[331] in UA Exec
Re: You are being lied to.
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Derric Tay)
Tue Apr 6 18:53:42 2010
In-Reply-To: <l2u4852bb3a1004061549mcb16f239q990a80e9f45446eb@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 6 Apr 2010 18:53:34 -0400
From: Derric Tay <derric.g.tay@gmail.com>
To: Rachel Ellison <rellison@mit.edu>
Cc: "Ainsley K. Braun" <ainsleyb@mit.edu>, Cinjon Resnick <cinjon@mit.edu>,
Nathan Lachenmyer <scottnla@mit.edu>, Austen McRae <amcrae@mit.edu>,
Clayton Sims <ctsims@mit.edu>, hwkns@mit.edu,
Keri Garel <thekeri@mit.edu>, Jessica H Lowell <jessiehl@mit.edu>,
Martin F Holmes <goholmes@mit.edu>, "Liz A. Denys" <lizdenys@mit.edu>,
Andrew Lukmann <lukymann@mit.edu>, Ted Hilk <thilk@mit.edu>,
Nathaniel Fox <natefox@mit.edu>, Alexandra Jordan <amjordan@mit.edu>,
Anthony Rindone <arindone@mit.edu>, UA Senate <ua-senate@mit.edu>,
UA Executive Board <ua-exec@mit.edu>, cfs@mit.edu
One very innocuous, and normal, but potentially useful idea: heavily
promote/advertise living group comunities that cook for each other as
a group. Break through the "shut-in ramen-noodles student" narrative
by lighting up the truth.
~DT
On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 6:49 PM, Rachel Ellison <rellison@mit.edu> wrote:
> I don't think gathering some animosity against the admins qualifies as
> "bitching and moaning". It might be kind of extreme to imply that they're
> making us incompetent by limiting our dining options, but college is *abo=
ut*
> learning to handle being mature adults. Which, yes, involves learning to
> make compromises, but also means being able to call the administrators ou=
t
> on not wanting to listen to us (when they claim the opposite!).
>
> Also, staying on good terms with the administrators is the UA's job, not
> ours. Just sayin'.
>
> --Rachel
>
> On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 6:41 PM, Ainsley K. Braun <ainsleyb@mit.edu> wrote=
:
>>
>> Agreed with Cinjon.
>>
>> I don't think the whole underlying purpose of CFS is to bitch and
>> moan. =A0I thought it was a way to make others aware of what is going on
>> in the school.
>>
>> People don't care anymore. =A0There has to be a large revamping of the
>> UA and a new connection made with the administration, which, yes, may
>> involve a lot of ass kissing if we're ever going to get anything done.
>>
>> If anything bitching and moaning would make the admins completely not
>> want to work with us.
>>
>> Think about it.
>> Ainsley
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 6:36 PM, Cinjon Resnick <cinjon@mit.edu> wrote:
>> > That seems antithetical to the grand idea of promoting student
>> > objectives,
>> > which is I believe strongly indicated in the name and spirit of the CF=
S.
>> >
>> > On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 6:30 PM, Nathan Lachenmyer <scottnla@mit.edu>
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> It's the UA's job to work with them. =A0It *should* be CFS's job to
>> >> humiliate them until they work with the UA.
>> >>
>> >> Nathan
>> >>
>> >> On Tue, 6 Apr 2010, Austen McRae wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> If you try to publicly make them lose face, or humiliate them, then
>> >>> they
>> >>> will get more defensive, and we will never make
>> >>> any progress.=A0 Whether they are right or wrong, they will stand ti=
ll
>> >>> the
>> >>> end so they don't lose face.=A0 It's human nature;
>> >>> if we were dealing with intellectuals we wouldn't have this problem.
>> >>>
>> >>> As such, I strongly recommend not taking this form of action.
>> >>>
>> >>> My 117 cents,
>> >>>
>> >>> -more cents
>> >>>
>> >>> On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 5:24 PM, Clayton Sims <ctsims@mit.edu> wrote:
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0If people are forming a PR approach to this issue: I'd re=
commend
>> >>> focusing on this notion, personally. These
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0administrators (those who don't just fetishize dining hal=
l
>> >>> culture)
>> >>> are working from a common data set which
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0says that:
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0* Students suck at feeding themselves
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0* Dining halls provide quality food which alleviates that=
problem
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0* Running piece-meal dining programs is expensive and cum=
bersome
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0Given these statements along with the premise "I have the=
right
>> >>> to
>> >>> control your actions", mandatory dining
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0seems like an entirely reasonable plan. Arguing with the
>> >>> administration about whether the above elements are
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0true is almost certainly a losing game (given that they d=
on't
>> >>> seem
>> >>> to care, and also that those statements
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0are almost certainly true for large subsets of students, =
possibly
>> >>> all of them).
