[27472] in resnet
Re: ResNet Bandwidth Standards and Shaping too
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Mike King)
Fri Mar 16 15:57:40 2012
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Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 15:47:28 -0400
Reply-To: Resnet Forum <RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu>
From: Mike King <me@mpking.com>
To: RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu
In-Reply-To: <B3C0241889401F4AB97A55E980BABBA0013459A9BC4B@EXV01.wcu.edu>
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You just didn't read the right news service:
http://www.dailytech.com/Verizon+TWC+and+Comcast+to+Play+Copyright+Cop+for+=
the+RIAA/article24244.htm
On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 1:33 PM, Andy Voelker <avoelker@email.wcu.edu>wrote=
:
> True, we aren=92t the internet police. But some forces are going to driv=
e
> us in that direction soon:****
>
> ** **
>
>
> http://news.yahoo.com/major-isps-turn-copyright-police-july-says-riaa-164=
611860.html
> ****
>
> ** **
>
> Funny, it doesn=92t name the ISP=92s.****
>
> ** **
>
> -- Andy Voelker****
>
> Manager of Student Computing in the Technology Commons****
>
> Western Carolina University****
>
> Be sure to check out the WCU TechTips Podcast at
> http://www.youtube.com/WesternCarolinaU!!****
>
> Check the status of your IT requests at any time at http://help.wcu.edu/ =
!
> ****
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* Resnet Forum [mailto:RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] *On Behalf Of *And=
rew
> Wolf
> *Sent:* Friday, March 16, 2012 11:08 AM
>
> *To:* RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
> *Subject:* Re: ResNet Bandwidth Standards and Shaping too****
>
> ** **
>
> I have to reiterate that using the Netequalizer (behavior based vs DPI)
> and using Neteq powerful connection limits per user on the students has
> eliminated the P2P issues for our campus. I=92m sure that there are a ve=
ry
> small percentage that still manage to P2P via a single encrypted tunnel o=
r
> by using proxy methods; but overall I think we=92ve eliminated almost all=
P2P
> issues that were affecting the network which was our real goal, since we=
=92re
> not the internet police.****
>
> We didn=92t have this kind of success chasing them with DPI, trying to ID
> the protocols and spending countless management hours managing the
> packeteer. The Netequalizer is a much more elegant approach in controlli=
ng
> HOW they are doing stuff, vs. WHAT they are doing, and it makes the end
> user experience tremendously better. Great performance due low
> utilization, and good performance due max utilization =96 much better tha=
n a
> fixed cap or quota per user.****
>
> ** **
>
> I suppose somewhere down the road, legislation will appear to limit =93De=
ep
> Packet Inspection=94 in as far as inspecting a users packets might violat=
e
> some right of privacy=85I know that sounds ridiculous now, but we=92ve go=
t a
> great deal of ridiculous on the law books currently; I don=92t see that
> stopping anytime soon. ****
>
> ** **
>
> Andrew Wolf****
>
> Linfield College****
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* Resnet Forum [mailto:RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] *On Behalf Of *Jim
> Warner
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 15, 2012 9:19 PM
> *To:* RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
> *Subject:* Re: ResNet Bandwidth Standards and Shaping too****
>
> ** **
>
> There is a lot of knashing of teeth over P-2-P. Consider whether you're
> solving today's problem or instead, looking backwards to a problem of a f=
ew
> years ago. Dorm room P-2-P just isn't what it used to be. Craig Labovit=
z
> gave a talk on this at Nanog. Certainly anyone spending large amounts of
> $$ to combat the evils of P2P would want to put a half hour into hearing
> research based on real data.
>
>
> http://www.nanog.org/meetings/nanog54/presentations/Tuesday/NANOG_54_03_o=
rth_50_percent.wmv
>
> -jim warner, UC Santa Cruz****
>
> ** **
>
> From: Resnet Forum [mailto:RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Cal Fry=
e
> Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2012 2:23 PM
> To: RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
> Subject: Re: ResNet Bandwidth Standards and Shaping too.
