[29745] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 989 Volume: 11
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Tue Oct 30 09:09:44 2007
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 06:09:05 -0700 (PDT)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Tue, 30 Oct 2007 Volume: 11 Number: 989
Today's topics:
Re: how to close a stalled file descriptor? <eponymousalias@yahoo.com>
new CPAN modules on Tue Oct 30 2007 (Randal Schwartz)
Re: packing a C structure <ben@morrow.me.uk>
Re: packing a C structure <haairam@gmail.com>
Posting Guidelines for comp.lang.perl.misc ($Revision: tadmc@seesig.invalid
Re: Regex Help usenet@DavidFilmer.com
Re: Regex Help <zaxfuuq@invalid.net>
Re: Regex Help <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
TeX programming and LaTeX hacking <jlrn77@gmail.com>
Re: TeX programming and LaTeX hacking (Robin Fairbairns)
Re: TeX programming and LaTeX hacking <dak@gnu.org>
Re: TeX programming and LaTeX hacking (Robin Fairbairns)
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 05:35:05 -0700
From: Glenn <eponymousalias@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: how to close a stalled file descriptor?
Message-Id: <1193747705.973701.135270@y27g2000pre.googlegroups.com>
On Oct 29, 3:03 pm, Ben Morrow <b...@morrow.me.uk> wrote:
> Quoth Glenn <eponymousal...@yahoo.com>:
>
> > I'm having trouble closing a file descriptor on a stalled named pipe.
> > To unblock myself if the write takes too long because the pipe is full
> > and there is no reader on the other end of the pipe, I put in place
> > a signal handler.
>
> Which OS are you using? Under most Unices, a writing to a full pipe with
> no readers will first send SIGPIPE, and if that is handled or ignored,
> fail with EPIPE.
I'm testing this on Red Hat Linux 4. But bear in mind that named
pipes
differ from anonymous pipes in one important aspect. A named pipe can
be written to before any reader has attached to the pipe. In that
case,
no SIGPIPE or EPIPE will arise. Those error conditions only arise if
an
attached reader closes the pipe. Without such a reader in the first
place,
there's no such feedback, and all I have is my own SIGALRM timeout to
tell
that the data is not being read.
> > But if the signal handler is invoked and I regain
> > control, on any subsequent attempt to close the file descriptor,
> > it stalls again!
>
> When you say 'file descriptor' do you mean 'Perl file handle'? Which
> perl version are you using? Are you using PerlIO? It's possible that you
> are closing a Perl FH, which is attempting to flush its buffers and
> handling the error badly. If this is the case, then you may be able to
> ignore (and lose) the buffer by pushing a :unix layer before you close.
Yes, I mean 'Perl file handle'. I'm running v5.8.8. I didn't know
about
PerlIO, so I'm not explicitly using it, but "perldoc open" says it's
now
the default IO system.
Yes, it seems like the Perl FH, in trying to flush its buffers, is
continuing the write operation (a large write to a small pipe) and
therefore hanging (there's no error condition to be handled).
I hadn't known about these i/o disciplines. Opening the pipe in the
first place with an explicit :unix discipline (and thereby not
stacking
whatever other buffering would normally be induced on the i/o stream)
has cured the problem. Thanks!!
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 04:42:16 GMT
From: merlyn@stonehenge.com (Randal Schwartz)
Subject: new CPAN modules on Tue Oct 30 2007
Message-Id: <JqpJqG.tMs@zorch.sf-bay.org>
The following modules have recently been added to or updated in the
Comprehensive Perl Archive Network (CPAN). You can install them using the
instructions in the 'perlmodinstall' page included with your Perl
distribution.
Astro-NED-Query-0.20
http://search.cpan.org/~djerius/Astro-NED-Query-0.20/
base class for NED queries
----
CA-AutoSys-1.04
http://search.cpan.org/~sini/CA-AutoSys-1.04/
Interface to CA's AutoSys job control.
----
Class-Dot-2.0.0_02
http://search.cpan.org/~asksh/Class-Dot-2.0.0_02/
Simple and fast properties for Perl 5.
