[30898] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 2143 Volume: 11
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Tue Jan 20 21:09:46 2009
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 18:09:10 -0800 (PST)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Tue, 20 Jan 2009 Volume: 11 Number: 2143
Today's topics:
Re: Can't spawn "cmd.exe" <t34www@googlemail.com>
Re: Concatenating regular exprs in a 'grep' call sln@netherlands.com
Re: fastest way to allocate memory ? <nospam-abuse@ilyaz.org>
Re: inputting the ephemerides <larry@example.invalid>
Re: inputting the ephemerides <larry@example.invalid>
Re: unable to open file <hjp-usenet2@hjp.at>
Re: unable to open file <hjp-usenet2@hjp.at>
Re: use hash to name params, then stringify values in s <glex_no-spam@qwest-spam-no.invalid>
Re: use hash to name params, then stringify values in s sln@netherlands.com
Re: use hash to name params, then stringify values in s <DJStunks@gmail.com>
Re: What do you need to have to be considered a Master sln@netherlands.com
Re: What do you need to have to be considered a Master <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Re: What do you need to have to be considered a Master <tim@burlyhost.com>
Re: What do you need to have to be considered a Master sln@netherlands.com
Re: What do you need to have to be considered a Master <tim@burlyhost.com>
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 13:45:08 -0800 (PST)
From: T3X <t34www@googlemail.com>
Subject: Re: Can't spawn "cmd.exe"
Message-Id: <5c52c9a7-7585-494e-9572-02f7c6e2ba0f@v39g2000pro.googlegroups.com>
Never mind, I've located the bug.
Cheers,
Tomek
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 21:10:04 GMT
From: sln@netherlands.com
Subject: Re: Concatenating regular exprs in a 'grep' call
Message-Id: <s7fcn4dv1b0e1qbk6aqkkr2vp35unduc4c@4ax.com>
On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 15:34:17 -0500, Charlton Wilbur <cwilbur@chromatico.net> wrote:
>>>>>> "TJM" == Tad J McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid> writes:
>
> TJM> Understand the difference between what is "code" and what is
> TJM> "data".
>
> >> I'm tempted to ask you to elaborate on this one.
IMO:
Data can't dictate to a processor, code can.
[snip]
sln
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 21:30:20 +0000 (UTC)
From: Ilya Zakharevich <nospam-abuse@ilyaz.org>
Subject: Re: fastest way to allocate memory ?
Message-Id: <gl5fpc$2led$1@agate.berkeley.edu>
[A complimentary Cc of this posting was sent to
Xho Jingleheimerschmidt
<xhoster@gmail.com>], who wrote in article <4973797e$0$25707$ed362ca5@nr5c.newsreader.com>:
> >> my $needle = "B";
> >> $gras = $gras.$needle;
> > RHS takes another 10000GiB.
> It seems that, at least as of 5.8.8, this construct is optimized
> to be about the same as $gras.=$needle
No, it is not:
> env PERL_DEBUG_MSTATS=1 perl -e "$s=q(a); $s x= 5e5; 1"
Memory allocation statistics after execution: (buckets 4(4)..528380(524288)
18184 free: 111 114 56 21 6 2 2 2 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
408 21 51 30 18
650612 used: 144 140 70 134 10 6 6 4 1 16 1 0 0 0 0 0 1
103 149 544 138 7
Total sbrk(): 669696/37:186. Odd ends: pad+heads+chain+tail: 0+900+0+0.
> env PERL_DEBUG_MSTATS=1 perl -e "$s=q(a); $s x= 5e5; $s = $s.q(b); 1"
Memory allocation statistics after execution: (buckets 4(4)..528380(524288)
17892 free: 111 114 49 20 6 2 2 2 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
407 21 51 30 18
1179284 used: 144 140 77 135 10 6 6 4 1 16 1 0 0 0 0 0 2
104 149 544 138 7
Total sbrk(): 1198080/38:187. Odd ends: pad+heads+chain+tail: 0+904+0+0.
