[41195] in Resnet-Forum
Re: Student Internet
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Hunter Fuller)
Fri May 13 16:28:14 2016
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Date: Fri, 13 May 2016 15:28:07 -0500
Reply-To: Resnet Forum <RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu>
From: Hunter Fuller <hf0002@uah.edu>
To: RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu
In-Reply-To: <c700e7b6f6f34bb48c144897d4c469a9@ISU-EXCH-1.isuad.indstate.edu>
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Xirrus equivalent is the XR-320. We're very happy with ours.
On Friday, May 13, 2016, Amanda Cockrell <Amanda.Cockrell@indstate.edu>
wrote:
> Provided these are multi-tenant rooms, you might consider the Cisco 700
> series WAP. The WAP only needs a single data port (saving on the back end=
)
> and provides 4 ports out (one POE). This is, of course, provided you have=
a
> controller and POE switches or wall outlet near for powering the device.
> Depending on the amount of rooms and person per room this could be a good
> option for you.
>
>
>
> At any rate, I would say the cost will highly depend on the building
> structure and design.
>
>
>
> Amanda Cockrell
>
> ISU-OIT-Networking
>
> Tirey Hall Room T065
>
> (812)237-8854
>
>
>
> *From:* Resnet Forum [mailto:RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU');>] *On Behalf Of
> *Swenson, Chris
> *Sent:* Friday, May 13, 2016 2:54 PM
> *To:* RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU');>
> *Subject:* Re: Student Internet
>
>
>
> We are moving off the original question, but yes I agree, buy the best of
> breed for the wireless and then as cheap as possible for the wired port p=
er
> pillow.
>
> And to clarify, port per pillow is literal. For the wireless we are now
> assuming 5 devices per students in the load calculation.
>
> We were using approximately 3.5 megs per student as a rough calculation
> assuming a high def. video stream per student and maybe 60% of the studen=
ts
> online at peak capacity.
>
> I have not seen how much bandwidth the 4K tv=E2=80=99s will take, but on =
a go
> forward basis we are assuming the death of traditional cable and migratio=
n
> to all streaming.
>
> I am on a slow but sure campaign replacing my 22 year old multi-mode fibe=
r
> with single mode and pushing up to 10 gig with the potential of 40 gig in
> our internal network among our 50 buildings.
>
> We use Net Equalizers to make sure everyone gets a fair crack at the
> bandwidth across our 2 clustered internet connections.
>
> Of course you can also set fair share in the wireless controllers.
>
> Chris Swenson
>
> Network Manager
>
> Curry College
>
> Milton Massachusetts.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Resnet Forum [mailto:RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu');>] *On Behalf Of
> *Doughty, Marc
> *Sent:* Friday, May 13, 2016 2:35 PM
> *To:* RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu');>
> *Subject:* Re: Student Internet
>
>
>
> > very expensive switches
>
>
>
> I'm scared I'll get laughed out of the room, but do the edges in a dorm
> *really* need Cisco-branded switches? I imagine you could run one
> fancypants switch with PoE to feed the APs and then cascade down to $10/p=
ort
> managed gigabit switches
> <http://OU=3DTest,OU=3DHighlyManaged,OU=3DDepartments,DC=3DAD,DC=3DBrown,=
DC=3DEdu> behind
> the ports that users in dorms connect to.
>
>
>
> - Marc Doughty
> "If you aren't sure who is the give-way vessel, you are the give-way
> vessel."
>
>
>
> On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 1:26 PM, Swenson, Chris <cswenson@curry.edu
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','cswenson@curry.edu');>> wrote:
>
> While I cannot give you an answer to your question I can give you a bunch
> of caveats.
>
> We built a residence all for 170 students 2 years ago. Here in New
> England we have to build stuff so it holds up to something like a 8.2
> Richter or so earthquake. (I am not a construction guy)
>
> The cost on the wireless is staggering in the opinion of this 58 year old
> guy. This was the first building we built where the wireless was part of
> the original project, all others were additions to older buildings.
>
> The additions to the older buildings were part of my tech department
> costs, when the facilities people saw the first cost of the wireless in n=
ew
> construction their jaws hit the floor. They were not prepared for the cos=
t
> of the modern AP.
>
> Because of the thick walls we ended up with something like 72 access
> points (Aruba AP-205=E2=80=99s) for every 4 or so students. The others co=
vered
> common areas.
>
> I am also finding that I have to revisit my wireless in buildings upgrade=
d
> as recently as 3 or 4 years ago because of inadequate signal penetration =
as
> we move from the 2.4 g to 5.0 g bands.