----
Class-Simple-0.16
http://search.cpan.org/~sullivan/Class-Simple-0.16/
Simple Object-Oriented Base Class
----
Crypt-GCrypt-1.17
http://search.cpan.org/~aar/Crypt-GCrypt-1.17/
Perl interface to the GNU Cryptographic library
----
Cvs-Simple-0.04
http://search.cpan.org/~stephenca/Cvs-Simple-0.04/
Perl interface to cvs
----
DBIx-DBSchema-0.35
http://search.cpan.org/~ivan/DBIx-DBSchema-0.35/
Database-independent schema objects
----
DB_File-1.816
http://search.cpan.org/~pmqs/DB_File-1.816/
Perl5 access to Berkeley DB version 1.x
----
Data-Validate-URI-0.03
http://search.cpan.org/~sonnen/Data-Validate-URI-0.03/
common url validation methods
----
EV-0.03
http://search.cpan.org/~mlehmann/EV-0.03/
perl interface to libevent, monkey.org/~provos/libevent/
----
Exception-Base-0.12
http://search.cpan.org/~dexter/Exception-Base-0.12/
Lightweight exceptions
----
Exception-System-0.0702
http://search.cpan.org/~dexter/Exception-System-0.0702/
The exception class for system or library calls
----
Fatal-Exception-0.02
http://search.cpan.org/~dexter/Fatal-Exception-0.02/
succeed or throw exception
----
File-Stat-Moose-0.0103
http://search.cpan.org/~dexter/File-Stat-Moose-0.0103/
Status info for a file - Moose-based
----
Finance-Card-Citibank-1.60
http://search.cpan.org/~mgrimes/Finance-Card-Citibank-1.60/
Check your Citigroup credit card accounts from Perl
----
Finance-Currency-Convert-XE-0.14
http://search.cpan.org/~barbie/Finance-Currency-Convert-XE-0.14/
Currency conversion module.
----
Gungho-0.09000_02
http://search.cpan.org/~dmaki/Gungho-0.09000_02/
Yet Another High Performance Web Crawler Framework
----
Gungho-0.09000_03
http://search.cpan.org/~dmaki/Gungho-0.09000_03/
Yet Another High Performance Web Crawler Framework
----
HTML-Element-Tiny-0.003
http://search.cpan.org/~hdp/HTML-Element-Tiny-0.003/
lightweight DOM-like elements
----
HTML-Element-Tiny-0.004
http://search.cpan.org/~hdp/HTML-Element-Tiny-0.004/
lightweight DOM-like elements
----
HTML-Element-Tiny-0.005
http://search.cpan.org/~hdp/HTML-Element-Tiny-0.005/
lightweight DOM-like elements
----
HTML-RobotsMETA-0.00003
http://search.cpan.org/~dmaki/HTML-RobotsMETA-0.00003/
Parse HTML For Robots Exclusion META Markup
----
HTML-Template-Compiled-0.89
http://search.cpan.org/~tinita/HTML-Template-Compiled-0.89/
Template System Compiles HTML::Template files to Perl code
----
HTML-Template-Compiled-Plugin-HTML_Tags-0.05
http://search.cpan.org/~tinita/HTML-Template-Compiled-Plugin-HTML_Tags-0.05/
HTC-Plugin for various HTML tags
----
Lingua-EN-Conjugate-0.306
http://search.cpan.org/~rwg/Lingua-EN-Conjugate-0.306/
Conjugation of English verbs
----
Lingua-EN-Conjugate-0.307
http://search.cpan.org/~rwg/Lingua-EN-Conjugate-0.307/
Conjugation of English verbs
----
Log-Report-0.13
http://search.cpan.org/~markov/Log-Report-0.13/
report a problem, pluggable handlers and language support
----
MARC-Fast-0.08
http://search.cpan.org/~dpavlin/MARC-Fast-0.08/
Very fast implementation of MARC database reader
----
Module-CPANTS-Analyse-0.75
http://search.cpan.org/~domm/Module-CPANTS-Analyse-0.75/
Generate Kwalitee ratings for a distribution
----
Module-CPANTS-ProcessCPAN-0.71
http://search.cpan.org/~domm/Module-CPANTS-ProcessCPAN-0.71/
Generate Kwalitee ratings for the whole CPAN
----
Module-CPANTS-Site-0.71
http://search.cpan.org/~domm/Module-CPANTS-Site-0.71/
Catalyst based application
----
Net-FTP-Common-6.1
http://search.cpan.org/~tbone/Net-FTP-Common-6.1/
simplify common usages of Net::FTP
----
Net-TacacsPlus-1.07
http://search.cpan.org/~jkutej/Net-TacacsPlus-1.07/
Tacacs+ library
----
Net-Z3950-ZOOM-1.21
http://search.cpan.org/~mirk/Net-Z3950-ZOOM-1.21/
Perl extension for invoking the ZOOM-C API.
----
POE-Component-PreforkDispatch-0.101
http://search.cpan.org/~ewaters/POE-Component-PreforkDispatch-0.101/
Preforking task dispatcher
----
POE-Filter-LOLCAT-0.01
http://search.cpan.org/~bingos/POE-Filter-LOLCAT-0.01/
POE FILTR T SPEKK LIEK LOLCATZ. KTHNX!
