sinan
--
A. Sinan Unur <1usa@llenroc.ude.invalid>
(remove .invalid and reverse each component for email address)
comp.lang.perl.misc guidelines on the WWW:
http://www.rehabitation.com/clpmisc/
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 10 May 2009 14:34:34 -0700 (PDT)
From: ccc31807 <cartercc@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: standard and OOP together
Message-Id: <87fecc59-518f-412e-80c7-0c95a8f742a2@h23g2000vbc.googlegroups.com>
On May 10, 3:14=A0pm, "Guy" <some...@somewhere.nb.ca> wrote:
> I completed my Perl script in Notepad and it's only 22KBytes in size. =A0=
It
> works but it's ugly, and I'm going to rewrite it. =A0If I decide to use t=
he OO
> interface of CGI.pm such as...
You may or not may be aware that typically Perl allows multiple ways
to do the same thing. Emitting HTML is one of those things that you
can do a number of different ways. I don't use CGI to emit HTML, I
don't like CGI for this purpose, and the following two paragraphs are
an attempt to justify my view. Note: most Perlists will disagree with
the following and find much fault with it, but you need to form your
own opinion. Don't take my word for it, but try it my way just for the
sake of comparison.
HTML (XHTML), and its attendants, CSS and JavaScript, have standard
specifications and their own validators. The specifications have as
their goal an absolute language standard which user interface agent
writers can rely on. I believe strongly in a strict adherence to the
standards, and that HTML authors should not cater to just one browser,
e.g., IE. In pursuit of this goal, I believe that HTML authors should
begin with hand written HTML (and CSS and JS) code written in a plain
text editor, like vi or notepad, and validating your code. Yes, if you
are in a production environment you will use an automated tool, like
Dreamweaver, but there is no substitute for the skills that
handwriting HTML gives you.
Everything I just said applies to HTML code emitted by Perl scripts.
After all, a CGI script is merely a program that spits out raw HTML,
CSS, and JS. The final judgment (if I may call it that) is the quality
of the HTML produced, not the pretty (or obfuscated) code written by
the programmers. Using CGI.pm tends to separate the programmer from
the HTML, and if you care about the quality of your HTML, you need to
see it as it is and without any intervening automation.
Okay, to modularize your code and avoid the cut-and-paste dance, you
will wind up writing functions to produce your HTML, which you will
call from other functions, until you have several layers, in essence
duplication in another fashion exactly what CGI does. HOWEVER -- it
isn't hard to do, and the bedrock on which you build your program is
STILL hand written HTML, and any time you want to look at it and alter
it, you can do so exactly as if you were hand writing HTML in vi or
notepad. The first time you run your HTML (the product of your CGI
script) through the validator and have it flag 127 errors, you will
understand exactly what I mean. You have an ironclad and direct
correlation between your HTML and your Perl script, and can track the
source of your HTML, CSS, and JS output.
For all its merits, CGI.pm doesn't give you this.
CC
------------------------------
Date: 6 Apr 2001 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
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Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01)
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#to almanac@ruby.oce.orst.edu with the command "send perl-users x.y",
#where x is the volume number and y is the issue number.
#For other requests pertaining to the digest, send mail to
#perl-users-request@ruby.oce.orst.edu. Do not waste your time or mine
#sending perl questions to the -request address, I don't have time to
#answer them even if I did know the answer.
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End of Perl-Users Digest V11 Issue 2407
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