[23226] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 5447 Volume: 10
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Fri Sep 5 06:10:42 2003
Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2003 03:10:10 -0700 (PDT)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Fri, 5 Sep 2003 Volume: 10 Number: 5447
Today's topics:
Posting Guidelines for comp.lang.perl.misc ($Revision: tadmc@augustmail.com
Re: Redirect stdio into a string (Bryan Castillo)
Re: Silly push tricks <cwilbur@mithril.chromatico.net>
Re: Silly push tricks <abigail@abigail.nl>
Re: Small string problem <kraut@ukrmdotnet.cut>
Re: SORRY! Fax via ISDN-Card, and scanning with multifu <upro@gmx.net>
Re: The life of $! <spikey-wan@bigfoot.com>
Re: <bwalton@rochester.rr.com>
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2003 02:23:21 -0500
From: tadmc@augustmail.com
Subject: Posting Guidelines for comp.lang.perl.misc ($Revision: 1.4 $)
Message-Id: <qrmcnQGoLJx0pMWiXTWJiw@august.net>
Outline
Before posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
Must
- Check the Perl Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
- Check the other standard Perl docs (*.pod)
Really Really Should
- Lurk for a while before posting
- Search a Usenet archive
If You Like
- Check Other Resources
Posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
Is there a better place to ask your question?
- Question should be about Perl, not about the application area
How to participate (post) in the clpmisc community
- Carefully choose the contents of your Subject header
- Use an effective followup style
- Speak Perl rather than English, when possible
- Ask perl to help you
- Do not re-type Perl code
- Provide enough information
- Do not provide too much information
- Do not post binaries, HTML, or MIME
Social faux pas to avoid
- Asking a Frequently Asked Question
- Asking a question easily answered by a cursory doc search
- Asking for emailed answers
- Beware of saying "doesn't work"
- Sending a "stealth" Cc copy
Be extra cautious when you get upset
- Count to ten before composing a followup when you are upset
- Count to ten after composing and before posting when you are upset
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Posting Guidelines for comp.lang.perl.misc ($Revision: 1.4 $)
This newsgroup, commonly called clpmisc, is a technical newsgroup
intended to be used for discussion of Perl related issues (except job
postings), whether it be comments or questions.
As you would expect, clpmisc discussions are usually very technical in
nature and there are conventions for conduct in technical newsgroups
going somewhat beyond those in non-technical newsgroups.
This article describes things that you should, and should not, do to
increase your chances of getting an answer to your Perl question. It is
available in POD, HTML and plain text formats at:
http://mail.augustmail.com/~tadmc/clpmisc.shtml
For more information about netiquette in general, see the "Netiquette
Guidelines" at:
http://andrew2.andrew.cmu.edu/rfc/rfc1855.html
A note to newsgroup "regulars":
Do not use these guidelines as a "license to flame" or other
meanness. It is possible that a poster is unaware of things
discussed here. Give them the benefit of the doubt, and just
help them learn how to post, rather than assume
A note about technical terms used here:
In this document, we use words like "must" and "should" as
they're used in technical conversation (such as you will
encounter in this newsgroup). When we say that you *must* do
something, we mean that if you don't do that something, then
it's unlikely that you will benefit much from this group.
We're not bossing you around; we're making the point without
lots of words.
Do *NOT* send email to the maintainer of these guidelines. It will be
discarded unread. The guidelines belong to the newsgroup so all
discussion should appear in the newsgroup. I am just the secretary that
writes down the consensus of the group.
Before posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
Must
This section describes things that you *must* do before posting to
clpmisc, in order to maximize your chances of getting meaningful replies
to your inquiry and to avoid getting flamed for being lazy and trying to
have others do your work.
The perl distribution includes documentation that is copied to your hard
drive when you install perl. Also installed is a program for looking
things up in that (and other) documentation named 'perldoc'.
You should either find out where the docs got installed on your system,
or use perldoc to find them for you. Type "perldoc perldoc" to learn how
to use perldoc itself. Type "perldoc perl" to start reading Perl's
standard documentation.
Check the Perl Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
Checking the FAQ before posting is required in Big 8 newsgroups in
general, there is nothing clpmisc-specific about this requirement.
