[30713] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 1958 Volume: 11
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Sun Nov 2 18:09:46 2008
Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2008 15:09:06 -0800 (PST)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Sun, 2 Nov 2008 Volume: 11 Number: 1958
Today's topics:
Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/ <sbryce@scottbryce.com>
Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/ <sbryce@scottbryce.com>
Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/ <xiaoxia2005a@yahoo.com>
Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/ <xiaoxia2005a@yahoo.com>
Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/ <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/ <jurgenex@hotmail.com>
Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/ <xiaoxia2005a@yahoo.com>
Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/ <jurgenex@hotmail.com>
Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/ <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/ <xiaoxia2005a@yahoo.com>
Re: if ($line == $count++) <RedGrittyBrick@spamweary.invalid>
Re: if ($line == $count++) <tim@burlyhost.com>
Re: if ($line == $count++) <xiaoxia2005a@yahoo.com>
Re: if ($line == $count++) <xiaoxia2005a@yahoo.com>
Re: if ($line == $count++) <tim@burlyhost.com>
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 02 Nov 2008 07:44:10 -0700
From: Scott Bryce <sbryce@scottbryce.com>
Subject: Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/
Message-Id: <gekec3$ipv$1@registered.motzarella.org>
April wrote:
>>> if test: elsif ($header && /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/)
<snip>
> as && requires the matching needs to be done in the header ($header)
No. The $header && requires only that whatever value is stored in
$header evaluates to TRUE, which it would not do if it had no value at
all. It is probably a test to see whether $header contains a non-null value.
If you wanted to require that the matching be done to the value stored
in $header, you would write that as
elsif ($header =~ /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/)
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 02 Nov 2008 08:01:04 -0700
From: Scott Bryce <sbryce@scottbryce.com>
Subject: Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/
Message-Id: <gekfbq$tuu$1@registered.motzarella.org>
April wrote:
> I applogize but am suprised people feel so strongly about the posting
> style
The regulars here expect a certain posting style because it communicates
effectively in this medium.
> ... I always think posting with the history will provide neccessary
> backgroud for anyone with convenience to respond, for people familiar
> with the thread, skip the unneccessry part and get to the point; for
> those unfamiliar, then have the background right there ...
What the regulars expect is that you will quote enough to provide
necessary background, and that YOU will skip the unnecessary parts by
trimming them from your post.
> the issue with TFM or other general doc is that they say so many
> things the ways should be, however, they won't tell you whether and
> how it applies to a particular case .. as a new leaner, what I need
> is a confirmation that it applies here and in this way.
Questions of that type should be fair game here.
> the other part I also have issues is to identfy things that are
> specific applications of certain functions or statements, or whatever
> you name it.
Questions of that type should also be fair game here.
> I don't know what you mean here, it seems to me based on my initial
> question, anyone would figure out I'm new to Perl.
We know that you are new to Perl. What people want to see is some
indication that you are putting out some effort yourself, and that you
don't expect us to spoon feed it to you. If the answer to your question
is in the docs, hopefully you have made some effort to find the answer
there.
Have you read the posting guidelines that are posted here twice weekly?
They will help you ask your questions in a way that will make it easier
for people here to answer you.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2008 07:26:53 -0800 (PST)
From: April <xiaoxia2005a@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/
Message-Id: <686d2a69-ff64-4038-bac2-16cbdedf0acd@i24g2000prf.googlegroups.com>
On Nov 2, 9:44=A0am, Scott Bryce <sbr...@scottbryce.com> wrote:
> April wrote:
> >>> if test: =A0elsif ($header && /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/)
>
> > as && requires the matching needs to be done in the header ($header)
>
> No. The $header && requires only that whatever value is stored in
> $header evaluates to TRUE, which it would not do if it had no value at
> all. It is probably a test to see whether $header contains a non-null val=
ue.
>
what I meant was as $header also needs to be evaluated true (&&), so
this test must be done in the header section which is what $header
stands for.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2008 07:43:21 -0800 (PST)
From: April <xiaoxia2005a@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/
Message-Id: <20b4ae7b-38d5-4790-b768-17c3ae0f2e0e@p10g2000prf.googlegroups.com>
On Nov 2, 10:01=A0am, Scott Bryce <sbr...@scottbryce.com> wrote:
>
> We know that you are new to Perl. What people want to see is some
> indication that you are putting out some effort yourself, and that you
> don't expect us to spoon feed it to you. If the answer to your question
> is in the docs, hopefully you have made some effort to find the answer
> there.
>
thanks .. I have this piece program was not working and what I was
expecting is kind of reassurance so I can rule out certain things and
focus on the others.
