[22091] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 4313 Volume: 10
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Thu Dec 26 03:05:38 2002
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 00:05:08 -0800 (PST)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Perl-Users Digest Thu, 26 Dec 2002 Volume: 10 Number: 4313
Today's topics:
Re: help missing module <bwalton@rochester.rr.com>
Re: Is there a perl command equivalent to su - user ? (Anno Siegel)
Re: Is there a perl command equivalent to su - user ? <spamtrap@bd-home-comp.no-ip.org>
Re: Is there a perl command equivalent to su - user ? <mlaks2000@nospam.yahoo.com>
Re: Is there something obviously wrong w/ my script? <spamtrap@bd-home-comp.no-ip.org>
Re: Is there something obviously wrong w/ my script? <xaran73@hotmail.com>
Re: Perl Vs PHP <comdog@panix.com>
The Superiority of PHP over Perl (Egg Troll)
Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl <uri@stemsystems.com>
Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl <spamtrap@bd-home-comp.no-ip.org>
Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl <cybear@pacbell.net>
Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl <mgjv@tradingpost.com.au>
Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl <spamtrap@bd-home-comp.no-ip.org>
Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl <cybear@pacbell.net>
Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl <spamtrap@bd-home-comp.no-ip.org>
Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl <goldbb2@earthlink.net>
Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl <steven.smolinski@sympatico.ca>
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 03:47:26 GMT
From: Bob Walton <bwalton@rochester.rr.com>
Subject: Re: help missing module
Message-Id: <3E0A7BB1.2050506@rochester.rr.com>
jaster wrote:
> Happy holiday to everyone.
> I'm using RH7.2 w/ Perl 5.6.1 but now if I " use Digest::MD5 " I get an
> error module not found. I installed perl-Digest-2.20 and my rpm -qa perl*
> shows the module is installed. Any idea what I need to do to fix this
> problem? Thanks for all help.
Are you sure that it isn't Digest-MD5-2.20 that you want?
--
Bob Walton
------------------------------
Date: 26 Dec 2002 01:19:50 GMT
From: anno4000@lublin.zrz.tu-berlin.de (Anno Siegel)
Subject: Re: Is there a perl command equivalent to su - user ?
Message-Id: <audlfm$htv$1@mamenchi.zrz.TU-Berlin.DE>
According to Mitchell Laks <mlaks2000@yahoo.com>:
> Is there a perl command equivalent to su - user ?
> I am configuring many linux computers and automating the process with
> perl.
> I can do it - but perhaps there is "another way to do it" thats
> prettier.
> Some of the setup steps are done as root, and some (that involve a
> postgresql database) can not be done as root, rather as a regular
> user.
If you are running under root, you can change the effective userid
through Perl's $> variable. (You can also change the real userid ($<),
but then you won't be able to switch back to root.) Whether that will
convince your database that you are the right user must be seen.
Anno
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 03:49:31 GMT
From: bd <spamtrap@bd-home-comp.no-ip.org>
Subject: Re: Is there a perl command equivalent to su - user ?
Message-Id: <s3udua-ekm.ln@ID-151211.user.cis.dfn.de>
Anno Siegel wrote:
> According to Mitchell Laks <mlaks2000@yahoo.com>:
>> Is there a perl command equivalent to su - user ?
>> I am configuring many linux computers and automating the process with
>> perl.
>> I can do it - but perhaps there is "another way to do it" thats
>> prettier.
>> Some of the setup steps are done as root, and some (that involve a
>> postgresql database) can not be done as root, rather as a regular
>> user.
>
> If you are running under root, you can change the effective userid
> through Perl's $> variable. (You can also change the real userid ($<),
> but then you won't be able to switch back to root.) Whether that will
> convince your database that you are the right user must be seen.
>
> Anno
There's probably a flag that can be passed to the database.
--
Replace spamtrap with bd to reply.
War is never imperative.
-- McCoy, "Balance of Terror", stardate 1709.2
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 07:20:05 GMT
From: Mitchell Laks <mlaks2000@nospam.yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Is there a perl command equivalent to su - user ?
Message-Id: <F4yO9.88919$_S2.26010@nwrddc01.gnilink.net>
> Anno Siegel wrote:
>
>> According to Mitchell Laks <mlaks2000@yahoo.com>:
>> If you are running under root, you can change the effective userid
>> through Perl's $> variable. (You can also change the real userid ($<),
>> but then you won't be able to switch back to root.) Whether that will
>> convince your database that you are the right user must be seen.
>>
>> Anno
>
bd wrote:
> There's probably a flag that can be passed to the database.
