[24091] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 6285 Volume: 10
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Sun Mar 21 18:05:38 2004
Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:05:07 -0800 (PST)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Sun, 21 Mar 2004 Volume: 10 Number: 6285
Today's topics:
Re: dollar sign and spaces from a string <mr@sandman.net>
Re: dollar sign and spaces from a string (Anno Siegel)
Re: dollar sign and spaces from a string <vetro@online.no>
Re: dollar sign and spaces from a string <vetro@online.no>
Re: dollar sign and spaces from a string <noName@no.spam.please.com>
Re: dollar sign and spaces from a string <tassilo.parseval@rwth-aachen.de>
Re: dollar sign and spaces from a string <tadmc@augustmail.com>
graph smoothing... <bill@gites.org.uk>
Re: How can I get the release number? <Tigerhillsideremove@removenetscape.net>
Re: How can I get the release number? <bik.mido@tiscalinet.it>
how to make tk-window visible (Perl-WinXP) <jwall@t-online.de>
Re: how to make tk-window visible (Perl-WinXP) <kevin@vaildc.net>
Re: open (FAILEHANDLER, ">>$filename") what is the ron <roel-perl@st2x.net>
Re: Problem installing Net::DNS (John Oliver)
Problem with using LWP to download https webpage (Tulip)
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:11:04 +0100
From: Sandman <mr@sandman.net>
Subject: Re: dollar sign and spaces from a string
Message-Id: <mr-D3E277.15110421032004@news.fu-berlin.de>
In article <m3r7vmk0v8.fsf@quimby.dirtyhack.org>,
Vetle Roeim <vetro@online.no> wrote:
> >> I asked for evidence, you give me an anecdote (no news there, I
> >> read this newsgroup too).
> >>
> >> How many newbies are scared off by the elitist attitude of this NG,
> >> and how do you know?
> >
> > I have showed you exactly what I wanted to show and I have no doubt
> > my claim is adequately substantiated.
>
> Although I believe that Kenton _perhaps_ could have been treated a
> little better, your claim is that a lot of newbies are scared
> off. You have only showed us Kenton. Where's the rest of them?
I will counter that with a question. During the time clp.misc has existed, do
you think Kenton is the only one, ever, to have done this?
Mind you, even if you would actually believe this to be the case, I have no
need to substantiate my claim on a semantical level.
> I can understand much of the attitude here, though. Sometimes it
> seems like 90% of the posts here are from people who haven't
> bothered to even pick up a book on Perl.
I don't share that opinion. If 90% of the group bothers you that much - LEAVE.
If you're here to help people and get some help yourself - DO THAT.
There is no reason, and I really mean "no" when I say "no" here, to insult
people just because they haven't learned enough yet when they post here for the
first time.
--
Sandman[.net]
------------------------------
Date: 21 Mar 2004 14:58:53 GMT
From: anno4000@lublin.zrz.tu-berlin.de (Anno Siegel)
Subject: Re: dollar sign and spaces from a string
Message-Id: <c3kajd$44q$1@mamenchi.zrz.TU-Berlin.DE>
Vetle Roeim <vetro@online.no> wrote in comp.lang.perl.misc:
> * mr@sandman.net
> > In article <c3hf1t$d7h$1@mamenchi.zrz.TU-Berlin.DE>,
> >> I asked for evidence, you give me an anecdote (no news there, I
> >> read this newsgroup too).
> >>
> >> How many newbies are scared off by the elitist attitude of this NG,
> >> and how do you know?
> >
> > I have showed you exactly what I wanted to show and I have no doubt
> > my claim is adequately substantiated.
>
> Although I believe that Kenton _perhaps_ could have been treated a
> little better, your claim is that a lot of newbies are scared
> off. You have only showed us Kenton. Where's the rest of them?
The claim really seems to be that _too many_ newbies are scared away,
whatever their number or percentage.
> I can understand much of the attitude here, though. Sometimes it
> seems like 90% of the posts here are from people who haven't
> bothered to even pick up a book on Perl.
