[16176] in Perl-Users-Digest
Perl-Users Digest, Issue: 3588 Volume: 9
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Mon Jul 10 18:18:41 2000
Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2000 15:18:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: Perl-Users Digest <Perl-Users-Request@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU>
To: Perl-Users@ruby.OCE.ORST.EDU (Perl-Users Digest)
Message-Id: <963267508-v9-i3588@ruby.oce.orst.edu>
Content-Type: text
Perl-Users Digest Mon, 10 Jul 2000 Volume: 9 Number: 3588
Today's topics:
One easy question! <d98_rli@telge.kth.se>
Re: One easy question! (Tad McClellan)
Re: One easy question! <iltzu@sci.invalid>
Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system <zef@zefnet.com>
Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system (zawy)
Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system <thunderbear@bigfoot.com>
Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system (Randal L. Schwartz)
Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system (Abigail)
Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system (brian d foy)
Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system <tony_curtis32@yahoo.com>
Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system (Bart Lateur)
Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system (zawy)
Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system <gellyfish@gellyfish.com>
Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system <gellyfish@gellyfish.com>
Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system <gellyfish@gellyfish.com>
Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system (Nobody)
Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system <danny@lennon.postino.com>
Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system <iltzu@sci.invalid>
operator lt <simanek@uiuc.edu>
Re: operator lt <care227@attglobal.net>
Re: operator lt <qvaff@hotmail.com>
Re: operator lt (brian d foy)
OT: Jobs <info@REMOVEaiuk.net>
Re: OT: Jobs (Bernard El-Hagin)
Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 16 Sep 99) (Perl-Users-Digest Admin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2000 13:33:26 +0200
From: Rikard Lindstrom <d98_rli@telge.kth.se>
Subject: One easy question!
Message-Id: <3969B486.E68D759F@telge.kth.se>
Hi!
I've made a simple perl script that takes text from a textarea in a
form. And then write that text to a textfile, called news.txt.
Well the problem I encountered was, that a linefeed (<enter>) result in
a "^M" in the textfile. Now I wonder if I can search through that
textfile and replace all "^M" with a "<BR>", so when I look at the file
(in my browser) there should be a linefeed.
(I've made a script that reads the textfile and prints it, so I can see
the result.)
This is a bit of my code, that wont work as I want to :
---
open (DATA, $news) or die "Cant' open news file";
while ($text = <DATA>)
{
if ($text =~ /\^M$/) { chop ($text); } # "^M" at the end of the
line, is the expression right ?
@array = $text; #could I use things like : @array++ = $text; ?
}
close (DATA);
open (DATA, ">$news"); #overwrite the file with @array
print DATA "@array";
close(DATA);
---
But the problem here, i think, is that @array gets overwritten all the
time by $text. I want to store each word/character or whatever in the
arrayindexes, and then overwrite the old file with the new one.
And I also dont know if chop really erases "^M", !?..
Could someone help me ? (I've tried look for documentation over the net,
but I havn't found that help I need.. Maybe you can help me ? ).
Thanks / Rikard the newbie.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2000 08:12:59 -0400
From: tadmc@metronet.com (Tad McClellan)
Subject: Re: One easy question!
Message-Id: <slrn8mjfeb.tf8.tadmc@magna.metronet.com>
On Mon, 10 Jul 2000 13:33:26 +0200, Rikard Lindstrom <d98_rli@telge.kth.se> wrote:
>Well the problem I encountered was, that a linefeed (<enter>) result in
^^^^^^^^
>a "^M" in the textfile.
^^
^M is a "carriage return", not a "linefeed".
ASCII defines separate characters for each.
>Now I wonder if I can search through that
>textfile and replace all "^M" with a "<BR>", so when I look at the file
>(in my browser) there should be a linefeed.
perl -pe 's/\015/<BR>/g' file1.html file2.html ...
