[29094] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 338 Volume: 11
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Sat Apr 14 21:14:20 2007
Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 18:14:10 -0700 (PDT)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Sat, 14 Apr 2007 Volume: 11 Number: 338
Today's topics:
Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007) <edMbj@aes-intl.com>
Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007) <edMbj@aes-intl.com>
Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007) <sigzero@gmail.com>
Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007) cartercc@gmail.com
Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007) <bik.mido@tiscalinet.it>
Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007) <bik.mido@tiscalinet.it>
Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007) <purlgurl@purlgurl.net>
Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007) <edMbj@aes-intl.com>
Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007) <uri@stemsystems.com>
Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007) <edMbj@aes-intl.com>
Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007) <uri@stemsystems.com>
What does 'grep -M' do? <cdalten@gmail.com>
Re: Where did cgi-bin go? <spamtrap@dot-app.org>
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 11:51:00 -0700
From: Ed Jay <edMbj@aes-intl.com>
Subject: Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007)
Message-Id: <mp7223l5uosm02b4u738pmr7204hga9ok7@4ax.com>
Michele Dondi scribed:
>On Sat, 14 Apr 2007 00:34:28 -0700, Ed Jay <edMbj@aes-intl.com> wrote:
>
>>>If you want to get laughed at, use Perl. It's so ... 80's.
>>>
>>As a struggling Perl newbie, I derive little encouragement to pursue my
>>education from your statements. Perhaps it's time for me to go down a
>>different programming path while I'm still embryonic.
>
>Please don't! (/me reads further on below...) Please do! :-)
>
>>I'm even less encouraged when I read:
>>
>>On 16 Mar, "The Count" wrote:
>>>Im a BSc4 Maths/Computer Science student and would like to find out
>>>the best way to learn programming in perl.Perl is not offered in my
>>>course but I find that it is a very popular language.I can program in
>>>Pascal,Delphi and C++...
>>
>>Perl isn't offered in the BSc/CS curriculum? That speaks loudly to me. I
>>tried to take a course in Perl at my local junior college, but it's not
>>offered.
>
>It doesn't surprise me even a little bit. In fact I don't think Perl
>is best suited as a *learning* language.
>
>>Which brings me back on-topic. Many of the people who come to
>>comp.lang.perl.misc are people, like myself and 'The Count,' who are forced
>>to learn on our own. This newsgroup is chartered to be among our Internet
>
>/me too.
>
>>resources. I'm therefore struck with amazement when I read a group veteran's
>
>/me's too.
>
>>response to a newbie's technical question and obvious Usenet-newbie request
>>that the answer be sent to him by email:
>>
>>>How profoundly rude of you!
>>>The reason this newsgroup exists is to help fellow programmers.
>>>They will not be helped if you hoard the answer.
>>
>>How profoundly rude, indeed! Having lurked here for a couple of months, the
>
>Yep, really rude. Given that help here is given on a volounteering
>basis, it is also given at some conditions. One of which being that it
>be public, for others to also benefit from it and possibly to allow
>corrections.
>
>ut then the OP may have asked for the answers to be handwritten on
>parchment paper and delivered to his physical address along with a
>bottle of champagne by a stripteaser.
I've always felt that when someone has to exaggerate to make their point,
their point isn't worth mentioning.
>And from your POV it would have
>been very polite, because he's "an obvious newbie" to USENET.
Too bad some people have abandoned the thought of politeness. If a poster is
recognized as a newbie, it is easy to phrase one's response to the newbie's
request without resorting to offensive banter. How difficult is it to write,
'This NG exists to help fellow programmers. Responding by email defeats
sharing information?'
>
>>offensive response was expected from the NG regular. As are set of similar
> ^^^^^^^^^
> ^^^^^^^^^
>
>A remark that that's not the way the NG works is *NOT* offensive:
It depends on the manner in which the information was conveyed. Calling
someone profoundly rude because they're ignorant is indeed offensive.