----
Test-Harness-2.99_05
http://search.cpan.org/~andya/Test-Harness-2.99_05/
Run Perl standard test scripts with statistics
----
Test-Unit-Lite-0.07
http://search.cpan.org/~dexter/Test-Unit-Lite-0.07/
Unit testing without external dependencies
----
Test-WWW-Mechanize-1.16
http://search.cpan.org/~petdance/Test-WWW-Mechanize-1.16/
Testing-specific WWW::Mechanize subclass
----
Text-CSV-Track-0.7
http://search.cpan.org/~jkutej/Text-CSV-Track-0.7/
module to work with .csv file that stores some value(s) per identificator
----
Tie-Tools-1.06
http://search.cpan.org/~jonasbn/Tie-Tools-1.06/
a collection of tying tools
----
Tk-Enscript-1.10
http://search.cpan.org/~srezic/Tk-Enscript-1.10/
a text-to-postscript converter using Tk::Canvas
----
WWW-Scraper-ISBN-Amazon_Driver-0.11
http://search.cpan.org/~barbie/WWW-Scraper-ISBN-Amazon_Driver-0.11/
----
XML-Tiny-1.09
http://search.cpan.org/~dcantrell/XML-Tiny-1.09/
simple lightweight parser for a subset of XML
----
XML-Tiny-1.10
http://search.cpan.org/~dcantrell/XML-Tiny-1.10/
simple lightweight parser for a subset of XML
----
onto-perl-1.01
http://search.cpan.org/~easr/onto-perl-1.01/
If you're an author of one of these modules, please submit a detailed
announcement to comp.lang.perl.announce, and we'll pass it along.
This message was generated by a Perl program described in my Linux
Magazine column, which can be found on-line (along with more than
200 other freely available past column articles) at
http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/LinuxMag/col82.html
print "Just another Perl hacker," # the original
--
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
<merlyn@stonehenge.com> <URL:http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Perl/Unix/security consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See PerlTraining.Stonehenge.com for onsite and open-enrollment Perl training!
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 07:12:44 +0000
From: Ben Morrow <ben@morrow.me.uk>
Subject: Re: packing a C structure
Message-Id: <c42jv4-hr5.ln1@osiris.mauzo.dyndns.org>
Quoth bgeer <bgeer@xmission.com>:
>
> Check out "man perlfunc", then use "/" to search followed by " pack "
> with the spaces & without the ".
Or use perldoc -f pack .
> Note especially that if you want to put the resulting binary structure
> on a network, that you should consider the difference between I (32
> bit int) & N (unsigned long in network order).
>
> On a 32-bit Intel, a long & int are the same size - I don't know why
> there isn't a specific template character for "unsigned int in network
> order".
n and N are 'unsigned 16-bit in network order' and 'unsigned 32-bit in
network order' respectively. Since they're meant for operations where
you are trying to be portable, a format for 'native int in network
order, whatever size it may be' is not likely to be useful. If you care,
$Config{intsize} will tell you the size of C's 'int' and $Config{ivsize}
will tell you the size of perl's integer variables (which will be
different if your perl was built to use 64 bits on a 32bit arch).
Ben
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 03:19:05 -0700
From: rams <haairam@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: packing a C structure
Message-Id: <1193739545.181089.248760@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com>
On Oct 30, 2:40 am, "jl_p...@hotmail.com" <jl_p...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Oct 29, 5:04 am, rams <haai...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Thanks for ur help....when i used the format specified by you i
> > observed a strange behaviour..i have given $a value as 271 ans i
> > expect that the data while sending through socket would be 00 00 01 0f
> > that is hex value(271) 0x010F but what i saw as a output of my socket
> > is data as 32 37 31...since i tried with L option as well both are
> > giving the same result.how to send that value as a hex itself..
>
> Okay, if you gave $a a value of 271, then the data you want to send
> through the socket would be 00 00 01 0f (hexadecimal) BUT ONLY IF the
> data is in big-endian order. If the platforms are little-endian, then
> 217 would be sent as 0f 01 00 00 (hexadecimal). Just keep this in
> mind. (Most platforms I work on are little-endian, so it's good to be
> aware of the ordering.)
>
> You said that when you tried sending 271 through the socket, the
> socket received the bytes 32 37 31 (hexadecimal) instead of what you
> expected of 00 00 01 0f (hexadecimal). Well, the values 32, 37, 31
> (hexadecimal) correspond to the values 50, 55, 49 (decimal) which
> correspond to the ASCII characters '2', '7', '1'.
>
> It looks like when you packed the value 271 you mistakenly packed
> it as a string (with something like "Z*") and not as an integer (with
> "I"). Go back into your perl code and make sure that the 271 value is
> the first value given after the pack-string in the pack() function,
> and that the first character in your pack-string is "I" (and not "Z",
> "A", or "a").
>
> > for a variable $b i need to send 16 characters iam wondering during
> > packing what will happen to the Null Character of the string.