You are expected to do this in nearly all newsgroups.
You can use the "-q" switch with perldoc to do a word search of the
questions in the Perl FAQs.
Check the other standard Perl docs (*.pod)
The perl distribution comes with much more documentation than is
available for most other newsgroups, so in clpmisc you should also
see if you can find an answer in the other (non-FAQ) standard docs
before posting.
It is *not* required, or even expected, that you actually *read* all of
Perl's standard docs, only that you spend a few minutes searching them
before posting.
Try doing a word-search in the standard docs for some words/phrases
taken from your problem statement or from your very carefully worded
"Subject:" header.
Really Really Should
This section describes things that you *really should* do before posting
to clpmisc.
Lurk for a while before posting
This is very important and expected in all newsgroups. Lurking means
to monitor a newsgroup for a period to become familiar with local
customs. Each newsgroup has specific customs and rituals. Knowing
these before you participate will help avoid embarrassing social
situations. Consider yourself to be a foreigner at first!
Search a Usenet archive
There are tens of thousands of Perl programmers. It is very likely
that your question has already been asked (and answered). See if you
can find where it has already been answered.
One such searchable archive is:
http://groups.google.com/advanced_group_search
If You Like
This section describes things that you *can* do before posting to
clpmisc.
Check Other Resources
You may want to check in books or on web sites to see if you can
find the answer to your question.
But you need to consider the source of such information: there are a
lot of very poor Perl books and web sites, and several good ones
too, of course.
Posting to comp.lang.perl.misc
There can be 200 messages in clpmisc in a single day. Nobody is going to
read every article. They must decide somehow which articles they are
going to read, and which they will skip.
Your post is in competition with 199 other posts. You need to "win"
before a person who can help you will even read your question.
These sections describe how you can help keep your article from being
one of the "skipped" ones.
Is there a better place to ask your question?
Question should be about Perl, not about the application area
It can be difficult to separate out where your problem really is,
but you should make a conscious effort to post to the most
applicable newsgroup. That is, after all, where you are the most
likely to find the people who know how to answer your question.
Being able to "partition" a problem is an essential skill for
effectively troubleshooting programming problems. If you don't get
that right, you end up looking for answers in the wrong places.
It should be understood that you may not know that the root of your
problem is not Perl-related (the two most frequent ones are CGI and
Operating System related), so off-topic postings will happen from
time to time. Be gracious when someone helps you find a better place
to ask your question by pointing you to a more applicable newsgroup.
How to participate (post) in the clpmisc community
Carefully choose the contents of your Subject header
You have 40 precious characters of Subject to win out and be one of
the posts that gets read. Don't waste them. Take care while
composing them, they are the key that opens the door to getting an
answer.
Spend them indicating what aspect of Perl others will find if they
should decide to read your article.
Do not spend them indicating "experience level" (guru, newbie...).
Do not spend them pleading (please read, urgent, help!...).
Do not spend them on non-Subjects (Perl question, one-word
Subject...)
For more information on choosing a Subject see "Choosing Good
Subject Lines":
http://www.cpan.org/authors/id/D/DM/DMR/subjects.post
Part of the beauty of newsgroup dynamics, is that you can contribute
to the community with your very first post! If your choice of
Subject leads a fellow Perler to find the thread you are starting,
then even asking a question helps us all.
Use an effective followup style
When composing a followup, quote only enough text to establish the
context for the comments that you will add. Always indicate who
wrote the quoted material. Never quote an entire article. Never
quote a .signature (unless that is what you are commenting on).
Intersperse your comments *following* each section of quoted text to
which they relate. Unappreciated followup styles are referred to as
"Jeopardy" (because the answer comes before the question), or
"TOFU".
Reversing the chronology of the dialog makes it much harder to
understand (some folks won't even read it if written in that style).
For more information on quoting style, see:
http://web.presby.edu/~nnqadmin/nnq/nquote.html
Speak Perl rather than English, when possible
Perl is much more precise than natural language. Saying it in Perl
instead will avoid misunderstanding your question or problem.
Do not say: I have variable with "foo\tbar" in it.