It's part of a feedback loop. A high number of newbie posts means less
time for the regulars to deal with each, means less patience with postings
that are a waste of time, means the tone in the group gets rougher, means
newbies are scared away (I'm not denying that) until their number is such
that the group can deal with them. If this group-dynamic process doesn't
work for some reason, the regulars leave and the newsgroup goes to seed
(see alt.perl).
You don't have to like all the consequences, but trying to influence the
process through moral appeals is... well, greetings from King Canute.
The only way to improve the tone on clpm is to join the crew (welcome
to it, by the way :), thus increasing the group's capacity for questions,
and its tolerance for less-than-optimal ones. The occasional scaring-away
comes naturally after a while :)
Anno
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 17:31:38 +0100
From: Vetle Roeim <vetro@online.no>
Subject: Re: dollar sign and spaces from a string
Message-Id: <m3vfky40wl.fsf@quimby.dirtyhack.org>
* mr@sandman.net
> Vetle Roeim <vetro@online.no> wrote:
>> Although I believe that Kenton _perhaps_ could have been treated
>> a little better, your claim is that a lot of newbies are scared
>> off. You have only showed us Kenton. Where's the rest of them?
>
> I will counter that with a question. During the time clp.misc has
> existed, do you think Kenton is the only one, ever, to have done
> this?
No and I don't think he'll be the last.
> Mind you, even if you would actually believe this to be the case, I
> have no need to substantiate my claim on a semantical level.
I'm sorry, but you're the one who said you wouldn't make such a
claim if you couldn't back it up. ;)
>> I can understand much of the attitude here, though. Sometimes it
>> seems like 90% of the posts here are from people who haven't
>> bothered to even pick up a book on Perl.
>
> I don't share that opinion. If 90% of the group bothers you that
> much - LEAVE.
The 10% is too interesting to give it up.
> If you're here to help people and get some help yourself - DO THAT.
Asking people to RTFM or STFW can actually be very helpful. :)
> There is no reason, and I really mean "no" when I say "no" here, to
> insult people just because they haven't learned enough yet when they
> post here for the first time.
Someone have gone to great lenghts to assemble extensive
documentation for Perl, and it's a little insulting when they don't
bother reading *any* of it.
Anyway; I doubt you'll manage to rid USENET of insults, but I'm sure
newbies will appriciate your not-so-insulting answers to their
posts.
--
#!/usr/bin/vr
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 17:41:55 +0100
From: Vetle Roeim <vetro@online.no>
Subject: Re: dollar sign and spaces from a string
Message-Id: <m3fzc240fg.fsf@quimby.dirtyhack.org>
* Anno Siegel
[...]
>>
>> I can understand much of the attitude here, though. Sometimes it
>> seems like 90% of the posts here are from people who haven't
>> bothered to even pick up a book on Perl.
>
> It's part of a feedback loop. A high number of newbie posts means less
> time for the regulars to deal with each, means less patience with postings
> that are a waste of time, means the tone in the group gets rougher, means
> newbies are scared away (I'm not denying that) until their number is such
> that the group can deal with them. If this group-dynamic process doesn't
> work for some reason, the regulars leave and the newsgroup goes to seed
> (see alt.perl).
Btw: wasn't comp.lang.perl.moderated created partly because of
clueless newbies? There's not much traffic there, though. Any
particular reason for that?
[...]
--
#!/usr/bin/vr
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 12:41:41 -0800
From: "Newbie" <noName@no.spam.please.com>
Subject: Re: dollar sign and spaces from a string
Message-Id: <U9udnXpV3KMlmcPdRVn-gg@comcast.com>
>Vetle Roeim <vetro@online.no> wrote in comp.lang.perl.misc:
>> * mr@sandman.net
>> > In article <c3hf1t$d7h$1@mamenchi.zrz.TU-Berlin.DE>,
>> >> I asked for evidence, you give me an anecdote (no news there, I
>> >> read this newsgroup too).
>> >>
>> >> How many newbies are scared off by the elitist attitude of this NG,
>> >> and how do you know?