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0MIT is upset to lose face in the public's eyes in general=
, and
>> >>> lose
>> >>> the support of its funders (both alumni
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0and other). If you can't hit MIT in one of those ways, yo=
u
>> >>> probably
>> >>> aren't going to get very far. I'd say
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0that trying to humiliate MIT in the eyes of the public an=
d alumni
>> >>> by
>> >>> focusing on how students are
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0increasingly treated like children rather than adults see=
ms like
>> >>> a
>> >>> way to do that.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0"Don't give money to MIT, it's a waste. Their students ar=
e too
>> >>> stupid to feed themselves: How could they
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0build rocket engines?"
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0"MIT graduates are an increasingly undesirable set of peo=
ple to
>> >>> hire. Being coddled all throughout their
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0college years leaves them unable to deal with real world
>> >>> problems."
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0If you can make the administration actually suffer in mea=
ningful
>> >>> ways (loss of funding, loss of face),
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0they'll acquiesce.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0Just remember that in many ways this is an argument about
>> >>> framing.
>> >>> It isn't about whether MIT is correct that
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0they will save 5% each year on dining, or whether the din=
ing
>> >>> options
>> >>> are sufficient, or whether students
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0really would save money and eat better if their plan goes
>> >>> through.
>> >>> It's about Freshman on Campus, in loco
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0parentis, and the fact that the MIT student body is compr=
ised of
>> >>> adults who have the right to make their own
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0decisions no matter what. That's what you should all be s=
creaming
>> >>> at
>> >>> the top of your lungs about.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0-Clayton
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0Daniel Hawkins wrote:
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Charles Stewart and John Essigman are fine pe=
ople, but
>> >>> their
>> >>> perspective (at least on dining
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0matters) is very much "it doesn't matter what=
students say;
>> >>> we
>> >>> know what's best for them."
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0-hwkns
>> >>>
>> >>> On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 2:57 PM, Keri Garel <thekeri@mit.edu
>> >>> <mailto:thekeri@mit.edu>> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0I second the recommendation of Matt McGann and also strongly
>> >>> =A0 =A0suggest avoiding Dean Randolph.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0Charles Stewart and John Essigmann are housemasters of McCorm=
ick
>> >>> =A0 =A0and Simmons (respectively) - I've worked with both of them in=
the
>> >>> =A0 =A0past, and they'd both be good people to turn to.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0-Keri
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 2:47 PM, Jessica H Lowell <jessiehl@mi=
t.edu
>> >>> =A0 =A0<mailto:jessiehl@mit.edu>> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0I second Winston and Wartman (and I would add Abelson=
,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Sussman, and Slocum to
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0the category of sympathetic profs. =A0Gray somewhat v=
aries by
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0issue - I have no
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0idea what he thinks about Dining. =A0Personally, I wo=
uldn't
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0generally take senior
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0admins into my confidence on controversial issues - t=
hey can
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0be helpful to work
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0with, but there's a difference between a helpful part=
ner and
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0someone you really
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0trust. =A0Hastings and Lerman both signed on to today=
's letter
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0in the Tech - make
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0of that what you will.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0I would add Matt McGann in Admissions as someone I'd =
trust
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0absolutely and who
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0can give good advice.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0I *strongly* dis-recommend Randolph.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0- Jessie
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Quoting Martin F Holmes <goholmes@MIT.EDU
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0<mailto:goholmes@MIT.EDU>>:
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Whenever I got the impression that students w=
ere being
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0manipulated by the
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0administration, there were a few key people I=
always went
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0to for advice or
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0help. =A0Here's my laundry list of great cont=
acts that you
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0can be very forward
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0and upfront with and who will listen to you a=
nd provide
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0solid confidential
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0advice:
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Dan Hastings (Dean for Undergraduate Educatio=
n, not
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0involved with DSL but great
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0advocate and still has influence, respect, an=
d power with
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0senior admins)
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Bish Sanyal (former Chair of the Faculty, ver=
y sympathetic
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0to student concerns,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0not sure of his current sway as former chair =
though)
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Paul Gray (former President, hard to get a me=
eting with,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0not directly involved
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0with administration, but can provide you with=
great advice
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0and still use his
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0weight when he desires to add pressure to a s=
ituation)
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Phil Walsh (Director of Campus Activities Com=
plex, very
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0experienced and
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0knowledgeable, able to provide good advice, h=
as some sway
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0within DSL and great
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0experience with dining in the past)
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Anne McCants (former Chair of Faculty Committ=
ee on Student