> env PERL_DEBUG_MSTATS=1 perl -e "$s=q(a); $s x= 5e5; $s = q(b); 1"
Memory allocation statistics after execution: (buckets 4(4)..528380(524288)
17988 free: 111 114 52 20 6 2 2 2 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
407 21 51 30 18
650808 used: 144 140 74 135 10 6 6 4 1 16 1 0 0 0 0 0 1
104 149 544 138 7
Total sbrk(): 669696/37:186. Odd ends: pad+heads+chain+tail: 0+900+0+0.
Hope this helps,
Ilya
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 18:15:21 -0700
From: Larry Gates <larry@example.invalid>
Subject: Re: inputting the ephemerides
Message-Id: <j300dcq6de8f.1nho9xapb7w2v.dlg@40tude.net>
On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 10:39:23 -0800, Jim Gibson wrote:
> In article <1x83tkcjxizri.7vvnwjo82ona$.dlg@40tude.net>, Larry Gates
> <larry@example.invalid> wrote:
>
>
>> This is the data set:
>>
>> C:\MinGW\source>type eph3.txt
>> ! yesterday
>> # another comment
>>
>> Sun 18h 41m 55s -23 5.4' 0.983 10.215 52.155 Up
>> Mercury 20h 2m 16s -22 12.5' 1.102 22.537 37.668 Up
>> Venus 21h 55m 33s -14 16.3' 0.795 39.872 11.703 Up
>> Moon 21h 17m 19s -15 2.4' 62.4 ER 36.796 22.871 Up
>> Mars 18h 11m 59s -24 6.1' 2.431 4.552 56.184 Up
>> Jupiter 20h 3m 35s -20 49.4' 6.034 23.867 38.203 Up
>> Saturn 11h 32m 59s +5 8.6' 9.018 -47.333 157.471 Set
>> Uranus 23h 21m 30s -4 57.9' 20.421 48.328 -18.527 Up
>> Neptune 21h 39m 30s -14 22.8' 30.748 38.963 16.599 Up
>> Pluto 18h 4m 34s -17 44.5' 32.543 7.443 62.142 Up
>>
>> C:\MinGW\source>
>>
>> Thanks for your comment.
>
> You can use the unpack function to unpack data lines with fixed-length
> columns like your example. See 'perldoc -f unpack' for details, and
> 'peldoc -f pack' for template parameters. Note that the A parameter
> will cause Perl to trim trailing blanks on unpacking.
>
> Something like
>
> my( $name, $hour, $min, $sec, ... ) =
> unpack('A8 A4 A4 A4 ... ',$line);
>
> should work.
Thanks, Jim. I've been working really hard to get my head around pattern
matching and tried something similar to what you write but was unable to
get output.
my $filename = 'eph6.txt';
open(my $fh, '<', $filename) or die "cannot open $filename: $!";
while (<$fh>) {
/(\w+)\W*(\d2).*(\d2).*(\d2)\W*([-|+]\d+).*(\d+\.\d+).*(\d+\.\d+).*(-*\d+\.\d+).*(-*\d+\.\d+)\W*(\w+)\W*/;
print "$1\n";
print $_;
}
close($fh)
# perl faulk11.pl
C:\MinGW\source>perl faulk11.pl
Sun 19h 43m 51s -21░ 17.8' 0.984 -35.020 87.148 Set
Mercury 20h 36m 41s -16░ 59.3' 0.747 -22.075 84.236 Set
Venus 22h 51m 18s -7░ 46.9' 0.691 10.142 72.919 Up
Moon 10h 24m 21s +7░ 29.5' 58.6 ER -4.992 -102.785 Set
Mars 18h 58m 51s -23░ 33.8' 2.398 -45.280 90.860 Set
Jupiter 20h 17m 22s -20░ 8.1' 6.082 -27.618 83.843 Set
Saturn 11h 32m 29s +5░ 16.0' 8.806 -19.672 -111.729 Set
Uranus 23h 23m 12s -4░ 46.5' 20.638 18.211 70.235 Up
Neptune 21h 41m 17s -14░ 13.9' 30.892 -7.527 77.864 Set
Pluto 18h 6m 40s -17░ 44.9' 32.485 -52.833 108.052 Set
C:\MinGW\source>
So no better output yet, but I think I'm close here.