Thanks for the suggestions. I tried the $> variable setting, and it didn't
work, because Postgres rejected me as root, however with setting the
$< variable as well it worked. Unfortunately, as Anno pointed out, then I am
locked in to being the nonsuperuser...
Interesting is that the script
open(CREATEUSER,"|su - postgres");
print CREATEUSER "createuser wustl\n";
print CREATEUSER "y\n";
print CREATEUSER "y\n";
print CREATEUSER "pg_ctl reload \n";
close(CREATEUSER);
works perfectly.
Wait a second - I can fork off a process and then do this combined $<, $>
trick for the child process which will then end and continue as root for
the main process!!!! let me try it! COOL! THANKS everyone!!!!
Mitchell
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 03:49:32 GMT
From: bd <spamtrap@bd-home-comp.no-ip.org>
Subject: Re: Is there something obviously wrong w/ my script?
Message-Id: <u6udua-ekm.ln@ID-151211.user.cis.dfn.de>
C:\ wrote:
> Script (count.pl):
>
> $FileToGet = $ENV{'QUERY_STRING'};
> $FileToGet =~ s/^\//http:\/\/$ENV{'HTTP_HOST'}\//g;
> print "Location:$FileToGet\n\n";
>
> Simple, right?
>
> I point a browser to the script:
> /cgi-bin/count.pl?/files/file.zip
> and file.zip is supposed to appear for download.
CGI is OT for this group.
> Problem:
> _Some_ files refuses to work. Instead, I get a download of count.pl
>
> It works if I:
> A) Move count.pl to anoter folder, say /cgi-bin/counter/count.pl
> B) Change name for the "problem file(s)": CTemp30.zip -> CTemp31.zip
>
> My system is Apache 2.0.43 and ActivePerl 5.6, on WinXPP
Probably the directory in question is not marked for CGI execution. Also,
you should use the CGI module to get the command-line information.
--
Replace spamtrap with bd to reply.
Between infinite and short there is a big difference.
-- G.H. Gonnet
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 07:43:16 GMT
From: "C:\\" <xaran73@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Is there something obviously wrong w/ my script?
Message-Id: <Xns92F058B614D7Cxaran73hotmailcom@195.67.237.53>
bd <spamtrap@bd-home-comp.no-ip.org> wrote in
news:u6udua-ekm.ln@ID-151211.user.cis.dfn.de:
> CGI is OT for this group.
Oh? I didn't realize.
Sorry.
Thanks a/w.
--
C:\Magnus
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 22:17:29 -0800
From: brian d foy <comdog@panix.com>
Subject: Re: Perl Vs PHP
Message-Id: <251220022217293018%comdog@panix.com>
In article <au8ksl$92h$1@newsreader.mailgate.org>, Kasp
<kasp@NO_SPAMepatra.com> wrote:
> I would like to know your opinion on whether Perl or PHP is better?
better for what?
define your task before you pick your tools.
--
brian d foy, comdog@panix.com
------------------------------
Date: 25 Dec 2002 16:25:59 -0800
From: eggtroll@yahoo.com (Egg Troll)
Subject: The Superiority of PHP over Perl
Message-Id: <4e2f159f.0212251625.702cd571@posting.google.com>
Hello Usenet,
Recently I've had a chance to do some web design with PHP. Previously
I'd used Perl because I'd heard from many people that Perl was the end
all and be all of scripting languages for the web. Imagine my suprise
to discover that PHP was vastly superior! I know this is a bold
statement, but I have solid arguements to support it.
Before I begin, let me just clarify something. I'm not arguing that
PHP is better than Perl in all cases. There is certainly still a use
for Perl. Also, PHP isn't perfect but it does manage to fix many of
the shortcomings I've had with Perl. Here are a few of the things I've
noticed about PHP. Finally, I'm not the most talented Perl programmer
out there. I generally prefer to use the vastly superior Python, but
can use Perl if I have to.
* Ease of use. After about a day I had an excellent understanding of
both PHP and SQL. I was able to get a stable, useable and presentable
website up within 24 hours of reading the basics of PHP. Learning Perl
took me weeks and I'm still not even as good with it as I am with PHP.
I would definitely not recommend anyone new to programming begin with
Perl.
* The OO of PHP is excellent. In my experience, it rivals Smalltalk.
We all know that Perl's OO still needs work (whether or not OO is all
that great is another discussion.) Hopefully Perl will be patched up
so it supports such must-have OO features like introspection,
reflection, self-replication and ontological data-points.