>
>: From Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary (1913) [web1913]:
>:
>: Offense \Of*fense"\, Offence \Of*fence"\, n. [F., fr. L.
>: offensa. See {Offend}.]
>: 1. The act of offending in any sense; esp., a crime or a sin,
>: an affront or an injury.
>
>Had the regular also added "you idiot", it would have been. But he
>didn't...
Telling someone they are profoundly rude, when saying so is completely
unnecessary and inappropriate, is patently wrong. If you can't see it I feel
sorry for you.
>
>>comments, by many of the people in the OP's list. Look at the blatant
>>hypocrisy in the above. Does anyone really think that this type of response
>>provides assistance or fosters a desire to further participate in this
>>forum? Or, to learn and perpetuate this programming language?
>
>Most certainly not. I'm already looking up some pornstars to hire (see
>above) to be more gentle to the next newbie who pops here just saying
>"help me", without helping people to help him/her (some top male
>perfomer expected in the second case). Should we loose him/her, what a
>terrible loss for the community would result!!
I hope your programming capabilities exceed your lame attempts at
exaggerating reality. Your sarcasm is lost on yourself.
>
>>Or, does it matter?
>
>Yes it does matter. You should notice though, that just along with the
>authoritative sources you quoted yourself, just today in a post in
>some other thread I read:
>
>: Can't thank you enough! It was (really){2,}\.\.\. dumb on my part to
>: not check the faq first!
>
>I suppose you should feel compelled now to go to that thread and warn
>the incautious OP, who obviously should know better: for some reasons
>he feels like thanking the group and of course just didn't realize how
>hard he's been bashed and abused by the offensive regulars. Please, do
>help him before it's too late!
>
I feel compelled to tell you that your resorting to grossly amplified,
unrelated examples to make your case has failed. Had you not tried to be
sarcastic you may have made a valid point. Your response was lame, at best.
If anyone needs help, it's people who behave as you have in your response.
--
Ed Jay (remove 'M' to respond by email)
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 12:04:17 -0700
From: Ed Jay <edMbj@aes-intl.com>
Subject: Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007)
Message-Id: <6a9223562j153n926ktpnmro8qin24bjt2@4ax.com>
Michele Dondi scribed:
>On Sat, 14 Apr 2007 09:19:47 -0700, Ed Jay <edMbj@aes-intl.com> wrote:
>
>>>Did schools like MIT or Stanford ever offer a "regular" course in
>>>Perl? Please enlighten me on this because I never applied to either of
>>>these schools.
>>
>>I don't know, but I have seen classes offered in javascript, Java, VB, C++
>>and others. I would have thought that if Perl is as popular as we'd like to
>>believe, it too would be offered.
>
>As I wrote in my other post, I don't think so. Even if Perl were many
>many times more popular than it actually is. I think that it's a good
>thing people will learn how to program with Java. Then they will
>stumble upon Perl and say: whoa, so I don't have to create a whole
>class just to print "hello, world"?
If nothing else, you got me to cross Java off my list of 'maybe I'll learn.'
:-)
>
>>>Forced to learn on our own? You don't learn because you love to learn?
>>
>>You misunderstood my comment. We are forced to learn on our own versus
>>taking a class.
>
>I think that was just (probably misplaced) sarcasm.
>
I seem to attract misplaced sarcasm. ;-)
--
Ed Jay (remove 'M' to respond by email)
------------------------------
Date: 14 Apr 2007 14:59:15 -0700
From: "Robert Hicks" <sigzero@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007)
Message-Id: <1176587955.366739.246420@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>
On Apr 14, 10:37 am, Michele Dondi <bik.m...@tiscalinet.it> wrote:
> On 13 Apr 2007 12:31:17 -0700, carte...@gmail.com wrote:
>
<snip>
> >and in my area, Python.
>
> Nice area! Have fun! No, seriously, eh!