>> >
>> > I have showed you exactly what I wanted to show and I have no doubt
>> > my claim is adequately substantiated.
>>
>> Although I believe that Kenton _perhaps_ could have been treated a
>> little better, your claim is that a lot of newbies are scared
>> off. You have only showed us Kenton. Where's the rest of them?
>>The claim really seems to be that _too many_ newbies are scared away,
>>whatever their number or percentage.
Count me among the newbies who got scared away! :-) Yes I know, 'good
riddance' is the standard answer... or is it "plonk/ploink"? :-)
>> I can understand much of the attitude here, though. Sometimes it
>> seems like 90% of the posts here are from people who haven't
>> bothered to even pick up a book on Perl.
>It's part of a feedback loop. A high number of newbie posts means less
>time for the regulars to deal with each, means less patience with postings
>that are a waste of time, means the tone in the group gets rougher, means
>newbies are scared away (I'm not denying that) until their number is such
>that the group can deal with them. If this group-dynamic process doesn't
>work for some reason, the regulars leave and the newsgroup goes to seed
>(see alt.perl).
Newbies see that this mailing list is really active, they appreciate the
quick feedback when it is limited to technical responses. At some level, to
the credit of this newsgroup, it is a good source of information and it
became the de-facto place to get answers about Perl. However, to get answers
you are told that you have to 'accept' the insults or less than helpful
sarcasms.
If I may make an analogy, CLPM is like a big 'administrative monopoly' where
you end up in the sitting room. When you post, your number gets called and
you stand up in front of everyone. You are told that you forgot a piece of
information. The guru #1 on a good day provides the answer, on an OK day
provides a good dose of sarcasm and on a bad day starts shooting/shouting to
you all possible names in front of the other people . You, poor newbie,
feel like crap and just try to get to 'justify' your ignorance or your
position. Shame on you if you step out of bound and don't admit that you are
stupid or if you manage to stand your ground. Arguments such as ' but sir,
when I go to administration XYZ, they are nice' or any other arguments are
looked down. You are promptly reminded that this is administration CLPM. On
a very bad day, the guru #2, #3 and #4 to #X, jump up and down, they also
start shooting/shouting at the newbie... and in the process they stop
serving the other requests and generated a lot noise. Whoaoao, everyone
starts to feel better after releasing the buildup tension. Then the fight
goes on for a while... and the newbie leaves. He/she swears to never come
back unless absolutely necessary (the boss says that you MUST use Perl!).
In the end everyone looses when many old timers just pound on a newbie for
not knowing any better.
>You don't have to like all the consequences, but trying to influence the
>process through moral appeals is... well, greetings from King Canute.
Newbies might think differently ... but they sit quiet in the room because
their number is still being called. :-) Maybe their silence is seen as a
sign of approval.
>The only way to improve the tone on clpm is to join the crew (welcome
>to it, by the way :), thus increasing the group's capacity for questions,
>and its tolerance for less-than-optimal ones. The occasional scaring-away
>comes naturally after a while :)
Continuing on my 'administrative analogy'. Sometimes a newbie in the room
decides to stand up and help the poor person who gets mistreated. That
newbie would love to become a guru one day. If they do so and happen to
provide the wrong answer, they also subjects themselves to the ire of the
real gurus. How many times, do you read statments such as 'go learn Perl
before posting a reply' (not the exact terms but close enough). These
newbies were just trying to help... and they end up being stuck in the
middle. They are told to come help, oh wait, we don't need your help, you
don't know enough! While it is often true that they don't know enough,
there are other ways to tell that politely. The best part is that the
newbies don't have a voice in CLPM until they come to help but they are
often discourage to reply/post. If you ask about my contribution to this
group, it is 'zero'. I have contacted people via email directly when
sometimes I have an answer and I know for sure/absolutely sure that it is
correct. I'm no guru but I don't want to subject myself to mistreatment. Why
should I?
I have no war to win/loose by replying. It seems logical to insert my reply
after Anno's. You asked for feedback and I'm providing one "anecdote" to add
to another anecdote. Are there more anecdotes? Any other newbie would like
to share their experience?