>
> Another thing we decided to do was drop adding phone service to every
> room. Finally you will want to get guarantees from the wireless vendor
> that the system works. Students who have to use their data plans for the
> smart phones are very unhappy campers. Beat up the architect for a decen=
t
> set of CAD drawings that you can submit to the wireless vendor. For some
> reason they are reluctant to give that stuff up in my dealings.
>
>
>
> Lastly we currently promise 1 port per pillow. Quite honestly 95 % of
> some very expensive switches are sitting idle. I do not know what the
> answer is on this.
>
>
>
> Chris Swenson
>
> Network Manager
>
> Curry College
>
> Milton Massachusetts.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Resnet Forum [mailto:RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu');>] *On Behalf Of
> *Rocha, Kevin
> *Sent:* Friday, May 13, 2016 12:58 PM
> *To:* RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu');>
> *Subject:* Student Internet
>
>
>
> Hello Folks,
>
> We are building a residence hall here at UNTD and are having trouble
> getting a decent quote for budgetary estimate purposes for cost per stude=
nt
> for Internet access. This hall will have 125 residents. Has anyone done=
a
> similar cost analysis recently for a similar setup.
>
> Thanks for your help.
>
> Kevin Rocha
> IT Manager
> University of North Texas at Dallas
>
> Get Outlook for Android <https://aka.ms/ghei36>
>
> ___________________________________________________ You are subscribed to
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>
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> ___________________________________________________
>
> ___________________________________________________ You are subscribed to
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>
> To subscribe, unsubscribe or search the archives, go to
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> ___________________________________________________
>
>
>
> ___________________________________________________ You are subscribed to
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>
> To subscribe, unsubscribe or search the archives, go to
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> To subscribe, unsubscribe or search the archives, go to
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--=20
--
Hunter Fuller
Network Engineer
VBRH Annex B-1
+1 256 824 5331
Office of Information Technology
The University of Alabama in Huntsville
Systems and Infrastructure
___________________________________________________
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Xirrus equivalent is the XR-320. We're very happy with ours.=C2=A0<span=
></span><div><br>On Friday, May 13, 2016, Amanda Cockrell <<a href=3D"ma=
ilto:Amanda.Cockrell@indstate.edu">Amanda.Cockrell@indstate.edu</a>> wro=
te:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-=
left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a name=3D"m_2956011871673848123__MailEndCompose"><s=
pan style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;co=
lor:#1f497d">Provided these are multi-tenant rooms, you might consider the =
Cisco 700 series WAP. The WAP only needs a single data port (saving on
the back end) and provides 4 ports out (one POE). This is, of course, prov=
ided you have a controller and POE switches or wall outlet near for powerin=
g the device. Depending on the amount of rooms and person per room this cou=
ld be a good option for you.
<u></u><u></u></span></a></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&q=
uot;Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></sp=
an></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&q=
uot;Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">At any rate, I would say the co=
st will highly depend on the building structure and design.<u></u><u></u></=
span></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&q=
uot;Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></sp=
an></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&q=
uot;Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Amanda Cockrell<u></u><u></u></=
span></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&q=
uot;Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">ISU-OIT-Networking<u></u><u></u=
></span></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&q=
uot;Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Tirey Hall Room T065<u></u><u><=
/u></span></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&q=
uot;Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">(812)237-8854<u></u><u></u></sp=
an></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&q=
uot;Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></sp=
an></p>
<span></span>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"=
;Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;=
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Resnet Forum [mailto:<a href=
=3D"javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU')=
;" target=3D"_blank">RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Swenson, Chris<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, May 13, 2016 2:54 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','RESNET-L@LIS=
TSERV.ND.EDU');" target=3D"_blank">RESNET-L@LISTSERV.ND.EDU</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Student Internet<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">We are moving off the original questi=
on, but yes I agree, buy the best of breed for the wireless and then as che=
ap as possible for the wired port per pillow.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">And to clarify, port per pillow is li=
teral.=C2=A0 For the wireless we are now assuming 5 devices per students in=
the load calculation.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">We were using approximately 3.5 megs =
per student as a rough calculation assuming a high def. video stream per st=
udent and maybe 60% of the students online at
peak capacity.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">I have not seen how much bandwidth th=
e 4K tv=E2=80=99s will take, but on a go forward basis we are assuming the =
death of traditional cable and migration to all streaming.<u></u><u></u></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">I am on a slow but sure campaign repl=
acing my 22 year old multi-mode fiber with single mode and pushing up to 10=
gig with the potential of 40 gig in our internal
network among our 50 buildings.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">We use Net Equalizers to make sure ev=
eryone gets a fair crack at the bandwidth across our 2 clustered internet c=
onnections.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Of course you can also set fair share=
in the wireless controllers.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Chris Swenson<u></u><u></u></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Network Manager</span><u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Curry College</span><u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Milton Massachusetts.</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"=
;Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;=
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Resnet Forum [</span><a href=
=3D"javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu')=
;" target=3D"_blank"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Cali=
bri",sans-serif">mailto:RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu</span></a><span style=
=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Doughty, Marc<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, May 13, 2016 2:35 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> </span><a href=3D"javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','RESNE=
T-L@listserv.nd.edu');" target=3D"_blank"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0=
pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu</sp=
an></a><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans=
-serif"><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Student Internet<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">> very expensive switches<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I'm scared I'll get laughed out of the room,=
but do the edges in a dorm
<i>really</i> need Cisco-branded switches? I imagine you could run one fanc=
ypants switch with PoE to feed the APs and then cascade down to
<a href=3D"http://OU=3DTest,OU=3DHighlyManaged,OU=3DDepartments,DC=3DAD,DC=
=3DBrown,DC=3DEdu" target=3D"_blank">$10/port managed gigabit switches</a>=
=C2=A0behind the ports that users in dorms connect to.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br clear=3D"all">
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br>
- Marc Doughty<br>
"If you aren't sure who is the give-way vessel, you are the give-w=
ay vessel."<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Fri, May 13, 2016 at 1:26 PM, Swenson, Chris <=
<a href=3D"javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','cswenson@curry.edu'=
);" target=3D"_blank">cswenson@curry.edu</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0i=
n 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-=
bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">While I cannot give you an answer to =
your question I can give you a bunch of caveats.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">We built a residence all for 170 stud=
ents 2 years ago.=C2=A0 Here in New England we have to build stuff
so it holds up to something like a 8.2 Richter or so earthquake. (I am not=
a construction guy)</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">The cost on the wireless is staggerin=
g in the opinion of this 58 year old guy.=C2=A0 This was the first
building we built where the wireless was part of the original project, all=
others were additions to older buildings.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">The additions to the older buildings =
were part of my tech department costs, when the facilities people
saw the first cost of the wireless in new construction their jaws hit the =
floor. They were not prepared for the cost of the modern AP.</span><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Because of the thick walls we ended u=
p with something like 72 access points (Aruba AP-205=E2=80=99s) for every
4 or so students. The others covered common areas.</span><u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">I am also finding that I have to revi=
sit my wireless in buildings upgraded as recently as 3 or 4 years
ago because of inadequate signal penetration as we move from the 2.4 g to =
5.0 g bands.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Another thing we decided to do was dr=
op adding phone service to every room.=C2=A0 Finally you will want
to get guarantees from the wireless vendor that the system works. Students=
who have to use their data plans for the smart phones are very unhappy cam=
pers.=C2=A0 Beat up the architect for a decent set of CAD drawings that you=
can submit to the wireless vendor. For
some reason they are reluctant to give that stuff up in my dealings.</span=
><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Lastly we currently promise 1 port pe=
r pillow.=C2=A0 Quite honestly 95 % of some very expensive switches
are sitting idle. I do not know what the answer is on this.</span><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Chris Swenson</span><u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Network Manager</span><u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Curry College</span><u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Milton Massachusetts.</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Ca=
libri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"=
;Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;=
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Resnet Forum [mailto:</span><a=
href=3D"javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu&=
#39;);" target=3D"_blank"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"=
;Calibri",sans-serif">RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu</span></a><span style=
=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Rocha, Kevin<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, May 13, 2016 12:58 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> </span><a href=3D"javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','RESNE=
T-L@listserv.nd.edu');" target=3D"_blank"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0=
pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">RESNET-L@listserv.nd.edu</sp=
an></a><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans=
-serif"><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Student Internet</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Hello Folks,<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>We are building a residence hall here at UNTD and are having trouble get=
ting a decent quote for budgetary estimate purposes for cost per student fo=
r Internet access.=C2=A0 This hall will have 125 residents.=C2=A0 Has anyon=
e done a similar cost analysis recently for
a similar setup.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thanks for your help.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Kevin Rocha <br>
IT Manager<br>
University of North Texas at Dallas<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Get <a href=3D"https://aka.ms/ghei36" target=3D"_blank">Outlook for Andr=
oid</a><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
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___________________________________________________
</p></blockquote></div><br><br>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><br>--<br>Hunte=
r Fuller<br>Network Engineer<br>VBRH Annex B-1<br>+1 256 824 5331<br><br>Of=
fice of Information Technology<br>The University of Alabama in Huntsville<b=
r>Systems and Infrastructure<br></div></div><br>
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