[30384] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 1627 Volume: 11
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Tue Jun 10 03:09:49 2008
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2008 00:09:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Tue, 10 Jun 2008 Volume: 11 Number: 1627
Today's topics:
Re: A dumb question but... <uri@stemsystems.com>
Re: A dumb question but... <dragnet\_@_/internalysis.com>
Change only one character to uppercase <samik@frKKshKll.org>
Re: Change only one character to uppercase <peter@makholm.net>
Re: Change only one character to uppercase <someone@example.com>
discover invisible characters <ela@yantai.org>
discover invisible characters <ela@yantai.org>
Re: discover invisible characters (Ben Bullock)
Re: Good intro to perl to a "newbie to programming" <uri@stemsystems.com>
Re: Moving from delimited to XML <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
new CPAN modules on Tue Jun 10 2008 (Randal Schwartz)
Posting Guidelines for comp.lang.perl.misc ($Revision: tadmc@seesig.invalid
Re: System level file / directory comparion <syang8@gmail.com>
Trying to catch invalid emails <samik@frKKshKll.org>
Re: Trying to catch invalid emails <slick.users@gmail.com>
Re: Trying to catch invalid emails <sbryce@scottbryce.com>
Re: Trying to catch invalid emails (Ben Bullock)
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2008 01:48:13 GMT
From: Uri Guttman <uri@stemsystems.com>
Subject: Re: A dumb question but...
Message-Id: <x7iqwi2h7m.fsf@mail.sysarch.com>
>>>>> "MB" == Marc Bissonnette <dragnet\_@_/internalysis.com> writes:
MB> Uri Guttman <uri@stemsystems.com> fell face-first on the keyboard. This
MB> was the result: news:x7bq2a48k0.fsf@mail.sysarch.com:
>> regardless of the other shell issues and solutions, this is a poor way
>> to do this. you would be much better off installing a mailing list
>> manager such as majordomo or mailman and creating a list for this.
>> then you send it one email and it does the work for you in the
>> background and a hell of a lot faster than 2 hours. your perl script
>> is reduced to sending a single email out to that list and it will be
>> done immediately. also this means users (email receivers) could
>> subscribe/unsubscribe and manage their list features without your
>> help.
MB> [snip]
MB> Out of curiosity, what kind of speed improvements would you see
MB> from using Majordomo over a perl script ?
MB> I've got a self-written mass-mailer for 400 clients that takes
MB> probably just under 30 minutes to run (sleeping for 3 seconds
MB> every 15 mails - holdover from a previous ISP that told me I
MB> needed to do this to avoid their spam trapping software). I only
MB> run it every two or three months, but still, now you've got me
MB> curious :)
the biggest win is that your code becomes trivial sending out one email
and exiting. then you also don't need to code special cases because most
mailing list managers can throttle as needed. and most of then can send
multiple emails in one interaction with an smtp server (only one body is
sent). and you can manage the list of subscribers easily and usually
from a web page. and subscribers can manage their own stuff as
needed. it isn't just about speed but overall simplicity and
convenience. and the OP was worried about total time and blocking a
shell window he wanted to close. this way he can run it, it returns
right away and no need to deal with 2 hours of blocked window.
so yes, it should be faster but it will be a whole lot more.
uri
--
Uri Guttman ------ uri@stemsystems.com -------- http://www.sysarch.com --
----- Perl Code Review , Architecture, Development, Training, Support ------
--------- Free Perl Training --- http://perlhunter.com/college.html ---------
--------- Gourmet Hot Cocoa Mix ---- http://bestfriendscocoa.com ---------
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 09 Jun 2008 21:34:30 -0500
From: Marc Bissonnette <dragnet\_@_/internalysis.com>
Subject: Re: A dumb question but...
Message-Id: <Xns9AB8E5A0B9C9Edragnetinternalysisc@216.196.97.131>
Uri Guttman <uri@stemsystems.com> fell face-first on the keyboard. This
was the result: news:x7iqwi2h7m.fsf@mail.sysarch.com:
>>>>>> "MB" == Marc Bissonnette <dragnet\_@_/internalysis.com> writes:
>
> MB> Uri Guttman <uri@stemsystems.com> fell face-first on the
> keyboard. This MB> was the result:
> news:x7bq2a48k0.fsf@mail.sysarch.com:
>
> >> regardless of the other shell issues and solutions, this is a poor
> >> way to do this. you would be much better off installing a mailing
> >> list manager such as majordomo or mailman and creating a list for
> >> this. then you send it one email and it does the work for you in
> >> the background and a hell of a lot faster than 2 hours. your perl
> >> script is reduced to sending a single email out to that list and
> >> it will be done immediately. also this means users (email
> >> receivers) could subscribe/unsubscribe and manage their list
> >> features without your help.
>
> MB> [snip]
>
> MB> Out of curiosity, what kind of speed improvements would you see
> MB> from using Majordomo over a perl script ?