BTW, I appreciate the replies of the gurus and I learn a lot here on a good
day. I believe that you are providing a great service to people who have
some level of experience in Perl and know how to ask questions. On the
other hands, CLPM could greatly improve if people added a few 'please',
'thank you', and pointed newbie to the wonderful guidelines. It is that
simple and sometimes silence is better than a 'sarcasm' :
- "You have an error on line X" could be changed to "provide some code and
we will be able to help you"
- "Why don't you bother searching?" could be "Section X of the guidelines
encourages searching before posting" and if you feel good that day, you
could point the newbie to the reference in google of the same topic.
- "Why are you not reading the FAQs" could be a simple "Section Z of the
guidelines encourages reading FAQs before posting" If you feel kind that
day, you could provide the reference to the FAQs.
- "What is your Perl question?" could be changed to "It does not seem to be
a Perl related question"
"Have you read the guidelines" could be changed to "Please refer to section
XXX of the guidelines and post again, provide the guidelines"
"Plonk/ploink" could be a simple silence
While CLPM is not a moderated group, it seems that the guidelines are often
used as a shield to what is 'appropriate'. It would be so great if the
guidelines posted from Tad would contain amendments about proper replies and
behaviors from gurus. Guru, count to 100 before replying. :-) Guru, read
your reply and count to 100 before sending! :-) :-) :-) Sorry, the last 2
sentences are a poor attempt at humor but I'm serious about amending the
guidelines.
Would people really behave the way they do if the questions was asked face
to face by someone/newbie that they care about? Are you saying that you
don't care about the newbies? You might but it is not ovbious. Really, my
comments here pertain to most electronic replies. Via post or mail, one must
absolutely make a point and show that one is right. Wouldn't it be better to
simply smile and remember the days where you were a newbie and thought that
you knew more than you really did?
All the gurus should remember that in many other areas, they are not gurus.
While they claim to have 'thick skins', the replies could lead to believe
that they would be raising hell if they were treated poorly by another
'administrations'. Could Perl be even more successful if CLPM was more
friendly. If you feel overwhelmed by the number of stupid posts, save
yourself a reply, save us from reading a non technical reply (one could
argue that this apply to my reply here :) and just move on to another post.
Final note: English is not my first language. I'm not making any excuse with
this statment. Just keep in mind that sometimes, I have been told that I'm
not using the proper words/nuances. Also, I'm not using a real email
address. I have not attacked anyone here but simply provided a point of
view. I'm sure that you could 'hunt me down' if you wanted to spend the time
or energy. I will not post any reply to my post and add "oil to the fire".
Also, no need to waste precious seconds to add me to your kill file. :-) I'm
back on the watching/reading mode.
>Anno
------------------------------
Date: 21 Mar 2004 22:22:02 GMT
From: "Tassilo v. Parseval" <tassilo.parseval@rwth-aachen.de>
Subject: Re: dollar sign and spaces from a string
Message-Id: <c3l4ia$si0$1@nets3.rz.RWTH-Aachen.DE>
Also sprach Newbie:
> Continuing on my 'administrative analogy'. Sometimes a newbie in the room
> decides to stand up and help the poor person who gets mistreated. That
> newbie would love to become a guru one day. If they do so and happen to
> provide the wrong answer, they also subjects themselves to the ire of the
> real gurus. How many times, do you read statments such as 'go learn Perl
> before posting a reply' (not the exact terms but close enough). These
> newbies were just trying to help... and they end up being stuck in the
> middle. They are told to come help, oh wait, we don't need your help, you
> don't know enough! While it is often true that they don't know enough,
> there are other ways to tell that politely. The best part is that the
> newbies don't have a voice in CLPM until they come to help but they are
> often discourage to reply/post. If you ask about my contribution to this
> group, it is 'zero'. I have contacted people via email directly when
> sometimes I have an answer and I know for sure/absolutely sure that it is
> correct. I'm no guru but I don't want to subject myself to mistreatment. Why
> should I?