In my original post I was trying to ask specific questions, and then
in following posts with something for reassurance, which is important
as it gives me confidance.
I'm not expecting lengthy responses (though appreciate them), but just
some quick confirmation and short explanation, direction would be
plus.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2008 10:04:03 -0600
From: Tad J McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Subject: Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/
Message-Id: <slrnggrjrj.o36.tadmc@tadmc30.sbcglobal.net>
Scott Bryce <sbryce@scottbryce.com> wrote:
> April wrote:
>> I applogize but am suprised people feel so strongly about the posting
>> style
>
> The regulars here expect a certain posting style because it communicates
> effectively in this medium.
>
>> ... I always think posting with the history will provide neccessary
>> backgroud for anyone with convenience to respond, for people familiar
>> with the thread, skip the unneccessry part and get to the point; for
>> those unfamiliar, then have the background right there ...
>
> What the regulars expect is that you will quote enough to provide
> necessary background, and that YOU will skip the unnecessary parts by
> trimming them from your post.
Which illustrates the effectiveness mentioned above.
Q: How many people spend time on the unnecessary parts if the
poster trims them?
A: One
Q: How many people spend time on the unnecessary parts if the
poster leaves them in?
A: Dozens or even hundreds.
Shifting the work from one person to hundreds of other people will
likely annoy hundreds of other people.
--
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.noitatibaher\100cmdat/"
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 02 Nov 2008 09:23:25 -0800
From: Jürgen Exner <jurgenex@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/
Message-Id: <9bnrg4hp3dlrm7n5f7a1ce96eemop1nnfn@4ax.com>
April <xiaoxia2005a@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> April wrote:
>> >>> if test: elsif ($header && /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/)
>>
>> > as && requires the matching needs to be done in the header ($header)
>
>what I meant was as $header also needs to be evaluated true (&&), so
And this is exactly the main problem that I personally have with your
postings. Computers are the most notorius nitpicking bastards you can
possibly imagine. One character in the wrong place and your program may
do something completely different from what you intented it to do.
Very often you articles and questions are vague and ambigious or at the
very least confusing. Please, if you want help then at least try to be
as exact as possible.
Above you wrote verbatim "the matching needs to be done in the header".
So Scott correctly pointed out that code doesn't do that, instead it
matches in $_. And now you are changing your story and saying that's not
what you meant. Well, thank you for leading Scott and everyone else on a
wild goose chase.
Now, having said that, things like this happen to everyone every now and
then. However in your case it happens very, very often. And that makes
it very frustrating for your audience.
.
>this test must be done in the header section which is what $header
>stands for.
And that is the second main problem I personally have with your
postings: they information you provide is incomplete.
How are we supposed to know what $header stands for in your program? By
all typical programming patterns and naming conventions it's most likely
a string contain the (or a) header from whatever your program is
processing. There is no way to guess that you are using it as some sort
of flag.
We do not, cannot, and don't want to know all of your program. But those
parts that you post need to be self-contained, such that other people
can understand what is going on. There is a very good reason why the
posting guidelines strongly suggest a minimal self-contained program
instead of an incomplete excerpt from a larger program.
jue
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2008 09:43:08 -0800 (PST)
From: April <xiaoxia2005a@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/
Message-Id: <eeee2e80-61e9-4e32-b5e5-ea5b96e77b1d@z6g2000pre.googlegroups.com>
On Nov 2, 12:23=A0pm, J=FCrgen Exner <jurge...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> April <xiaoxia20...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> April wrote:
> >> >>> if test: =A0elsif ($header && /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/)
>
> >> > as && requires the matching needs to be done in the header ($header)
>
> >what I meant was as $header also needs to be evaluated true (&&), so
>
> And this is exactly the main problem that I personally have with your
> postings. Computers are the most notorius nitpicking bastards you can
> possibly imagine. One character in the wrong place and your program may
> do something completely different from what you intented it to do.
> Very often you articles and questions are vague and ambigious or at the
> very least confusing. Please, if you want help then at least try to be
> as exact as possible.
>
> Above you wrote verbatim "the matching needs to be done in the header".
> So Scott correctly pointed out that code doesn't do that, instead it
> matches in $_. And now you are changing your story and saying that's not
> what you meant. Well, thank you for leading Scott and everyone else on a
> wild goose chase.
>
> Now, having said that, things like this happen to everyone every now and
> then. However in your case it happens very, very often. And that makes
> it very frustrating for your audience.
> .
>
> >this test must be done in the header section which is what $header
> >stands for.