>
> MB> I've got a self-written mass-mailer for 400 clients that takes
> MB> probably just under 30 minutes to run (sleeping for 3 seconds
> MB> every 15 mails - holdover from a previous ISP that told me I
> MB> needed to do this to avoid their spam trapping software). I only
> MB> run it every two or three months, but still, now you've got me
> MB> curious :)
>
> the biggest win is that your code becomes trivial sending out one
> email and exiting. then you also don't need to code special cases
> because most mailing list managers can throttle as needed. and most of
> then can send multiple emails in one interaction with an smtp server
> (only one body is sent). and you can manage the list of subscribers
> easily and usually from a web page. and subscribers can manage their
> own stuff as needed. it isn't just about speed but overall simplicity
> and convenience. and the OP was worried about total time and blocking
> a shell window he wanted to close. this way he can run it, it returns
> right away and no need to deal with 2 hours of blocked window.
>
> so yes, it should be faster but it will be a whole lot more.
What you say makes a *lot* of sense. It certainly is worth the investment
of a little time up front to learn and implement in order to save time
and improve functionality and value in the future.
Thanks for explaining.
--
Marc Bissonnette
Looking for a new ISP? http://www.canadianisp.com
Largest ISP comparison site across Canada.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 09 Jun 2008 22:03:31 -0600
From: "Samik R." <samik@frKKshKll.org>
Subject: Change only one character to uppercase
Message-Id: <g2kuit$va5$1@aioe.org>
Hello,
I am trying to change only one character to uppercase, if the char is
after a hyphen (-). I can't think of a RE to do that. Right now, I am
splitting the word on -, and then using ucfirst() for the second word,
but I am curious if there is a better way.
For example, I have the word: "Springer-verlag". I want to have the word
as: "Springer-Verlag".
Thanks.
-Samik
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2008 08:02:21 +0200
From: Peter Makholm <peter@makholm.net>
Subject: Re: Change only one character to uppercase
Message-Id: <87hcc1akuq.fsf@hacking.dk>
"Samik R." <samik@frKKshKll.org> writes:
> I am trying to change only one character to uppercase, if the char is
> after a hyphen (-). I can't think of a RE to do that.
You are able to make a regexp that matches a char after a hyphern,
right?
The replace this match with "\U$1" and you're done. The escape
sequence '\U' uppercases the rest of the string (or until a
'\E'). Read about it in 'perldoc perlop' under the heading 'Quote and
Quote-like Operators'
//Makholm
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2008 06:26:22 GMT
From: "John W. Krahn" <someone@example.com>
Subject: Re: Change only one character to uppercase
Message-Id: <i8p3k.662$L03.259@edtnps92>
Samik R. wrote:
> Hello,
> I am trying to change only one character to uppercase, if the char is
> after a hyphen (-). I can't think of a RE to do that.
s/(?<=-)([[:lower:]])/\u$1/g;
John
--
Perl isn't a toolbox, but a small machine shop where you
can special-order certain sorts of tools at low cost and
in short order. -- Larry Wall
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2008 12:10:03 -0700
From: "Ela" <ela@yantai.org>
Subject: discover invisible characters
Message-Id: <g2kuqh$3bn$1@ijustice.itsc.cuhk.edu.hk>
$pattern2 = $aref2->[$cog3i];
$pattern2 =~ s/[\t\n^M]//g;
$pattern1 = $aref1->[$orfi];
$pattern1 =~ s/[\t\n^M]//g;
if ($pattern1 !~ /$pattern2/) {
print "ORF: AAAA$pattern1\n";
print "pattern COG3i start: AAAA$pattern2\n";
<STDIN>;
}
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2008 12:12:20 -0700
From: "Ela" <ela@yantai.org>
Subject: discover invisible characters
Message-Id: <g2kuuq$3c5$1@ijustice.itsc.cuhk.edu.hk>
I've tried to identify the invisible characters leading to unsuccessful
pattern matching. However the screen prints out nothing special like this:
ORF: AAAAMT0002
pattern COG3i start: AAAAMT0002
What should I do to find out the problem? Thanks a lot.
$pattern2 = $aref2->[$cog3i];
$pattern2 =~ s/[\t\n^M]//g;
$pattern1 = $aref1->[$orfi];
$pattern1 =~ s/[\t\n^M]//g;
if ($pattern1 !~ /$pattern2/) {
print "ORF: AAAA$pattern1\n";
print "pattern COG3i start: AAAA$pattern2\n";
<STDIN>;
}
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2008 06:43:38 +0000 (UTC)
From: benkasminbullock@gmail.com (Ben Bullock)
Subject: Re: discover invisible characters
Message-Id: <g2l7qq$hbm$1@ml.accsnet.ne.jp>
Ela <ela@yantai.org> wrote:
> I've tried to identify the invisible characters leading to unsuccessful
> pattern matching. However the screen prints out nothing special like this:
>
> ORF: AAAAMT0002
> pattern COG3i start: AAAAMT0002
>
> What should I do to find out the problem? Thanks a lot.
The problem is probably a space character at the end of the string. If
you change the print statement you might see it.
> $pattern2 = $aref2->[$cog3i];
> $pattern2 =~ s/[\t\n^M]//g;
$pattern2 =~ s/\s+//g;
> $pattern1 = $aref1->[$orfi];
> $pattern1 =~ s/[\t\n^M]//g;
$pattern1 =~ s/\s+//g;
> if ($pattern1 !~ /$pattern2/) {
> print "ORF: AAAA$pattern1\n";
print "ORF: '$pattern1'\n";
> print "pattern COG3i start: AAAA$pattern2\n";
print "pattern COG3i start: '$pattern2'\n";
> <STDIN>;
What does that do?
