[26334] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 8509 Volume: 10
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Tue Oct 11 00:05:28 2005
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 21:05:04 -0700 (PDT)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Mon, 10 Oct 2005 Volume: 10 Number: 8509
Today's topics:
Re: PAR gone? <ddunham@redwood.taos.com>
Re: PAR gone? <matthew.garrish@sympatico.ca>
Re: PAR gone? <matthew.garrish@sympatico.ca>
Re: PAR gone? <toddrw69@excite.com>
Re: Problem signing on to AIM with Net::AOLIM <MrReallyVeryNice.RemoveNoSPAM@yahoo.RemoveNoSPAM.com>
Re: Problem signing on to AIM with Net::AOLIM <rfs9999@earthlink.net>
Re: Problem signing on to AIM with Net::AOLIM <rfs9999@earthlink.net>
Re: Problem signing on to AIM with Net::AOLIM <segraves_f13@mindspring.com>
Re: Problem signing on to AIM with Net::AOLIM <MrReallyVeryNice.RemoveNoSPAM@yahoo.RemoveNoSPAM.com>
re: why the perl docs suck <Fred@fred.net>
Re: why the perl docs suck <matthew.garrish@sympatico.ca>
Re: why the perl docs suck <sherm@dot-app.org>
Re: why the perl docs suck <1usa@llenroc.ude.invalid>
Re: why the perl docs suck <yyusenet@yahoo.com>
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 22:08:12 GMT
From: Darren Dunham <ddunham@redwood.taos.com>
Subject: Re: PAR gone?
Message-Id: <gDB2f.369$7h7.140@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com>
John Bokma <john@castleamber.com> wrote:
> http://par.perl.org/
> First of all, I am not going into how braindead and clueless someone must
> be who develops software and comes up with a shitty story like "My machine
> crashed".
> Anyway: http://web.archive.org/web/20041012035744/par.perl.org/index.cgi
> seems to be *the* place for PAR right now?
I think http://search.cpan.org/~autrijus/PAR/ or
http://search.cpan.org/~autrijus/PAR/lib/PAR.pm would be correct.
--
Darren Dunham ddunham@taos.com
Senior Technical Consultant TAOS http://www.taos.com/
Got some Dr Pepper? San Francisco, CA bay area
< This line left intentionally blank to confuse you. >
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 18:21:05 -0400
From: "Matt Garrish" <matthew.garrish@sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: PAR gone?
Message-Id: <jPB2f.2933$vD4.141144@news20.bellglobal.com>
"John Bokma" <john@castleamber.com> wrote in message
news:Xns96EBA62337A5castleamber@130.133.1.4...
> http://par.perl.org/
>
> First of all, I am not going into how braindead and clueless someone must
> be who develops software and comes up with a shitty story like "My machine
> crashed".
>
<quote>
This machine suffered a catastrophic hardware failure...
</quote>
Why the venom, were you looking for his life story?
Matt
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 22:05:02 -0400
From: "Matt Garrish" <matthew.garrish@sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: PAR gone?
Message-Id: <f5F2f.3313$S43.306509@news20.bellglobal.com>
"John Bokma" <john@castleamber.com> wrote in message
news:Xns96EBCE6CE3251castleamber@130.133.1.4...
> "Matt Garrish" <matthew.garrish@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>
>>
>> "John Bokma" <john@castleamber.com> wrote in message
>> news:Xns96EBA62337A5castleamber@130.133.1.4...
>>> http://par.perl.org/
>>>
>>> First of all, I am not going into how braindead and clueless someone
>>> must be who develops software and comes up with a shitty story like
>>> "My machine crashed".
>>>
>>
>> <quote>
>> This machine suffered a catastrophic hardware failure...
>> </quote>
>>
>> Why the venom, were you looking for his life story?
>
> par.perl.org, I mean, not some home page at geocities. There was a wiki
> and
> a lot of info. Gone? To me that looks extremely stupid to say the least.