Instead say: I have $var = "foo\tbar", or I have $var = 'foo\tbar',
or I have $var = <DATA> (and show the data line).
Ask perl to help you
You can ask perl itself to help you find common programming mistakes
by doing two things: enable warnings (perldoc warnings) and enable
"strict"ures (perldoc strict).
You should not bother the hundreds/thousands of readers of the
newsgroup without first seeing if a machine can help you find your
problem. It is demeaning to be asked to do the work of a machine. It
will annoy the readers of your article.
You can look up any of the messages that perl might issue to find
out what the message means and how to resolve the potential mistake
(perldoc perldiag). If you would like perl to look them up for you,
you can put "use diagnostics;" near the top of your program.
Do not re-type Perl code
Use copy/paste or your editor's "import" function rather than
attempting to type in your code. If you make a typo you will get
followups about your typos instead of about the question you are
trying to get answered.
Provide enough information
If you do the things in this item, you will have an Extremely Good
chance of getting people to try and help you with your problem!
These features are a really big bonus toward your question winning
out over all of the other posts that you are competing with.
First make a short (less than 20-30 lines) and *complete* program
that illustrates the problem you are having. People should be able
to run your program by copy/pasting the code from your article. (You
will find that doing this step very often reveals your problem
directly. Leading to an answer much more quickly and reliably than
posting to Usenet.)
Describe *precisely* the input to your program. Also provide example
input data for your program. If you need to show file input, use the
__DATA__ token (perldata.pod) to provide the file contents inside of
your Perl program.
Show the output (including the verbatim text of any messages) of
your program.
Describe how you want the output to be different from what you are
getting.
If you have no idea at all of how to code up your situation, be sure
to at least describe the 2 things that you *do* know: input and
desired output.
Do not provide too much information
Do not just post your entire program for debugging. Most especially
do not post someone *else's* entire program.
Do not post binaries, HTML, or MIME
clpmisc is a text only newsgroup. If you have images or binaries
that explain your question, put them in a publically accessible
place (like a Web server) and provide a pointer to that location. If
you include code, cut and paste it directly in the message body.
Don't attach anything to the message. Don't post vcards or HTML.
Many people (and even some Usenet servers) will automatically filter
out such messages. Many people will not be able to easily read your
post. Plain text is something everyone can read.
Social faux pas to avoid
The first two below are symptoms of lots of FAQ asking here in clpmisc.
It happens so often that folks will assume that it is happening yet
again. If you have looked but not found, or found but didn't understand
the docs, say so in your article.
Asking a Frequently Asked Question
It should be understood that you may have missed the applicable FAQ
when you checked, which is not a big deal. But if the Frequently
Asked Question is worded similar to your question, folks will assume
that you did not look at all. Don't become indignant at pointers to
the FAQ, particularly if it solves your problem.
Asking a question easily answered by a cursory doc search
If folks think you have not even tried the obvious step of reading
the docs applicable to your problem, they are likely to become
annoyed.
If you are flamed for not checking when you *did* check, then just
shrug it off (and take the answer that you got).
Asking for emailed answers
Emailed answers benefit one person. Posted answers benefit the
entire community. If folks can take the time to answer your
question, then you can take the time to go get the answer in the
same place where you asked the question.
It is OK to ask for a *copy* of the answer to be emailed, but many
will ignore such requests anyway. If you munge your address, you
should never expect (or ask) to get email in response to a Usenet
post.
Ask the question here, get the answer here (maybe).
Beware of saying "doesn't work"
This is a "red flag" phrase. If you find yourself writing that,
pause and see if you can't describe what is not working without
saying "doesn't work". That is, describe how it is not what you
want.
Sending a "stealth" Cc copy
A "stealth Cc" is when you both email and post a reply without
indicating *in the body* that you are doing so.
Be extra cautious when you get upset
Count to ten before composing a followup when you are upset
This is recommended in all Usenet newsgroups. Here in clpmisc, most
flaming sub-threads are not about any feature of Perl at all! They
are most often for what was seen as a breach of netiquette. If you
have lurked for a bit, then you will know what is expected and won't
make such posts in the first place.