>
> Are you trying to pack a null-terminated string in the "char b[16]"
> field? If so, the "Z16" specifier will be sure to terminate whatever
> perl string you give it with a null-byte. For example, if you write:
>
> my $string = pack("Z5", "abcdefgh");
>
> then $string will be set to "abcd\0". (Notice that it doesn't use any
> more characters that you told it to (in this case, 5) and that the
> resulting string is always null-terminated, even if it means
> truncating the original string.)
>
> Whether or not you need that string to be null-terminated when you
> send it through the socket depends on the receiving program. If it
> needs to be null-terminated, use "Z16". If it doesn't need to be null-
> terminated, you might want to use "a16". If it's not a string at all
> but rather sixteen different integer values, use "c16". This is just
> a guess, but most likely you'll want to use "Z16" (but I'll never be
> sure unless I can read how the receiving program handles the data it
> gets).
>
> Is is possible to post the hex output of a sample structure that
> you are trying to match? (Just one would be good; any more would
> probably be too much.) That way a lot of questions can get answered
> and I can help you better.
>
> By the way, if you're confused about how to use the pack()
> function, you may consider reading the Perl tutorial on "pack" and
> "unpack" by typing "perldoc perlpacktut" at the DOS/Unix prompt. (I
> found this page after I used pack() and unpack() extensively, and it
> still taught me a lot.)
>
> I hope this helps, Rams.
>
> -- Jean-Luc Romano
hi Jean ,,
Thanks a lot for your response.The pack command you provided gave me
much needed output.I got this almost done.The only problem right now
iam facing is to convert a variable into a 6 byte hexa value.
i have variable $i=123456789012 then i would like to convert this into
a hexa value 12 34 56 78 90 12
and i would like this hexa value also to pack along with my
structure..
could plz provide me a feedback on the above query
Thanks and Regards
Rams
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 07:10:26 GMT
From: tadmc@seesig.invalid
Subject: Posting Guidelines for comp.lang.perl.misc ($Revision: 1.8 $)
Message-Id: <CNAVi.3075$Bk.1924@newssvr19.news.prodigy.net>
Outline
Before posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
Must
- Check the Perl Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
- Check the other standard Perl docs (*.pod)
Really Really Should
- Lurk for a while before posting
- Search a Usenet archive
If You Like
- Check Other Resources
Posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
Is there a better place to ask your question?
- Question should be about Perl, not about the application area
How to participate (post) in the clpmisc community
- Carefully choose the contents of your Subject header
- Use an effective followup style
- Speak Perl rather than English, when possible
- Ask perl to help you
- Do not re-type Perl code
- Provide enough information
- Do not provide too much information
- Do not post binaries, HTML, or MIME
Social faux pas to avoid
- Asking a Frequently Asked Question
- Asking a question easily answered by a cursory doc search
- Asking for emailed answers
- Beware of saying "doesn't work"
- Sending a "stealth" Cc copy
Be extra cautious when you get upset
- Count to ten before composing a followup when you are upset
- Count to ten after composing and before posting when you are upset
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Posting Guidelines for comp.lang.perl.misc ($Revision: 1.8 $)
This newsgroup, commonly called clpmisc, is a technical newsgroup
intended to be used for discussion of Perl related issues (except job
postings), whether it be comments or questions.
As you would expect, clpmisc discussions are usually very technical in
nature and there are conventions for conduct in technical newsgroups
going somewhat beyond those in non-technical newsgroups.
The article at:
http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
describes how to get answers from technical people in general.
This article describes things that you should, and should not, do to
increase your chances of getting an answer to your Perl question. It is
available in POD, HTML and plain text formats at:
http://www.rehabitation.com/clpmisc.shtml
For more information about netiquette in general, see the "Netiquette
Guidelines" at:
http://andrew2.andrew.cmu.edu/rfc/rfc1855.html
A note to newsgroup "regulars":
Do not use these guidelines as a "license to flame" or other
meanness. It is possible that a poster is unaware of things
discussed here. Give them the benefit of the doubt, and just
help them learn how to post, rather than assume that they do
know and are being the "bad kind" of Lazy.
A note about technical terms used here:
In this document, we use words like "must" and "should" as
they're used in technical conversation (such as you will
encounter in this newsgroup). When we say that you *must* do
something, we mean that if you don't do that something, then
it's unlikely that you will benefit much from this group.
We're not bossing you around; we're making the point without
lots of words.
Do *NOT* send email to the maintainer of these guidelines. It will be
discarded unread. The guidelines belong to the newsgroup so all
discussion should appear in the newsgroup. I am just the secretary that
writes down the consensus of the group.
Before posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
Must
This section describes things that you *must* do before posting to
clpmisc, in order to maximize your chances of getting meaningful replies
to your inquiry and to avoid getting flamed for being lazy and trying to
have others do your work.