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Life, huge student
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0advocate, likely still has some influence wit=
hin DSL)
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Jim Champy (one of the most influence members=
of the
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Corporation, member of
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Executive Committee of the Corporation, very =
difficult to
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0get ahold of and
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0likely requires a meeting request from Mike, =
Maggie,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Vrajesh, or Sammi, a huge
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0student ally although he usually works behind=
the scenes,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0provides very
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0reasonable and balanced advice, has a ton of =
sway withing
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0all levels of MIT)
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Steve Lerman (Vice Chancellor, about to leave=
MIT,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0provides awesome confidential
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0advice, listens well to students, has huge sw=
ay within the
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0administration but
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0that may be subsiding given his pending depar=
ture from MIT)
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Rafael Reif (Provost, hard to get a meeting w=
ith, listens
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0and sympathizes with
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0students but requires a degree of tact since =
he's clearly
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0a member of the
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0senior admin, has a tremendous amount of sway=
and leverage)
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Dana Mead (Chairman of the Corporation, retir=
ing at end of
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0year, strong student
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0advocate but also requires tremendous tact si=
nce he is a
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0senior leader of MIT,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0tremendous amount of sway)
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Patrick Winston (Professor, very sympathetic =
to student
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0concerns and provides
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0good advice, limited sway withing DSL)
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Jed Wartman (limited sway but provides good s=
ound advice)
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Robert Randolph (limited sway but provides go=
od sound
>> >>> advice)
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0I'd also recommend combing through recent iss=
ues of The
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Tech and Faculty
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Newsletter to identify other members of the f=
aculty,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0administratior, or
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Corporation that you feel like may be strong =
student
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0advocates.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Martin
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Quoting "Liz A. Denys" <lizdenys@MIT.EDU
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0<mailto:lizdenys@MIT.EDU>>:
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0I have a pretty well established rela=
tionship with
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Muriel. I'll try to meet with her thi=
s week.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0-Liz
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Andrew Lukmann wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Hey Ted,
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0I'm sorry to hear that, but i=
t certainly makes
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0sense given my experience wit=
h her when she was an
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Asst. Housemaster at Simmons =
(5-7 yrs. ago). I
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0mentioned her mostly for the =
fact that she is one
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0of the few people who are usu=
ally willing to talk
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0with students and who, by the=
nature of her
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0position, has some real lever=
age over DSL. In
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0general, she's probably someo=
ne that active
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0student advocates should buil=
d a relationship with
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0- even if she proves to be al=
together unhelpful on
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0the dining front, she may be =
willing to take a
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0stand on other things that st=
udents care about.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0-Andrew L.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Ted Hilk wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Hey Andrew,
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0The last time I spoke=
with Prof. Muriel
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Medard, she was tryin=
g to justify reducing
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0financial aid by $140=
0 for students opting out
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0of the dining plan wh=
en the actual difference
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0in expenses between d=
ining hall food and
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0cooking for oneself o=
ver a year is only $500
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0on average. =A0Neverm=
ind the fact that this
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0would essentially be =
predicating student aid
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0on student choices (s=
hould I get extra
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0financial aid if I wa=
nt a new computer?).
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 After half an hour s=
he finally admitted that
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0the amount was arbitr=
ary and that the extra
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0deduction was solely =
intended to 'encourage'
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0students to buy into =
the dining system. =A0She
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0is very polite and wi=
lling to talk at great
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0length about issues, =
but I'm afraid she does
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0not appear to be in s=
upport of the student
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0perspective on this m=
atter.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Ted
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0On Sun, Apr 4, 2010 a=
t 7:12 PM, Andrew Lukmann
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0<lukymann@mit.edu <ma=
ilto:lukymann@mit.edu>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0<mailto:lukymann@mit.=
edu
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0<mailto:lukymann@mit.=
edu>>> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Hey Jessie (and =
everybody else)...