But not making posts publicly means that possible mistakes cannot be
corrected by those who maybe know better. I doubt that many people here
withhold advise because they are afraid of being flamed to death by
regulars. They aren't.
The best advise for anyone new to this group or usenet in general is
never to take things personally. Therefore everyone should be encouraged
to post. They shouldn't make wild guesses and speculations in their
answers. But they sure benefit when they try to find an answer for a
question (and trying to verify their would-be advise with the help of
the documentation and the Perl interpreter itself before posting it).
I'll take any bet that follow-ups in case he made a mistake will be
quite civil.
> I have no war to win/loose by replying. It seems logical to insert my reply
> after Anno's. You asked for feedback and I'm providing one "anecdote" to add
> to another anecdote. Are there more anecdotes? Any other newbie would like
> to share their experience?
>
> BTW, I appreciate the replies of the gurus and I learn a lot here on a good
> day. I believe that you are providing a great service to people who have
> some level of experience in Perl and know how to ask questions. On the
> other hands, CLPM could greatly improve if people added a few 'please',
> 'thank you', and pointed newbie to the wonderful guidelines. It is that
> simple and sometimes silence is better than a 'sarcasm' :
> - "You have an error on line X" could be changed to "provide some code and
> we will be able to help you"
Ok, that's a shallow joke that perhaps needs to be replaced by a fresh
and better one. However, it is often a sign that the OP didn't bother to
read the posting guidelines of this group. That he might not have known
about them is hardly an excuse. Whenever entering a new surrounding, it
is better to watch things for a while before making a step forth. If you
don't, well, you risk stepping on some people's toes.
> - "Why don't you bother searching?" could be "Section X of the guidelines
> encourages searching before posting" and if you feel good that day, you
> could point the newbie to the reference in google of the same topic.
> - "Why are you not reading the FAQs" could be a simple "Section Z of the
> guidelines encourages reading FAQs before posting" If you feel kind that
> day, you could provide the reference to the FAQs.
Note that the guidelines don't just "encourage" people to do certain
things. Some are listed as "musts". Looking up the FAQs is one of those.
> Would people really behave the way they do if the questions was asked face
> to face by someone/newbie that they care about? Are you saying that you
> don't care about the newbies? You might but it is not ovbious. Really, my
> comments here pertain to most electronic replies. Via post or mail, one must
> absolutely make a point and show that one is right. Wouldn't it be better to
> simply smile and remember the days where you were a newbie and thought that
> you knew more than you really did?
From a newbieish point of view, that sounds logical. For a regular of
this group (and someone who has probably participated in usenet for many
years), the amount of outright rubbish that gets dumped in here and
elsewhere is painful. There are many ways to deal with it. The easiest
(and worst) way is leaving the group and have more time to spend for
one's family or hobbies. That would render this group possibly a place
with a very nice tone, but not one where you could find those competent
people that used to be the regulars.
> All the gurus should remember that in many other areas, they are not gurus.
> While they claim to have 'thick skins', the replies could lead to believe
> that they would be raising hell if they were treated poorly by another
> 'administrations'. Could Perl be even more successful if CLPM was more
> friendly. If you feel overwhelmed by the number of stupid posts, save
> yourself a reply, save us from reading a non technical reply (one could
> argue that this apply to my reply here :) and just move on to another post.
The reputation of this group for being a hostile place is probably a
good thing. It makes first-time posters a bit more cautious in what they
write (and thus improving the overall quality of the posts). Once they
do that they'll realize that clpm is in fact quite a friendly group.
Tassilo
--
$_=q#",}])!JAPH!qq(tsuJ[{@"tnirp}3..0}_$;//::niam/s~=)]3[))_$-3(rellac(=_$({
pam{rekcahbus})(rekcah{lrePbus})(lreP{rehtonabus})!JAPH!qq(rehtona{tsuJbus#;
$_=reverse,s+(?<=sub).+q#q!'"qq.\t$&."'!#+sexisexiixesixeseg;y~\n~~dddd;eval
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:25:53 -0600
From: Tad McClellan <tadmc@augustmail.com>
Subject: Re: dollar sign and spaces from a string
Message-Id: <slrnc5s5jh.6ih.tadmc@magna.augustmail.com>
Newbie <noName@no.spam.please.com> wrote:
> Newbies see that this mailing list is really active,
This is not a mailing list, this is a Usenet newsgroup.