* Outstanding database support. PHP supports virtually every DB under
the sun (although Berkeley DB is missing, oddly enough.) Perl seems
limited to MySQL and PostgreSQL, and its really a kludge for the
later. I've heard that this will be fixed in upcoming versions of Perl
though.
* Speed. PHP is one of the fastest languages I've ever used. While it
won't be replacing assembly or C, its definitely faster than Perl in
almost every case, particularly in regex which has long been Perl's
strongest point. I'm sure there are cases where Perl is equal to PHP,
but I can't think of any at the moment.
* Portability. I can take PHP code off my Linux box and plop it onto
an IIS server, or even one of those new Macintosh servers and have it
run without having to change a single line of code. Try doing this
with Perl! Its as though it was written in assembly, Perl requires
that much rewriting.
* Graphics. PHP comes with a nice little graphics library. While I
wouldn't use its to code the new Doom (VB would be a better choice)
its adequate for most web pages, and should be considered as a
substitute for Flash for certain things. Perl lacks a graphics library
of any kind.
* Data Structures. Under PHP you can create any type of datastructure
you need: Linked lists, binary trees, hash tables, queues, inverse
Reiser-biased recursion trees, etc. Under Perl you're extremely
limited in what you can do. This is because Perl isn't OO (so you
can't create Node classes, for example, usefull in a linked list) and
because it lacks pointers. Some of you may notice that PHP lacks
pointers, but look deeper! Behind the scenes, hidden from the user
pointers are used. Because of this, PHP can support complex data
structures.
Again this is just my experience. I don't mean to offend any Perl
coders because Perl was an excellent language. However, in certain
cases it may behoove one to write the back end in PHP instead of Perl.
Merry Kwanza!
Egg Troll
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 00:31:12 GMT
From: Uri Guttman <uri@stemsystems.com>
Subject: Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl
Message-Id: <x7d6npaaen.fsf@mail.sysarch.com>
go away. you have no clue about anything you babbled about.
--
Uri Guttman ------ uri@stemsystems.com -------- http://www.stemsystems.com
----- Stem and Perl Development, Systems Architecture, Design and Coding ----
Search or Offer Perl Jobs ---------------------------- http://jobs.perl.org
Damian Conway Perl Classes - January 2003 -- http://www.stemsystems.com/class
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 01:14:30 GMT
From: bd <spamtrap@bd-home-comp.no-ip.org>
Subject: Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl
Message-Id: <j3ldua-gcm.ln@ID-151211.user.cis.dfn.de>
Egg Troll wrote:
> Hello Usenet,
>
> Recently I've had a chance to do some web design with PHP. Previously
> I'd used Perl because I'd heard from many people that Perl was the end
> all and be all of scripting languages for the web. Imagine my suprise
> to discover that PHP was vastly superior! I know this is a bold
> statement, but I have solid arguements to support it.
You have crossposted your reply to many irrelevant groups. It really only
belongs in comp.lang.php and comp.lang.perl.misc. Why are you putting it in
a C newsgroup?
--
Replace spamtrap with bd to reply.
To follow foolish precedents, and wink
With both our eyes, is easier than to think.
- William Cowper
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 01:23:33 GMT
From: cybear <cybear@pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl
Message-Id: <pSsO9.4967$PN.164636721@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com>
Egg Troll wrote:
> Hello Usenet,
>
> Recently I've had a chance to do some web design with PHP. Previously
> I'd used Perl because I'd heard from many people that Perl was the end
> all and be all of scripting languages for the web. Imagine my suprise
> to discover that PHP was vastly superior! I know this is a bold
> statement, but I have solid arguements to support it.
>
I like using PHP as a web scripting language, BUT, web scripting is NOT
the only scripting that is done. Perl works well for all my other
scripting language. If a person wants to learn just one scripting
language to do everything, Perl wins.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 12:41:40 +1100
From: Martien Verbruggen <mgjv@tradingpost.com.au>
Subject: Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl
Message-Id: <slrnb0knik.4tt.mgjv@martien.heliotrope.home>
On Thu, 26 Dec 2002 01:23:33 GMT,
cybear <cybear@pacbell.net> wrote:
> Egg Troll wrote:
>
>> Hello Usenet,
>>
>> Recently I've had a chance to do some web design with PHP. Previously
>> I'd used Perl because I'd heard from many people that Perl was the end
>> all and be all of scripting languages for the web. Imagine my suprise
>> to discover that PHP was vastly superior! I know this is a bold
>> statement, but I have solid arguements to support it.
>>
>
> I like using PHP as a web scripting language, BUT, web scripting is NOT
> the only scripting that is done. Perl works well for all my other
> scripting language. If a person wants to learn just one scripting
> language to do everything, Perl wins.