--
larry gates
Or I suppose we could always recontextualize the meaning of "is"
instead. There is prior art...
-- Larry Wall in <20050420192727.GF766@wall.org>
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 18:27:54 -0700
From: Larry Gates <larry@example.invalid>
Subject: Re: inputting the ephemerides
Message-Id: <126j6mn32t947.1dy1omgewbftk$.dlg@40tude.net>
On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:09:44 -0800, Tim Greer wrote:
> I saw your original post (I don't have you blocked). You posted a
> portion of code, such as above, that goes through each line and prints
> it. It's not really doing anything related to the task you asked
> about. What was "weird" was that you posted the same code again (for
> the most part), but just failed to check the return value of open and
> didn't add $_ to print (since it wouldn't be needed -- it wasn't in the
> first one either). I fail to understand the purpose of you doing that?
> You then posted about what you wanted to do, but you didn't post any
> code relevant to it to show us what you have tried. I admit, I thought
> that was weird.
It turns out I've gone different ways twice with this as I try to get some
output here. This is essentially the same script that I posted downthread
as resposnse to Jim Gibson:
my $filename = 'eph6.txt';
open(my $fh, '<', $filename) or die "cannot open $filename: $!";
while (<$fh>) {
/(\w+)\W*(\d2).*(\d2).*(\d2)\W*([-|+]\d+).*(\d+\.\d+).*(\d+\.\d+)
.*(-*\d+\.\d+).*(-*\d+\.\d+)\W*(\w+)\W*/;
print "$1\n";
print $_;
}
close($fh)
# perl faulk12.pl
I was under the impression that I created a bunch of variables like $1 $2
$3, but I don't have output yet.:-(
--
larry gates
One error message that would be of great benefit to novices is if we
could guess where the missing brace is based on indentation. (But not
*assuming* the missing brace, of course--this isn't Python... :-)
-- Larry Wall in <20040714172318.GA21069@wall.org>
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 23:04:58 +0100
From: "Peter J. Holzer" <hjp-usenet2@hjp.at>
Subject: Re: unable to open file
Message-Id: <slrngncika.47v.hjp-usenet2@hrunkner.hjp.at>
On 2009-01-20 16:52, Tad J McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid> wrote:
> Ken Teague <"kteague at pobox dot com"> wrote:
>> Tad J McClellan wrote:
>>> What is your current working directory?
>>
>> I created this script and placed it in my cgi-bin directory:
>>
>> #!/usr/bin/perl
>> use warnings;
>> use strict;
>> use Cwd;
>>
>> print "Content-type:text/html\r\n\r\n";
>> print '<html>';
>> print '<head>';
>> my $dir = getcwd;
>> print "$dir", "\n";
>> print '</body>';
>> print '</html>';
>>
>> I hope this gives us the information we're looking for.
>>
>> I loaded it in my browser. It reveals:
>> C:/WINDOWS
>
>
> Good.
>
> After you do
>
> chdir 'C:/WINDOWS' or die "could not cd to 'C:/WINDOWS' $!";
>
> you will be able to use a path that is relative to C:/WINDOWS.
Since he is already in 'C:/WINDOWS' he will also be able to do that
before the chdir.
I guess you meant "chdir $path_to_cgi_bin", so that he can access files
relative to his cgi-bin directory.
hp
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 23:18:17 +0100
From: "Peter J. Holzer" <hjp-usenet2@hjp.at>
Subject: Re: unable to open file
Message-Id: <slrngncjd9.47v.hjp-usenet2@hrunkner.hjp.at>
On 2009-01-20 19:43, Ken Teague <"kteague at pobox dot com"> wrote:
> Tad J McClellan wrote:
>> Where the perl binary is installed is not relevant to relative paths.
>>
>> Where your Perl program is installed is not relevant to relative
>> paths.
>>
>> What is relevant to relative paths is your current working directory.
>>
>> What is relevant to relative paths is your current working directory.
>>
>> What is relevant to relative paths is your current working directory.
>
> How is it not relevant when we're dealing with perl installed on an OS
> that has a non-posix file system? Seems to me that it is relevant if
> the two reside on different volumes, and different volumes are denoted
> by "drive letters".