>
Maybe you know something I don't (which is entirely possible), but how do
you know it's all gone? Catastrophic hardware failures do happen. The
company I recently left lost their entire mail server raid array one
weekend. Shit happens. If you're complaining that it wasn't instantly put
back up online, I imagine it's because no one is being paid to keep it
online (plus I'm sure it will take some time to reconfigure the applications
and get the data back up).
Considering that you seem to need this information quite badly, I can't help
but remark again that it's rather unfair of you to call the person who has
been maintaining the site for you all this time braindead because it went
down. You're not entitled to anything on the internet, after all.
Matt
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 03:22:32 GMT
From: "Todd W" <toddrw69@excite.com>
Subject: Re: PAR gone?
Message-Id: <YdG2f.1221$ny2.696@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com>
"John Bokma" <john@castleamber.com> wrote in message
news:Xns96EBA62337A5castleamber@130.133.1.4...
> http://par.perl.org/
>
> First of all, I am not going into how braindead and clueless someone must
> be who develops software and comes up with a shitty story like "My machine
> crashed".
>
> Anyway: http://web.archive.org/web/20041012035744/par.perl.org/index.cgi
> seems to be *the* place for PAR right now?
>
You can use the wayback machine to browse defunct web sites:
http://www.archive.org/
Here is the par site:
http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://par.perl.org/
Todd W.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 15:14:03 -0700
From: MrReallyVeryNice <MrReallyVeryNice.RemoveNoSPAM@yahoo.RemoveNoSPAM.com>
Subject: Re: Problem signing on to AIM with Net::AOLIM
Message-Id: <a_adnUyRw6YPetfeRVn-iA@comcast.com>
J. Gleixner wrote:
> Rick Sanders wrote:
>
>> J. Gleixner wrote:
>> > Post real code.
>>
>> What do you mean 'post real code'? The code in my post is the same
>> code I am trying to run, except that I have obscured the username and
>> password.
>
>
> Please, cut & paste the code you posted and actually try to run it,
> before asking what 'post real code' means. The code you posted won't
> actually execute, unless you have some weird "Strict.pm" on your system.
Without any Strict.pm on my system (Windows XP / Active State Perl 5.8
build806), "use Strict;" executes.
I might be missing something obvious, in which case I would appreciate
your correction. Please consider the following:
If I execute:
use strict;
use warnings;
$value = 'this and that';
print $value;
As expected I get the following:
Global symbol "$value" requires explicit package name at D:\tt8.pl line 3.
Global symbol "$value" requires explicit package name at D:\tt8.pl line 4.
If I execute:
use StRiCt;
use Warnings;
$value = 'this and that';
print $value;
I get: "this and that". I don't have any StRiCt.pm on my system. Note
that I actually cut/pasted the code provided in the two other examples.
Of course, I always use the lower case "use strict;" and "use warnings;"
in my code. But I believe that other people may make that mistake and
not realize it because they get no warnings and no error messages.
This might simply indicate that the OP is on Windows and not that OP did
not 'post real code'.
Please advise
MrRallyVeryNice
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 22:31:00 GMT
From: Rick Sanders <rfs9999@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Problem signing on to AIM with Net::AOLIM
Message-Id: <EYB2f.1271$y14.359@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>
A. Sinan Unur wrote:
> That should be
> use strict;
> Case matters.
J. Gleixner wrote:
> The code you posted won't actually execute, unless you have some
weird > "Strict.pm" on your system.
I did run it and Perl did not complain about Strict.pm. But you're
right, it should have been "strict". Unfortunately it also doesn't do
the checking that strict should do. So, chastened, I have changed to
"use strict", fixed the errors it reported, and here is what my script
looks like now:
#!/usr/bin/perl -w
use Net::AOLIM;
use strict;
my $user = 'rfsaim';
my $pass = 'aim5052';
my $aim = Net::AOLIM->new(
'username' => $user,
'password' => $pass,
'login_timeout' => 5,
'callback' => \&handler);
unless ($aim->signon) {
my $im_err = $main::IM_ERR;
my $errstr = $Net::AOLIM::ERROR_MSGS{$im_err};
print "Signon failed:$errstr (IM_ERR = $im_err)\n";
exit;
} else {
print "Signon successful\n";
}
sub handler {
print "Do something\n";
}
I still get "Signon failed:Net::AOLIM Error: Login timeout (IM_ERR =
6)". I imagine I am doing something stupid but I can't see it.