Don't respond to this troll.
Martien
--
| Yes; Windows is great for running &
Martien Verbruggen | developing viruses, for instance. It's also
| very popular, but then again, so is the
| common cold. -- Dave Hinz
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 03:39:31 GMT
From: bd <spamtrap@bd-home-comp.no-ip.org>
Subject: Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl
Message-Id: <ohtdua-ekm.ln@ID-151211.user.cis.dfn.de>
Martien Verbruggen wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Dec 2002 01:23:33 GMT,
> cybear <cybear@pacbell.net> wrote:
>> Egg Troll wrote:
>>
>>> Hello Usenet,
>>>
>>> Recently I've had a chance to do some web design with PHP. Previously
>>> I'd used Perl because I'd heard from many people that Perl was the end
>>> all and be all of scripting languages for the web. Imagine my suprise
>>> to discover that PHP was vastly superior! I know this is a bold
>>> statement, but I have solid arguements to support it.
>>>
>>
>> I like using PHP as a web scripting language, BUT, web scripting is NOT
>> the only scripting that is done. Perl works well for all my other
>> scripting language. If a person wants to learn just one scripting
>> language to do everything, Perl wins.
>
> Don't respond to this troll.
>
> Martien
I fail to see how it's a troll. It's an informed opinion. You may not agree
with it. If so, please state your reasons. Don't just accuse them of being
a troll.
--
Replace spamtrap with bd to reply.
Reporter: "How did you like school when you were growing up, Yogi?"
Yogi Berra: "Closed."
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 03:41:47 GMT
From: cybear <cybear@pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl
Message-Id: <%TuO9.1139$Xp3.244@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com>
Martien Verbruggen wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Dec 2002 01:23:33 GMT,
> cybear <cybear@pacbell.net> wrote:
>> Egg Troll wrote:
>>
>>> Hello Usenet,
>>>
>>> Recently I've had a chance to do some web design with PHP. Previously
>>> I'd used Perl because I'd heard from many people that Perl was the end
>>> all and be all of scripting languages for the web. Imagine my suprise
>>> to discover that PHP was vastly superior! I know this is a bold
>>> statement, but I have solid arguements to support it.
>>>
>>
>> I like using PHP as a web scripting language, BUT, web scripting is NOT
>> the only scripting that is done. Perl works well for all my other
>> scripting language. If a person wants to learn just one scripting
>> language to do everything, Perl wins.
>
> Don't respond to this troll.
Don't tell me what to do.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 03:49:31 GMT
From: bd <spamtrap@bd-home-comp.no-ip.org>
Subject: Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl
Message-Id: <11udua-ekm.ln@ID-151211.user.cis.dfn.de>
Egg Troll wrote:
> (so you
> can't create Node classes, for example, usefull in a linked list)
Why would you need a linked list, when you can do essentially everything
that can be done with a linked list with perl's array? See the
documentation for array slices and the 'delete' function.
--
Replace spamtrap with bd to reply.
Thank you for observing all safety precautions.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 23:47:18 -0500
From: Benjamin Goldberg <goldbb2@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl
Message-Id: <3E0A89D6.518125D2@earthlink.net>
Egg Troll wrote:
[snip]
> * Ease of use. After about a day I had an excellent understanding of
> both PHP and SQL. I was able to get a stable, useable and presentable
> website up within 24 hours of reading the basics of PHP. Learning Perl
> took me weeks and I'm still not even as good with it as I am with PHP.
> I would definitely not recommend anyone new to programming begin with
> Perl.
Perl has a long, shallow learning curve. I learned to do basic things
within a day of starting out.
> * The OO of PHP is excellent. In my experience, it rivals
> Smalltalk. We all know that Perl's OO still needs work (whether or not
> OO is all that great is another discussion.) Hopefully Perl will be
> patched up so it supports such must-have OO features like
> introspection, reflection, self-replication and ontological
> data-points.
Perl's OO already supports introspection, reflection, and
self-replication to a degree.
For introspection/reflection, one can use the UNIVERSAL:: methods "can"
and "isa"; also, one can look at the @ISA tree of a class directly, and
the %SymbolTable:: of a class directly.
For self-replication, you have to write a constructor which somehow
supports it. E.g., one could write:
sub clone {
my $oldself = shift;
my %newself = %{ $oldself };
return bless \%newself, ref $oldself;
}
> * Outstanding database support. PHP supports virtually every DB
> under the sun (although Berkeley DB is missing, oddly enough.) Perl
> seems limited to MySQL and PostgreSQL, and its really a kludge for the
> later. I've heard that this will be fixed in upcoming versions of Perl
> though.
