[25878] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 8108 Volume: 10
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Tue May 24 06:05:33 2005
Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 03:05:05 -0700 (PDT)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Tue, 24 May 2005 Volume: 10 Number: 8108
Today's topics:
"Incremental" Embedded Perl <guenther.sohler@newlogic.com>
Re: "Incremental" Embedded Perl <spamtrap@dot-app.org>
Re: "Incremental" Embedded Perl <guenther.sohler@newlogic.com>
Emacs modules for Perl programming (Jari Aalto+mail.perl)
Re: Error Handler in Embedded Perl <guenther.sohler@newlogic.com>
Re: input record separator and the modifiers /s and /m. <someone@example.com>
Re: input record separator and the modifiers /s and /m. <joe@inwap.com>
Re: might be OT sendmail script running very slow <usenet@NOSPAM.obantec.net>
Posting Guidelines for comp.lang.perl.misc ($Revision: tadmc@augustmail.com
Re: Question about Modules and Variable Scope <dhannotte@nyc.rr.com>
Re: Question about Modules and Variable Scope <joe@inwap.com>
Re: Strange 'for' behaviour? <tim@vegeta.ath.cx>
Re: Strange 'for' behaviour? <1usa@llenroc.ude.invalid>
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 07:49:46 +0200
From: Guenther Sohler <guenther.sohler@newlogic.com>
Subject: "Incremental" Embedded Perl
Message-Id: <pan.2005.05.24.05.49.45.538050@newlogic.com>
I have an Application using embedded Perl
it works in following steps
1) I allocate and create perl
2) I parse my perl script with the perl interpreter (perl_parse)
3) I definde my own functions using newXS
4) I run the perl script
5) Eventually some perl functions are called from within my c code
which properly do their job - all find
6) My program has the ability to run custom perl scripts. In this case
continue at 2
perl_parse is called again to read in the new perl script
7) Unfortunately all the other context already read is deleted. Varibles,
functions ... that means the fucntions called at 5 will fail
Is it possible to incrementally load perl scripts using perl_parse
eg if I load script1 which defines a=5, I parse and execute it, so a
becomes 5 ; then to parse script2 which prints out a, and then run script2
to see that a is set to 5.
How would it work ? what do I have to do ?
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 02:43:11 -0400
From: Sherm Pendley <spamtrap@dot-app.org>
Subject: Re: "Incremental" Embedded Perl
Message-Id: <p8adneaZW5mdUA_fRVn-vg@adelphia.com>
Guenther Sohler wrote:
> 1) I allocate and create perl
> 2) I parse my perl script with the perl interpreter (perl_parse)
> 3) I definde my own functions using newXS
> 4) I run the perl script
> 5) Eventually some perl functions are called from within my c code
> which properly do their job - all find
>
> 6) My program has the ability to run custom perl scripts. In this case
> continue at 2
> perl_parse is called again to read in the new perl script
>
> 7) Unfortunately all the other context already read is deleted. Varibles,
> functions ... that means the fucntions called at 5 will fail
>
>
> Is it possible to incrementally load perl scripts using perl_parse
> eg if I load script1 which defines a=5, I parse and execute it, so a
> becomes 5 ; then to parse script2 which prints out a, and then run script2
> to see that a is set to 5.
> How would it work ? what do I have to do ?
The details vary according to your specific application, but the gist of
it will usually remain the same: You call perl_parse() and perl_run()
once, as part of creating and initializing the Perl interpreter. After
that, you call one or more of the eval_*() functions as many times as
you need to.
Let's start with the simplest possible Perl program:
char *emb = { "", "-e", "1" };
PerlInterpreter *pi = perl_alloc();
perl_construct(pi);
perl_parse(pi, xs_init, 3, emb, (char**)NULL);
perl_run(pi);
After you've done this, don't release or deallocate the Perl interpreter
you've created here, and don't call perl_parse() or perl_run() again.
Instead, use one of the several eval_*() functions whenever you want to
parse and run any additional Perl code.