But if you get upset, wait a while before writing your followup. I
recommend waiting at least 30 minutes.
Count to ten after composing and before posting when you are upset
After you have written your followup, wait *another* 30 minutes
before committing yourself by posting it. You cannot take it back
once it has been said.
AUTHOR
Tad McClellan <tadmc@augustmail.com> and many others on the
comp.lang.perl.misc newsgroup.
------------------------------
Date: 4 Sep 2003 23:46:19 -0700
From: rook_5150@yahoo.com (Bryan Castillo)
Subject: Re: Redirect stdio into a string
Message-Id: <1bff1830.0309042246.18666c77@posting.google.com>
pkent <pkent77tea@yahoo.com.tea> wrote in message news:<pkent77tea-427292.23411004092003@usenet.force9.net>...
> In article <368466cc.0309032208.4af16e6@posting.google.com>,
> neruson_newsletter@yahoo.ca (Initial-N) wrote:
>
> > How to catch all stdio output into a string?
> > I am using system() to call a external tool (exe), with some
> > arguments. Just doing so, it will print out all lot of data (which I
> > need to process it within the script). I wonder how I can catch all
> > the stdio ouput and redirect them into a string so that I can parse
> > it.
>
> It sounds like you want the backticks or qx() operator. This returns the
> output of the command, like:
>
> my $x = `ls`;
> print length $x;
>
> prints 46 just now.
>
If there is alot of data to be processed it might me better
(more efficient) to open a pipe.
use strict;
use warnings;
use IO::File;
print "Listening ports: ";
my $proc = IO::File->new("netstat -a |") || die;
while (my $line = <$proc>) {
if ($line =~ /TCP\s+\S+:(\S+)\s+\S+\s+LISTENING/) {
print $1, " ";
}
}
print "\n";
$proc->close;
Both, my example and the examples using backticks `'s assume you only
want STDOUT. If you want STDERR (since it looks like you are using
windows - the reference to exe) you may have to look at IPC::Open3.
I don't think <some command> 2>&1 | would work on windows.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2003 04:42:54 GMT
From: Charlton Wilbur <cwilbur@mithril.chromatico.net>
Subject: Re: Silly push tricks
Message-Id: <878yp45p03.fsf@mithril.chromatico.net>
>>>>> "A" == Abigail <abigail@abigail.nl> writes:
A> So, the "there is more than one way of doing it" is just a
A> marketing slogan, because in reality, there's just one way of
A> doing it, and alternatives are "bad style"?
No. There is frequently more than one way to do it, but not all of
them are equally good for all situations. There are numerous sorting
algorithms; does this mean that bogosort is as good a way of sorting a
list as mergesort? This is why a broad variety of approaches is
valuable, and I don't think that pointing out that a particular
approach is badly suited for the task at hand is in conflict with
TMTOWTDI.
A> In perl6, there won't be a 'foreach' keyword. Oh my! You will
A> be programming in bad style!
Well, for one, I probably won't be programming in perl6 at all; by the
time it arrives, I'll be in another career entirely, but that's
largely irrelevant to the world at large.
For another, the point of considering style in the first place is to
get the point of the code across to the reader or readers of the code.
If there are multiple possible ways to express something, then the
programmer ought to choose the clearest way; not doing so is poor
style. At the same time, good style varies across languages: things
that are perfectly idiomatic in C are poor style in Perl, for
instance; perl6 is going to be substantially different from perl5, and
will almost certainly have different stylistic criteria as well.
Charlton
--
cwilbur at chromatico dot net
cwilbur at mac dot com
------------------------------
Date: 05 Sep 2003 09:09:23 GMT
From: Abigail <abigail@abigail.nl>
Subject: Re: Silly push tricks
Message-Id: <slrnblgkm3.6g7.abigail@alexandra.abigail.nl>
Charlton Wilbur (cwilbur@mithril.chromatico.net) wrote on MMMDCLVII
September MCMXCIII in <URL:news:878yp45p03.fsf@mithril.chromatico.net>:
-- >>>>> "A" == Abigail <abigail@abigail.nl> writes:
--
-- A> So, the "there is more than one way of doing it" is just a
-- A> marketing slogan, because in reality, there's just one way of
-- A> doing it, and alternatives are "bad style"?