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2008 01:51:21 GMT
From: Uri Guttman <uri@stemsystems.com>
Subject: Re: Good intro to perl to a "newbie to programming"
Message-Id: <x7ej762h2e.fsf@mail.sysarch.com>
>>>>> "I" == Ignoramus25756 <ignoramus25756@NOSPAM.25756.invalid> writes:
I> I am looking for a book on Perl that introduces it to a person who is
I> not a programmer, and offers a track along with exercises, etc.
I> That would be for someone who does not know any programming, so it
I> would need to explain a little more what is a "loop", "subroutine" and
I> similar things in more depth than a book for people who are
I> programmers already.
I> Some useful recommendations would be appreciated. Thanks
there is actually such a book but i think it is out of print. probably
you can find used copies around. it is called "elements of programming
with perl" and it is quite good. it directly addresses your need as it
teaches programming from scratch while using perl as the language. look
for it on amazon or abe or other use book places.
uri
--
Uri Guttman ------ uri@stemsystems.com -------- http://www.sysarch.com --
----- Perl Code Review , Architecture, Development, Training, Support ------
--------- Free Perl Training --- http://perlhunter.com/college.html ---------
--------- Gourmet Hot Cocoa Mix ---- http://bestfriendscocoa.com ---------
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2008 22:10:51 -0500
From: Tad J McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Subject: Re: Moving from delimited to XML
Message-Id: <slrng4rs5r.f45.tadmc@tadmc30.sbcglobal.net>
Bill H <bill@ts1000.us> wrote:
> Recently I have started using XML in other areas and realize that this
> format would be more easily maintained then the text files. So the
> question of the day, can someone point me to some simple XML
^^^^^^^^^^
^^^^^^^^^^
Errr, like the XML::Simple module?
> implementation in perl that wont take days to learn and includes some
> commentary on how it works that is geared more to the layman?
You will need to understand Perl's references and data structures
to use XML::Simple, start with perlreftut.pod.
> As a more detailed example of what I am hoping to accomplish, say I
> have a simple tab delimited record in a file that contains a persons
> address:
>
> First Name\tLast Name\tStreet Address\tCity\tState\t\Zip
>
> and I wanted to get all the zip codes in this file I would load:
>
> open(FILE,"thefile.txt");
> @data = <FILE>;
> close(FILE);
>
> foreach $record (@data)
> {
> @temp = split("\t",$record);
> $zips[@zips] = $temp[5];
> }
>
> Now if I decided later to have 2 street addresses and a middle name
> the above code would have to be altered. But I was thinking if it was
> in XML and each entry looked like this:
>
><record firstname="John" lastname="Doe" address="123 Main"
> city="Anytown" state="NN" zip="12345" />
You could also represent the "fields" in elements rather than
in attributes (as I've done below).
See the XML FAQ:
http://xml.silmaril.ie/developers/attributes/
> and the psuedo code would be something like
>
> open xml file
> get number of records (elements)
> for each record
> load record
> $zips[@zips] = value of attribute named "zip"
> next record
>
> This would allow the XML file to be changed, more information added
> etc without changing the code.
I fail to see how switching to an XML representation would
obviate the need to change the code though...
> I know one of your are going to tell me what module to include - thats
> fine, just hopefully it includes a good description.
----------------------------
#!/usr/bin/perl
use warnings;
use strict;
use XML::Simple;
my $xml = join '', <DATA>; # No Uri, I don't want to use File::Slurp here :-)
my $ref = XMLin($xml);
foreach my $person ( @{ $ref->{person} } ) { # "Use Rule 1" from perlreftut
print "$person->{zip}\n";
}
__DATA__
<?xml version='1.0' encoding='UTF-8'?>
<addressbook>
<person>
<firstname>John</firstname>
<lastname>Doe</lastname>
<address>123 Main</address>
<city>Anytown</city>
<state>NN</state>
<zip>12345</zip>
</person>
<person>
<firstname>Bill</firstname>
<lastname>Aitch</lastname>
<address>bill@ts1000.us</address>
<city>Dunno</city>
<state>Confusion</state>
<zip>67890</zip>
</person>
</addressbook>
----------------------------
--
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.noitatibaher\100cmdat/"
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2008 04:42:20 GMT
From: merlyn@stonehenge.com (Randal Schwartz)
Subject: new CPAN modules on Tue Jun 10 2008
Message-Id: <K28D2K.CE9@zorch.sf-bay.org>
The following modules have recently been added to or updated in the
Comprehensive Perl Archive Network (CPAN). You can install them using the
instructions in the 'perlmodinstall' page included with your Perl
distribution.