For instance:
dTHX;
char *p = get_some_perl_code(); // Assume this reads some Perl
// from a file
SV *result = eval_pv(p, TRUE);
if (SvTRUE(ERRSV)) {
printf("Perl error: %s", SvPV(ERRSV, PL_na));
}
This is roughly equivalent to using eval() to catch errors, and then
checking for $@. You could also allow Perl to die() on errors by passing
FALSE as the second argument to eval_pv().
You could also use one of the other eval_*() functions to call a named
Perl function, a method, or a code ref, instead of passing the Perl code
as a string of text.
If you've gotten this far, I assume you're already quite familiar with
the relevant PODs, but for the sake of the archives:
perlembed Perl ways to embed perl in your C or C++ application
perldebguts Perl debugging guts and tips
perlxstut Perl XS tutorial
perlxs Perl XS application programming interface
perlclib Internal replacements for standard C library functions
perlguts Perl internal functions for those doing extensions
perlcall Perl calling conventions from C
perlapi Perl API listing (autogenerated)
perlintern Perl internal functions (autogenerated)
perliol C API for Perl's implementation of IO in Layers
perlapio Perl internal IO abstraction interface
perlhack Perl hackers guide
This list is taken from 5.8.6 - if you're using an older Perl, it might
not have all of the PODs listed above.
sherm--
--
Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net
Hire me! My resume: http://www.dot-app.org
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 10:28:04 +0200
From: Guenther Sohler <guenther.sohler@newlogic.com>
Subject: Re: "Incremental" Embedded Perl
Message-Id: <pan.2005.05.24.08.28.04.45794@newlogic.com>
On Tue, 24 May 2005 02:43:11 -0400, Sherm Pendley wrote:
It works perfectly, thank you for your help!
------------------------------
Date: 24 May 2005 04:28:03 GMT
From: <jari.aalto <AT> poboxes.com> (Jari Aalto+mail.perl)
Subject: Emacs modules for Perl programming
Message-Id: <perl-faq/emacs-lisp-modules_1116908855@rtfm.mit.edu>
Archive-name: perl-faq/emacs-lisp-modules
Posting-Frequency: 2 times a month
URL: http://tiny-tools.sourceforge.net/
Maintainer: Jari Aalto A T poboxes com
Announcement: "What Emacs lisp modules can help with programming Perl"
Preface
Emacs is your friend if you have to do anything comcerning software
development: It offers plug-in modules, written in Emacs lisp
(elisp) language, that makes all your programmings wishes come
true. Please introduce yourself to Emacs and your programming era
will get a new light.
Where to find Emacs/XEmacs
o Unix:
http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/emacs.html
http://www.xemacs.org/
o Unix Windows port (for Unix die-hards):
install http://www.cygwin.com/ which includes native Emacs 21.x.
and XEmacs port
o Pure Native Windows port
http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/windows/ntemacs.html
ftp://ftp.xemacs.org/pub/xemacs/windows/setup.exe
o More Emacs resources at
http://tiny-tools.sourceforge.net/ => Emacs resource page
Emacs Perl Modules
Cperl -- Perl programming mode
http://www.cpan.org/modules/by-authors/id/ILYAZ/cperl-mode/
http://math.berkeley.edu/~ilya/software/emacs/
by Ilya Zakharevich
CPerl is major mode for editing perl files. Forget the default
`perl-mode' that comes with Emacs, this is much better. Comes
standard in newest Emacs.
TinyPerl -- Perl related utilities
http://tiny-tools.sourceforge.net/
If you ever wonder how to deal with Perl POD pages or how to find
documentation from all perl manpages, this package is for you.