>
I thought Ruby was the "I have FUN when I program" language? : )
Robert
------------------------------
Date: 14 Apr 2007 16:22:58 -0700
From: cartercc@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007)
Message-Id: <1176592978.722600.48130@d57g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>
I spoke harshly. I may have had justification, or at least
provocation, and that may or may not excuse my harsh words. Please let
me temper what I said, as a former Perl newbie to a present Perl
newbie.
Programming languages, and all software (including OS's), are merely
tools. Use the best tool for the job. Personally, I believe that
everyone should be proficient in a scripting language and a system
language. People differ on what falls into what category, but for me,
I choose Perl for my scripting language and Java for my system
language. My present job requires a lot of heavy duty text and file
processing. IMO, Perl is THE BEST (!!!) tool for this. Java can't
touch it.
By the same token, if I have to build software that requires more than
about 50 LOC, I'll use Java. Java is an industrial strength tool
suitable for industrial programming, Perl isn't. Yeah, web pages,
database stuff, system administration, file manipulation, use Perl for
this -- you really can't beat it.
And ... if you look at these tasks ... they have been around for quite
a while, and despite what I said about Perl being so 80's, it's a
mature and well supported technology. You won't misspend your time
gaining proficiency in Perl.
CC
On Apr 14, 3:34 am, Ed Jay <e...@aes-intl.com> wrote:
> Which brings me back on-topic. Many of the people who come to
> comp.lang.perl.misc are people, like myself and 'The Count,' who are forced
> to learn on our own. This newsgroup is chartered to be among our Internet
> resources. I'm therefore struck with amazement when I read a group veteran's
> response to a newbie's technical question and obvious Usenet-newbie request
> that the answer be sent to him by email:
>
> >How profoundly rude of you!
> >The reason this newsgroup exists is to help fellow programmers.
> >They will not be helped if you hoard the answer.
>
> How profoundly rude, indeed! Having lurked here for a couple of months, the
> offensive response was expected from the NG regular. As are set of similar
> comments, by many of the people in the OP's list. Look at the blatant
> hypocrisy in the above. Does anyone really think that this type of response
> provides assistance or fosters a desire to further participate in this
> forum? Or, to learn and perpetuate this programming language?
>
> Or, does it matter?
> --
> Ed Jay (remove 'M' to respond by email)
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 01:37:37 +0200
From: Michele Dondi <bik.mido@tiscalinet.it>
Subject: Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007)
Message-Id: <dpn223h8dusu9keaa52c3r42ptinkjg2mp@4ax.com>
On Sat, 14 Apr 2007 11:51:00 -0700, Ed Jay <edMbj@aes-intl.com> wrote:
>>ut then the OP may have asked for the answers to be handwritten on
>>parchment paper and delivered to his physical address along with a
>>bottle of champagne by a stripteaser.
>
>I've always felt that when someone has to exaggerate to make their point,
>their point isn't worth mentioning.
Well, you know, when someone refuses hard to understand something that
should be so simple, then you try any trick that springs to mind. And
exaggeration or not, sarcasm or not, the difference between the
newbie's actual request and my "example" is purely quantitative, not
qualitative: it's just the same, rude, irrespectful approach.
>>And from your POV it would have
>>been very polite, because he's "an obvious newbie" to USENET.
>
>Too bad some people have abandoned the thought of politeness. If a poster is
>recognized as a newbie, it is easy to phrase one's response to the newbie's
>request without resorting to offensive banter. How difficult is it to write,
>'This NG exists to help fellow programmers. Responding by email defeats
>sharing information?'
And how is this *really* different from what Tad wrote? If you say
"idiot" or "son of a bitch" you're making unpleasant attributions to
*a person* with regards to stuff you don't really know. If you say
that *an action* of that person is rude, you're plainly reporting a
perceived charachteristic of that action, with regards to something
you *do* know. You're *informing* the person. No more no less. It's
quite different.