> @array = $text; #could I use things like : @array++ = $text; ?
push @array, $text; # perldoc -f push
--
Tad McClellan SGML Consulting
tadmc@metronet.com Perl programming
Fort Worth, Texas
------------------------------
Date: 10 Jul 2000 14:03:46 GMT
From: Ilmari Karonen <iltzu@sci.invalid>
Subject: Re: One easy question!
Message-Id: <963236110.23377@itz.pp.sci.fi>
In article <3969B486.E68D759F@telge.kth.se>, Rikard Lindstrom wrote:
>Subject: Re: One easy question!
Rather more than one, I'd say. I've seen two so far, one here and one
in c.l.p.modules. Please don't do that. If you must post to multiple
groups, list them all in the Newsgroups: line of a _single_ message.
>This is a bit of my code, that wont work as I want to :
You don't show how your code starts. I hope it's like this:
#!/usr/bin/perl -w
use strict;
>open (DATA, $news) or die "Cant' open news file";
Good enough, but you should include $! in the error message so that
you'll know what caused the failure. And please don't use DATA for
your own filehandles, it's a special filehandle opened by perl.
> while ($text = <DATA>)
> {
> if ($text =~ /\^M$/) { chop ($text); } # "^M" at the end of the line, is the expression right ?
If the lines contained a literal '^M' (two characters), then sure.
But I bet they actually have a single Ctrl-M character. And that chop
is probably not going to remove what you want. This will:
$text =~ s/\cM$//;
> @array = $text; #could I use things like : @array++ = $text; ?
Neither one works. Use:
push @array, $text;
(Okay, you could say $array[@array] = $text, but that's just silly..)
> }
> close (DATA);
>
>open (DATA, ">$news"); #overwrite the file with @array
You forgot the error message this time.
>print DATA "@array";
That will insert spaces at the start of every line except the first.
You probably want:
print DATA @array;
>close(DATA);
Okay, now that you've done it the hard - or at least verbose - way,
this is how I'd do in one shell command line:
perl -pi -e 'tr/\cM//d' news.txt
That does the same as your (corrected) code above. But that's not
what you said you originally wanted:
>a "^M" in the textfile. Now I wonder if I can search through that
>textfile and replace all "^M" with a "<BR>", so when I look at the file
>(in my browser) there should be a linefeed.
Interpreting that literally, the code would become:
perl -pi -e 's/\cM/<BR>/g' news.txt
But while this may work for you, I wouldn't rely on it. You see, the
precence of those Ctrl-M's - better known as carriage returns - is an
accidental side-effect. The fact that they happen to be right where
you want to put your BR tags is just a coincidence.
So you really have two tasks. Removing any extra carriage returns,
and inserting BR tags at ends of lines. I'd use separate statements
for each of them:
perl -pi -e 'tr/\cM//d; s/$/<BR>/' news.txt
This will work even if there _are_ no Ctrl-M's, in which case the
first statement is simply a no-op.
Now you may wonder how I know all that. The answer is simple: by
reading the documentation. If you have perl, you already have all the
documentation on your computer. Just type "perldoc perldoc" at your
shell prompt.
Alternatively you can find the documentation on the WWW by using your
favorite search engine, or you may wish to buy a book or two to carry
around - I'd recommend _Learning Perl_ and _Programming Perl_ from
O'Reilly, but there are other good books out there too. Unfortunately
there are also quite a few totally crappy Perl books. If you search
the archives of this newsgroup at http://www.deja.com/ or
http://www.remarq.com/ , you'll find some good recommendations.
--
Ilmari Karonen - http://www.sci.fi/~iltzu/
"The screwdriver *is* the portable method." -- Abigail
Please ignore Godzilla and its pseudonyms - do not feed the troll.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 4 Jul 2000 12:19:00 +0200
From: "Zef Hemel" <zef@zefnet.com>
Subject: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system
Message-Id: <8jsdns$p1$1@info.service.rug.nl>
I have been developing a Bulletin Board for a while, and I decided I want it
to be Open Source software now, so I need some perl programmers to continue
developing this Board. It's called YaBB (Yet another Bulletin Board), and
it's located at: http://www.yabb.com.ru
Read my post about it:
http://www.yabb.com.ru/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=general&action=display&num=11
Thank you,
Zef Hemel
--
.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.