Thanks,
Rick
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 22:37:02 GMT
From: Rick Sanders <rfs9999@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Problem signing on to AIM with Net::AOLIM
Message-Id: <i2C2f.1274$y14.1029@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>
> This might simply indicate that the OP is on Windows and not that OP did
> not 'post real code'.
That's correct. Windows XP, ActiveState v5.8.7 (build 813).
-Rick
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 23:00:18 GMT
From: "Bill Segraves" <segraves_f13@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Problem signing on to AIM with Net::AOLIM
Message-Id: <6oC2f.13010$q1.9923@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>
"MrReallyVeryNice" <MrReallyVeryNice.RemoveNoSPAM@yahoo.RemoveNoSPAM.com>
wrote in message news:a_adnUyRw6YPetfeRVn-iA@comcast.com...
<snip>
> Without any Strict.pm on my system (Windows XP / Active State Perl 5.8
> build806), "use Strict;" executes.
>
> I might be missing something obvious, in which case I would appreciate
> your correction. Please consider the following:
>
> If I execute:
>
> use strict;
> use warnings;
> $value = 'this and that';
> print $value;
>
> As expected I get the following:
>
> Global symbol "$value" requires explicit package name at D:\tt8.pl line 3.
> Global symbol "$value" requires explicit package name at D:\tt8.pl line 4.
>
> If I execute:
>
> use StRiCt;
> use Warnings;
> $value = 'this and that';
> print $value;
>
> I get: "this and that". I don't have any StRiCt.pm on my system. Note
> that I actually cut/pasted the code provided in the two other examples.
> Of course, I always use the lower case "use strict;" and "use warnings;"
> in my code. But I believe that other people may make that mistake and
> not realize it because they get no warnings and no error messages.
>
> This might simply indicate that the OP is on Windows and not that OP did
> not 'post real code'.
>
> Please advise
> MrRallyVeryNice
OTOH, if you "execute"
use strict;
use warnings;
use StRiCt;
use Warnings;
$value = 'this and that';
print $value;
you'll get something similar to:
Subroutine bits redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/StRiCt.pm line 101.
Subroutine import redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/StRiCt.pm line 107.
Subroutine unimport redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/StRiCt.pm line 112.
Subroutine bits redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/Warnings.pm line 285.
Subroutine import redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/Warnings.pm line 304.
Subroutine unimport redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/Warnings.pm line 314.
Subroutine __chk redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/Warnings.pm line 325.
Subroutine enabled redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/Warnings.pm line 373.
Subroutine warn redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/Warnings.pm line 386.
Subroutine warnif redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/Warnings.pm line 400.
Global symbol "$value" requires explicit package name at mrreallyverynice.pl
lin
e 6.
Global symbol "$value" requires explicit package name at mrreallyverynice.pl
lin
e 7.
Execution of mrreallyverynice.pl aborted due to compilation errors.
This should tell you that, while Win32 is not case sensitive and ignores
case during compilation, you should not infer that *Perl* ignores case
during execution. Indeed, in the earlier examples, it appears the code for
Strict [sic] and Warnings [sic] is compiled, but not executed, which helps
to explain why the code with misspelled module names compiled and executed,
giving the expected result.
Cheers.
--
Bill Segraves
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 17:35:20 -0700
From: MrReallyVeryNice <MrReallyVeryNice.RemoveNoSPAM@yahoo.RemoveNoSPAM.com>
Subject: Re: Problem signing on to AIM with Net::AOLIM
Message-Id: <jdKdnV6cZpsyldbeRVn-uA@comcast.com>
Bill Segraves wrote:
** snipped content from MrReallyVeryNice **
>
>
> OTOH, if you "execute"
>
> use strict;
> use warnings;
> use StRiCt;
> use Warnings;
> $value = 'this and that';
> print $value;
>
Errors seems to be system specific. With (Windows XP / Active State Perl
5.8 build806), when I "execute" the script that you provided above, I
simply get:
Global symbol "$value" requires explicit package name at D:\tt8.pl line 5.