ASNMTAP-3.000017
http://search.cpan.org/~asnmtap/ASNMTAP-3.000017/
----
AnyEvent-DBI-1.0
http://search.cpan.org/~mlehmann/AnyEvent-DBI-1.0/
asynchronous DBI access
----
App-Todo-0.93
http://search.cpan.org/~tsibley/App-Todo-0.93/
----
CPAN-Uploader-0.003
http://search.cpan.org/~rjbs/CPAN-Uploader-0.003/
upload things to the CPAN
----
Curses-UI-Grid-0.15
http://search.cpan.org/~adrianwit/Curses-UI-Grid-0.15/
Create and manipulate data in grid model
----
DBIx-Class-UserStamp-0.10
http://search.cpan.org/~jgoulah/DBIx-Class-UserStamp-0.10/
Automatically set update and create user id fields
----
DBIx-StORM-0.09
http://search.cpan.org/~lukeross/DBIx-StORM-0.09/
Perl extension for object-relational mapping
----
DBM-Deep-1.0012
http://search.cpan.org/~rkinyon/DBM-Deep-1.0012/
A pure perl multi-level hash/array DBM that supports transactions
----
Directory-Scratch-0.14
http://search.cpan.org/~jrockway/Directory-Scratch-0.14/
Easy-to-use self-cleaning scratch space.
----
Email-AutoReply-1.03
http://search.cpan.org/~amonsen/Email-AutoReply-1.03/
Perl extension for writing email autoresponders
----
Email-AutoReply-1.04
http://search.cpan.org/~amonsen/Email-AutoReply-1.04/
Perl extension for writing email autoresponders
----
File-Find-Rule-Age-0.1
http://search.cpan.org/~pfig/File-Find-Rule-Age-0.1/
rule to match on file age
----
Font-TTF-0.44
http://search.cpan.org/~mhosken/Font-TTF-0.44/
Perl module for TrueType Font hacking
----
Font-TTF-Scripts-0.11
http://search.cpan.org/~mhosken/Font-TTF-Scripts-0.11/
Smart font script supporting modules and scripts for TTF/OTF
----
Geo-GML-0.10
http://search.cpan.org/~markov/Geo-GML-0.10/
Geography Markup Language processing
----
Geo-Horizon-0.01
http://search.cpan.org/~mrdvt/Geo-Horizon-0.01/
Calculate distance to the visual horizon
----
Geo-Horizon-0.02
http://search.cpan.org/~mrdvt/Geo-Horizon-0.02/
Calculate distance to the visual horizon
----
Gtk2-Ex-WidgetCursor-4
http://search.cpan.org/~kryde/Gtk2-Ex-WidgetCursor-4/
mouse pointer cursor management for widgets
----
HTML-Template-Pro-0.70
http://search.cpan.org/~viy/HTML-Template-Pro-0.70/
Perl/XS module to use HTML Templates from CGI scripts
----
Hook-Filter-0.09
http://search.cpan.org/~erwan/Hook-Filter-0.09/
A runtime firewall for subroutine calls
----
IMDB-Film-0.33
http://search.cpan.org/~stepanov/IMDB-Film-0.33/
OO Perl interface to the movies database IMDB.
----
LaTeX-Writer-Simple-0.01
http://search.cpan.org/~ambs/LaTeX-Writer-Simple-0.01/
A module to help writing LaTeX file.
----
Language-Befunge-4.01
http://search.cpan.org/~jquelin/Language-Befunge-4.01/
a Befunge-98 interpreter
----
Locale-Geocode-1.01
http://search.cpan.org/~diz/Locale-Geocode-1.01/
----
Net-BobrDobr-0.04
http://search.cpan.org/~arto/Net-BobrDobr-0.04/
module for using http://bobrdobr.ru.
----
Net-Pcap-Reassemble-0.03
http://search.cpan.org/~jraftery/Net-Pcap-Reassemble-0.03/
IP fragment reassembly for Net::Pcap
----
Net-Z3950-ZOOM-1.23
http://search.cpan.org/~mirk/Net-Z3950-ZOOM-1.23/
Perl extension for invoking the ZOOM-C API.
----
POE-Component-SSLify-0.11
http://search.cpan.org/~apocal/POE-Component-SSLify-0.11/
Makes using SSL in the world of POE easy!
----
POE-Component-SimpleDBI-1.21
http://search.cpan.org/~apocal/POE-Component-SimpleDBI-1.21/
Asynchronous non-blocking DBI calls in POE made simple
----
POE-Component-SpreadClient-0.05
http://search.cpan.org/~apocal/POE-Component-SpreadClient-0.05/
handle Spread communications in POE
----
PPM-2.1.9
http://search.cpan.org/~murray/PPM-2.1.9/
Perl Package Manager: locate, install, upgrade software packages.
----
Path-Abstract-0.081
http://search.cpan.org/~rkrimen/Path-Abstract-0.081/
A fast and featureful class for UNIX-style path manipulation
----
Path-Abstract-0.083
http://search.cpan.org/~rkrimen/Path-Abstract-0.083/
A fast and featureful class for UNIX-style path manipulation
----
Persistence-Entity-0.06
http://search.cpan.org/~adrianwit/Persistence-Entity-0.06/
Persistence API for perl classes.