>>>offensive response was expected from the NG regular. As are set of similar
>> ^^^^^^^^^
>> ^^^^^^^^^
>>
>>A remark that that's not the way the NG works is *NOT* offensive:
>
>It depends on the manner in which the information was conveyed. Calling
>someone profoundly rude because they're ignorant is indeed offensive.
'How profoundly rude of you!' ne 'How profoundly rude you are!';
>>Had the regular also added "you idiot", it would have been. But he
>>didn't...
>
>Telling someone they are profoundly rude, when saying so is completely
>unnecessary and inappropriate, is patently wrong. If you can't see it I feel
>sorry for you.
Telling someone that something she did is profoundly rude, when saying
so is completely necessary and appropriate, is patently right. (For
otherwise, by virtue of a mistaken sense of kindness, she will behave
in exactly the same manner the next time.) If you can't see it I feel
sorry for you.
>>Most certainly not. I'm already looking up some pornstars to hire (see
>>above) to be more gentle to the next newbie who pops here just saying
>>"help me", without helping people to help him/her (some top male
>>perfomer expected in the second case). Should we loose him/her, what a
>>terrible loss for the community would result!!
>
>I hope your programming capabilities exceed your lame attempts at
>exaggerating reality. Your sarcasm is lost on yourself.
Nope, they're worse. Congratulations, you've just discovered one more
respect of how horrible a person I am.
>>Yes it does matter. You should notice though, that just along with the
>>authoritative sources you quoted yourself, just today in a post in
>>some other thread I read:
>>
>>: Can't thank you enough! It was (really){2,}\.\.\. dumb on my part to
>>: not check the faq first!
>>
>>I suppose you should feel compelled now to go to that thread and warn
>>the incautious OP, who obviously should know better: for some reasons
>>he feels like thanking the group and of course just didn't realize how
>>hard he's been bashed and abused by the offensive regulars. Please, do
>>help him before it's too late!
>>
>I feel compelled to tell you that your resorting to grossly amplified,
BTW: how is the example "grossly amplified"? I just cut the quote
above and pasted it here, verbatim. (But the quote signs, that is.)
>unrelated examples to make your case has failed. Had you not tried to be
>sarcastic you may have made a valid point. Your response was lame, at best.
I have worse problems. Really. But I think you should really go and
get some sense of humour, it doesn't hurt and it's cheap.
>If anyone needs help, it's people who behave as you have in your response.
While I don't have the slightest idea of how you can claim that, I
suppose you're right. In fact I *do* often need help. In particular,
when I need help with Perl, this group is my preferred resource to
search it. Actually I've learnt more from here about it than from
anything else. Incidentally, I've never been told that I was being
rude, by the regulars that is. I've never felt insulted or offended,
by the regulars that is. YMMV. Indeed, it seems it *does*, for some
reason that completely eludes my comprehension. I'm just sorry for
you, because I consider myself lucky for having had the opportunity to
receive help from this group.
Michele
--
{$_=pack'B8'x25,unpack'A8'x32,$a^=sub{pop^pop}->(map substr
(($a||=join'',map--$|x$_,(unpack'w',unpack'u','G^<R<Y]*YB='
.'KYU;*EVH[.FHF2W+#"\Z*5TI/ER<Z`S(G.DZZ9OX0Z')=~/./g)x2,$_,
256),7,249);s/[^\w,]/ /g;$ \=/^J/?$/:"\r";print,redo}#JAPH,
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 01:43:51 +0200
From: Michele Dondi <bik.mido@tiscalinet.it>
Subject: Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007)
Message-Id: <4ip2231h8us0hlp0qffb28ekbkimm4j65s@4ax.com>
On 14 Apr 2007 14:59:15 -0700, "Robert Hicks" <sigzero@gmail.com>
wrote:
>> Nice area! Have fun! No, seriously, eh!
>>
>
>I thought Ruby was the "I have FUN when I program" language? : )
I didn't know, but I felt compelled to search and it seems so!