Couple of keystrokes and all the documentaion is in your hands.
o Instant function help: See documentation of `shift', `pop'...
o Show Perl manual pages in *pod* buffer
o Grep through all Perl manpages (.pod)
o Follow POD references e.g. [perlre] to next pod with RETURN
o Coloured pod pages with `font-lock'
o Separate `tiperl-pod-view-mode' for jumping topics and pages
forward and backward in *pod* buffer.
o Update `$VERSION' variable with YYYY.MMDD on save.
o Load source code into Emacs, like Devel::DProf.pm
o Prepare script (version numbering) and Upload it to PAUSE
o Generate autoload STUBS (Devel::SelfStubber) for you
Perl Module (.pm)
TinyIgrep -- Perl Code browsing and easy grepping
[TinyIgrep is included in Tiny Tools Kit]
To grep from all installed Perl modules, define database to
TinyIgrep. There is example file emacs-rc-tinyigrep.el that shows
how to set up dattabases for Perl5, Perl4 whatever you have
installed
TinyIgrep calls Igrep.el to to do the search, You can adjust
recursive grep options, set search case sensitivity, add user grep
options etc.
You can find latest `igrep.el' module at
<http://groups.google.com/groups?group=gnu.emacs.sources> The
maintainer is Jefin Rodgers <kevinr <AT> ihs.com>.
TinyCompile -- To Browse grep results in Emacs *compile* buffer
TinyCompile is a minor mode for *compile* buffer from where
you can collapse unwanted lines or shorten file URLs:
/asd/asd/asd/asd/ads/as/da/sd/as/as/asd/file1:NNN: MATCHED TEXT
/asd/asd/asd/asd/ads/as/da/sd/as/as/asd/file2:NNN: MATCHED TEXT
-->
cd /asd/asd/asd/asd/ads/as/da/sd/as/as/asd/
file1:NNN: MATCHED TEXT
file1:NNN: MATCHED TEXT
End
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 07:42:05 +0200
From: Guenther Sohler <guenther.sohler@newlogic.com>
Subject: Re: Error Handler in Embedded Perl
Message-Id: <pan.2005.05.24.05.42.04.694853@newlogic.com>
On Mon, 23 May 2005 11:08:35 +0000, Anno Siegel wrote:
Hallo Anno,
It works wery fine,
thank you for your help!
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 06:05:47 GMT
From: "John W. Krahn" <someone@example.com>
Subject: Re: input record separator and the modifiers /s and /m.
Message-Id: <%uzke.12151$wr.6662@clgrps12>
jbl wrote:
> I don't use perl everyday, so I seem to get my thinking muddled
> between sessions when it comes to using/changing the input record
> separator and the modifiers /s and /m.
The Input Record Separator $/ involves inputing data from a file. It can
contain either a string or a reference to a number or undef. It cannot
contain a regular expression and has nothing to do with regular expressions.
The /s and /m options define the behavior of regular expressions. The /s
option determines that the . metacharacter matches the newline character as
well as every other character. The /m option determines if the ^ and $
anchors match at line boundaries within a string as determined by the location
of newline characters. They have nothing to do with inputing data from a file.
> I guess that I am trying to state my understanding of this in my own
> words and see from any comments, if I am anywhere close.
>
> Without altering $/ ( input/read file line by line)
>
> neither of the following would have any/much effect
>
> /m ^ and $ match next to embedded \n
>
> (^ and $ would both be useless here as the regex cannot look before
> the start of the line or after the end of the line.)
No. In the case where $/ has the default value of "\n" the ^ and $ anchors
will be unaffected by the presence or absence of the /m option.
> /s Dot (.) matches newline.
>
> same here because there is nothing in $_ except the current line
Without the /s option . will match every character in the line _except_ the
newline at the end of the line. With the /s option . will match _every_
character in the line.
> after using
>
> undef $/; # or some other quantifier like : ,
>
> The entire file is read in as one string, or defined paragraph
>
> The /m modifier asserts that, when used, /^reg.+?exp$/m, simply means
> that the target regexp cannot span across newlines, and that it begins
> immediately following a newline.
Even without the /m option and the ^ and $ anchors it will not "span across
newlines" because nothing in the expression between the anchors will match a
newline.
> The /s modifier asserts that, when used, /^reg.+?exp$/s, the target
> regexp can span newlines but will not either start immediately after a
> newline or end immediately before a newline, as it appears.
Without the /m option the ^ anchor will match at the beginning of the string,
however if the last character in the string is a newline then the $ anchor
will match immediately before it.