----
Pod-Eventual-0.002
http://search.cpan.org/~rjbs/Pod-Eventual-0.002/
read a POD document as a series of trivial events
----
RDF-Redland-DIG-0.04
http://search.cpan.org/~drrho/RDF-Redland-DIG-0.04/
DIG extension for Redland RDF (Reasoner)
----
Rose-DBx-Object-Renderer-0.08
http://search.cpan.org/~danny/Rose-DBx-Object-Renderer-0.08/
Web UI Rendering for Rose::DB::Object
----
SystemTray-Applet-0.01
http://search.cpan.org/~psinnott/SystemTray-Applet-0.01/
OS agnostic system tray applets
----
SystemTray-Applet-Gnome-0.01
http://search.cpan.org/~psinnott/SystemTray-Applet-Gnome-0.01/
Gnome support for SystemTray::Applet
----
TAP-Filter-0.01
http://search.cpan.org/~andya/TAP-Filter-0.01/
Filter TAP stream within TAP::Harness
----
Task-Perl-Critic-1.005
http://search.cpan.org/~elliotjs/Task-Perl-Critic-1.005/
Install everything Perl::Critic.
----
Task-Perl-Critic-IncludingOptionalDependencies-1.003
http://search.cpan.org/~elliotjs/Task-Perl-Critic-IncludingOptionalDependencies-1.003/
Install everything Perl::Critic plus its optional dependencies.
----
Test-Harness-3.11
http://search.cpan.org/~andya/Test-Harness-3.11/
Run Perl standard test scripts with statistics
----
Test-More-Strict-0.01
http://search.cpan.org/~andya/Test-More-Strict-0.01/
Enforce policies on test results
----
Test-More-Strict-0.02
http://search.cpan.org/~andya/Test-More-Strict-0.02/
Enforce policies on test results
----
Text-Printf-1.03
http://search.cpan.org/~roode/Text-Printf-1.03/
A simple, lightweight text fill-in class.
----
Tie-Trace-0.11
http://search.cpan.org/~ktat/Tie-Trace-0.11/
easy print debugging with tie, for watching variable
----
XML-RelaxNG-Compact-PXB-0.03
http://search.cpan.org/~mpg/XML-RelaxNG-Compact-PXB-0.03/
create perl XML (RelaxNG Compact) data binding API
----
XML-RelaxNG-Compact-PXB-0.04
http://search.cpan.org/~mpg/XML-RelaxNG-Compact-PXB-0.04/
create perl XML (RelaxNG Compact) data binding API
----
YAML-Syck-1.05
http://search.cpan.org/~audreyt/YAML-Syck-1.05/
Fast, lightweight YAML loader and dumper
----
clickTk-4.012
http://search.cpan.org/~mmarco/clickTk-4.012/
----
stockmonkey-2.1
http://search.cpan.org/~jettero/stockmonkey-2.1/
If you're an author of one of these modules, please submit a detailed
announcement to comp.lang.perl.announce, and we'll pass it along.
This message was generated by a Perl program described in my Linux
Magazine column, which can be found on-line (along with more than
200 other freely available past column articles) at
http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/LinuxMag/col82.html
print "Just another Perl hacker," # the original
--
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
<merlyn@stonehenge.com> <URL:http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See http://methodsandmessages.vox.com/ for Smalltalk and Seaside discussion
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2008 06:13:11 GMT
From: tadmc@seesig.invalid
Subject: Posting Guidelines for comp.lang.perl.misc ($Revision: 1.8 $)
Message-Id: <XXo3k.2709$cW3.365@nlpi064.nbdc.sbc.com>
Outline
Before posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
Must
- Check the Perl Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
- Check the other standard Perl docs (*.pod)
Really Really Should
- Lurk for a while before posting
- Search a Usenet archive
If You Like
- Check Other Resources
Posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
Is there a better place to ask your question?
- Question should be about Perl, not about the application area
How to participate (post) in the clpmisc community
- Carefully choose the contents of your Subject header
- Use an effective followup style
- Speak Perl rather than English, when possible
- Ask perl to help you
- Do not re-type Perl code
- Provide enough information
- Do not provide too much information
- Do not post binaries, HTML, or MIME
Social faux pas to avoid
- Asking a Frequently Asked Question
- Asking a question easily answered by a cursory doc search
- Asking for emailed answers
- Beware of saying "doesn't work"
- Sending a "stealth" Cc copy
Be extra cautious when you get upset
- Count to ten before composing a followup when you are upset
- Count to ten after composing and before posting when you are upset
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Posting Guidelines for comp.lang.perl.misc ($Revision: 1.8 $)
This newsgroup, commonly called clpmisc, is a technical newsgroup
intended to be used for discussion of Perl related issues (except job
postings), whether it be comments or questions.
As you would expect, clpmisc discussions are usually very technical in
nature and there are conventions for conduct in technical newsgroups
going somewhat beyond those in non-technical newsgroups.
The article at:
http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
describes how to get answers from technical people in general.
This article describes things that you should, and should not, do to
increase your chances of getting an answer to your Perl question. It is
available in POD, HTML and plain text formats at:
http://www.rehabitation.com/clpmisc.shtml
For more information about netiquette in general, see the "Netiquette
Guidelines" at:
http://andrew2.andrew.cmu.edu/rfc/rfc1855.html
A note to newsgroup "regulars":
Do not use these guidelines as a "license to flame" or other
meanness. It is possible that a poster is unaware of things
discussed here. Give them the benefit of the doubt, and just
help them learn how to post, rather than assume that they do
know and are being the "bad kind" of Lazy.