No, the position of the perl binary and the perl script are completely
irrelevant for resolving relative paths. Relative paths are always
resolved relative to the current working directory. This has nothing to
do with the file system.
If your perl binary is D:/perl/bin/perl.exe, your working direcory is
C:/WINDOWS, and your perl script is E:/web/cgi-bin/test.pl, the relative
filename "../data/test.txt" will always resolve to C:/data/test.txt".
Volumes are only relevant as there may be no way to specify a relative
filename which refers to a file on a different volume - you may need to
use an absolute filename.
> However, after finding this:
> http://www.rcbowen.com/imho/perl_cwd_iis.html
> and hashing out the issue on private list, we came up with this small
> piece of code which solves my issue:
>
> (my $dir = $0) =~ s:[\\/][^\\/]+$::;
> chdir $dir or die "Can't change to directory $dir: $!\n";
I believe FindBin (see perldoc FindBin) was already mentioned in this
thread.
hp
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 15:47:31 -0600
From: "J. Gleixner" <glex_no-spam@qwest-spam-no.invalid>
Subject: Re: use hash to name params, then stringify values in specific order
Message-Id: <49764673$0$87067$815e3792@news.qwest.net>
DJ Stunks wrote:
> Hey all,
>
> I have an API I need to call as a string of comma separated values. I
> want to name those values in a hash so that it's easy to see what I'm
> setting each value to. However, the values have to go into the API
> call in a certain order. The goal is to make the code as clean and as
> self-documenting as possible (ideally both the API call syntax and the
> call values should be clearly apparent in the Perl code)
>
> I can do it using a hash slice as follows, but this seems like a
> pretty bad approach so I thought I'd shop it around and see what you
> all think would be a better approach. Tie::IxHash maybe? (I've never
> used it)
>
> TIA,
> -jp
>
> #/usr/bin/perl
>
> use strict;
> use warnings;
>
> #API syntax: my_API_call
> (<this_parameter>,<that_parameter>,<extra_parameter>)
>
> my %parms = (
> this_parameter => 'some value',
> that_parameter => 'another value',
> extra_parameter => 'a third value',
> );
>
> my @order = qw{ this_parameter that_parameter extra_parameter };
>
> my $stringified_API_call = 'my_API_call(' . join(',', @parms
> { @order }) . ')';
If you're actually using $strigified_API_call, if there's a ',' in any
of your values, it won't work very well. Printing it like that
is fine, to possibly see what you're sending, but to actually
call 'my_API_call', pass the slice.
print 'call it: my_API_call(',
join(',', @parms{ @order } ),
')';
my_API_call( @parms{ @order } );
>
> print "call it: $stringified_API_call\n";
>
> __END__
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 22:16:41 GMT
From: sln@netherlands.com
Subject: Re: use hash to name params, then stringify values in specific order
Message-Id: <j4jcn45ap9nc7sllpspdaejagr10039jeh@4ax.com>
On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 10:53:57 -0800 (PST), DJ Stunks <DJStunks@gmail.com> wrote:
>Hey all,
>
[snip]
>The goal is to make the code as clean and as
>self-documenting as possible (ideally both the API call syntax and the
>call values should be clearly apparent in the Perl code)
[snip]
Is that really a goal? Are you some kind of a manager with some CS god complex?
Should a manager ever say this to me I would have him/her fired in 5 minutes!