> The /sm modifier asserts that, when used, /^reg.+?exp$/sm, the target
> regexp begins immediately following a newline and ends immediately
> before a newline, but can span across multiple newlines
Yes.
> I hear and see the term "multiline mode".
That refers to using the /m option with a regular expression.
> Is this just referring ro
> using undef $/; # or some other quantifier like : , causing input to
> get the whole file or a portion defined by another quantifier, and the
> /s modifier
No.
John
--
use Perl;
program
fulfillment
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 02:41:26 -0700
From: Joe Smith <joe@inwap.com>
Subject: Re: input record separator and the modifiers /s and /m.
Message-Id: <06GdnbnkA9haaw_fRVn-uw@comcast.com>
jbl wrote:
> /s Dot (.) matches newline.
>
> same here because there is nothing in $_ except the current line
That is an incomplete understanding, since $_ usually includes "\n".
The presence or absence of /s determines whether \n is included or
excluded by /.*/.
/^(.*)$/ and print "\$1 = '$1'\n"; # everything but the "\n"
/^(.*)$/s and print "\$1 = '$1'\n"; # everything including "\n"
> The /m modifier asserts that, when used,
When used, /m asserts that ^ will match the beginning of the
string, or immediately after any embedded newline.
Here's an example the prints the first word of each line:
perl -le 'undef $/; $_=<>; print "1=($1)" while /^(\S+)/gm'
/etc/resolv.conf
-Joe
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 09:37:22 +0100
From: "Mark D Smith" <usenet@NOSPAM.obantec.net>
Subject: Re: might be OT sendmail script running very slow
Message-Id: <4292e709$0$22584$da0feed9@news.zen.co.uk>
"Mark Clements" <mark.clementsREMOVETHIS@wanadoo.fr> wrote in message
news:4291befb$0$1242$8fcfb975@news.wanadoo.fr...
> Mark D Smith wrote:
>
> > Hi
> >
> > this might be a sendmail issue but the snippet below is from a script
> > that is used in part of an automated program than ran fine on RH8 but
> > on FC3 takes around 13 seconds from Start of sendmail line to end of
> > sendmail line.
> >
> > my $mailprog = '/usr/sbin/sendmail';
> >
> > print "start of sendmail<br>\n";
> >
> > open (MAIL, "|$mailprog -t -f system-check\@domain.xyz");
> > print MAIL "To: Support <support\@domain.xyz>\n";
> > print MAIL "Cc: Support1 <support1\@domain1.xyz>\n";
> > print MAIL "From: Test Script<server1\@domain.xyz>\n";
> > print MAIL "Subject: mail test\n\n";
> >
> > close(MAIL);
> > print "end of sendmail<br>\n";
> >
> DNS is working correctly on the FC3 system? Can its hostname (or
> whatever sendmail thinks it's called) be resolved by DNS?
>
> What happens if you run sendmail directly?
>
> This is off-topic for this newsgroup (as you have guessed), so I
> suggest that you either post the question in a sendmail group, or you
> can mail me directly, but note my crude address-munging.
>
> Mark
Hi Mark & group
just to let you know it was sendmail. as i use 8.13.1 i added 2 lines the
submit.mc and rebuilt it.
FEATURE(`nocanonify')
define(`confDIRECT_SUBMISSION_MODIFIERS',`C')
Mark
------------------------------
Date: 24 May 2005 07:23:02 GMT
From: tadmc@augustmail.com
Subject: Posting Guidelines for comp.lang.perl.misc ($Revision: 1.5 $)
Message-Id: <4292d655$0$25885$8b463f8a@news.nationwide.net>
Outline
Before posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
Must
- Check the Perl Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
- Check the other standard Perl docs (*.pod)
Really Really Should
- Lurk for a while before posting
- Search a Usenet archive
If You Like
- Check Other Resources
Posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
Is there a better place to ask your question?