A note about technical terms used here:
In this document, we use words like "must" and "should" as
they're used in technical conversation (such as you will
encounter in this newsgroup). When we say that you *must* do
something, we mean that if you don't do that something, then
it's unlikely that you will benefit much from this group.
We're not bossing you around; we're making the point without
lots of words.
Do *NOT* send email to the maintainer of these guidelines. It will be
discarded unread. The guidelines belong to the newsgroup so all
discussion should appear in the newsgroup. I am just the secretary that
writes down the consensus of the group.
Before posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
Must
This section describes things that you *must* do before posting to
clpmisc, in order to maximize your chances of getting meaningful replies
to your inquiry and to avoid getting flamed for being lazy and trying to
have others do your work.
The perl distribution includes documentation that is copied to your hard
drive when you install perl. Also installed is a program for looking
things up in that (and other) documentation named 'perldoc'.
You should either find out where the docs got installed on your system,
or use perldoc to find them for you. Type "perldoc perldoc" to learn how
to use perldoc itself. Type "perldoc perl" to start reading Perl's
standard documentation.
Check the Perl Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
Checking the FAQ before posting is required in Big 8 newsgroups in
general, there is nothing clpmisc-specific about this requirement.
You are expected to do this in nearly all newsgroups.
You can use the "-q" switch with perldoc to do a word search of the
questions in the Perl FAQs.
Check the other standard Perl docs (*.pod)
The perl distribution comes with much more documentation than is
available for most other newsgroups, so in clpmisc you should also
see if you can find an answer in the other (non-FAQ) standard docs
before posting.
It is *not* required, or even expected, that you actually *read* all of
Perl's standard docs, only that you spend a few minutes searching them
before posting.
Try doing a word-search in the standard docs for some words/phrases
taken from your problem statement or from your very carefully worded
"Subject:" header.
Really Really Should
This section describes things that you *really should* do before posting
to clpmisc.
Lurk for a while before posting
This is very important and expected in all newsgroups. Lurking means
to monitor a newsgroup for a period to become familiar with local
customs. Each newsgroup has specific customs and rituals. Knowing
these before you participate will help avoid embarrassing social
situations. Consider yourself to be a foreigner at first!
Search a Usenet archive
There are tens of thousands of Perl programmers. It is very likely
that your question has already been asked (and answered). See if you
can find where it has already been answered.
One such searchable archive is:
http://groups.google.com/advanced_group_search
If You Like
This section describes things that you *can* do before posting to
clpmisc.
Check Other Resources
You may want to check in books or on web sites to see if you can
find the answer to your question.
But you need to consider the source of such information: there are a
lot of very poor Perl books and web sites, and several good ones
too, of course.
Posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
There can be 200 messages in clpmisc in a single day. Nobody is going to
read every article. They must decide somehow which articles they are
going to read, and which they will skip.
Your post is in competition with 199 other posts. You need to "win"
before a person who can help you will even read your question.
These sections describe how you can help keep your article from being
one of the "skipped" ones.
Is there a better place to ask your question?
Question should be about Perl, not about the application area
It can be difficult to separate out where your problem really is,
but you should make a conscious effort to post to the most
applicable newsgroup. That is, after all, where you are the most
likely to find the people who know how to answer your question.
Being able to "partition" a problem is an essential skill for
effectively troubleshooting programming problems. If you don't get
that right, you end up looking for answers in the wrong places.
It should be understood that you may not know that the root of your
problem is not Perl-related (the two most frequent ones are CGI and
Operating System related), so off-topic postings will happen from
time to time. Be gracious when someone helps you find a better place
to ask your question by pointing you to a more applicable newsgroup.
How to participate (post) in the clpmisc community
Carefully choose the contents of your Subject header
You have 40 precious characters of Subject to win out and be one of
the posts that gets read. Don't waste them. Take care while
composing them, they are the key that opens the door to getting an
answer.
Spend them indicating what aspect of Perl others will find if they
should decide to read your article.
Do not spend them indicating "experience level" (guru, newbie...).
Do not spend them pleading (please read, urgent, help!...).
Do not spend them on non-Subjects (Perl question, one-word
Subject...)
For more information on choosing a Subject see "Choosing Good
Subject Lines":
http://www.cpan.org/authors/id/D/DM/DMR/subjects.post
Part of the beauty of newsgroup dynamics, is that you can contribute
to the community with your very first post! If your choice of
Subject leads a fellow Perler to find the thread you are starting,
then even asking a question helps us all.
Use an effective followup style
When composing a followup, quote only enough text to establish the
context for the comments that you will add. Always indicate who
wrote the quoted material. Never quote an entire article. Never
quote a .signature (unless that is what you are commenting on).
Intersperse your comments *following* each section of quoted text to
which they relate. Unappreciated followup styles are referred to as
"top-posting", "Jeopardy" (because the answer comes before the
question), or "TOFU" (Text Over, Fullquote Under).
Reversing the chronology of the dialog makes it much harder to
understand (some folks won't even read it if written in that style).
For more information on quoting style, see:
http://web.presby.edu/~nnqadmin/nnq/nquote.html
Speak Perl rather than English, when possible
Perl is much more precise than natural language. Saying it in Perl
instead will avoid misunderstanding your question or problem.
Do not say: I have variable with "foo\tbar" in it.