sln
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 16:38:29 -0800 (PST)
From: DJ Stunks <DJStunks@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: use hash to name params, then stringify values in specific order
Message-Id: <88f10ca0-3d62-4f25-9c40-74d9e08bd4ee@g1g2000pra.googlegroups.com>
On Jan 20, 1:53 pm, DJ Stunks <DJStu...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey all,
>
> I have an API I need to call as a string of comma separated values. I
> want to name those values in a hash so that it's easy to see what I'm
> setting each value to. However, the values have to go into the API
> call in a certain order. The goal is to make the code as clean and as
> self-documenting as possible (ideally both the API call syntax and the
> call values should be clearly apparent in the Perl code)
>
> I can do it using a hash slice as follows, but this seems like a
> pretty bad approach so I thought I'd shop it around and see what you
> all think would be a better approach. Tie::IxHash maybe? (I've never
> used it)
>
> TIA,
> -jp
>
> #/usr/bin/perl
>
> use strict;
> use warnings;
>
> #API syntax: my_API_call
> (<this_parameter>,<that_parameter>,<extra_parameter>)
>
> my %parms = (
> this_parameter => 'some value',
> that_parameter => 'another value',
> extra_parameter => 'a third value',
> );
>
> my @order = qw{ this_parameter that_parameter extra_parameter };
>
> my $stringified_API_call = 'my_API_call(' . join(',', @parms
> { @order }) . ')';
>
> print "call it: $stringified_API_call\n";
>
> __END__
Well, I think responder #1 missed what I was going for and responder
#2 appears to be off his meds.
However, I tried Tie::IxHash and it works quite well for me. It's
immediately clear what the values are for the various API parameters
and it skips the necessity of the @order array and the associated hash
slice. The only concern is that maintainers must realize the order in
the hash is critical.
Code below for the curious.
Thanks,
Jake
#/usr/bin/perl
use strict;
use warnings;
use Tie::IxHash;
tie (my %parms, 'Tie::IxHash');
#API syntax: my_API_call
(<this_parameter>,<that_parameter>,<extra_parameter>)
%parms = (
this_parameter => 'some value',
that_parameter => 'another value',
extra_parameter => 'a third value',
);
my $stringified_API_call = 'my_API_call(' . join(',', values
%parms) . ')';
print "call it: $stringified_API_call\n";
__END__
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 21:25:48 GMT
From: sln@netherlands.com
Subject: Re: What do you need to have to be considered a Master at Perl?
Message-Id: <tkfcn4ttq70ok7f1nq9vt6rd25b89ti7b4@4ax.com>
On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 15:50:22 -0500, Charlton Wilbur <cwilbur@chromatico.net> wrote:
>>>>>> "TJM" == Tad J McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid> writes:
>
> TJM> Vicky Conlan <comps@riffraff.plig.net> wrote:
> >> According to <cartercc@gmail.com>:
>
> >>> My take is that there must be a lot of people who claim to know
> >>> Perl but maybe they don't.
>
> TJM> This is absolutely true. I've seen it many many times.
>
>It's common everywhere. It's very easy for a programmer to know enough
>Perl to bamboozle a recruiter or HR person, and to be able to talk his
>or her way through a phone screening interview.
>
>My current company has a Perl test that touches on algorithms and data
>structures, interaction with the user via CGI, and interaction with
>databases via DBI. It's a problem that realistically should take a
>competent programmer about two hours to finish, and the candidate is
>told this and given an hour, so that we can see how far he or she gets
>and what the partial solution looks like. This is very useful
>information, even though (as I can attest, having taken the test myself)
>it is stressful.
>
Then your company's test is written by 1 enginner vision of bloviated
code he/she's written that worked like shit and took hours and hours of
guessing to finally get it right. "Hahaha, solve this candidate, you can't
so my job is secure"!
What utter, utter nonsense!
If you were to test anybody, you must first let the candidate test you,
the decider's. You must publish that YOU, the EMPLOYER are available for
certification, and establish that you are eligable to be considered as such,
and pass a test, determined by the employee!!
The ultimate test is pseudo code, not context/syntax sensitive bullshit that
foams from the mouth of employers written by engineers under durress, under the
threat of termination or just plain scared shitless for thier jobs.
Pseudo-code is middle ground. After all, the goal is not context/syntax sensitive
is it? The goal is to find a genious in waiting. Einstien was never hired as I
remember it.
[snip]
sln
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 16:13:23 -0600
From: Tad J McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Subject: Re: What do you need to have to be considered a Master at Perl?
Message-Id: <slrngncj43.3ck.tadmc@tadmc30.sbcglobal.net>
Charlton Wilbur <cwilbur@chromatico.net> wrote:
>>>>>> "TJM" == Tad J McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid> writes:
[snip questions to test Perl knowledge]
> TJM> Two of the test questions that I like to use in interviews:
>
> TJM> 1) What is the difference between my() and our()?