The perl distribution includes documentation that is copied to your hard
drive when you install perl. Also installed is a program for looking
things up in that (and other) documentation named 'perldoc'.
You should either find out where the docs got installed on your system,
or use perldoc to find them for you. Type "perldoc perldoc" to learn how
to use perldoc itself. Type "perldoc perl" to start reading Perl's
standard documentation.
Check the Perl Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
Checking the FAQ before posting is required in Big 8 newsgroups in
general, there is nothing clpmisc-specific about this requirement.
You are expected to do this in nearly all newsgroups.
You can use the "-q" switch with perldoc to do a word search of the
questions in the Perl FAQs.
Check the other standard Perl docs (*.pod)
The perl distribution comes with much more documentation than is
available for most other newsgroups, so in clpmisc you should also
see if you can find an answer in the other (non-FAQ) standard docs
before posting.
It is *not* required, or even expected, that you actually *read* all of
Perl's standard docs, only that you spend a few minutes searching them
before posting.
Try doing a word-search in the standard docs for some words/phrases
taken from your problem statement or from your very carefully worded
"Subject:" header.
Really Really Should
This section describes things that you *really should* do before posting
to clpmisc.
Lurk for a while before posting
This is very important and expected in all newsgroups. Lurking means
to monitor a newsgroup for a period to become familiar with local
customs. Each newsgroup has specific customs and rituals. Knowing
these before you participate will help avoid embarrassing social
situations. Consider yourself to be a foreigner at first!
Search a Usenet archive
There are tens of thousands of Perl programmers. It is very likely
that your question has already been asked (and answered). See if you
can find where it has already been answered.
One such searchable archive is:
http://groups.google.com/advanced_group_search
If You Like
This section describes things that you *can* do before posting to
clpmisc.
Check Other Resources
You may want to check in books or on web sites to see if you can
find the answer to your question.
But you need to consider the source of such information: there are a
lot of very poor Perl books and web sites, and several good ones
too, of course.
Posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
There can be 200 messages in clpmisc in a single day. Nobody is going to
read every article. They must decide somehow which articles they are
going to read, and which they will skip.
Your post is in competition with 199 other posts. You need to "win"
before a person who can help you will even read your question.
These sections describe how you can help keep your article from being
one of the "skipped" ones.
Is there a better place to ask your question?
Question should be about Perl, not about the application area
It can be difficult to separate out where your problem really is,
but you should make a conscious effort to post to the most
applicable newsgroup. That is, after all, where you are the most
likely to find the people who know how to answer your question.
Being able to "partition" a problem is an essential skill for
effectively troubleshooting programming problems. If you don't get
that right, you end up looking for answers in the wrong places.
It should be understood that you may not know that the root of your
problem is not Perl-related (the two most frequent ones are CGI and
Operating System related), so off-topic postings will happen from
time to time. Be gracious when someone helps you find a better place
to ask your question by pointing you to a more applicable newsgroup.
How to participate (post) in the clpmisc community
Carefully choose the contents of your Subject header
You have 40 precious characters of Subject to win out and be one of
the posts that gets read. Don't waste them. Take care while
composing them, they are the key that opens the door to getting an
answer.
Spend them indicating what aspect of Perl others will find if they
should decide to read your article.
Do not spend them indicating "experience level" (guru, newbie...).
Do not spend them pleading (please read, urgent, help!...).
Do not spend them on non-Subjects (Perl question, one-word
Subject...)
For more information on choosing a Subject see "Choosing Good
Subject Lines":
http://www.cpan.org/authors/id/D/DM/DMR/subjects.post
Part of the beauty of newsgroup dynamics, is that you can contribute
to the community with your very first post! If your choice of
Subject leads a fellow Perler to find the thread you are starting,
then even asking a question helps us all.
Use an effective followup style
When composing a followup, quote only enough text to establish the
context for the comments that you will add. Always indicate who
wrote the quoted material. Never quote an entire article. Never
quote a .signature (unless that is what you are commenting on).
Intersperse your comments *following* each section of quoted text to
which they relate. Unappreciated followup styles are referred to as
"top-posting", "Jeopardy" (because the answer comes before the
question), or "TOFU" (Text Over, Fullquote Under).
Reversing the chronology of the dialog makes it much harder to
understand (some folks won't even read it if written in that style).
For more information on quoting style, see:
http://web.presby.edu/~nnqadmin/nnq/nquote.html
Speak Perl rather than English, when possible
Perl is much more precise than natural language. Saying it in Perl
instead will avoid misunderstanding your question or problem.
Do not say: I have variable with "foo\tbar" in it.
Instead say: I have $var = "foo\tbar", or I have $var = 'foo\tbar',
or I have $var = <DATA> (and show the data line).