Instead say: I have $var = "foo\tbar", or I have $var = 'foo\tbar',
or I have $var = <DATA> (and show the data line).
Ask perl to help you
You can ask perl itself to help you find common programming mistakes
by doing two things: enable warnings (perldoc warnings) and enable
"strict"ures (perldoc strict).
You should not bother the hundreds/thousands of readers of the
newsgroup without first seeing if a machine can help you find your
problem. It is demeaning to be asked to do the work of a machine. It
will annoy the readers of your article.
You can look up any of the messages that perl might issue to find
out what the message means and how to resolve the potential mistake
(perldoc perldiag). If you would like perl to look them up for you,
you can put "use diagnostics;" near the top of your program.
Do not re-type Perl code
Use copy/paste or your editor's "import" function rather than
attempting to type in your code. If you make a typo you will get
followups about your typos instead of about the question you are
trying to get answered.
Provide enough information
If you do the things in this item, you will have an Extremely Good
chance of getting people to try and help you with your problem!
These features are a really big bonus toward your question winning
out over all of the other posts that you are competing with.
First make a short (less than 20-30 lines) and *complete* program
that illustrates the problem you are having. People should be able
to run your program by copy/pasting the code from your article. (You
will find that doing this step very often reveals your problem
directly. Leading to an answer much more quickly and reliably than
posting to Usenet.)
Describe *precisely* the input to your program. Also provide example
input data for your program. If you need to show file input, use the
__DATA__ token (perldata.pod) to provide the file contents inside of
your Perl program.
Show the output (including the verbatim text of any messages) of
your program.
Describe how you want the output to be different from what you are
getting.
If you have no idea at all of how to code up your situation, be sure
to at least describe the 2 things that you *do* know: input and
desired output.
Do not provide too much information
Do not just post your entire program for debugging. Most especially
do not post someone *else's* entire program.
Do not post binaries, HTML, or MIME
clpmisc is a text only newsgroup. If you have images or binaries
that explain your question, put them in a publically accessible
place (like a Web server) and provide a pointer to that location. If
you include code, cut and paste it directly in the message body.
Don't attach anything to the message. Don't post vcards or HTML.
Many people (and even some Usenet servers) will automatically filter
out such messages. Many people will not be able to easily read your
post. Plain text is something everyone can read.
Social faux pas to avoid
The first two below are symptoms of lots of FAQ asking here in clpmisc.
It happens so often that folks will assume that it is happening yet
again. If you have looked but not found, or found but didn't understand
the docs, say so in your article.
Asking a Frequently Asked Question
It should be understood that you may have missed the applicable FAQ
when you checked, which is not a big deal. But if the Frequently
Asked Question is worded similar to your question, folks will assume
that you did not look at all. Don't become indignant at pointers to
the FAQ, particularly if it solves your problem.
Asking a question easily answered by a cursory doc search
If folks think you have not even tried the obvious step of reading
the docs applicable to your problem, they are likely to become
annoyed.
If you are flamed for not checking when you *did* check, then just
shrug it off (and take the answer that you got).
Asking for emailed answers
Emailed answers benefit one person. Posted answers benefit the
entire community. If folks can take the time to answer your
question, then you can take the time to go get the answer in the
same place where you asked the question.
It is OK to ask for a *copy* of the answer to be emailed, but many
will ignore such requests anyway. If you munge your address, you
should never expect (or ask) to get email in response to a Usenet
post.
Ask the question here, get the answer here (maybe).
Beware of saying "doesn't work"
This is a "red flag" phrase. If you find yourself writing that,
pause and see if you can't describe what is not working without
saying "doesn't work". That is, describe how it is not what you
want.
Sending a "stealth" Cc copy
A "stealth Cc" is when you both email and post a reply without
indicating *in the body* that you are doing so.
Be extra cautious when you get upset
Count to ten before composing a followup when you are upset
This is recommended in all Usenet newsgroups. Here in clpmisc, most
flaming sub-threads are not about any feature of Perl at all! They
are most often for what was seen as a breach of netiquette. If you
have lurked for a bit, then you will know what is expected and won't
make such posts in the first place.
But if you get upset, wait a while before writing your followup. I
recommend waiting at least 30 minutes.
Count to ten after composing and before posting when you are upset
After you have written your followup, wait *another* 30 minutes
before committing yourself by posting it. You cannot take it back
once it has been said.
AUTHOR
Tad McClellan and many others on the comp.lang.perl.misc newsgroup.
--
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.noitatibaher\100cmdat/"
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2008 21:09:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: syang8 <syang8@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: System level file / directory comparion
Message-Id: <cf2dabde-d9f9-4d1d-b21d-b4a7f7cf7823@s50g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>
I just want to check the pathes. Here is actual work I need to do:
I have a project root directory called projRoot, which includes some
subdirectorys called subDir1, subDir2 ... , and the subdirectories
include more sub-sub-directories. A string $a, whose value is the
path of the directory I should deal with, is passed to my program. The
value of $a may be the an absolute path or the relative path to my
current working directory.
I want to check if $a is a subdirectory of projRoot.
-steve
On Jun 9, 8:19=A0pm, Ben Morrow <b...@morrow.me.uk> wrote:
> Quoth syang8 <sya...@gmail.com>:
>
> > Is there any command in perl that I can check if two files are the
> > same one?