>
> And that is the second main problem I personally have with your
> postings: they information you provide is incomplete.
> How are we supposed to know what $header stands for in your program? By
> all typical programming patterns and naming conventions it's most likely
> a string contain the (or a) header from whatever your program is
> processing. There is no way to guess that you are using it as some sort
> of flag.
> We do not, cannot, and don't want to know all of your program. But those
> parts that you post need to be self-contained, such that other people
> can understand what is going on. There is a very good reason why the
> posting guidelines strongly suggest a minimal self-contained program
> instead of an incomplete excerpt from a larger program.
>
> jue
I'm not changing my story at all .. the reason I mentioned the header
part is actually to make the line I mentioned self-contained:
"The reason I wasn't sure is that the following cannot be picked up
by
an if test:
From w...@bayview.com Tue Apr 24 11:02:41 2002
if test: elsif ($header && /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/)
I modified From: to From in the above and also checked still in the
header secton."
I still don't understand where your accusations come from, why you are
so upset, and what exactly you are expecting ..
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 02 Nov 2008 10:15:39 -0800
From: Jürgen Exner <jurgenex@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/
Message-Id: <c5rrg4l0c975t0des0ficjeoqqppo7mssj@4ax.com>
April <xiaoxia2005a@yahoo.com> wrote:
>I still don't understand where your accusations come from, why you are
>so upset, and what exactly you are expecting ..
I guess our communication is running on very very different frequencies.
I recognize and appreciate that you are _NOT_ acting like a troll or
some of the morons we had here over the years. I believe you are a
decend person and are trying to fit in.
However, I also realize that our communication styles are vastly
different and incompatible. I just can't make much sense of your
postings, sorry, my weakness. But because of this there isn't much
benefit to either of us if I continue to read your postings, therefore I
will stop doing so.
Good luck
jue
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2008 14:34:51 -0600
From: Tad J McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Subject: Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/
Message-Id: <slrnggs3nb.qlf.tadmc@tadmc30.sbcglobal.net>
April <xiaoxia2005a@yahoo.com> wrote:
> what exactly you are expecting ..
A short and complete program *that we can run*.
No full-quoting of articles.
No quoting of .sigs.
Have you seen the Posting Guidelines that are posted here frequently?
They spell out in quite some detail what we are expecting.
--
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.noitatibaher\100cmdat/"
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2008 13:23:07 -0800 (PST)
From: April <xiaoxia2005a@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: /^From:.*?([\w.-]+@[\w.-]+)/
Message-Id: <0dd921a9-b179-419a-ad5b-73e8d102477b@s1g2000prg.googlegroups.com>
On Nov 2, 3:34=A0pm, Tad J McClellan <ta...@seesig.invalid> wrote:
> A short and complete program *that we can run*.
>
> No full-quoting of articles.
>
> No quoting of .sigs.
>
> Have you seen the Posting Guidelines that are posted here frequently?
>
this is very helpful ..
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 02 Nov 2008 17:25:09 +0000
From: RedGrittyBrick <RedGrittyBrick@spamweary.invalid>
Subject: Re: if ($line == $count++)
Message-Id: <geknpp$nbs$1@registered.motzarella.org>
April wrote:
> On Nov 1, 2:12 pm, Tim Greer <t...@burlyhost.com> wrote:
>>>> See the difference (for example) between $count++ and ++$count.
>> <please don't quote signatures>
>>
>
> thanks Tim, I'll pay attention to this .. you know if you use Google
> Groups, then all the quotes are hidden automaticaly and you get a nice
> and clean interface. If you get a chance give it a try and you may
> like it.
Many of us have tried it and really dislike it. There are a number of
reasons for this.
I find that not only does it have many deficiencies and annoyances, it
has bugs. For example, the article numbers in the tree-view sometimes
don't match those in the main pane. Clicking an article in the tree-view
can take you to a different message in the main view.
Have you tried a proper news reader - like Thunderbird or even Outlook
Express?
> If you want to check the quotes, you can, and also all the
> posts for the same topic are in the same spot.
They are in a real newsreader but in GG they are spread over several
pages, you have to select "Next Page" a lot. In a real newsreader you
don't have this issue.
> I thought people are
> using this kind of web tools nowadays and did not pay much attention,
> besides I'm not familiar with the good old tradition either.
Here's a few questions I have about Google Groups:
How do you jump easily to the next unread item?
How do you mark an obnoxious poster so their future messages are
automatically ignored?
How do you configure it to delete spam before you read it?
How do you get it to automatically highlight posts from people you respect?
How do you get it to switch quickly between thread-order (tree view) and
date order or author order?