Ask perl to help you
You can ask perl itself to help you find common programming mistakes
by doing two things: enable warnings (perldoc warnings) and enable
"strict"ures (perldoc strict).
You should not bother the hundreds/thousands of readers of the
newsgroup without first seeing if a machine can help you find your
problem. It is demeaning to be asked to do the work of a machine. It
will annoy the readers of your article.
You can look up any of the messages that perl might issue to find
out what the message means and how to resolve the potential mistake
(perldoc perldiag). If you would like perl to look them up for you,
you can put "use diagnostics;" near the top of your program.
Do not re-type Perl code
Use copy/paste or your editor's "import" function rather than
attempting to type in your code. If you make a typo you will get
followups about your typos instead of about the question you are
trying to get answered.
Provide enough information
If you do the things in this item, you will have an Extremely Good
chance of getting people to try and help you with your problem!
These features are a really big bonus toward your question winning
out over all of the other posts that you are competing with.
First make a short (less than 20-30 lines) and *complete* program
that illustrates the problem you are having. People should be able
to run your program by copy/pasting the code from your article. (You
will find that doing this step very often reveals your problem
directly. Leading to an answer much more quickly and reliably than
posting to Usenet.)
Describe *precisely* the input to your program. Also provide example
input data for your program. If you need to show file input, use the
__DATA__ token (perldata.pod) to provide the file contents inside of
your Perl program.
Show the output (including the verbatim text of any messages) of
your program.
Describe how you want the output to be different from what you are
getting.
If you have no idea at all of how to code up your situation, be sure
to at least describe the 2 things that you *do* know: input and
desired output.
Do not provide too much information
Do not just post your entire program for debugging. Most especially
do not post someone *else's* entire program.
Do not post binaries, HTML, or MIME
clpmisc is a text only newsgroup. If you have images or binaries
that explain your question, put them in a publically accessible
place (like a Web server) and provide a pointer to that location. If
you include code, cut and paste it directly in the message body.
Don't attach anything to the message. Don't post vcards or HTML.
Many people (and even some Usenet servers) will automatically filter
out such messages. Many people will not be able to easily read your
post. Plain text is something everyone can read.
Social faux pas to avoid
The first two below are symptoms of lots of FAQ asking here in clpmisc.
It happens so often that folks will assume that it is happening yet
again. If you have looked but not found, or found but didn't understand
the docs, say so in your article.
Asking a Frequently Asked Question
It should be understood that you may have missed the applicable FAQ
when you checked, which is not a big deal. But if the Frequently
Asked Question is worded similar to your question, folks will assume
that you did not look at all. Don't become indignant at pointers to
the FAQ, particularly if it solves your problem.
Asking a question easily answered by a cursory doc search
If folks think you have not even tried the obvious step of reading
the docs applicable to your problem, they are likely to become
annoyed.
If you are flamed for not checking when you *did* check, then just
shrug it off (and take the answer that you got).
Asking for emailed answers
Emailed answers benefit one person. Posted answers benefit the
entire community. If folks can take the time to answer your
question, then you can take the time to go get the answer in the
same place where you asked the question.
It is OK to ask for a *copy* of the answer to be emailed, but many
will ignore such requests anyway. If you munge your address, you
should never expect (or ask) to get email in response to a Usenet
post.
Ask the question here, get the answer here (maybe).
Beware of saying "doesn't work"
This is a "red flag" phrase. If you find yourself writing that,
pause and see if you can't describe what is not working without
saying "doesn't work". That is, describe how it is not what you
want.
Sending a "stealth" Cc copy
A "stealth Cc" is when you both email and post a reply without
indicating *in the body* that you are doing so.
Be extra cautious when you get upset
Count to ten before composing a followup when you are upset
This is recommended in all Usenet newsgroups. Here in clpmisc, most
flaming sub-threads are not about any feature of Perl at all! They
are most often for what was seen as a breach of netiquette. If you
have lurked for a bit, then you will know what is expected and won't
make such posts in the first place.
But if you get upset, wait a while before writing your followup. I
recommend waiting at least 30 minutes.
Count to ten after composing and before posting when you are upset
After you have written your followup, wait *another* 30 minutes
before committing yourself by posting it. You cannot take it back
once it has been said.
AUTHOR
Tad McClellan and many others on the comp.lang.perl.misc newsgroup.
--
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.noitatibaher\100cmdat/"
------------------------------
Date: 30 Oct 2007 01:40:02 -0700
From: usenet@DavidFilmer.com
Subject: Re: Regex Help
Message-Id: <1193683097.115702.174840@v23g2000prn.googlegroups.com>
On Oct 29, 10:14 am, "inderpau...@yahoo.com" <inderpau...@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> What I want to do is to use a regex pattern to find the presence of an IP address
That wheel has already been invented:
http://search.cpan.org/~abigail/Regexp-Common-2.120/lib/Regexp/Common/net.pm
--
The best way to get a good answer is to ask a good question.