Zef Hemel
zef@zefnet.com
ICQ# 61109769
.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.
http://www.significon.com.ru
http://www.zefnet.com
http://www.redirectionguide.net
http://www.yabb.com.ru
.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.
Question: What's the best way to use Frontpage?
Answer: Start > Settings > Control Panel >
Add/Remove Programs > Microsoft FrontPage >
Add/Remove > Yes
.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.-'-.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 04 Jul 2000 13:05:57 GMT
From: zawy@yahoo.com (zawy)
Subject: Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system
Message-Id: <3961e111.5583408@news.mindspring.com>
As Abigail said recently, it's Perl, not PERL, because the Gods of
Perl decided it would be too simple to make an acronym follow the
rules of all other acronyms. They're elitists. They place barriers
up to newcomers. "Programming Perl" is a great example. "Let's block
new people (those who haven't hacked Unix for 5 or 10 years) from
wanting and being able to learn the language." It had to be a
conscious effort. "Programming Perl" achieves its objectives too well.
The elitists are complacent about the web. It's beneath them. They
would rather let PHP (not Php) make web programming (i.e. 90% of the
programming world's future) easy to use. Remember assembly? 10 years
from now: "Remember Perl?" The only question is, will it be LAMP
(the P doesn't stand for Perl) or Micro$oft? LAMP=Linux, Apache,
MySQL, PHP
Perl is like a camel, and it loves its image and its art. PHP is like
100 million Indian programmers wanting to add database capabilities to
the web,and it doesn't care about its image or its art. With XML,
it'll make the web a database. CGI made Perl known to the masses.
Perl made PHP a necessity.
But PHP borrowed so much from Perl, maybe the future PHP crowd will
bleed over enough to Perl to keep it alive.
But maybe I've got it all wrong and Perl just isn't capable of making
web programming as easy as PHP makes it. Maybe they're not elitists.
Maybe they're just stuck with an old tool.
Perl is like an expensive 10-speed. High-entry cost, old farts love
them, and the seat rides high off the ground making it harder to learn
and less useful for the slow speeds - and giving an aire of
superiority. PHP is like a cheap mountian bike. Low cost, easier to
learn, and about to be very popular with the kids.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 04 Jul 2000 15:41:54 +0200
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Thorbj=F8rn?= Ravn Andersen <thunderbear@bigfoot.com>
Subject: Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system
Message-Id: <3961E9A2.D6261F67@bigfoot.com>
zawy wrote:
> But maybe I've got it all wrong and Perl just isn't capable of making
> web programming as easy as PHP makes it. Maybe they're not elitists.
> Maybe they're just stuck with an old tool.
Perl is a tool. PHP is a tool.
Being a craftsman, means knowing all the tools available to
you and choosing the right for the task at hand.
--
Thorbjørn Ravn Andersen "...plus...Tubular Bells!"
http://bigfoot.com/~thunderbear
------------------------------
Date: 04 Jul 2000 07:36:01 -0700
From: merlyn@stonehenge.com (Randal L. Schwartz)
Subject: Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system
Message-Id: <m1n1jy6jzi.fsf@halfdome.holdit.com>
>>>>> "zawy" == zawy <zawy@yahoo.com> writes:
zawy> But PHP borrowed so much from Perl, maybe the future PHP crowd will
zawy> bleed over enough to Perl to keep it alive.
PHP is fine for small- and medium-sized programs because it stole
the parts of Perl that are good for those sizes. However, PHP hasn't
(yet) stolen the parts of Perl that work well with large programs.
So, program in PHP as much as you want. It was designed to be simple
for beginners.
But remember, PHP is "training wheels without the bicycle".