How do you jump quickly to the referred to posting?
Have you tried a real newsreader program?
--
RGB
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 02 Nov 2008 12:05:00 -0800
From: Tim Greer <tim@burlyhost.com>
Subject: Re: if ($line == $count++)
Message-Id: <NJnPk.34387$gD3.12037@newsfe01.iad>
April wrote:
> On Nov 1, 2:12Â pm, Tim Greer <t...@burlyhost.com> wrote:
>>
>> >> See the difference (for example) between $count++ and ++$count.
>>
>> <please don't quote signatures>
>>
>
> thanks Tim, I'll pay attention to this .. you know if you use Google
> Groups, then all the quotes are hidden automaticaly and you get a nice
> and clean interface. If you get a chance give it a try and you may
> like it. If you want to check the quotes, you can, and also all the
> posts for the same topic are in the same spot. I thought people are
> using this kind of web tools nowadays and did not pay much attention,
> besides I'm not familiar with the good old tradition either.
>
There are a lot of issues with services such as google groups. I'm not
interested in it at all (I won't get into the reasons why google groups
is less desirable in every single way, as that's best left to another
topic in another group). Anyway, you might check to see if there's a
configuration option in some 'preferences' area to view signatures or
not have it quote them, or something. It just makes followups appear
confusing as to whom typed what sometimes.
--
Tim Greer, CEO/Founder/CTO, BurlyHost.com, Inc.
Shared Hosting, Reseller Hosting, Dedicated & Semi-Dedicated servers
and Custom Hosting. 24/7 support, 30 day guarantee, secure servers.
Industry's most experienced staff! -- Web Hosting With Muscle!
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2008 13:04:35 -0800 (PST)
From: April <xiaoxia2005a@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: if ($line == $count++)
Message-Id: <7c5590fe-9f2c-4683-aece-710869d07eac@s1g2000prg.googlegroups.com>
On Nov 2, 12:25=A0pm, RedGrittyBrick <RedGrittyBr...@spamweary.invalid>
wrote:
>
> Here's a few questions I have about Google Groups:
>
> How do you jump easily to the next unread item?
>
> How do you mark an obnoxious poster so their future messages are
> automatically ignored?
>
> How do you configure it to delete spam before you read it?
>
> How do you get it to automatically highlight posts from people you respec=
t?
>
> How do you get it to switch quickly between thread-order (tree view) and
> date order or author order?
>
> How do you jump quickly to the referred to posting?
>
> Have you tried a real newsreader program?
>
> --
> RGB
I see your needs as a newsgroup regular, which is quite different from
mine. I only come to a particular newsgroup when I get an issue, and
Google Groups seems meet my needs for that purpose.
Yours seem well-thought-out questions, may consider to send to Google
so they can may enhancement in the future.
I did configure OE for newsgroup at one time, however, later lost it
when HW upgraded. Then I found Google Groups and did not go back or
any real readers.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2008 13:13:35 -0800 (PST)
From: April <xiaoxia2005a@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: if ($line == $count++)
Message-Id: <450c2684-ebcb-4dc7-8d8a-291d825f2658@e1g2000pra.googlegroups.com>
On Nov 2, 3:05=A0pm, Tim Greer <t...@burlyhost.com> wrote:
>
> Anyway, you might check to see if there's a
> configuration option in some 'preferences' area to view signatures or
> not have it quote them, or something. =A0
Just looked but could not find one ...
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 02 Nov 2008 14:21:56 -0800
From: Tim Greer <tim@burlyhost.com>
Subject: Re: if ($line == $count++)
Message-Id: <9KpPk.38699$nl3.2643@newsfe01.iad>
April wrote:
> On Nov 2, 3:05Â pm, Tim Greer <t...@burlyhost.com> wrote:
>>
>> Anyway, you might check to see if there's a
>> configuration option in some 'preferences' area to view signatures or
>> not have it quote them, or something.
>
> Just looked but could not find one ...
No matter, you seem to have found a way to not quote them in your recent
replies, so that should work fine. I don't think anyone minds what
usenet service you use, and if you are able to reply without google
groups forcing some sig quote on you, then you're good. :-)
--
Tim Greer, CEO/Founder/CTO, BurlyHost.com, Inc.
Shared Hosting, Reseller Hosting, Dedicated & Semi-Dedicated servers
and Custom Hosting. 24/7 support, 30 day guarantee, secure servers.
Industry's most experienced staff! -- Web Hosting With Muscle!
------------------------------
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------------------------------
End of Perl-Users Digest V11 Issue 1958
***************************************