David Filmer (http://DavidFilmer.com)
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 03:48:57 -0600
From: "Wade Ward" <zaxfuuq@invalid.net>
Subject: Re: Regex Help
Message-Id: <vYOdnXCY0ZqPY7vanZ2dnUVZ_hGdnZ2d@comcast.com>
<usenet@DavidFilmer.com> wrote in message
news:1193683097.115702.174840@v23g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 29, 10:14 am, "inderpau...@yahoo.com" <inderpau...@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>> What I want to do is to use a regex pattern to find the presence of an IP
>> address
>
> That wheel has already been invented:
>
>
> http://search.cpan.org/~abigail/Regexp-Common-2.120/lib/Regexp/Common/net.pm
>
How do you install this wheel?
--
wade ward
President
Merrill Jensen Consulting
wade@zaxfuuq.net
435 -838-7760
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 10:48:04 GMT
From: Tad McClellan <tadmc@seesig.invalid>
Subject: Re: Regex Help
Message-Id: <slrnfie2dl.hvc.tadmc@tadmc30.sbcglobal.net>
Wade Ward <zaxfuuq@invalid.net> wrote:
>
><usenet@DavidFilmer.com> wrote in message
> news:1193683097.115702.174840@v23g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
>> On Oct 29, 10:14 am, "inderpau...@yahoo.com" <inderpau...@yahoo.com>
>> wrote:
>>> What I want to do is to use a regex pattern to find the presence of an IP
>>> address
>>
>> That wheel has already been invented:
>>
>>
>> http://search.cpan.org/~abigail/Regexp-Common-2.120/lib/Regexp/Common/net.pm
>>
> How do you install this wheel?
perldoc -q install
How do I install a module from CPAN?
--
Tad McClellan
email: perl -le "print scalar reverse qq/moc.noitatibaher\100cmdat/"
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 01:55:43 -0000
From: Luis Rivera <jlrn77@gmail.com>
Subject: TeX programming and LaTeX hacking
Message-Id: <1193709343.952391.15420@z9g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>
On Oct 26, 3:04 am, David Kastrup <d...@gnu.org> wrote:
> Brian Blackmore <b...@po.cwru.edu> writes:
>
> > In any case, since this is the TeX channel, I will mention that I
> > think TeX is an excellent programming language
>
> Uh no, it isn't. It is reasonably flexible for macro/input
> transformation. It is also quite good for typesetting using its fixed
> algorithms programmed in Pascal.
>
> But as a programming language, it is a steaming pile of crap. [...] Programming TeX really sucks, and its creator Donald
> Knuth has expressed his amazement at what tasks people actually have
> bothered implementing in TeX (rather than in Pascal or whatever) and
> says that it probably had been a mistake from him to let himself be
> prodded into adding the basics for making programming, however awful,
> basically possible in TeX.
>
Every once in a while there are threads in this newsgroup complaining
that "TeX is awful", "LaTeX is a waste of time", and so forth; and
there might be some truth to that. LaTeX is essentially a massive
macro construction, which may not even qualify as a thoroughly
systematic markup language (it lacks a generalized grammar), based on
TeX, an idiosyncratic typesetting engine with many limitations in all
counts: typesetting and macro programming capabilities, and font/glyph
handling and display, and so on.
TeX is indeed the solo effort of a guy who thought he could put his
brains into improving something he perceived as deeply wrong, and
somewhat within his reach to fix: Knuth thought that the proofs of a
book he recalled as acceptably typeset turned awful when using a
computer-aided typographic system; and since he is a computer
scientist, he thought he could do something to fix it.
So TeXmf (the combo TeX/metafont) was originally conceived as being
able to typeset English books with mathematics, at a time (ca. 1980)
when any extant system was rather hard to handle and produced rather
ugly paper copies. AFAIK, Knuth didn't think of designing a
generalized text or mathematics markup language, or a programming
language for that matter, or even a general purpose typesetter or font
format. TeXmf was meant to be able to typeset stuff like TAOCP: so
pretty much everything in the system was indeed very limited, and I
have the sense that Knuth thought that was alright, as eventually he
stopped active development pretty much as soon as he reached his own
goals (well: a little farther: TeX$\pi$ and MF$_e$ may be able to
typeset books written in pretty much any alphabetic script, with some
mathematics). Thus, nothing in the TeXmf system (the typesetter, the
macro programming language, the "markup language", etc.) was designed
to be either "perfect" nor "everything for everyone".