The dynamic is different in both subtle and obvious ways.
Confusing them is, well, confusing.
> it seems that the guidelines are often
> used as a shield to what is 'appropriate'.
What is seen as appropriate was seen that way before the guidelines existed.
Everything in there applied before they were ever written down.
I just wrote it down so beginners wouldn't have to learn it the hard way,
(because that would likely be "too late", they'd already be auto-ignored).
> poor attempt at humor but I'm serious about amending the
> guidelines.
Post a patch worded exactly as you think it should be,
and the group can discuss it.
> Would people really behave the way they do if the questions was asked face
> to face by someone/newbie that they care about?
Would beginners ask someone to read the docs to them if face to face?
That sword cuts both ways...
> Also, no need to waste precious seconds to add me to your kill file.
I didn't see any rudeness in your post, so there is nothing there
to killfile you over.
--
Tad McClellan SGML consulting
tadmc@augustmail.com Perl programming
Fort Worth, Texas
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 19:26:39 +0100
From: "Bill Parker" <bill@gites.org.uk>
Subject: graph smoothing...
Message-Id: <c3kmp0$bb4$1@news-reader3.wanadoo.fr>
I'm using GD::Graph quite successfully to produce a (temperature by time)
graph.
But it's quite spikey and so I thought I'd overlay it with some sort of
smoothed graph, so's the trend can (well, may be) displayed. But my
statistics knowledge is very rusty now:
So can anyone recommend a method for smoothing out the data into something
"pretty" but with a sound maths or scientific basis behind it? I'd rather to
use a perl module if one exists - as I said, I'm so rusty on what to do with
my data that I'm not sure what to look for in a statistics module of some
sort.
Any help gratefully received etc. etc.
Bill
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 13:32:53 GMT
From: Tigerhillside <Tigerhillsideremove@removenetscape.net>
Subject: Re: How can I get the release number?
Message-Id: <q86r50tnfqmnt90kk6mbmuv3sfctklgc2h@4ax.com>
In comp.lang.perl.misc, Xaonon <xaonon@hotpop.com>, I read and
responded
>Ned i bach <cvfp50tfsvcogkgojcjud2dqi62kllng7f@4ax.com>, Tigerhillside
><Tigerhillsideremove@removenetscape.net> teithant i thiw hin:
>
>> How can I tell what release of perl is on my hosting system?
>> Their documentation says 5.80, but a script I borrowed says that
>> $] says it is 5.008.
>
>That's the same thing. The old version numbering system goes revision
>number, version number / 1000, subversion number / 1000000. For example, on
>my system:
>
> $ perl -v
> This is perl, v5.6.1 built for i586-linux
> [etc...]
>
> $ perl -e 'print "$]\n"'
> 5.006001
Thank you.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 18:27:15 +0100
From: Michele Dondi <bik.mido@tiscalinet.it>
Subject: Re: How can I get the release number?
Message-Id: <53kr50tife9kbinor57r6efa0anstn0lqt@4ax.com>
On 20 Mar 2004 22:33:16 GMT, Xaonon <xaonon@hotpop.com> wrote:
> $ perl -e 'print "$]\n"'
BTW, -l cmd line switch is often quite useful:
perl -le 'print $]'
Michele
--
you'll see that it shouldn't be so. AND, the writting as usuall is
fantastic incompetent. To illustrate, i quote:
- Xah Lee trolling on clpmisc,
"perl bug File::Basename and Perl's nature"
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 19:43:48 +0100
From: "Jochen Wall" <jwall@t-online.de>
Subject: how to make tk-window visible (Perl-WinXP)
Message-Id: <c3knp1$k5$00$1@news.t-online.com>
we are using WinXP-client computers in an OS/2-Server environment.
At userlogon a script "c:\logon.bat" is started.