- Question should be about Perl, not about the application area
How to participate (post) in the clpmisc community
- Carefully choose the contents of your Subject header
- Use an effective followup style
- Speak Perl rather than English, when possible
- Ask perl to help you
- Do not re-type Perl code
- Provide enough information
- Do not provide too much information
- Do not post binaries, HTML, or MIME
Social faux pas to avoid
- Asking a Frequently Asked Question
- Asking a question easily answered by a cursory doc search
- Asking for emailed answers
- Beware of saying "doesn't work"
- Sending a "stealth" Cc copy
Be extra cautious when you get upset
- Count to ten before composing a followup when you are upset
- Count to ten after composing and before posting when you are upset
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Posting Guidelines for comp.lang.perl.misc ($Revision: 1.5 $)
This newsgroup, commonly called clpmisc, is a technical newsgroup
intended to be used for discussion of Perl related issues (except job
postings), whether it be comments or questions.
As you would expect, clpmisc discussions are usually very technical in
nature and there are conventions for conduct in technical newsgroups
going somewhat beyond those in non-technical newsgroups.
The article at:
http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
describes how to get answers from technical people in general.
This article describes things that you should, and should not, do to
increase your chances of getting an answer to your Perl question. It is
available in POD, HTML and plain text formats at:
http://mail.augustmail.com/~tadmc/clpmisc.shtml
For more information about netiquette in general, see the "Netiquette
Guidelines" at:
http://andrew2.andrew.cmu.edu/rfc/rfc1855.html
A note to newsgroup "regulars":
Do not use these guidelines as a "license to flame" or other
meanness. It is possible that a poster is unaware of things
discussed here. Give them the benefit of the doubt, and just
help them learn how to post, rather than assume
A note about technical terms used here:
In this document, we use words like "must" and "should" as
they're used in technical conversation (such as you will
encounter in this newsgroup). When we say that you *must* do
something, we mean that if you don't do that something, then
it's unlikely that you will benefit much from this group.
We're not bossing you around; we're making the point without
lots of words.
Do *NOT* send email to the maintainer of these guidelines. It will be
discarded unread. The guidelines belong to the newsgroup so all
discussion should appear in the newsgroup. I am just the secretary that
writes down the consensus of the group.
Before posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
Must
This section describes things that you *must* do before posting to
clpmisc, in order to maximize your chances of getting meaningful replies
to your inquiry and to avoid getting flamed for being lazy and trying to
have others do your work.
The perl distribution includes documentation that is copied to your hard
drive when you install perl. Also installed is a program for looking
things up in that (and other) documentation named 'perldoc'.
You should either find out where the docs got installed on your system,
or use perldoc to find them for you. Type "perldoc perldoc" to learn how
to use perldoc itself. Type "perldoc perl" to start reading Perl's
standard documentation.
Check the Perl Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
Checking the FAQ before posting is required in Big 8 newsgroups in
general, there is nothing clpmisc-specific about this requirement.
You are expected to do this in nearly all newsgroups.
You can use the "-q" switch with perldoc to do a word search of the
questions in the Perl FAQs.
Check the other standard Perl docs (*.pod)
The perl distribution comes with much more documentation than is
available for most other newsgroups, so in clpmisc you should also
see if you can find an answer in the other (non-FAQ) standard docs
before posting.
It is *not* required, or even expected, that you actually *read* all of
Perl's standard docs, only that you spend a few minutes searching them
before posting.
Try doing a word-search in the standard docs for some words/phrases
taken from your problem statement or from your very carefully worded
"Subject:" header.
Really Really Should
This section describes things that you *really should* do before posting
to clpmisc.
Lurk for a while before posting
This is very important and expected in all newsgroups. Lurking means
to monitor a newsgroup for a period to become familiar with local
customs. Each newsgroup has specific customs and rituals. Knowing
these before you participate will help avoid embarrassing social
situations. Consider yourself to be a foreigner at first!
Search a Usenet archive
There are tens of thousands of Perl programmers. It is very likely
that your question has already been asked (and answered). See if you
can find where it has already been answered.
One such searchable archive is:
http://groups.google.com/advanced_group_search
If You Like
This section describes things that you *can* do before posting to
clpmisc.