> TJM> (followup if they get that right: What about local()?)
> TJM> (followup if they have still not eliminated themselves: When
> TJM> would you use one over the other?)
>
> We use a variant of this -- we ask about the difference between my, our,
> and local.
I sure hope you give at least partial credit if the response
is something like:
my() and our() are ways to declare variables
local() does not declare a variable
(which is why I put local in a followup, as it doesn't really belong
with the other two.
)
> TJM> 2) What is returned by mystery_func()?
>
> TJM> sub mystery_func { my @ra = 4; push @ra, 2+3; $ra[@ra] = 6;
> TJM> return @ra;
> TJM> }
>
> TJM> I'll leave what is taken to be "the correct answer" as an
> TJM> exercise for the reader...
>
> That one threw me for a loop
It is an obfu-push.
> until I realized I was mentally filling in
> a @ for the $ because there was a @ inside the brackets....
That prompts 2 more potential followup questions:
Q: what does @ra contain if there was an @ instead of a $ in $ra[@ra] = 6?
A: 4, 5, undef, undef, 6, undef
Q: what does @ra contain if there was an $ instead of a @ in $ra[@ra] = 6?
A: a program that does not run under "use strict"
or
A: 6, 5
Though those are both tricky enough that I'd count no points off
if they got them wrong.
And if they got them right, they may need to make more money than
the interviewer does. :-)
> One of my favorites:
>
> You have a string that comes from a freeform text field where the user
> is expected to enter a telephone number.
I sure hope that is restricted to "a US phone number"...
> validate it and capture a usable phone number.
>
> This is usually good for a lot of discussion about what should be valid,
I'll offer my unsolicited opinion below without accepting discussion. :-)
> and about the damnfool things that users do.
I think my solution will allow plenty damnfoolery and still
yield a usable US telephone number:
sub validate_phonenumber {
my($phone) = @_;
$phone =~ s/\D+//g; # allow hyphens, dots, parens, spaces etc
$phone =~ s/^1//; # no long-distance prefix needed
return $phone if $phone =~ s/^(\d{3})(\d{4})$/$1-$2/;
return $phone if $phone =~ s/^(\d{3})(\d{3})(\d{4})$/$1-$2-$3/;
return 0;
}
Do I get the job?
(only half-kidding, as I am available for hire right now, but it would need
to be telecommute or near Fort Worth...
)
--
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.noitatibaher\100cmdat/"
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 15:09:17 -0800
From: Tim Greer <tim@burlyhost.com>
Subject: Re: What do you need to have to be considered a Master at Perl?
Message-Id: <yQsdl.53021$Nv1.21017@newsfe03.iad>
cartercc wrote:
> On Jan 20, 12:14 pm, Tim Greer <t...@burlyhost.com> wrote:
>> To be honest, most of the "tests" I've seen people have to take, are
>> very, very rudimentary. I'd hate to think someone took a basic test,
>> scored high and thought this might mean they are an expert at a
>> language they've only just started really learning. If they get the
>> job and can perform the tasks, and are willing to accept they always
>> have more to learn, then that's great.
>
> Of the two tests I've taken, one was a programming test of three
> programs with an hour to complete. The first two were pretty simple.
> The third was more difficult, mostly due to the problem set rather
> than language issues. I missed a significant portion of the third
> question due to a misreading of the specification.
>
> The second test was an objective test, and I thought it was a pretty
> good measure of knowledge. I normally have a very poor opinion of
> objective tests, but this one was a work-out. I did pretty well on it
> but attribute it to a combination of luck and inspired guessing.
>
> I believe that these kinds of tests are a good idea for employers as
> long as their purpose is to weed out imposters. I don't think that
> they do a good job of measuring proficiency from the standpoint that a
> person's experience in writing a KIND of script says nothing about his
> aptitude. (A test focusing on file manipulation might catch a person
> who excels at writing sys admin scripts, and would reveal nothing
> about his aptitude in general.)