>
> Hi, Chris,
> On 3/14/12 12:40 PM, Chris Davis wrote:
> > ratio of students to Mbps in bandwidth that was about 4:1.
>
> Agreed. We're at about 6:1, and can almost get away without bandwidth
> managing of any sort. But as you note, we do use our Packetlogic to block
> P2P applications except for those registering to opt-in. The Packetlogic =
is
> pretty good at permitting game updates while blocking general P2P
> downloads, too.
> >****
>
> ___________________________________________________ You are subscribed to
> the ResNet-L mailing list. ****
>
> To subscribe, unsubscribe or search the archives, go to
> http://LISTSERV.ND.EDU/archives/resnet-l.html____________________________=
_______________________
> ****
>
___________________________________________________
You are subscribed to the ResNet-L mailing list.
To subscribe, unsubscribe or search the archives,
go to http://LISTSERV.ND.EDU/archives/resnet-l.html
___________________________________________________
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You just didn't read the right news service:<div><br></div><div><a href=
=3D"http://www.dailytech.com/Verizon+TWC+and+Comcast+to+Play+Copyright+Cop+=
for+the+RIAA/article24244.htm">http://www.dailytech.com/Verizon+TWC+and+Com=
cast+to+Play+Copyright+Cop+for+the+RIAA/article24244.htm</a>=A0<br>
<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 1:33 PM, Andy Voelke=
r <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:avoelker@email.wcu.edu">avoelker@=
email.wcu.edu</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" st=
yle=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div><p class=3D"MsoNorm=
al"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","s=
ans-serif";color:#1f497d">True, we aren=92t the internet police.=A0 Bu=
t some forces are going to drive us in that direction soon:<u></u><u></u></=
span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u>=A0<u></u></span><=
/p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"http://news.yahoo.com/major-isps-turn-=
copyright-police-july-says-riaa-164611860.html" target=3D"_blank">http://ne=
ws.yahoo.com/major-isps-turn-copyright-police-july-says-riaa-164611860.html=
</a><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u>=A0<u></u></span><=
/p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"=
;Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Funny, it doesn=92t na=
me the ISP=92s.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u>=A0<u></u></span><=
/p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:=
"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">-- Andy Voelker<u=
></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Manager of Student Comput=
ing in the Technology Commons<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal=
">
<span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-=
serif";color:#1f497d">Western Carolina University<u></u><u></u></span>=
</p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quo=
t;Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Be sure to check out =
the WCU TechTips Podcast at <a href=3D"http://www.youtube.com/WesternCaroli=
naU" target=3D"_blank">http://www.youtube.com/WesternCarolinaU</a>!!<u></u>=
<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Check the status of your =
IT requests at any time at <a href=3D"http://help.wcu.edu/" target=3D"_blan=
k">http://help.wcu.edu/</a> !<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&q=
uot;Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u>=A0<u></u></=
span></p><div><div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padd=
ing:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"=
;Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Resnet F=
orum [mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU" target=3D"_blank">=
RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Andrew Wolf<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 16, 2012 11:08 AM</span></p><div class=3D"im"><b=
r><b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU" target=3D"_blank">=
RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU</a><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: ResNet Bandwidth Standa=
rds and Shaping too<u></u><u></u></div>
<p></p></div></div><div class=3D"im"><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=A0<u></=
u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&q=
uot;Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">I have to reiterate=
that using the Netequalizer (behavior based vs DPI) and using Neteq powerf=
ul connection limits per user on the students has eliminated the P2P issues=
for our campus.=A0 I=92m sure that there are a very small percentage that =
still manage to P2P via a single encrypted tunnel or by using proxy methods=
; but overall I think we=92ve eliminated almost all P2P issues that were af=
fecting the network which was our real goal, since we=92re not the internet=
police.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">We didn=92t have this kin=