If you want something that takes a little more effort to begin with,
but pays off when you cross that 500-line threshold, or when you
finally start doing something other than web pages, start with Perl.
--
Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095
<merlyn@stonehenge.com> <URL:http://www.stonehenge.com/merlyn/>
Perl/Unix/security consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc.
See PerlTraining.Stonehenge.com for onsite and open-enrollment Perl training!
------------------------------
Date: 04 Jul 2000 14:31:46 EDT
From: abigail@delanet.com (Abigail)
Subject: Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system
Message-Id: <slrn8m4ce8.59a.abigail@alexandra.delanet.com>
Zef Hemel (zef@zefnet.com) wrote on MMCDXCIX September MCMXCIII in
<URL:news:8jsdns$p1$1@info.service.rug.nl>:
[] I have been developing a Bulletin Board for a while, and I decided I want it
[] to be Open Source software now, so I need some perl programmers to continue
[] developing this Board.
As opposed to needing Tcl programmers for Closed Source software?
Your request doesn't make sense. You need to hire programmers if you
have a task that you cannot, or will not, do yourself. Whether it's
closed or open source is completely irrelevant.
However, programmers are not to be fished for here. Use an appropriate
.jobs group.
Abigail
--
echo "==== ======= ==== ======"|perl -pes/=/J/|perl -pes/==/us/|perl -pes/=/t/\
|perl -pes/=/A/|perl -pes/=/n/|perl -pes/=/o/|perl -pes/==/th/|perl -pes/=/e/\
|perl -pes/=/r/|perl -pes/=/P/|perl -pes/=/e/|perl -pes/==/rl/|perl -pes/=/H/\
|perl -pes/=/a/|perl -pes/=/c/|perl -pes/=/k/|perl -pes/==/er/|perl -pes/=/./;
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 04 Jul 2000 14:35:29 -0400
From: brian@smithrenaud.com (brian d foy)
Subject: Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system
Message-Id: <brian-ya02408000R0407001435290001@news.panix.com>
In article <3961e111.5583408@news.mindspring.com>, zawy@yahoo.com (zawy) posted:
> As Abigail said recently, it's Perl, not PERL, because the Gods of
> Perl decided it would be too simple to make an acronym follow the
> rules of all other acronyms.
well, it's not an acronym. many things are made into acronyms
after the fact, and "Perl" is one of them.
As for the Gods, there is only one, and he can call his langauge
whatever he likes.
> They're elitists. They place barriers
> up to newcomers. "Programming Perl" is a great example. "Let's block
> new people (those who haven't hacked Unix for 5 or 10 years) from
> wanting and being able to learn the language."
but then, there is "Learning Perl".
> It had to be a
> conscious effort. "Programming Perl" achieves its objectives too well.
> The elitists are complacent about the web. It's beneath them. They
> would rather let PHP (not Php) make web programming (i.e. 90% of the
> programming world's future) easy to use.
you mistake the web's importance. most of programming is not the
web.
> Remember assembly?
yes.
> 10 years
> from now: "Remember Perl?"
remember COBOL? FORTRAN? PL/1? they are all still around.
code bases don't just disappear.
> The only question is, will it be LAMP
> (the P doesn't stand for Perl) or Micro$oft? LAMP=Linux, Apache,
> MySQL, PHP
you greatly over-estimate the future of the web, and underestimate
the entry of future players.
> CGI made Perl known to the masses.
> Perl made PHP a necessity.
Most of Perl programming is not CGI, although if you base your
arguments on how publishers position books it's easy to be misled.
you see Perl paired with CGI on book spines because people with
little experience want to do CGI and the easiest language to do
that with is Perl. However, programmers who know their task already
don't need to be told how to apply Perl to it.
> But PHP borrowed so much from Perl, maybe the future PHP crowd will
> bleed over enough to Perl to keep it alive.
PHP is limited to working with a web server - a minor market. PHP
might be fine for some people, but Perl is a fully featured programming
language. it does far more and is much more flexible.