Check Other Resources
You may want to check in books or on web sites to see if you can
find the answer to your question.
But you need to consider the source of such information: there are a
lot of very poor Perl books and web sites, and several good ones
too, of course.
Posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
There can be 200 messages in clpmisc in a single day. Nobody is going to
read every article. They must decide somehow which articles they are
going to read, and which they will skip.
Your post is in competition with 199 other posts. You need to "win"
before a person who can help you will even read your question.
These sections describe how you can help keep your article from being
one of the "skipped" ones.
Is there a better place to ask your question?
Question should be about Perl, not about the application area
It can be difficult to separate out where your problem really is,
but you should make a conscious effort to post to the most
applicable newsgroup. That is, after all, where you are the most
likely to find the people who know how to answer your question.
Being able to "partition" a problem is an essential skill for
effectively troubleshooting programming problems. If you don't get
that right, you end up looking for answers in the wrong places.
It should be understood that you may not know that the root of your
problem is not Perl-related (the two most frequent ones are CGI and
Operating System related), so off-topic postings will happen from
time to time. Be gracious when someone helps you find a better place
to ask your question by pointing you to a more applicable newsgroup.
How to participate (post) in the clpmisc community
Carefully choose the contents of your Subject header
You have 40 precious characters of Subject to win out and be one of
the posts that gets read. Don't waste them. Take care while
composing them, they are the key that opens the door to getting an
answer.
Spend them indicating what aspect of Perl others will find if they
should decide to read your article.
Do not spend them indicating "experience level" (guru, newbie...).
Do not spend them pleading (please read, urgent, help!...).
Do not spend them on non-Subjects (Perl question, one-word
Subject...)
For more information on choosing a Subject see "Choosing Good
Subject Lines":
http://www.cpan.org/authors/id/D/DM/DMR/subjects.post
Part of the beauty of newsgroup dynamics, is that you can contribute
to the community with your very first post! If your choice of
Subject leads a fellow Perler to find the thread you are starting,
then even asking a question helps us all.
Use an effective followup style
When composing a followup, quote only enough text to establish the
context for the comments that you will add. Always indicate who
wrote the quoted material. Never quote an entire article. Never
quote a .signature (unless that is what you are commenting on).
Intersperse your comments *following* each section of quoted text to
which they relate. Unappreciated followup styles are referred to as
"top-posting", "Jeopardy" (because the answer comes before the
question), or "TOFU" (Text Over, Fullquote Under).
Reversing the chronology of the dialog makes it much harder to
understand (some folks won't even read it if written in that style).
For more information on quoting style, see:
http://web.presby.edu/~nnqadmin/nnq/nquote.html
Speak Perl rather than English, when possible
Perl is much more precise than natural language. Saying it in Perl
instead will avoid misunderstanding your question or problem.
Do not say: I have variable with "foo\tbar" in it.
Instead say: I have $var = "foo\tbar", or I have $var = 'foo\tbar',
or I have $var = <DATA> (and show the data line).
Ask perl to help you
You can ask perl itself to help you find common programming mistakes
by doing two things: enable warnings (perldoc warnings) and enable
"strict"ures (perldoc strict).
You should not bother the hundreds/thousands of readers of the
newsgroup without first seeing if a machine can help you find your
problem. It is demeaning to be asked to do the work of a machine. It
will annoy the readers of your article.
You can look up any of the messages that perl might issue to find
out what the message means and how to resolve the potential mistake
(perldoc perldiag). If you would like perl to look them up for you,
you can put "use diagnostics;" near the top of your program.
Do not re-type Perl code
Use copy/paste or your editor's "import" function rather than
attempting to type in your code. If you make a typo you will get
followups about your typos instead of about the question you are
trying to get answered.
Provide enough information
If you do the things in this item, you will have an Extremely Good
chance of getting people to try and help you with your problem!
These features are a really big bonus toward your question winning
out over all of the other posts that you are competing with.