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Like you pointed=
out, a number of reliable
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0student allies in the
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 administration h=
ave moved on and on the
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0whole, less cooperati=
ve
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 people have repl=
aced them. Without a guy
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0like Immer or Larry t=
o go
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 to, this generat=
ion of student leaders is
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0(I believe) having a
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 harder leveragin=
g their relationships than
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0we did. That said,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 there are still =
a number of people who
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0might have a bit of p=
ull in
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 DSL that I would=
recommend people engage,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0if they haven't alrea=
dy:
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Phil Walsh (CAC)=
, Ann McCants (former
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0faculty CSL chair), M=
uriel
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Medard (CSL chai=
r - though her opinions on
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0dining might be
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 well-ingrained).=
Also, even though he is on
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0his way out, I've
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 always found Ste=
ve Lerman to be a friend to
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0students and he might
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 be in the positi=
on to speak (or act) a
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0little more freely no=
w that
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 he is moving to =
GWU.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 I think it's gre=
at to see a number of
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0students realizing th=
at they
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 need to hold adm=
inistrators feet to the
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0fire when they fall s=
hort
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 of their own rhe=
toric/promises regarding
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0meaningfully engaging
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 students on impo=
rtant issues. If you (and I
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0do mean all of you)
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 don't make it di=
fficult (or embarrassing)
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0for them to ignore yo=
u,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 they will never =
have any incentive to act
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0in your best interest
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 any time it conf=
licts with the easiest path
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0to their goals (in
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 this case, dinin=
g cost effectiveness).
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Keep it up!
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 -Andrew L.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Jessica H Lowell=
wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Quoting =
Daniel Hawkins <hwkns@MIT.EDU
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0<mailto:hwkns@MIT.EDU=
> <mailto:hwkns@MIT.EDU
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0<mailto:hwkns@MIT.EDU=
>>>:
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =
Jessie,
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =
We tried coming up with our own
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0proposal last year (D=
PC).
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =
=A0Admins keep
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =
calling it "an important piece of
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0student input" and
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =
completely ignoring its
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =
contents. =A0What's driving this is
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0the desire to elimina=
te
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =
the deficit and
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =
"build community" around dining,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0which involves less
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =
choice and more money
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =
(but not MIT's money - they need to
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0eliminate the
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =
deficit). =A0Those are
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =
principles that everyone in the
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0administration (that =
I'm
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =
aware of) agrees
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =
on. =A0I haven't talked to Matt -
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0I'll send him an e-ma=
il.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Yeah, I =
saw the proposal. =A0It looked
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0like a good step. =A0=
It's
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 the same=
old story
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 with Din=
ing. =A0When I dealt with that,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0though, it was easier=
,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 because =
larryben
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 (Columbo=
's predecessor) was still
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0around and he was on =
our side.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Who does=
Columbo listen to? =A0Presumably
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Phil Clay, but I doub=
t
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Clay's u=
seful
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 here. =
=A0Immerman's gone, so that's a
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0non-starter. =A0The F=
SILGs
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 generall=
y have a
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 stake in=
students not getting screwed
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0over on Dining, since
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 less cho=
ice often
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 hurts th=
eir frosh and on-campus members
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0- is anyone on the
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 FSILG si=
de of the
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Student =
Life staff persuadable and
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0trusted by Columbo? =
=A0Could
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 any of t=
he RLAs
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 help her=
e? =A0If Admissions has any
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0influence with Columb=
o,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 which th=
ey may not,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 they'd l=
ikely be willing to help you
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0out with him.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 It sound=
s like if you keep working
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0primarily with Columb=
o,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 you're n=
ot going to
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 get anyw=
here. =A0Obviously, you have to
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0work with him,
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 communic=
ate with him, not
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 antagoni=
ze him too much. =A0But that
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0doesn't mean you can'=
t work
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 with oth=
er
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 people (=
sounds like a good project for
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0a senator or two!).
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0And i=
f you can dig
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 up admin=
istrative allies, they might be
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0able to make more
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 progress=
with Columbo
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 than you=
can.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Have you=
bugged your rich
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0potential-big-donor a=
lumni? =A0Many
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 FSILGs a=
nd some dorm
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 living g=
roups keep in contact with a
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0lot of their alumni, =
and
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 might be=
able to
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 dig up a=
few wealthy folks who would be
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0pissed about students
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 being sc=
rewed
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 over on =
dining.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 The UA h=
as little real power given to
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0it - it has to find w=
ays
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 to manuf=
acture
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 its own.
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 - Jessie
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0-- =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Li=
z A. Denys
>> >>> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0lizdenys@mit.edu <mailto:lizdenys@mit=
.edu>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> =A0 =A0--
>> >>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>> >>> =A0 =A0Keri Garel
>> >>> =A0 =A0Department of Brain and Cognitive Sciences
>> >>> =A0 =A0MIT Class of 2010
>> >>> =A0 =A0thekeri@mit.edu <mailto:thekeri@mit.edu>
>> >>> =A0 =A0http://keri.mitblogs.com/
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Ainsley K. Braun
>> Massachusetts Institute of Technology
>> Department of Brain and Cognitive Sciences
>> Class of 2010
>> ainsleyb@mit.edu
>> 603.957.2822
>
>