--
-- No. There is frequently more than one way to do it, but not all of
-- them are equally good for all situations. There are numerous sorting
-- algorithms; does this mean that bogosort is as good a way of sorting a
-- list as mergesort?
What does that have to do with it? Is the running time of map {} of
a different magnitude than for ()? If you want to make an analogy
with sorting, it's more "Heapsort is bad style, it's obfuscating.
You should use mergesort instead".
-- This is why a broad variety of approaches is
-- valuable, and I don't think that pointing out that a particular
-- approach is badly suited for the task at hand is in conflict with
-- TMTOWTDI.
Could you point out why it's badly suited? Does it take significantly
more code to do the same?
-- A> In perl6, there won't be a 'foreach' keyword. Oh my! You will
-- A> be programming in bad style!
--
-- Well, for one, I probably won't be programming in perl6 at all; by the
-- time it arrives, I'll be in another career entirely, but that's
-- largely irrelevant to the world at large.
--
-- For another, the point of considering style in the first place is to
-- get the point of the code across to the reader or readers of the code.
-- If there are multiple possible ways to express something, then the
-- programmer ought to choose the clearest way; not doing so is poor
-- style.
Agreed. All I do is to object to the notion that "map" is unclear while
"foreach" with the same block isn't.
Abigail
--
END {print "Hacker\n"}
INIT {print "Perl " }
BEGIN {print "Just " }
CHECK {print "another "}
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 5 Sep 2003 10:49:49 +0100
From: "PeterT" <kraut@ukrmdotnet.cut>
Subject: Re: Small string problem
Message-Id: <bj9m7q$l8k$1@news.ox.ac.uk>
"David Oswald"
> "PeterT"
> > I'm trying to extract the numerical part and the letter part of a short
> > string.
> >
> > i.e.
> >
> > $mix = "6KL" --> $num = "6" and $let = "KL"
> >
> > I can't find a way to do it with split, or substr
> >
> > anybody can give me a clue? ;-)
>
> As your problem expanded with your understanding of how matching works,
you
> probably came up with the following regexp already, but if not, here it
is:
>
>
> my ( $num, $let ) = $mix =~ m/(\d+)(.+)/;
>
> This tells the regexp engine to match all digits at the beginning of the
> string (one or more), and to match everything else (one or more). I make
the
> assumption that there will always be digits, and there will always be
> something following the digits.
>
> Note that this will fail on the following situation: If the string
consists
> of "1111", you will get 111 as the number and 1 as the remainder. Why?
> Because we've told '.' that it has to match something. You could avoid
this
> by saying .* instead of .+.
Thanks a lot, which goes to everybody who replied and gave me good advice,
I've succesfully managed to get my script to do what I want.
--
petert
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 05 Sep 2003 10:11:25 +0200
From: upro <upro@gmx.net>
Subject: Re: SORRY! Fax via ISDN-Card, and scanning with multifunctional device
Message-Id: <87u17rr6xe.fsf@lux99.localhost>
SORRY SORRY, ACCIDENTALLY POSTED TO THE WRONG GROUP!
upro <upro@gmx.net> writes:
> Hi there!
>
> Some 10 days ago I convinced a Windows hardliner to switch to Linux
> completely!
>
> Basically he was pissed off by virusses (I think he got SOBIG or
> something similar). I got him to by a pack of SuSE 8.1 and installed
> it for him.
>
> I myself do use Slackware, since years, and I love it because of ots
> ease, clarity and because of the absence of anything line linuxconf or
> yast, tools which INHO never really do what they should. linuxconf was
> real crap until I stopped to use RedHat at the company (7.0
> then). yast/yast2 seems better, and anyway there's no other way for a
> newbie who doesn't want to get into linux computing, but who wants to
> remain a plain "user". So I am not really proficient in the SuSE
> way...
>
> Well, so far everything works for him: Banking, printing, DSL
> internet, e-mail, DVD, TV etc. but he needs two more things: fax and
> scanning.