Perl supports, through the DBI module, a whole slew of relational
databases. ADO, ASAny (Adaptive Server Anywhere), Adabas, DB2, Empress,
EmpressNet, Fulcrum, Illustra, Informix, Informix4, InterBase, JDBC,
LDAP, ODBC, Ovrimos (aka Altera), PostgreSQL, PrimeBase, QBase, SQLite,
SearchServer, Solid, Sprite, Sybase, Teradata, Unify, XBase, and MySQL.
There are also modules for using CSV files and Excel files as databases.
> * Speed. PHP is one of the fastest languages I've ever used.
> While it won't be replacing assembly or C, its definitely faster than
> Perl in almost every case, particularly in regex which has long been
> Perl's strongest point. I'm sure there are cases where Perl is equal
> to PHP, but I can't think of any at the moment.
Do you have benchmarks on this? In particular, since PHP is generally
embeded in the server (eg, the mod_php apache module), make sure that
the perl script that you compare it to is run similarly (mod_php).
> * Portability. I can take PHP code off my Linux box and plop it
> onto an IIS server, or even one of those new Macintosh servers and
> have it run without having to change a single line of code. Try doing
> this with Perl!
I've never had a problem with this. It's possible to go out of your way
to write *unportable* code, of course, but writing portable code isn't
the least bit difficult.
> Its as though it was written in assembly, Perl requires that much
> rewriting.
Any chance you could show me a perl program which requires such
modifications (other than binmode(filehandle), that is) when moving it
from one machine to another?
> * Graphics. PHP comes with a nice little graphics library. While
> I wouldn't use its to code the new Doom (VB would be a better choice)
> its adequate for most web pages, and should be considered as a
> substitute for Flash for certain things. Perl lacks a graphics library
> of any kind.
What about the GD and ImageMagik modules?
> * Data Structures. Under PHP you can create any type of datastructure
> you need: Linked lists, binary trees, hash tables, queues, inverse
> Reiser-biased recursion trees, etc.
Perl's builtin 'array' data structure can perform most of the functions
of a linked list, and all of the functions of a queue, since it's
implemented as a dequeue (you can perform O(1) push, pop, shift, and
unshift operations on it).
Perl has a builtin hash function.
One can *easily* use hashrefs or arrayrefs the same way that you would
use pointers to structs, in C -- and of course with that, you can build
any kind of tree you want.
> Under Perl you're extremely limited in what you can do.
Pff.
> This is because Perl isn't OO (so you can't create Node classes, for
> example, usefull in a linked list) and because it lacks pointers.
You seem to completely forgotten about Perl's references. These do all
the things that pointers do, with the big bonus of being garbage
collected for you.
See perldoc perlref
> Some of you may notice that PHP lacks pointers, but look deeper!
> Behind the scenes, hidden from the user pointers are used. Because of
> this, PHP can support complex data structures.
Perl's reference types are right up front where users can use them
easily -- this makes complex data structures in perl easy to build.
See perldoc perldsc
--
$..='(?:(?{local$^C=$^C|'.(1<<$_).'})|)'for+a..4;
$..='(?{print+substr"\n !,$^C,1 if $^C<26})(?!)';
$.=~s'!'haktrsreltanPJ,r coeueh"';BEGIN{${"\cH"}
|=(1<<21)}""=~$.;qw(Just another Perl hacker,\n);
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 06:03:41 GMT
From: Steven Smolinski <steven.smolinski@sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: The Superiority of PHP over Perl
Message-Id: <1ZwO9.7266$%R6.235142@news20.bellglobal.com>
Note:
>Newsgroups: alt.chinchilla,comp.lang.php,comp.lang.perl.misc,comp.lang.c,comp.os.linux.advocacy
alt.chinchilla! clc!
Benjamin Goldberg <goldbb2@earthlink.net> wrote:
> Egg Troll wrote:
> [snip]
[all snipped]
YHBT.
Steve
--
Steven Smolinski => http://arbiter.ca/
GnuPG Public Key => http://arbiter.ca/steves_public_key.txt
=> or email me with 'auto-key' in the subject.
Key Fingerprint => 08C8 6481 3A7B 2A1C 7C26 A5FC 1A1B 66AB F637 495D
------------------------------
Date: 6 Apr 2001 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
From: Perl-Users-Request@ruby.oce.orst.edu (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 6 Apr 01)
Message-Id: <null>
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------------------------------
End of Perl-Users Digest V10 Issue 4313
***************************************