Unfortunately I don't know it, and I say "unfortunately" because from
all accounts I've read it seems very interesting. (I don't share the
same feeling wrt Python.) But then it's known to be heavily inspired
by Perl, and I like to think that it's the source of the fun. Oh, and
Perl 6 borrows features back from Ruby, which makes for more fun. And
for even more fun, Pugs is a Perl 6 implementation "optimized for
fun"...
Michele
--
{$_=pack'B8'x25,unpack'A8'x32,$a^=sub{pop^pop}->(map substr
(($a||=join'',map--$|x$_,(unpack'w',unpack'u','G^<R<Y]*YB='
.'KYU;*EVH[.FHF2W+#"\Z*5TI/ER<Z`S(G.DZZ9OX0Z')=~/./g)x2,$_,
256),7,249);s/[^\w,]/ /g;$ \=/^J/?$/:"\r";print,redo}#JAPH,
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 17:04:45 -0700
From: Purl Gurl <purlgurl@purlgurl.net>
Subject: Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007)
Message-Id: <Re2dnbNEUdu-8bzbnZ2dnUVZ_jmdnZ2d@giganews.com>
Michele Dondi wrote:
> Robert Hicks wrote:
>>> Nice area! Have fun! No, seriously, eh!
>> I thought Ruby was the "I have FUN when I program" language? : )
> I didn't know, but I felt compelled to search and it seems so!
> Unfortunately I don't know it, and I say "unfortunately" because from
> all accounts I've read it seems very interesting. (I don't share the
> same feeling wrt Python.) But then it's known to be heavily inspired
> by Perl, and I like to think that it's the source of the fun. Oh, and
> Perl 6 borrows features back from Ruby, which makes for more fun. And
> for even more fun, Pugs is a Perl 6 implementation "optimized for
> fun"...
Perl 6 is a disaster. Seven years in development and Perl 6
remains a patchwork three ring circus. I have doubts Perl 6
will ever be released and if so, Perl 6 is not likely to be
adopted into mainstream programming.
Those seven years of wasted efforts could have been directed
into rendering Perl 5 a wildly popular programming language,
such as developing a lite version of perl 5 core for speed
and efficiency.
Perl 6 is vaporware bloatware which will prove unpopular.
Purl Gurl
Three Ring Circus:
http://use.perl.org/articles/07/04/03/2143229.shtml
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 17:39:06 -0700
From: Ed Jay <edMbj@aes-intl.com>
Subject: Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007)
Message-Id: <21s223la7t1iqkkuauuaqb4m8l42hf0o8m@4ax.com>
Michele Dondi scribed:
>On Sat, 14 Apr 2007 11:51:00 -0700, Ed Jay <edMbj@aes-intl.com> wrote:
>
>>>ut then the OP may have asked for the answers to be handwritten on
>>>parchment paper and delivered to his physical address along with a
>>>bottle of champagne by a stripteaser.
>>
>>I've always felt that when someone has to exaggerate to make their point,
>>their point isn't worth mentioning.
>
>Well, you know, when someone refuses hard to understand something that
>should be so simple, then you try any trick that springs to mind. And
>exaggeration or not, sarcasm or not, the difference between the
>newbie's actual request and my "example" is purely quantitative, not
>qualitative: it's just the same, rude, irrespectful approach.
Is it rude or disrespectful if the person committing the faux pas is
ignorant of the 'rules?' I think not. I also think it's pretty easy to spot
a newbie, i.e., an ignorant one, so it's real easy to go that extra word or
two in the name of diplomacy. You remember the Golden Rule, don't you?
>
>>>And from your POV it would have
>>>been very polite, because he's "an obvious newbie" to USENET.
>>
>>Too bad some people have abandoned the thought of politeness. If a poster is
>>recognized as a newbie, it is easy to phrase one's response to the newbie's
>>request without resorting to offensive banter. How difficult is it to write,
>>'This NG exists to help fellow programmers. Responding by email defeats
>>sharing information?'