>
> Now this is a prob for me, because he has a somewhat strange config:
>
> He has no modem, only an ISDN card, and he uses a HP OfficeJet (I
> think the model is K60 or similar, I don't have it in fromt of me. DId
> I mention my froend is some 800 km away?)
>
> I installed efax, and he has also hylafax. I have no clue how to get
> this ISDN card to send faxes. No ISDN at my place, no DSL, no
> multifunctional device etc.
>
> I also do have no clue about how to get scaning to work with his
> OfficeJet. Yast searches for USB os SCSI scanners, but his device is
> connected via parport, as it is a parallel printer...
>
> Any help in getting his fax and scanner to work is greatly
> appreciated!
>
> Hope to hear from ya!
--
Michael
r-znvy: zvpunry.wryqra jro.qr (chg gur "@" jurer vg svgf...)
ab fcnz cyrnfr
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2003 12:58:42 +0100
From: "Richard S Beckett" <spikey-wan@bigfoot.com>
Subject: Re: The life of $!
Message-Id: <bj79g3$4a0$1@newshost.mot.com>
Hmmm, nice.
Thanks.
--
R.
GPLRank +79.699
"James Willmore" <jwillmore@cyberia.com> wrote in message
news:e0160815.0309031438.4d1d42cc@posting.google.com...
> "Richard S Beckett" <spikey-wan@bigfoot.com> wrote in message
news:<bii3i0$8mg$1@newshost.mot.com>...
> > Guys,
> >
> > How long does $! live for after the event, as it were?
>
> Short answer: until the next event that populates '$!'.
> Long answer: '$!' holds the OS error. So, until an OS error occurs,
> this is undef. When an OS error occurs (ex file not found), it is
> populated with the error (FYI: there's a 'hack' to change the
> "English" error into a numeric equivlent - $!+0 - ex.
> open(F,"duh.txt") or die $!+0,"\n";). Unless you do something with
> it, it will be replaced the next time there is an OS error.
>
> That's my limited understanding of the whole thing :)
>
> >
> > For example, in the code snippet below, do I need to assign $! to
> > $error_text on the second line, or can I use $! on the 8th line, and
still
> > get the correct error?
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > R.
> >
> > copy ("$source", "$dest") or do {
> >
> > my $error_text = $!; # -----> Do I really need to do this?
> >
> > my $error_window = $main_window -> DialogBox (
> > -title => "$title - Error!",
> > -buttons=>["OK"]);
> > my $text = $error_window -> Label (-text=>
> > "\nERROR: Cannot backup file!\n\n".
> >
> > "$error_text\n", # ------> Could I use $! here?
> >
> > )
> > ->pack;
> > $error_window -> bell;
> > $error_window->Show();
> > }
>
> Ugh! Use Tk::ErrorDialog and Tk::Error instead of 'rolling your own'
> error dialog. It handles errors, IMHO, much better than I ever could.
> For example:
> ##untested##
> #!/usr/bin/perl -w
>
> use strict;
> use Tk;
> require Tk::ErrorDialog;
>
> my $mw = new MainWindow();
> #generate an error by calling to subroutine
> open_file();
> MainLoop;
>
> sub open_file{
> #notice the die statement
> #we have 2 flavors: a message going to STDOUT and an error
> #dialog being displayed
> open(FILE,"duh.txt")
> or die "File error: $!",$mw->Tk::Error("Can't open file\n$!\n");
> my @file = <FILE>;
> close FILE;
> }
>
> HTH
>
> Jim
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2003 01:59:56 GMT
From: Bob Walton <bwalton@rochester.rr.com>
Subject: Re:
Message-Id: <3F18A600.3040306@rochester.rr.com>
Ron wrote:
> Tried this code get a server 500 error.
>
> Anyone know what's wrong with it?
>
> if $DayName eq "Select a Day" or $RouteName eq "Select A Route") {
(---^
> dienice("Please use the back button on your browser to fill out the Day
> & Route fields.");
> }
...
> Ron
...
--
Bob Walton
------------------------------
Date: 6 Apr 2001 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
From: Perl-Users-Request@ruby.oce.orst.edu (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01)
Message-Id: <null>
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End of Perl-Users Digest V10 Issue 5447
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