Global symbol "$value" requires explicit package name at D:\tt8.pl line 6.
Execution of D:\tt8.pl aborted due to compilation errors.
> you'll get something similar to:
>
> Subroutine bits redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/StRiCt.pm line 101.
> Subroutine import redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/StRiCt.pm line 107.
> Subroutine unimport redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/StRiCt.pm line 112.
> Subroutine bits redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/Warnings.pm line 285.
> Subroutine import redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/Warnings.pm line 304.
> Subroutine unimport redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/Warnings.pm line 314.
> Subroutine __chk redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/Warnings.pm line 325.
> Subroutine enabled redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/Warnings.pm line 373.
> Subroutine warn redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/Warnings.pm line 386.
> Subroutine warnif redefined at C:/indigoperl/lib/Warnings.pm line 400.
> Global symbol "$value" requires explicit package name at mrreallyverynice.pl
> lin
> e 6.
> Global symbol "$value" requires explicit package name at mrreallyverynice.pl
> lin
> e 7.
> Execution of mrreallyverynice.pl aborted due to compilation errors.
>
> This should tell you that, while Win32 is not case sensitive and ignores
> case during compilation, you should not infer that *Perl* ignores case
> during execution. Indeed, in the earlier examples, it appears the code for
> Strict [sic] and Warnings [sic] is compiled, but not executed, which helps
> to explain why the code with misspelled module names compiled and executed,
> giving the expected result.
>
Your conclusions seems to be valid with IndigoPerl.
> Cheers.
>
> --
> Bill Segraves
>
>
>
MrReallyVeryNice
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 18:30:48 -0500
From: "Fred@fred.net" <Fred@fred.net>
Subject: re: why the perl docs suck
Message-Id: <8qtlk1ls7mt7rn8n1oof5shfus7igkkld9@4ax.com>
The "old-timers" and other flame prone morons always love to opine:
RTFM
Meaning "read the fucking manual".
Now, when you hear that from someone, it means they are useless.
And you can try and kill file or anything else....
(efBi)
The reason I post thusly: I was helping a new programmer
at work get used to perl. But I had to laugh when we found
this gem in the hallowed "docs";
looking for info on push() we find this helpful entry in
the help files:
push ARRAY,LIST
Treats ARRAY as a stack, and pushes the values of LIST onto the end of
ARRAY. The length of ARRAY increases by the length of LIST. Has the
same effect as
for $value (LIST) {
$ARRAY[++$#ARRAY] = $value;
}
but is more efficient. Returns the new number of elements in the
array.
That's like asking "Hows the weather" and someone begins talking about
the big bang theory. It does not even use push. I don't fucking *want*
to think, I wan't a fucking answer right now! Fucking idots. Let's see
what is the format specifier for printf... let's see it's just like c.
Uhmm... printf("%2.8f",$fux); oh yeah the percent sign.
I did not need to be sent off into oblivion by a manual written by
idiots. I just wanted someone to say "It's the percent sign you
fucking idiot!!"
Right!
Part 1 in a series.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 21:17:51 -0400
From: "Matt Garrish" <matthew.garrish@sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: why the perl docs suck
Message-Id: <1pE2f.3201$S43.297152@news20.bellglobal.com>
<Fred@fred.net> wrote in message
news:8qtlk1ls7mt7rn8n1oof5shfus7igkkld9@4ax.com...
>
> The "old-timers" and other flame prone morons always love to opine:
> RTFM
>
> Meaning "read the fucking manual".
>
> Now, when you hear that from someone, it means they are useless.
> And you can try and kill file or anything else....