We use this script to start a perl-script "start perl.exe MyLogonScript.pl".
Both scripts are invisible, that means I can see them in task manager but
on the desktop there are no windows opened.
The logon-client that our company uses seams to start "c:\logon.bat" with
an option like "INVISIBLE" or "NO_WINDOW" or something like that.
All applications (not only perl-scripts) that I start in "c:\logon.bat" are
invisible.
If I try to open a Tk-window in "MyLogonScript" it is also invisible.
The following should display "HELLO WORLD" at the upper side of the desktop.
#! /usr/bin/perl
use Tk;
my $main = MainWindow->new;
$main->Label(-font => "Arial 8",-text => "HELLO WORLD")->pack;
$main->overrideredirect(1);
$main->geometry(($main->screenwidth).'x10+0+0');
$main->MapWindow();
Tk::MainLoop();
If I start this from a dos-prompt it works fine.
Now the question: Is it possible to force the window to be displayed?
Or is it possible to start a subprocess with Win32::Process, that will be
visible?
I want to communicate with the user and I can't do this if all my windows
are invisible!
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 20:10:12 GMT
From: Kevin Michael Vail <kevin@vaildc.net>
Subject: Re: how to make tk-window visible (Perl-WinXP)
Message-Id: <kevin-6B76B0.15101021032004@news.verizon.net>
In article <c3knp1$k5$00$1@news.t-online.com>,
"Jochen Wall" <jwall@t-online.de> wrote:
> we are using WinXP-client computers in an OS/2-Server environment.
> At userlogon a script "c:\logon.bat" is started.
> We use this script to start a perl-script "start perl.exe MyLogonScript.pl".
>
> Both scripts are invisible, that means I can see them in task manager but
> on the desktop there are no windows opened.
> The logon-client that our company uses seams to start "c:\logon.bat" with
> an option like "INVISIBLE" or "NO_WINDOW" or something like that.
> All applications (not only perl-scripts) that I start in "c:\logon.bat" are
> invisible.
>
> If I try to open a Tk-window in "MyLogonScript" it is also invisible.
>
>[snip]
>
> Now the question: Is it possible to force the window to be displayed?
> Or is it possible to start a subprocess with Win32::Process, that will be
> visible?
Try using wperl.exe rather than perl.exe, if you're using ActiveState
(you didn't say). This starts a Perl script without a DOS console. I
don't know that this will work but it's worth a try. Or give
Win32::Process a try--nothing to lose.
> I want to communicate with the user and I can't do this if all my windows
> are invisible!
Well, there's always Morse code via the system speaker. :-)
--
boss, sometimes i think | kevin michael vail
that our friend mehitabel | kevin@vaildc.net
is a trifle too gay |
-- archy | wotthehell wotthehell
------------------------------
Date: 21 Mar 2004 12:06:57 GMT
From: Roel van der Steen <roel-perl@st2x.net>
Subject: Re: open (FAILEHANDLER, ">>$filename") what is the rong with that
Message-Id: <slrnc5r1a8.baf.roel-perl@195-86-124-242.dsl.easynet.nl>
On Sun, 21 Mar 2004 at 09:45 GMT, John W. Krahn <krahnj@acm.org> wrote:
> Roel van der Steen wrote:
>>
>> On Sat, 20 Mar 2004 at 23:29 GMT, Sameh Abdelatef wrote:
>> >
>> > #Turn off Perl buffering
>> > $| = 1;
>> ^^^^^^
>> It turns of buffering on the currently selected filehandle, which
>> is the default STDIN.
>
> Actually, $| has no effect on buffering.
Of course. My comment was rather lousy formulated. Sorry for that.