> But maybe I've got it all wrong and Perl just isn't capable of making
> web programming as easy as PHP makes it.
it depends on what you think "easy" is. you can write PHP in Perl,
if you like, and the new version might even be better.
however, there is always going to be a trade-off between ease
of use and flexibility. you might be able to get started with
something like PHP instantly, but then, in a few days, you will
have done everything that PHP can do. there is no such limit
with a general programming language.
> Maybe they're not elitists.
there is no "they".
> Maybe they're just stuck with an old tool.
or a tool that works. no matter how old a knife is, it still
does its job and is found at many meals.
> Perl is like an expensive 10-speed. High-entry cost,
i'm not sure which cost you mean. Perl is free, and even if you
buy "Learning Perl", which isn't necessary, you are only out
$US30.
--
brian d foy
CGI Meta FAQ <URL:http://www.smithrenaud.com/public/CGI_MetaFAQ.html>
Perl Mongers <URL:http://www.perl.org/>
------------------------------
Date: 04 Jul 2000 13:51:01 -0500
From: Tony Curtis <tony_curtis32@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system
Message-Id: <87ya3h91be.fsf@limey.hpcc.uh.edu>
>> On Tue, 04 Jul 2000 13:05:57 GMT,
>> zawy@yahoo.com (zawy) said:
> As Abigail said recently, it's Perl, not PERL, because
> the Gods of Perl decided it would be too simple to make
> an acronym follow the rules of all other acronyms.
> They're elitists. They place barriers up to
> newcomers. "Programming Perl" is a great example. "Let's
> block new people (those who haven't hacked Unix for 5 or
> 10 years) from wanting and being able to learn the
> language." It had to be a conscious
Of course, the non-conspiracy view might be that the book
is not an entry-level one. Does every book have to be
"for dummies"?
And why should programming necessarily be easy? Effort
and work are not bad things. I may be an old fart, but
the "something for nothing" attitude is all too prevalent
on the 'net these days.
> Perl is like a camel, and it loves its image and its
> art. PHP is like 100 million Indian programmers wanting
> to add database capabilities to the web,and it doesn't
> care about its image or its art. With XML, it'll make
Well, I have seen camels in India :-)
And India has a very rich tradition of art. To ignore
that would be to impoverish oneself.
Your article had lots of out-front opinion, care to back
any of it up with data?
hth
t
--
"With $10,000, we'd be millionaires!"
Homer Simpson
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 04 Jul 2000 23:33:07 GMT
From: bart.lateur@skynet.be (Bart Lateur)
Subject: Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system
Message-Id: <396373b4.765270@news.skynet.be>
brian d foy wrote:
>well, it's not an acronym. many things are made into acronyms
>after the fact, and "Perl" is one of them.
It looks like one to me. The explanation "Practical Extraction and
Reporting Language" (or similar) suggests that the actual spelling
should have been "Pearl", which makes that explanation even more likely.
Only, the name "Pearl" was already taken, AFAIK.
--
Bart.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2000 04:19:19 GMT
From: zawy@yahoo.com (zawy)
Subject: Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system
Message-Id: <3962b2f6.59324703@news.mindspring.com>
>Your article had lots of out-front opinion, care to back
>any of it up with data?
I assert that PHP can handle the vast major of CGI needs more
efficiently (programmers' time) than Perl, possibly with better
support for the myriad of databases. DBI might be more powerful, but
I assert PHP does what the vast majority of us need for the web with
less effort.
My data to support the above: The sudden emergence of PHP despite the
well-known existence of Perl. Most people seem to be turning to PHP
instead of Perl when starting new MySQL projects on websites. No one
has denied PHP is easier. No one has said PHP cannot handle all your
web CGI needs. No one has explained why I or anyone else should be
using Perl instead of PHP for CGI databases.
In response to the other poster, by calling Perl "expensive" I'm
referring to it being more difficult to learn.