> (efBi)
>
> The reason I post thusly: I was helping a new programmer
> at work get used to perl. But I had to laugh when we found
> this gem in the hallowed "docs";
> looking for info on push() we find this helpful entry in
> the help files:
>
I'm still trying to determine what I find most frightening about this post:
that you were hired as a programmer, that you are teaching someone else or
that you had to look up the push function and still couldn't understand it.
It's too bad that you've chosen to be a prick than rather contribute
anything useful. I hope the google archives serve you well...
Matt
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 20:38:39 -0400
From: Sherm Pendley <sherm@dot-app.org>
Subject: Re: why the perl docs suck
Message-Id: <m27jck28hc.fsf@Sherm-Pendleys-Computer.local>
"Fred@fred.net" <Fred@fred.net> writes:
> I don't fucking *want* to think
Then why did you choose a profession that requires thinking?
> I wan't a fucking answer right now!
Hire a consultant.
> Fucking idots.
Kind of ironic to misspell "idiot", isn't it?
> Part 1 in a series.
Thanks for the warning. *plonk*
sherm--
--
Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net
Hire me! My resume: http://www.dot-app.org
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 00:49:51 GMT
From: "A. Sinan Unur" <1usa@llenroc.ude.invalid>
Subject: Re: why the perl docs suck
Message-Id: <Xns96EBD3E8872F0asu1cornelledu@127.0.0.1>
Sherm Pendley <sherm@dot-app.org> wrote in news:m27jck28hc.fsf@Sherm-
Pendleys-Computer.local:
> "Fred@fred.net" <Fred@fred.net> writes:
...
>> I wan't a fucking answer right now!
Is that like "want not"?
...
>> Part 1 in a series.
>
> Thanks for the warning. *plonk*
Welcome to the club ;-)
Sinan
--
A. Sinan Unur <1usa@llenroc.ude.invalid>
(reverse each component and remove .invalid for email address)
comp.lang.perl.misc guidelines on the WWW:
http://mail.augustmail.com/~tadmc/clpmisc/clpmisc_guidelines.html
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 18:59:45 -0600
From: YYusenet <yyusenet@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: why the perl docs suck
Message-Id: <dif2pq$p4e$1@news.xmission.com>
Fred@fred.net wrote:
> ...
> looking for info on push() we find this helpful entry in
> the help files:
>
> push ARRAY,LIST
>
> Treats ARRAY as a stack, and pushes the values of LIST onto the end of
> ARRAY. The length of ARRAY increases by the length of LIST. Has the
> same effect as
>
> for $value (LIST) {
> $ARRAY[++$#ARRAY] = $value;
> }
>
> but is more efficient. Returns the new number of elements in the
> array.
If you are not able to understand this, then maybe you should not be
trying to program Perl. It is explaining exactly what the "push"
function does. If you can think of a better way to explain it, I would
like to hear it.
>
> That's like asking "Hows the weather" and someone begins talking about
> the big bang theory. It does not even use push. I don't fucking *want*
What are you talking about? You asked what the push function did,
and you were told. There were no crazy tangents that were followed
talking about the inner workings of the FTP protocol.
> to think, I wan't a fucking answer right now! Fucking idots. Let's see
What did this information give you besides an answer?
> what is the format specifier for printf... let's see it's just like c.
> Uhmm... printf("%2.8f",$fux); oh yeah the percent sign.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
What are you talking about? I believe that the problem here is not
that the Perl manual "sucks", but that you are not able to understand
it. You obviously are not understanding what it told you (the answer
you are looking for).
>
> I did not need to be sent off into oblivion by a manual written by
> idiots. I just wanted someone to say "It's the percent sign you
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
What is the percent sign? You wanted to find out what the push
function did... and the manual explained that.
> fucking idiot!!"
> Right!
>
> Part 1 in a series.
>
--
k g a b e r t (at) x m i s s i o n (dot) c o m
------------------------------
Date: 6 Apr 2001 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
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Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01)
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------------------------------
End of Perl-Users Digest V10 Issue 8509
***************************************