>
> > For example, if there some file test =A0at the directory: /usr/var/test,=
> > and two strings $a =3D "./test" and $b =3D"../var/test". Is there any
> > function that returns true if I compare $a and $b?
>
> If you want to test the actual filesystem, use the device and inode
> values from stat (assuming a Unix system: they tend to be meaningless on
> other systems). If you just want to check the paths, use Cwd::abs_path.
>
> Ben
>
> --
> For the last month, a large number of PSNs in the Arpa[Inter-]net have bee=
n
> reporting symptoms of congestion ... These reports have been accompanied b=
y an
> increasing number of user complaints ... As of June,... the Arpanet contai=
ned
> 47 nodes and 63 links. [ftp://rtfm.mit.edu/pub/arpaprob.txt] * b...@morrow=
.me.uk
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 09 Jun 2008 22:08:35 -0600
From: "Samik R." <samik@frKKshKll.org>
Subject: Trying to catch invalid emails
Message-Id: <g2kusa$va5$2@aioe.org>
Hello,
I use the following regular expression to catch typical invalid email
addresses:
------------
my @Email=("sam._\@abc.org", "sam_.\@abc.org", "sam_.\@abc.org");
foreach (@Email)
{
if(/^[A-z0-9]+([_\.][A-z0-9\-]+)*[@][A-z0-9_\-]+([.][A-z0-9_\-]+)?\.[A-z]{2,3}$/)
{ print "$_ is a valid email id\n"; }
else
{ print "$_ is an invalid email id\n"; }
}
-------------
This expression does not catch the above 3 emails in the array (the
program says that they are valid emails).
Can someone help me to discard these three?
Thanks.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2008 21:33:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: Slickuser <slick.users@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Trying to catch invalid emails
Message-Id: <e3d1d5b2-fd3e-4ada-bd39-ecf1ef7e5946@l42g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>
So you want
sam._@abc.org
sam_.@abc.org
to be invalid while
sam@abc.org
sam_a@abc.org
sam.b@abc.org
sam.a_b@abc.org??
On Jun 9, 9:08 pm, "Samik R." <sa...@frKKshKll.org> wrote:
> Hello,
> I use the following regular expression to catch typical invalid email
> addresses:
> ------------
> my @Email=("sam._\@abc.org", "sam_.\@abc.org", "sam_.\@abc.org");
> foreach (@Email)
> {
>
> if(/^[A-z0-9]+([_\.][A-z0-9\-]+)*[@][A-z0-9_\-]+([.][A-z0-9_\-]+)?\.[A-z]{2,3}$/)
> { print "$_ is a valid email id\n"; }
> else
> { print "$_ is an invalid email id\n"; }}
>
> -------------
>
> This expression does not catch the above 3 emails in the array (the
> program says that they are valid emails).
>
> Can someone help me to discard these three?
> Thanks.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 09 Jun 2008 22:56:51 -0600
From: Scott Bryce <sbryce@scottbryce.com>
Subject: Re: Trying to catch invalid emails
Message-Id: <0e2dnSIQJsc5lNPVnZ2dnUVZ_g6dnZ2d@comcast.com>
Samik R. wrote:
> I use the following regular expression to catch typical invalid email
> addresses:
Is there a reason that you are not using the Email::Valid module?
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2008 06:34:44 +0000 (UTC)
From: benkasminbullock@gmail.com (Ben Bullock)
Subject: Re: Trying to catch invalid emails
Message-Id: <g2l7a4$h7i$1@ml.accsnet.ne.jp>
Samik R. <samik@frkkshkll.org> wrote:
> This expression does not catch the above 3 emails in the array (the
> program says that they are valid emails).
>
> Can someone help me to discard these three?
You asked the same question on May 7th 2008, and got a lot of replies:
http://groups.google.co.jp/group/comp.lang.perl.misc/browse_frm/thread/a807e473d83be073/d0e7a31a55bedb02?hl=en#d0e7a31a55bedb02
Perhaps if you don't understand the replies you got, you could try
asking for a clearer reply on that thread rather than asking exactly
the same question a month later.
------------------------------
Date: 6 Apr 2001 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
From: Perl-Users-Request@ruby.oce.orst.edu (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01)
Message-Id: <null>
Administrivia:
#The Perl-Users Digest is a retransmission of the USENET newsgroup
#comp.lang.perl.misc. For subscription or unsubscription requests, send
#the single line:
#
# subscribe perl-users
#or:
# unsubscribe perl-users
#
#to almanac@ruby.oce.orst.edu.
NOTE: due to the current flood of worm email banging on ruby, the smtp
server on ruby has been shut off until further notice.
To submit articles to comp.lang.perl.announce, send your article to
clpa@perl.com.
#To request back copies (available for a week or so), send your request
#to almanac@ruby.oce.orst.edu with the command "send perl-users x.y",
#where x is the volume number and y is the issue number.
#For other requests pertaining to the digest, send mail to
#perl-users-request@ruby.oce.orst.edu. Do not waste your time or mine
#sending perl questions to the -request address, I don't have time to
#answer them even if I did know the answer.
------------------------------
End of Perl-Users Digest V11 Issue 1627
***************************************