------------------------------
Date: 5 Jul 2000 00:24:58 +0100
From: Jonathan Stowe <gellyfish@gellyfish.com>
Subject: Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system
Message-Id: <8jtroa$lg7$1@orpheus.gellyfish.com>
On Tue, 04 Jul 2000 13:05:57 GMT zawy wrote:
> As Abigail said recently, it's Perl, not PERL, because the Gods of
> Perl decided it would be too simple to make an acronym follow the
> rules of all other acronyms. They're elitists. They place barriers
> up to newcomers. "Programming Perl" is a great example. "Let's block
> new people (those who haven't hacked Unix for 5 or 10 years) from
> wanting and being able to learn the language." It had to be a
> conscious effort. "Programming Perl" achieves its objectives too well.
> The elitists are complacent about the web. It's beneath them. They
> would rather let PHP (not Php) make web programming (i.e. 90% of the
> programming world's future) easy to use. Remember assembly? 10 years
> from now: "Remember Perl?" The only question is, will it be LAMP
> (the P doesn't stand for Perl) or Micro$oft? LAMP=Linux, Apache,
> MySQL, PHP
>
Lawdy an honest to gosh troll, and we have had so few of them here recently.
I believe PHP stands for Personal Home Page. Perl is the name of a
programming language. Back to the ice caves of Skaro with you troll.
/J\
--
** This space reserved for venue sponsor for yapc::Europe **
<http://www.yapc.org/Europe/>
------------------------------
Date: 5 Jul 2000 00:28:17 +0100
From: Jonathan Stowe <gellyfish@gellyfish.com>
Subject: Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system
Message-Id: <8jtruh$lgi$1@orpheus.gellyfish.com>
On 04 Jul 2000 07:36:01 -0700 Randal L. Schwartz wrote:
> when you
> finally start doing something other than web pages, start with Perl.
>
Oh but Randal 90% of *all* programming is going to be for the web, the
troll said so ...
/J\
--
** This space reserved for venue sponsor for yapc::Europe **
<http://www.yapc.org/Europe/>
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2000 09:37:33 GMT
From: Jonathan Stowe <gellyfish@gellyfish.com>
Subject: Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system
Message-Id: <xlD85.1360$iP2.128053@news.dircon.co.uk>
On 04 Jul 2000 13:51:01 -0500, Tony Curtis Wrote:
>
> Of course, the non-conspiracy view might be that the book
> is not an entry-level one. Does every book have to be
> "for dummies"?
Of course it does, I believe the Dummies people are even beginning to
translate their PHP book into Chimpanzee and Pig to even further lower
the entry level ...
/J\
------------------------------
Date: 5 Jul 2000 16:03:25 GMT
From: nobody@contract.East.Sun.COM (Nobody)
Subject: Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system
Message-Id: <8jvm8d$1s9$1@eastnews1.east.sun.com>
In article <3962b2f6.59324703@news.mindspring.com>,
zawy <zawy@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>Your article had lots of out-front opinion, care to back
>>any of it up with data?
>
>I assert that PHP can handle the vast major of CGI needs more
>efficiently (programmers' time) than Perl, possibly with better
>support for the myriad of databases. DBI might be more powerful, but
>I assert PHP does what the vast majority of us need for the web with
>less effort.
>
>My data to support the above: The sudden emergence of PHP despite the
>well-known existence of Perl. Most people seem to be turning to PHP
>instead of Perl when starting new MySQL projects on websites. No one
>has denied PHP is easier. No one has said PHP cannot handle all your
>web CGI needs. No one has explained why I or anyone else should be
>using Perl instead of PHP for CGI databases.