>
>And how is this *really* different from what Tad wrote? If you say
>"idiot" or "son of a bitch" you're making unpleasant attributions to
>*a person* with regards to stuff you don't really know. If you say
>that *an action* of that person is rude, you're plainly reporting a
>perceived charachteristic of that action, with regards to something
>you *do* know. You're *informing* the person. No more no less. It's
>quite different.
It isn't much different than what Tad wrote, but it reads miles apart.
That's my point.
>
>>>>offensive response was expected from the NG regular. As are set of similar
>>> ^^^^^^^^^
>>> ^^^^^^^^^
>>>
>>>A remark that that's not the way the NG works is *NOT* offensive:
>>
>>It depends on the manner in which the information was conveyed. Calling
>>someone profoundly rude because they're ignorant is indeed offensive.
>
> 'How profoundly rude of you!' ne 'How profoundly rude you are!';
A infers B, but I understand your point.
>
>>>Had the regular also added "you idiot", it would have been. But he
>>>didn't...
>>
>>Telling someone they are profoundly rude, when saying so is completely
>>unnecessary and inappropriate, is patently wrong. If you can't see it I feel
>>sorry for you.
>
>Telling someone that something she did is profoundly rude, when saying
>so is completely necessary and appropriate, is patently right. (For
>otherwise, by virtue of a mistaken sense of kindness, she will behave
>in exactly the same manner the next time.) If you can't see it I feel
>sorry for you.
Don't feel sorry for me so fast. I agree with your point.
>
>>>Most certainly not. I'm already looking up some pornstars to hire (see
>>>above) to be more gentle to the next newbie who pops here just saying
>>>"help me", without helping people to help him/her (some top male
>>>perfomer expected in the second case). Should we loose him/her, what a
>>>terrible loss for the community would result!!
>>
>>I hope your programming capabilities exceed your lame attempts at
>>exaggerating reality. Your sarcasm is lost on yourself.
>
>Nope, they're worse. Congratulations, you've just discovered one more
>respect of how horrible a person I am.
If bad programming makes a person a horrible person, I'm in much more
trouble than you are.
>
>>>Yes it does matter. You should notice though, that just along with the
>>>authoritative sources you quoted yourself, just today in a post in
>>>some other thread I read:
>>>
>>>: Can't thank you enough! It was (really){2,}\.\.\. dumb on my part to
>>>: not check the faq first!
>>>
>>>I suppose you should feel compelled now to go to that thread and warn
>>>the incautious OP, who obviously should know better: for some reasons
>>>he feels like thanking the group and of course just didn't realize how
>>>hard he's been bashed and abused by the offensive regulars. Please, do
>>>help him before it's too late!
>>>
>>I feel compelled to tell you that your resorting to grossly amplified,
>
>BTW: how is the example "grossly amplified"? I just cut the quote
>above and pasted it here, verbatim. (But the quote signs, that is.)
I don't want to ignore your question, but I forget what I was thinking,
besides the porn star, when I wrote it. Mea culpa. I'm old.
>
>>unrelated examples to make your case has failed. Had you not tried to be
>>sarcastic you may have made a valid point. Your response was lame, at best.
>
>I have worse problems. Really. But I think you should really go and
>get some sense of humour, it doesn't hurt and it's cheap.
I'm known for having a wonderful sense of humor. You ought to see my code.
>
>>If anyone needs help, it's people who behave as you have in your response.
>
>While I don't have the slightest idea of how you can claim that, I
>suppose you're right. In fact I *do* often need help. In particular,
>when I need help with Perl, this group is my preferred resource to
>search it. Actually I've learnt more from here about it than from
>anything else. Incidentally, I've never been told that I was being
>rude, by the regulars that is. I've never felt insulted or offended,
>by the regulars that is. YMMV. Indeed, it seems it *does*, for some
>reason that completely eludes my comprehension. I'm just sorry for
>you, because I consider myself lucky for having had the opportunity to
>receive help from this group.