d of success chasing them with DPI, trying to ID the protocols and spending=
countless management hours managing the packeteer.=A0 The Netequalizer is =
a much more elegant approach in controlling HOW they are doing stuff, vs. W=
HAT they are doing, and it makes the end user experience tremendously bette=
r.=A0 Great performance due low utilization, and good performance due max u=
tilization =96 much better than a fixed cap or quota per user.<u></u><u></u=
></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u>=A0<u></u></span><=
/p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"=
;Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">I suppose somewhere do=
wn the road, legislation will appear to limit =93Deep Packet Inspection=94 =
in as far as inspecting a users packets might violate some right of privacy=
=85I know that sounds ridiculous now, but we=92ve got a great deal of ridic=
ulous on the law books currently; I don=92t see that stopping anytime soon.=
=A0=A0 <u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u>=A0<u></u></span><=
/p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"=
;Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Andrew Wolf<u></u><u><=
/u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Linfield College<u></u><u=
></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font=
-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u>=
=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u>=A0<u></u></span><=
/p><div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0=
in 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"=
;Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Resnet F=
orum <a href=3D"mailto:[mailto:RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU]" target=3D"_blank"=
>[mailto:RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU]</a> <b>On Behalf Of </b>Jim Warner<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 15, 2012 9:19 PM<br><b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mail=
to:RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU" target=3D"_blank">RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU</a>=
<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: ResNet Bandwidth Standards and Shaping too<u></u><u=
></u></span></p>
</div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=A0<u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" st=
yle=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">There is a lot of knashing of teeth over P-2-P=
.=A0 Consider whether you're solving today's problem or instead, lo=
oking backwards to a problem of a few years ago.=A0 Dorm room P-2-P just is=
n't what it used to be.=A0 Craig Labovitz gave a talk on this at Nanog.=
=A0 Certainly anyone spending large amounts of $$ to combat the evils of P2=
P would want to put a half hour into hearing research based on real data.<b=
r>
<br><a href=3D"http://www.nanog.org/meetings/nanog54/presentations/Tuesday/=
NANOG_54_03_orth_50_percent.wmv" target=3D"_blank">http://www.nanog.org/mee=
tings/nanog54/presentations/Tuesday/NANOG_54_03_orth_50_percent.wmv</a><br>
<br>-jim warner, UC Santa Cruz<u></u><u></u></p><div><blockquote style=3D"b=
order:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin=
-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal">
<u></u>=A0<u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">From: Resnet Forum [mailto:<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU" target=3D"_blank">RESNET-L@LISTSERV=
.ND.EDU</a>] On Behalf Of Cal Frye<br>Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2012 2:23 =
PM<br>
To: <a href=3D"mailto:RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU" target=3D"_blank">RESNET-L@=
LISTSERV.ND.EDU</a><br>Subject: Re: ResNet Bandwidth Standards and Shaping =
too.<br><br>Hi, Chris,<br>On 3/14/12 12:40 PM, Chris Davis wrote:<br>> r=
atio of students to Mbps in bandwidth that was about 4:1.<br>
<br>Agreed. We're at about 6:1, and can almost get away without bandwid=
th managing of any sort. But as you note, we do use our Packetlogic to bloc=
k P2P applications except for those registering to opt-in. The Packetlogic =
is pretty good at permitting game updates while blocking general P2P downlo=
ads, too.<br>
><u></u><u></u></p></blockquote></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">___________=
________________________________________ You are subscribed to the ResNet-L=
mailing list. <u></u><u></u></p><p>To subscribe, unsubscribe or search the=
archives, go to <a href=3D"http://LISTSERV.ND.EDU/archives/resnet-l.html" =
target=3D"_blank">http://LISTSERV.ND.EDU/archives/resnet-l.html</a> _______=
____________________________________________ <u></u><u></u></p>
</div></div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>
___________________________________________________
You are subscribed to the ResNet-L mailing list.
<p>
To subscribe, unsubscribe or search the archives,
go to http://LISTSERV.ND.EDU/archives/resnet-l.html
___________________________________________________
--f46d04426f148aa84004bb617a84--