>
One word: Maintainability
This is something that is often overlooked in programming everywhere,
not just in PHP. I have had the (mis)fortune of being stuck dealing
with PHP. Trying to analyze/maintain code that is intermixed within
HTML gives me a headache. For that matter, I have the same problem with
all of these pseudo-client-side cgi languages. If the code runs on the
server, then that's where it belongs, IMHO. Note that this is my personal
opinion, since I prefer a 3-tiered architecture for most of my software
development, especially web development. I prefer to keep my data
handling separate from my display and from other processing. From what
I have seen, PHP is just a way for ISPs to let people do some minimal
cgi without the need for giving them access to the server proper.
>In response to the other poster, by calling Perl "expensive" I'm
>referring to it being more difficult to learn.
>
Two more words: Job Security :-)
Honestly, though, what is wrong with something being difficult to
learn? Just because some people wanted everything handed to them,
doesn't mean that the rest of us don't like to exercise our minds.
It scares me to think of clueless types like that doing "programming"
on the web. You don't let babies play with butcher knives, do you?
Anita
------------------------------
Date: 6 Jul 2000 02:41:09 GMT
From: <danny@lennon.postino.com>
Subject: Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system
Message-Id: <8k0rk5$nbo$1@lennon.postino.com>
User-Agent: tin/1.4.2-20000205 ("Possession") (UNIX) (Linux/2.2.14-5.0 (i586))
Abigail <abigail@delanet.com> wrote:
> Your request doesn't make sense. You need to hire programmers if you
> have a task that you cannot, or will not, do yourself. Whether it's
> closed or open source is completely irrelevant.
> However, programmers are not to be fished for here. Use an appropriate
> .jobs group.
Larry Wall, are you listening?! How can you live with yourself, asking
all those Perl-Porters to work for free. Despicable. And you too Linus
Torvalds. And RMS, and Eric Raymond, and ...
<Tongue Firmly in Cheek>
--
Danny Aldham Providing Certified Internetworking Solutions to Business
www.postino.com E-Mail, Web Servers, Web Databases, SQL PHP & Perl
------------------------------
Date: 7 Jul 2000 07:39:59 GMT
From: Ilmari Karonen <iltzu@sci.invalid>
Subject: Re: Open Source PERL Bulletin Board system
Message-Id: <962954386.11058@itz.pp.sci.fi>
In article <8k0rk5$nbo$1@lennon.postino.com>, danny@lennon.postino.com wrote:
>User-Agent: tin/1.4.2-20000205 ("Possession") (UNIX) (Linux/2.2.14-5.0 (i586))
Keep your headers where they belong, thank you.
>Abigail <abigail@delanet.com> wrote:
>> Your request doesn't make sense. You need to hire programmers if you
>> have a task that you cannot, or will not, do yourself. Whether it's
>> closed or open source is completely irrelevant.
>
>Larry Wall, are you listening?! How can you live with yourself, asking
>all those Perl-Porters to work for free. Despicable. And you too Linus
>Torvalds. And RMS, and Eric Raymond, and ...
The point is that people don't normally spend effort on something they
get no benefit from. That benefit might be money, a solution to a
problem, supporting a good cause, or simply the fun of doing it.
None of those seem likely to be sufficient reasons for someone here to
satisfy the original poster's request. And posting that request here
certainly isn't likely to change that.
><Tongue Firmly in Cheek>
AI::NLP::context(): Ignoring metainformation while 'literal' in force..
--
Ilmari Karonen - http://www.sci.fi/~iltzu/
"The screwdriver *is* the portable method." -- Abigail
Please ignore Godzilla and its pseudonyms - do not feed the troll.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 15:46:19 -0500
From: "Michael Simanek" <simanek@uiuc.edu>
Subject: operator lt
Message-Id: <8k5fiq$bek$1@schbbs.mot.com>
When using the string operator 'lt' (less than) does this compare by
alphabetic [order] value or by total ascii value or what? Can I use this
for an alphabetizing algorithm? Thanks in advance.
Mike
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2000 17:17:15 -0400
From: Drew Simonis <care227@attglobal.net>
Subject: Re: operator lt
Message-Id: <396648DB.EB59577A@attglobal.net>
Michael Simanek wrote:
>
> When using the string operator 'lt' (less than) does this compare by
> alphabetic [order] value or by total ascii value or what?
