[96629] in North American Network Operators' Group
Re: [cacti-announce] Cacti 0.8.6j Released (fwd)
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Dorn Hetzel)
Thu May 17 08:02:05 2007
Date: Thu, 17 May 2007 08:00:26 -0400
From: "Dorn Hetzel" <dhetzel@gmail.com>
To: nanog@merit.edu
In-Reply-To: <20070517051100.GB8115@subspacefield.org>
Errors-To: owner-nanog@merit.edu
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ASN.1 is quite concrete, and specifys several encoding methods (I prefer BER
myself) :)
I'm not saying everyone would consider it pretty, but it's quite concrete
...
Check out http://lionet.info/asn1c/
On 5/17/07, Travis H. <travis+ml-nanog@subspacefield.org> wrote:
>
> On Wed, May 09, 2007 at 10:25:14AM +0100, michael.dillon@bt.com wrote:
> > A MIB is the database schema for an object-oriented hierarchical
> > database. The key words there are schema and hierarchical.
>
> A-ha!
>
> So when they say "object" as in "OID", they are referring to stuff in
> the MIB database? Okay, now many things are beginning to make more
> sense. By itself, that word gives no clue as to what it refers to.
> For that matter, it'd be nice if someone defined LDAP's use of the
> word "attribute", too.
>
> Drift:
>
> LDAP too uses ASN.1, in fact the same OIDs used by SNMP, and in the
> O'Reilly book it mentions that it is possible to define different
> matching rules for each class. Now, do they mean that somehow, this
> MIB syntax can actually encode an algorithm in some kind of hideous
> turing-machine-gone-mad, and that I've got to worry about malicious
> MIBs, or does it just refer to a routine implemented elsewhere?
>
> > Schema means
> > that it describes how the data is organized
>
> Should read: ``Schemata describe how the data are organized''
>
> Stigma, stigmata; schema, schemata
>
> :-)
>
> Forgive me if I digress into ASN.1 very briefly; it apparently rears its
> ugly head in numerous places in cryptography as well as networking, and
> I have struggled with it a bit.
>
> Based on what I have read, this syntax is "abstract" in the sense that
> it says something like "class C is composed of a DATE object, TIME
> object, and BLARG object", without specifying how to encode or decode
> any of those objects into some concrete form either for the user or to
> put in a packet to send to another system. The encoding and decoding
> is done with a "transfer syntax", and interpreting it for a human
> (that is, figuring out a way to represent it) is yet another unsolved
> problem. Sounds a lot like stone soup (or XML) to me.
>
> > That would work but it can be tricky to get the RIGHT MIBs that match
> > the data actually available in your device. Also, reading MIBs can be
> > misleading because you will see things that look great, but don't work
> > because they are deprecated
>
> Those of you who use this word frequently may be amused at its definition:
>
> To pray against, as an evil; to seek to avert by prayer; to seek
> deliverance from; to express deep regret for; to desire the removal
> of. [archaic]
>
> > Now you see where the SNMP alligator swamp lies. If you are building
> > your own network management applications, you may be happier only
> > putting the MIBs on the development machines, and putting the numeric
> > keys into your application code, or better yet, into your application's
> > config file. MIBs have lots of stuff that you probably don't need unless
> > you are allowing users to browse through and query arbitrary data.
>
> Yeah, at this point I'm just playing around and exploring,
> and so want the MIBs to make sense of the numbers.
> --
> Kill dash nine, and its no more CPU time, kill dash nine, and that
> process is mine. -><- <URL:http://www.subspacefield.org/~travis/>
> For a good time on my UBE blacklist, email john@subspacefield.org.
>
>
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<div>ASN.1 is quite concrete, and specifys several encoding methods (I prefer BER myself) :)</div>
<div>I'm not saying everyone would consider it pretty, but it's quite concrete ...</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Check out <a href="http://lionet.info/asn1c/">http://lionet.info/asn1c/</a> <br><br> </div>
<div><span class="gmail_quote">On 5/17/07, <b class="gmail_sendername">Travis H.</b> <<a href="mailto:travis+ml-nanog@subspacefield.org">travis+ml-nanog@subspacefield.org</a>> wrote:</span>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">On Wed, May 09, 2007 at 10:25:14AM +0100, <a href="mailto:michael.dillon@bt.com">michael.dillon@bt.com</a>
wrote:<br>> A MIB is the database schema for an object-oriented hierarchical<br>> database. The key words there are schema and hierarchical.<br><br>A-ha!<br><br>So when they say "object" as in "OID", they are referring to stuff in
<br>the MIB database? Okay, now many things are beginning to make more<br>sense. By itself, that word gives no clue as to what it refers to.<br>For that matter, it'd be nice if someone defined LDAP's use of the<br>
word "attribute", too.<br><br>Drift:<br><br>LDAP too uses ASN.1, in fact the same OIDs used by SNMP, and in the<br>O'Reilly book it mentions that it is possible to define different<br>matching rules for each class. Now, do they mean that somehow, this
<br>MIB syntax can actually encode an algorithm in some kind of hideous<br>turing-machine-gone-mad, and that I've got to worry about malicious<br>MIBs, or does it just refer to a routine implemented elsewhere?<br><br>
> Schema means<br>> that it describes how the data is organized<br><br>Should read: ``Schemata describe how the data are organized''<br><br>Stigma, stigmata; schema, schemata<br><br>:-)<br><br>Forgive me if I digress into
ASN.1 very briefly; it apparently rears its<br>ugly head in numerous places in cryptography as well as networking, and<br>I have struggled with it a bit.<br><br>Based on what I have read, this syntax is "abstract" in the sense that
<br>it says something like "class C is composed of a DATE object, TIME<br>object, and BLARG object", without specifying how to encode or decode<br>any of those objects into some concrete form either for the user or to
<br>put in a packet to send to another system. The encoding and decoding<br>is done with a "transfer syntax", and interpreting it for a human<br>(that is, figuring out a way to represent it) is yet another unsolved
<br>problem. Sounds a lot like stone soup (or XML) to me.<br><br>> That would work but it can be tricky to get the RIGHT MIBs that match<br>> the data actually available in your device. Also, reading MIBs can be<br>
> misleading because you will see things that look great, but don't work<br>> because they are deprecated<br><br>Those of you who use this word frequently may be amused at its definition:<br><br>To pray against, as an evil; to seek to avert by prayer; to seek
<br>deliverance from; to express deep regret for; to desire the removal<br>of. [archaic]<br><br>> Now you see where the SNMP alligator swamp lies. If you are building<br>> your own network management applications, you may be happier only
<br>> putting the MIBs on the development machines, and putting the numeric<br>> keys into your application code, or better yet, into your application's<br>> config file. MIBs have lots of stuff that you probably don't need unless
<br>> you are allowing users to browse through and query arbitrary data.<br><br>Yeah, at this point I'm just playing around and exploring,<br>and so want the MIBs to make sense of the numbers.<br>--<br>Kill dash nine, and its no more CPU time, kill dash nine, and that
<br>process is mine. -><- <URL:<a href="http://www.subspacefield.org/~travis/">http://www.subspacefield.org/~travis/</a>><br>For a good time on my UBE blacklist, email <a href="mailto:john@subspacefield.org">john@subspacefield.org
</a>.<br><br></blockquote></div><br>
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