>
Again, don't be so fast feeling sorry for me. I too have had tremendous luck
in getting help resulting from my participation in this NG, even as a
lurker. As to my suggesting you were rude, etc., on reflection, after
reading some of today's nasty posts your sarcasm probably triggered a
proactive response. Sorry 'bout that.
--
Ed Jay (remove 'M' to respond by email)
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 20:41:04 -0400
From: Uri Guttman <uri@stemsystems.com>
Subject: Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007)
Message-Id: <x73b32cvvj.fsf@mail.sysarch.com>
>>>>> "MD" == Michele Dondi <bik.mido@tiscalinet.it> writes:
MD> 'How profoundly rude of you!' ne 'How profoundly rude you are!';
michele, please don't try to teach such good logical english! you don't
speak it natively! :)
>> If anyone needs help, it's people who behave as you have in your response.
MD> While I don't have the slightest idea of how you can claim that, I
MD> suppose you're right. In fact I *do* often need help. In
MD> particular, when I need help with Perl, this group is my preferred
MD> resource to search it. Actually I've learnt more from here about
MD> it than from anything else. Incidentally, I've never been told
MD> that I was being rude, by the regulars that is. I've never felt
MD> insulted or offended, by the regulars that is. YMMV. Indeed, it
MD> seems it *does*, for some reason that completely eludes my
MD> comprehension. I'm just sorry for you, because I consider myself
MD> lucky for having had the opportunity to receive help from this
MD> group.
ok, i will insult you gratuitously: you're just an italian perl hacker!!
:)
uri
--
Uri Guttman ------ uri@stemsystems.com -------- http://www.stemsystems.com
--Perl Consulting, Stem Development, Systems Architecture, Design and Coding-
Search or Offer Perl Jobs ---------------------------- http://jobs.perl.org
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 17:52:17 -0700
From: Ed Jay <edMbj@aes-intl.com>
Subject: Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007)
Message-Id: <gat223tj57i7s8gqkp0k5fu9ihdnkhtsmf@4ax.com>
cartercc@gmail.com scribed:
>I spoke harshly. I may have had justification, or at least
>provocation, and that may or may not excuse my harsh words. Please let
>me temper what I said, as a former Perl newbie to a present Perl
>newbie.
Understood. Not to worry, though. After making it through the first 100
pages of 'The Llama,' I'm not about to quit. :-)
I have programming experience in machine (assembly) language and javascript.
The more Perl I learn, the happier I am.
>
>Programming languages, and all software (including OS's), are merely
>tools. Use the best tool for the job. Personally, I believe that
>everyone should be proficient in a scripting language and a system
>language. People differ on what falls into what category, but for me,
>I choose Perl for my scripting language and Java for my system
>language. My present job requires a lot of heavy duty text and file
>processing. IMO, Perl is THE BEST (!!!) tool for this. Java can't
>touch it.
I'm using Perl to generate DHTML pages for a medical AI diagnostic program.
It's perfect for my application; however, I'm sure that ASP, etc., are
equally suitable.
>
>By the same token, if I have to build software that requires more than
>about 50 LOC, I'll use Java. Java is an industrial strength tool
>suitable for industrial programming, Perl isn't. Yeah, web pages,
>database stuff, system administration, file manipulation, use Perl for
>this -- you really can't beat it.
>
>And ... if you look at these tasks ... they have been around for quite
>a while, and despite what I said about Perl being so 80's, it's a
>mature and well supported technology. You won't misspend your time
>gaining proficiency in Perl.
>
Someone is likely going to get on you for 'top posting' your response.
Usenet etiquette, tradition and logical discussion flow dictates that you
post your response below that to which your responding, or interspersed, as
I've done, above, to answer a specific point.