First make a short (less than 20-30 lines) and *complete* program
that illustrates the problem you are having. People should be able
to run your program by copy/pasting the code from your article. (You
will find that doing this step very often reveals your problem
directly. Leading to an answer much more quickly and reliably than
posting to Usenet.)
Describe *precisely* the input to your program. Also provide example
input data for your program. If you need to show file input, use the
__DATA__ token (perldata.pod) to provide the file contents inside of
your Perl program.
Show the output (including the verbatim text of any messages) of
your program.
Describe how you want the output to be different from what you are
getting.
If you have no idea at all of how to code up your situation, be sure
to at least describe the 2 things that you *do* know: input and
desired output.
Do not provide too much information
Do not just post your entire program for debugging. Most especially
do not post someone *else's* entire program.
Do not post binaries, HTML, or MIME
clpmisc is a text only newsgroup. If you have images or binaries
that explain your question, put them in a publically accessible
place (like a Web server) and provide a pointer to that location. If
you include code, cut and paste it directly in the message body.
Don't attach anything to the message. Don't post vcards or HTML.
Many people (and even some Usenet servers) will automatically filter
out such messages. Many people will not be able to easily read your
post. Plain text is something everyone can read.
Social faux pas to avoid
The first two below are symptoms of lots of FAQ asking here in clpmisc.
It happens so often that folks will assume that it is happening yet
again. If you have looked but not found, or found but didn't understand
the docs, say so in your article.
Asking a Frequently Asked Question
It should be understood that you may have missed the applicable FAQ
when you checked, which is not a big deal. But if the Frequently
Asked Question is worded similar to your question, folks will assume
that you did not look at all. Don't become indignant at pointers to
the FAQ, particularly if it solves your problem.
Asking a question easily answered by a cursory doc search
If folks think you have not even tried the obvious step of reading
the docs applicable to your problem, they are likely to become
annoyed.
If you are flamed for not checking when you *did* check, then just
shrug it off (and take the answer that you got).
Asking for emailed answers
Emailed answers benefit one person. Posted answers benefit the
entire community. If folks can take the time to answer your
question, then you can take the time to go get the answer in the
same place where you asked the question.
It is OK to ask for a *copy* of the answer to be emailed, but many
will ignore such requests anyway. If you munge your address, you
should never expect (or ask) to get email in response to a Usenet
post.
Ask the question here, get the answer here (maybe).
Beware of saying "doesn't work"
This is a "red flag" phrase. If you find yourself writing that,
pause and see if you can't describe what is not working without
saying "doesn't work". That is, describe how it is not what you
want.
Sending a "stealth" Cc copy
A "stealth Cc" is when you both email and post a reply without
indicating *in the body* that you are doing so.
Be extra cautious when you get upset
Count to ten before composing a followup when you are upset
This is recommended in all Usenet newsgroups. Here in clpmisc, most
flaming sub-threads are not about any feature of Perl at all! They
are most often for what was seen as a breach of netiquette. If you
have lurked for a bit, then you will know what is expected and won't
make such posts in the first place.
But if you get upset, wait a while before writing your followup. I
recommend waiting at least 30 minutes.
Count to ten after composing and before posting when you are upset
After you have written your followup, wait *another* 30 minutes
before committing yourself by posting it. You cannot take it back
once it has been said.
AUTHOR
Tad McClellan <tadmc@augustmail.com> and many others on the
comp.lang.perl.misc newsgroup.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 07:33:00 GMT
From: "Dean Hannotte" <dhannotte@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Question about Modules and Variable Scope
Message-Id: <MMAke.709$XB2.376051@twister.nyc.rr.com>
Are you implying that I should turn 'config.pl' itself into a module (i.e.
'config.pm') and then issue 'use config;' both in my scripts and from inside
'cms.pm'?
In that case, might it not be easier to merge 'config.pm' and 'cms.pm' into
one file? Thanks!
Dean
"Anno Siegel" <anno4000@lublin.zrz.tu-berlin.de> wrote in message
news:d6sk51$nio$6@mamenchi.zrz.TU-Berlin.DE...