But TeXmf does its original job so well (again: roughly, right-to-
left, up-to-bottom books with some math in them), that many other
people (not only scientists) feel the system may be extended to help
them doing their job (book and journal paper publishing). So that's
where TeX/metafont developers began to see its obvious limits: trying
to adapt it to typeset other languages, including non-latin scripts or
multidirectional texts; trying to make it typeset critical editions,
polyglot texts, and so on... Many of these tasks (relatively complex
tables or footnotes, just to mention some simple examples) are awfully
hard, and push the system to its limits, yet still remain doable.
That's why we end-users feel LaTeX hacking manageable, while core
developers break their brains to find ways to make things possible
within a purposefully limited macro language.
After a while I've come to understand David's complaints (and the
merits of himself and a number of other very able TeX programmers);
and I respect him the more as he repeatedly acknowledges that, despite
its many obvious limitations, TeX is the best we have. Hopefully, for
not much longer.
I agree that teaching TeX programming may not be the best in the
interest of CS undergrads; it looks more like the subject of advanced
CS grad students, perhaps with the aim of working out something much
better than TeX: more general, more systematic, and much easier to
handle, even from the point of view of a saner macro programming
language.
My penny thoughts,
Luis.
------------------------------
Date: 30 Oct 2007 10:38:50 GMT
From: rf10@cl.cam.ac.uk (Robin Fairbairns)
Subject: Re: TeX programming and LaTeX hacking
Message-Id: <fg71jq$k4a$1@gemini.csx.cam.ac.uk>
Luis Rivera <jlrn77@gmail.com> writes:
>[lots of good sense omitted]
>
>I agree that teaching TeX programming may not be the best in the
>interest of CS undergrads; it looks more like the subject of advanced
>CS grad students, perhaps with the aim of working out something much
>better than TeX: more general, more systematic, and much easier to
>handle, even from the point of view of a saner macro programming
>language.
i read brian's comment as "we need to exercise undergraduates' brains
better".
an old friend (and mentor: roger needham) once proposed a practical
exam where the students were given a machine and its manuals (back
then there was enough variety for them not to have encountered every
one possible); they would then be expected to implement something
useful on the machine, in half a day (or however long the exam was
going to take). this would have been a practical introduction to
thinking on your feet, in a way you would never learn from lectures.
i agree that teaching tex programming may not be the most practical
way of getting students to think outside the box, but it's an amusing
and thought-provoking idea. next time i'm the tea room with the head
of teaching here, i'll ask whether he's ever thought in such terms.
on any course, there are always students who're inquisitive and
eager to expand their horizons. a course that stimulated that
attitude would surely be welcome.
--
Robin Fairbairns, Cambridge
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 12:09:41 +0100
From: David Kastrup <dak@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: TeX programming and LaTeX hacking
Message-Id: <85prywvoy2.fsf@lola.goethe.zz>
rf10@cl.cam.ac.uk (Robin Fairbairns) writes:
> i agree that teaching tex programming may not be the most practical
> way of getting students to think outside the box, but it's an
> amusing and thought-provoking idea. next time i'm the tea room with
> the head of teaching here, i'll ask whether he's ever thought in
> such terms.
>
> on any course, there are always students who're inquisitive and
> eager to expand their horizons. a course that stimulated that
> attitude would surely be welcome.
Programming in TeX is rather about being able to restrict your
horizon.
--
David Kastrup, Kriemhildstr. 15, 44793 Bochum
UKTUG FAQ: <URL:http://www.tex.ac.uk/cgi-bin/texfaq2html>
------------------------------
Date: 30 Oct 2007 12:42:58 GMT
From: rf10@cl.cam.ac.uk (Robin Fairbairns)
Subject: Re: TeX programming and LaTeX hacking
Message-Id: <fg78si$be9$1@gemini.csx.cam.ac.uk>
David Kastrup <dak@gnu.org> writes:
>rf10@cl.cam.ac.uk (Robin Fairbairns) writes:
>> i agree that teaching tex programming may not be the most practical
>> way of getting students to think outside the box, but it's an
>> amusing and thought-provoking idea. next time i'm the tea room with
>> the head of teaching here, i'll ask whether he's ever thought in
>> such terms.
>>
>> on any course, there are always students who're inquisitive and
>> eager to expand their horizons. a course that stimulated that
>> attitude would surely be welcome.
>
>Programming in TeX is rather about being able to restrict your
>horizon.
;-)
but if your horizons don't reach to anything that can't be programmed
in c++ or c# -- i.e., anything out of the ordinary -- then coming to
such a weird environment as programming tex macros is going to extend
them.
not that i _would_ recommend teaching tex, but there's no denying that
it's good training for working with an environment of maximum surprise
--
Robin Fairbairns, Cambridge
------------------------------
Date: 6 Apr 2001 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
From: Perl-Users-Request@ruby.oce.orst.edu (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01)
Message-Id: <null>
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------------------------------
End of Perl-Users Digest V11 Issue 989
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