--
Ed Jay (remove 'M' to respond by email)
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 21:01:45 -0400
From: Uri Guttman <uri@stemsystems.com>
Subject: Re: Top Turds of comp.lang.perl.misc (2007)
Message-Id: <x7wt0ebgcm.fsf@mail.sysarch.com>
>>>>> "EJ" == Ed Jay <edMbj@aes-intl.com> writes:
EJ> If bad programming makes a person a horrible person, I'm in much more
EJ> trouble than you are.
you don't get it. it isn't bad programming that makes one bad. it is
being a bad programmer who either doesn't know it (e.g. moronzilla) or
doesn't want to get better and try to learn from those who are good
programmers. and how do you judge the good coders? you look at a
community of them and see how they are ranked there. just like chess
ranking scores or scholarly published articles and who references them,
the perl community has coders of many skill ranges. most of the regulars
here or on other forums have proven their perl skills and knowledge and
earned their respect and ranking (regardless of their tone in most
cases). no one respects moronzilla is the point. you don't have the
skills to even judge that and you think we are crazy for denigrating its
skills.
EJ> I'm known for having a wonderful sense of humor. You ought to see my code.
coding isn't humorous. look at the lost mars probe due to a coding
error. funny, ha ha. want funny code in your medical equipment or
accurate code that was coded by a jerk you don't like? i know what i
will buy.
EJ> Again, don't be so fast feeling sorry for me. I too have had
EJ> tremendous luck in getting help resulting from my participation in
EJ> this NG, even as a lurker. As to my suggesting you were rude,
EJ> etc., on reflection, after reading some of today's nasty posts
EJ> your sarcasm probably triggered a proactive response. Sorry 'bout
EJ> that.
you used the word luck. that is the perfect choice for getting useful
help from moronzilla. even a broken clock is right twice a
day. moronzilla can answer some trivial questions correctly once in a
while. its lack of depth of understanding programming in general and
perl in specifics is astounding. ask i to analyze some algorithms
using O(N) notation. ask it how to write a protocol. ask it how to do
anything beyond kiddie text munging with substr. do you ever see it
involved in threads outside its little skill set? that is what you
should be looking at.
uri
--
Uri Guttman ------ uri@stemsystems.com -------- http://www.stemsystems.com
--Perl Consulting, Stem Development, Systems Architecture, Design and Coding-
Search or Offer Perl Jobs ---------------------------- http://jobs.perl.org
------------------------------
Date: 14 Apr 2007 17:42:08 -0700
From: "grocery_stocker" <cdalten@gmail.com>
Subject: What does 'grep -M' do?
Message-Id: <1176597728.352825.300920@y5g2000hsa.googlegroups.com>
The following code is taken from
http://groups.google.com/group/perl.beginners/browse_thread/thread/c1b0afccf5fffccf/?hl=en#
# open the current directory
opendir my $dh, '.' or die "Cannot open '.' $!";
# get files older than three days
my @files = grep -M > 3, readdir $dh;
closedir $dh;
for my $file ( @files ) {
rename $file, "history/$file" or die "Cannot move '$file' $!";
}
What does grep -M do? Is this a perl option for grep? I don't see this
option when I look up grep on the unix man pages. I tried searching
google and found nothing.
Chad
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 15:12:48 -0400
From: Sherm Pendley <spamtrap@dot-app.org>
Subject: Re: Where did cgi-bin go?
Message-Id: <m2fy72ixcf.fsf@local.wv-www.com>
Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> writes:
> From observing other sites it is easy to see that the cgi-bin token is not
> mandatory for running CGI scripts. After all, some sites like slashdot
> itself are written in perl
But not using CGI. "CGI" ne "Perl".
sherm--
--
Web Hosting by West Virginians, for West Virginians: http://wv-www.net
Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net
------------------------------
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Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01)
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End of Perl-Users Digest V11 Issue 338
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