> Dean Hannotte <dhannotte@nyc.rr.com> wrote in comp.lang.perl.misc:
> > I'm writing a content management system and I've put some generally
useful
> > routines into a common library that I invoke by starting my scripts with
> > 'use cms;'. I then use a configuration file to initialize certain global
> > variables by coding 'require config.pl'. The problem is, I can't figure
out
> > how I can get the library routines to see the globals that I've set in
> > 'config.pl'. When I refer to these values from any of the library
routines,
> > their values are undefined. I guess segregating code into a Perl module
puts
> > it into a completely separate namespace.
> >
> > If I code 'require config.pl' from inside 'cms.pm', then the library
sees
> > the values, but the script doesn't! So I guess there's an internal
mechanism
> > to prevent the loading of the same 'require' more than once in the same
run?
> >
> > How can I get the library, 'cms.pm', to see the same values that my
scripts
> > see when they 'require config.pl' without having to pass these values as
> > subroutine parameters? Thanks!
>
> Make config.pl export the variables and import them as needed. The
> variables have to be package variables for that.
>
> perldoc Exporter.
>
> Anno
>
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 03:02:24 -0700
From: Joe Smith <joe@inwap.com>
Subject: Re: Question about Modules and Variable Scope
Message-Id: <QJmdnfrpvasvZg_fRVn-2Q@comcast.com>
Dean Hannotte wrote:
> 'use cms;'. I then use a configuration file to initialize certain global
> variables by coding 'require config.pl'.
Are you aware that 'use' and 'require' occur at
different times during the compilation process?
require 'config.pl'; # This is done *after* the 'use'
use cms; # This is done *before* previous line
BEGIN { print "This runs after 'use' but before 'require'\n"; }
-Joe
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 06:14:51 GMT
From: Tim Hammerquist <tim@vegeta.ath.cx>
Subject: Re: Strange 'for' behaviour?
Message-Id: <slrnd95h72.6o4.tim@vegeta.saiyix>
A. Sinan Unur <1usa@llenroc.ude.invalid> wrote:
> Besides, what you are doing with the loop is seriously ugly:
[ snip ]
> my $asc = join ',', 1999 .. 2005;
> my $dsc = join ',', reverse 1999 .. 2005;
This may even be an occasion to use the old C-style for() loop:
for (my $year = 2005; $year >= 1999; $year++) {...}
While it can be prone to fencepost errors, it's still a valid choice.
Cheers,
Tim Hammerquist
--
Tell Hector it's young filling behind a puddle.
Otherwise the ball in Lisette's lentil might help some empty wrinkles.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 06:18:42 GMT
From: "A. Sinan Unur" <1usa@llenroc.ude.invalid>
Subject: Re: Strange 'for' behaviour?
Message-Id: <Xns9660174CFA794asu1cornelledu@127.0.0.1>
Tim Hammerquist <tim@vegeta.ath.cx> wrote in
news:slrnd95h72.6o4.tim@vegeta.saiyix:
> A. Sinan Unur <1usa@llenroc.ude.invalid> wrote:
>> Besides, what you are doing with the loop is seriously ugly:
> [ snip ]
>> my $asc = join ',', 1999 .. 2005;
>> my $dsc = join ',', reverse 1999 .. 2005;
>
> This may even be an occasion to use the old C-style for() loop:
>
> for (my $year = 2005; $year >= 1999; $year++) {...}
>
> While it can be prone to fencepost errors, it's still a valid choice.
ITYM
for (my $year = 2005; $year >= 1999; $year--) {...}
Sinan
--
A. Sinan Unur <1usa@llenroc.ude.invalid>
(reverse each component and remove .invalid for email address)
comp.lang.perl.misc guidelines on the WWW:
http://mail.augustmail.com/~tadmc/clpmisc/clpmisc_guidelines.html
------------------------------
Date: 6 Apr 2001 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
From: Perl-Users-Request@ruby.oce.orst.edu (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01)
Message-Id: <null>
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------------------------------
End of Perl-Users Digest V10 Issue 8108
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