From the perlop documentation:
Binary "lt" returns true if the left argument is
stringwise less than the right argument.
-AND-
"lt", "le", "ge", "gt" and "cmp" use the collation (sort)
order specified by the current locale if use locale is in
effect. See the perllocale manpage.
------------------------------
Date: 07 Jul 2000 17:39:39 -0400
From: qvaff <qvaff@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: operator lt
Message-Id: <kusvgyhbox0.fsf@buphy.bu.edu>
"Michael Simanek" <simanek@uiuc.edu> writes:
> When using the string operator 'lt' (less than) does this compare by
> alphabetic [order] value or by total ascii value or what? Can I use
> this for an alphabetizing algorithm? Thanks in advance.
How about making a test
"abc" lt "ABC" && print "hi\n";
"ABC" lt "abc" && print "HI\n";
and seeing what happens? :)
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2000 18:05:38 -0400
From: brian@smithrenaud.com (brian d foy)
Subject: Re: operator lt
Message-Id: <brian-ya02408000R0707001805380001@news.panix.com>
In article <8k5fiq$bek$1@schbbs.mot.com>, "Michael Simanek" <simanek@uiuc.edu> posted:
> When using the string operator 'lt' (less than) does this compare by
> alphabetic [order] value or by total ascii value or what? Can I use this
> for an alphabetizing algorithm? Thanks in advance.
it compares strings ASCIIbetically, as documented. that is, it does not
compare them alphabetically.
--
brian d foy
CGI Meta FAQ <URL:http://www.smithrenaud.com/public/CGI_MetaFAQ.html>
Perl Mongers <URL:http://www.perl.org/>
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2000 13:14:17 +0100
From: "Aurora" <info@REMOVEaiuk.net>
Subject: OT: Jobs
Message-Id: <8kcfri$pg3$1@news.netkonect.net>
OFF TOPIC!
Hi Guys
We are currently seeking Perl developers to work full time on interactive
projects in Dorset, England. If anyone is interested please e-mail
jobs@aiuk.net with a CV or for a full job description.
Many thanks
Aurora
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2000 12:33:10 GMT
From: bernard.el-hagin@lido-tech.net (Bernard El-Hagin)
Subject: Re: OT: Jobs
Message-Id: <slrn8mjgbl.9rf.bernard.el-hagin@gdndev25.lido-tech>
On Mon, 10 Jul 2000 13:14:17 +0100, Aurora <info@REMOVEaiuk.net> wrote:
>OFF TOPIC!
I've always wondered what it is that drives people to post off topic
even when they *know* they're posting off topic. It's rude and
inconsiderate, you know. It's as if I came into your home, said "Hey, I
know this is rude, but forgive me" and proceeded to defecate on your
living-room floor.
Bernard
--
perl -e'@x=(3,2,4,1,3,2,1,3,1,3,2,3,3,2,3,0,0,1,2,1,1,1,4,1,2,1,1,2,2,1,
2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,1,1,2,1,0,0,3,2,3,2,3,2,1,1,1,1,1,2,4,2,3,2,1,2,1,0,0,1,
2,1,1,1,4,1,2,1,1,1,2,2,1,1,4,1,1,1,2,1,1,1,2,1,0,0,3,2,4,1,1,2,1,1,1,3,
1,1,1,4,1,1,1,2,1,1,3,0,0);sub x{print q x$xx$_;print q x x x shift@x};#
while(defined($_=shift @x)){s o0o\no;$_!=0?x:print}' #Symmetry yrtemmyS#
------------------------------
Date: 16 Sep 99 21:33:47 GMT (Last modified)
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Subject: Digest Administrivia (Last modified: 16 Sep 99)
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------------------------------
End of Perl-Users Digest V9 Issue 3588
**************************************