------------------------------
Date: 21 Mar 2004 18:05:00 GMT
From: joliver@john-oliver.net (John Oliver)
Subject: Re: Problem installing Net::DNS
Message-Id: <slrnc5rma9.l4i.joliver@ns.sdsitehosting.net>
On 20 Mar 2004 07:40:56 GMT, Roel van der Steen wrote:
> On Fri, 19 Mar 2004 at 22:28 GMT, John Oliver <joliver@john-oliver.net> wrote:
>> On 19 Mar 2004 18:38:11 GMT, Roel van der Steen wrote:
>>> On Fri, 19 Mar 2004 at 18:11 GMT, John Oliver <joliver@john-oliver.net> wrote:
>>><lots of dumped screen data snipped>
>>>>
>>>> There is a resolv.conf file, and it does work. This host is not behind
>>>> a firewall. I've asked the admin at that location to double-check the
>>>> router for ACLs, but I really doubt that's the case.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Just installed Net::DNS on my system without problems. Maybe you can
>>> add the line
>>>
>>> $res->debug(1);
>
>> I uncommented $res->debug(1); but still had the same problem. Was there
>> somewhere else in that file that I should add that line?
>>
>
> No, that was a correction interpretation of a somewhat unclear clue. :)
> But my intention was that it would help you to trace what is going on,
> not that it would solve the problem. I expect you get lots of debugging
> output. What does it say?
The exact same result... nothing more, nothing less.
--
* John Oliver http://www.john-oliver.net/ *
* California gun owners - protect your rights and join the CRPA today! *
* http://www.crpa.org/ Free 3 month trial membership available *
* San Diego shooters come to http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sdshooting/ *
------------------------------
Date: 21 Mar 2004 13:25:49 -0800
From: tulipsca04@hotmail.com (Tulip)
Subject: Problem with using LWP to download https webpage
Message-Id: <9d082ffa.0403211325.1fdf1d43@posting.google.com>
Hi All,
This is for my work. Any suggestions or input would be greatly
appreciated.
I've been trying to use LWP module to access an https web and download
a file with no luck so far -- the script works fine for http web,
while it threw out an error for https web -- I worked behind our
company's firewall. So I'd have to use proxy server (I got to know
this while I was debugging my script, it threw out an error message
LWP::UserAgent::_need_proxy: No proxy, so I guess I'd have to use a
proxy for this. But still stumped as the proxy doesn't seem to be
working). Here is my script and the error message I got:
(I'm using perl5.8.0 and it's RedHat Linux 7.2).
===========================
Script
===========================
use HTTP::Request::Common;
use LWP::UserAgent qw($ua);
use LWP::Debug qw(+);
$ua = LWP::UserAgent->new;
$ua->credentials("https://www.XXXX.com/login/log_log_page.jsp:80",
"admin",
"XXX" => "XXX"
); # authentication
$ua->proxy('https'=>"http://XX.XXX.XXX.XXX:8010"); # I'm not sure if
this caused the problem -- I used the server (on which I ran the
script) IP as the proxy;
my $request = HTTP::Request->new(GET =>
"https://www.XXXX.com/XXXinfo/xxxx.jsp"); # this is the file I have
to download for work
my $response = $ua->request($request, "./tmp.txt");
LWP::Debug::conns("Get Response");
print "Response is: ".$response->status_line."\n";
if ($response->is_success) {
print "Successfully updated BIN file: ./tmp.txt\n";
}
else {
$response->status_line;
}
__END__
============
Error Message:
============
LWP::UserAgent::request: Simple response: Internal Server Error
main::fetchBIN: Get Response
Response is: 500 Can't connect to XX.XX.XX.XXX:8010 (connect:
Connection refused)
I read almost all the posts on this forum (related to this topic) and
all the materials that were suggested (like lwp-cookbook, and all docs
for CPAN LWP modules) in the past 3 days, but still couldn't have my
problem solved. Could anybody take a quick look at my following
questions and drop me
an answer? Thanks in advance.
1) Could someone kindly point out my mistakes (if there are any) in
the small script?
2) As I'm a newbie on using perl to handle networking issues and still
trying to figure out which proxy I should use. Does someone know if
it's a MUST to
use a proxy if I wanna access to an https web from behind our
company's firewall? Usually, how do I know which proxy should be
used? Can I check the system settings to track this down or I do have
to contact my system admin for this?
Thanks a lot!
Tulip
------------------------------
Date: 6 Apr 2001 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
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Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01)
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