>
> CC
Those are valid points, and I'm not saying they are pointless, to be
clear. I just have seen a lot of people take online tests to prove
their programming or sys admin abilities and score very high, and think
that it serves as a valid and legitimate certification of their skill
level, yet I've seen many of those people fall flat on their face when
faced with more than the basics or common problems presented. It's
certainly one step to consider. I've been able to successfully weed
out people that exaggerate their skill set with some quick questions
before having to bother administering any test. Sometimes a candidate
can teach the employer something in an interview, if they aren't
intimidated and worry about losing their job by hiring someone that
either knows things in areas they are weak, or are just flat out
better.
--
Tim Greer, CEO/Founder/CTO, BurlyHost.com, Inc.
Shared Hosting, Reseller Hosting, Dedicated & Semi-Dedicated servers
and Custom Hosting. 24/7 support, 30 day guarantee, secure servers.
Industry's most experienced staff! -- Web Hosting With Muscle!
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 23:40:06 GMT
From: sln@netherlands.com
Subject: Re: What do you need to have to be considered a Master at Perl?
Message-Id: <64ocn412t8mn7kefib6ftbi22mmjggd6dm@4ax.com>
On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 15:09:17 -0800, Tim Greer <tim@burlyhost.com> wrote:
>cartercc wrote:
>
>> On Jan 20, 12:14pm, Tim Greer <t...@burlyhost.com> wrote:
>>> To be honest, most of the "tests" I've seen people have to take, are
>>> very, very rudimentary. I'd hate to think someone took a basic test,
>>> scored high and thought this might mean they are an expert at a
>>> language they've only just started really learning. If they get the
>>> job and can perform the tasks, and are willing to accept they always
>>> have more to learn, then that's great.
>>
>> Of the two tests I've taken, one was a programming test of three
>> programs with an hour to complete. The first two were pretty simple.
>> The third was more difficult, mostly due to the problem set rather
>> than language issues. I missed a significant portion of the third
>> question due to a misreading of the specification.
>>
>> The second test was an objective test, and I thought it was a pretty
>> good measure of knowledge. I normally have a very poor opinion of
>> objective tests, but this one was a work-out. I did pretty well on it
>> but attribute it to a combination of luck and inspired guessing.
>>
>> I believe that these kinds of tests are a good idea for employers as
>> long as their purpose is to weed out imposters. I don't think that
>> they do a good job of measuring proficiency from the standpoint that a
>> person's experience in writing a KIND of script says nothing about his
>> aptitude. (A test focusing on file manipulation might catch a person
>> who excels at writing sys admin scripts, and would reveal nothing
>> about his aptitude in general.)
>>
>> CC
>
>Those are valid points, and I'm not saying they are pointless, to be
>clear. I just have seen a lot of people take online tests to prove
>their programming or sys admin abilities and score very high, and think
>that it serves as a valid and legitimate certification of their skill
>level, yet I've seen many of those people fall flat on their face when
>faced with more than the basics or common problems presented. It's
>certainly one step to consider. I've been able to successfully weed
>out people that exaggerate their skill set with some quick questions
>before having to bother administering any test. Sometimes a candidate
>can teach the employer something in an interview, if they aren't
>intimidated and worry about losing their job by hiring someone that
>either knows things in areas they are weak, or are just flat out
>better.
We own all your base.
sln
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2009 17:24:29 -0800
From: Tim Greer <tim@burlyhost.com>
Subject: Re: What do you need to have to be considered a Master at Perl?
Message-Id: <hPudl.24417$u14.23460@newsfe21.iad>
sln@netherlands.com wrote:
> We own all your base.
Why, is that a sense of humor I'm detecting? :-)
--
Tim Greer, CEO/Founder/CTO, BurlyHost.com, Inc.
Shared Hosting, Reseller Hosting, Dedicated & Semi-Dedicated servers
and Custom Hosting. 24/7 support, 30 day guarantee, secure servers.
Industry's most experienced staff! -- Web Hosting With Muscle!
------------------------------
Date: 6 Apr 2001 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
From: Perl-Users-Request@ruby.oce.orst.edu (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01)
Message-Id: <null>
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------------------------------
End of Perl-Users Digest V11 Issue 2143
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