[94089] in North American Network Operators' Group
Re: Network end users to pull down 2 gigabytes a day, continuously?
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Gian Constantine)
Tue Jan 9 13:10:45 2007
In-Reply-To: <B070B4D1-05B3-4DD4-A8AF-939211B0206E@ca.afilias.info>
Cc: Thomas Leavitt <thomas@thomasleavitt.org>, nanog@merit.edu
From: Gian Constantine <constantinegi@corp.earthlink.net>
Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 13:04:29 -0500
To: Joe Abley <jabley@ca.afilias.info>
Errors-To: owner-nanog@merit.edu
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You are correct. Today, IP multicast is limited to a few small closed
networks. If we ever migrate to IPv6, this would instantly change.
One of my previous assertions was the possibility of streaming video
as the major motivator of IPv6 migration. Without it, video streaming
to a large market, outside of multicasting in a closed network, is
not scalable, and therefore, not feasible. Unicast streaming is a
short-term bandwidth-hogging solution without a future at high take
rates.
Gian Anthony Constantine
Senior Network Design Engineer
Earthlink, Inc.
Office: 404-748-6207
Cell: 404-808-4651
Internal Ext: x22007
constantinegi@corp.earthlink.net
On Jan 9, 2007, at 11:47 AM, Joe Abley wrote:
>
> On 9-Jan-2007, at 11:29, Gian Constantine wrote:
>
>> Those numbers are reasonably accurate for some networks at certain
>> times. There is often a back and forth between BitTorrent and NNTP
>> traffic. Many ISPs regulate BitTorrent traffic for this very
>> reason. Massive increases in this type of traffic would not be
>> looked upon favorably.
>
> The act of regulating p2p traffic is a bit like playing whack-a-
> mole. At what point does it cost more to play that game than it
> costs to build out to carry the traffic?
>
>> If you considered my previous posts, you would know I agree
>> streaming is scary on a large scale, but unicast streaming is what
>> I reference. Multicast streaming is the real solution. Ultimately,
>> a global multicast network is the only way to deliver these
>> services to a large market.
>
> The trouble with IP multicast is that it doesn't exist, in a wide-
> scale, deployed, inter-provider sense.
>
>
> Joe
>
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<HTML><BODY style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -khtml-nbsp-mode: space; =
-khtml-line-break: after-white-space; ">You are correct. Today, IP =
multicast is limited to a few small closed networks. If we ever migrate =
to IPv6, this would instantly change. One of my previous assertions was =
the possibility of streaming video as the major motivator of IPv6 =
migration. Without it, video streaming to a large market, outside of =
multicasting in a closed network, is not scalable, and therefore, not =
feasible. Unicast streaming is a short-term bandwidth-hogging solution =
without a future at high take rates.<DIV><BR><DIV> <SPAN =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
border-spacing: 0px 0px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; =
font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: =
normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; text-align: auto; =
-khtml-text-decorations-in-effect: none; text-indent: 0px; =
-apple-text-size-adjust: auto; text-transform: none; orphans: 2; =
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; "><SPAN =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
border-spacing: 0px 0px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; =
font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: =
normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; text-align: auto; =
-khtml-text-decorations-in-effect: none; text-indent: 0px; =
-apple-text-size-adjust: auto; text-transform: none; orphans: 2; =
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; "><DIV>Gian Anthony =
Constantine</DIV><DIV>Senior Network Design =
Engineer</DIV><DIV>Earthlink, Inc.</DIV><DIV>Office: =
404-748-6207</DIV><DIV>Cell: 404-808-4651</DIV><DIV>Internal Ext: =
x22007</DIV><DIV><A =
href=3D"mailto:constantinegi@corp.earthlink.net">constantinegi@corp.earthl=
ink.net</A></DIV><DIV><BR class=3D"khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><BR =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"></SPAN></SPAN> =
</DIV><BR><DIV><DIV>On Jan 9, 2007, at 11:47 AM, Joe Abley =
wrote:</DIV><BR class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><BLOCKQUOTE =
type=3D"cite"><DIV style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; =
margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV =
style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; =
margin-left: 0px; ">On 9-Jan-2007, at 11:29, Gian Constantine =
wrote:</DIV><DIV style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; =
margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV> =
<BLOCKQUOTE type=3D"cite"><DIV style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: =
0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Those numbers are =
reasonably accurate for some networks at certain times. There is often a =
back and forth between BitTorrent and NNTP traffic. Many ISPs regulate =
BitTorrent traffic for this very reason. Massive increases in this type =
of traffic would not be looked upon favorably.</DIV> </BLOCKQUOTE><DIV =
style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; =
margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style=3D"margin-top: =
0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">The act =
of regulating p2p traffic is a bit like playing whack-a-mole. At what =
point does it cost more to play that game than it costs to build out to =
carry the traffic?</DIV><DIV style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: =
0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; =
"><BR></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE type=3D"cite"><DIV style=3D"margin-top: 0px; =
margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">If you =
considered my previous posts, you would know I agree streaming is scary =
on a large scale, but unicast streaming is what I reference. Multicast =
streaming is the real solution. Ultimately, a global multicast network =
is the only way to deliver these services to a large market.</DIV> =
</BLOCKQUOTE><DIV style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; =
margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV =
style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; =
margin-left: 0px; ">The trouble with IP multicast is that it doesn't =
exist, in a wide-scale, deployed, inter-provider sense.</DIV><DIV =
style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; =
margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style=3D"margin-top: =
0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; =
min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV><DIV style=3D"margin-top: 0px; =
margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Joe</DIV><DIV =
style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; =
margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><BR></DIV> =
</BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR></DIV></BODY></HTML>=
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