[178469] in North American Network Operators' Group
Re: Who is covered [was VZ...]
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Adam Rothschild)
Fri Feb 27 17:34:25 2015
X-Original-To: nanog@nanog.org
In-Reply-To: <D1164FF5.F9D71%jason_livingood@cable.comcast.com>
From: Adam Rothschild <asr@latency.net>
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 17:22:44 -0500
To: "Livingood, Jason" <Jason_Livingood@cable.comcast.com>
Cc: NANOG <nanog@nanog.org>
Errors-To: nanog-bounces@nanog.org
I think "terminating access monopoly" is (rightly IMO) the litmus test
for coverage, but I am not an attorney either...
$0.02,
-a
On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 4:54 PM, Livingood, Jason
<Jason_Livingood@cable.comcast.com> wrote:
> I have the same question. No one will know for sure until the rules are
> released, but my guess is it potentially covers more than people may
> initially think.
>
> For example, I would guess many =C2=B3transit=C2=B2 networks will be cove=
red since
> they also provide in many cases retail access to schools, hospitals,
> government, business, etc. It=C2=B9s not much of a stretch to see how CDN=
s,
> hosters, and others may be covered by at least parts of this, such as
> transparency/policy disclosure, maybe measurement. Blocking, throttling,
> and paid prioritization could also apply in some critical ways, especiall=
y
> given the % of Internet traffic that uses CDNs for example.
>
>
> Again, the key may be that there will be ambiguity that may only be sorte=
d
> out as case law develops around each of these areas. But IANAL so I=C2=B9=
m just
> guessing like the rest of us for now! ;-)
>
> - Jason
>
> On 2/27/15, 3:44 PM, "Adam Rothschild" <asr@latency.net> wrote:
>
>>I interpreted the FCC press release[*] to apply these provisions to
>>"broadband access" providers only -- that is to say, not hosters, nor
>>CDNs. It will indeed be interesting to see how this works once the full
>>documentation is released.
>>
>>FWIW,
>>-a
>>
>>[*]
>>http://transition.fcc.gov/Daily_Releases/Daily_Business/2015/db0226/DOC-3=
3
>>2260A1.pdf
>>
>>On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 2:49 PM, McElearney, Kevin
>><Kevin_McElearney@cable.comcast.com> wrote:
>>> [Sorry for top-posting]
>>>
>>> I actually think you are both right and partially wrong. It IS the ISP=
s
>>> responsibility to provide you with the broadband that was advertised an=
d
>>> you paid for. This is also measured today by the FCC through Measuring
>>> Broadband America.
>>>
>>>http://data.fcc.gov/download/measuring-broadband-america/2014/2014-Fixed=
-
>>>Me
>>> asuring-Broadband-America-Report.pdf
>>>
>>> That said, your ISP is NOT =C2=B3the Internet=C2=B2 and can=C2=B9t guar=
antee =C2=B3access
>>>the
>>> Internet sites of my choice at X megabits per second." While ISPs do
>>>take
>>> the phone call for all Internet problems (sometimes not very well), the=
y
>>> certainly don=C2=B9t control all levels of the QoE. ASPs may have
>>>server/site
>>> issues internally, CDNs may purposely throttle downloads (content owner=
s
>>> contract commits), not all transit ISPs are created equal, TCP distance
>>> limitations, etc.
>>>
>>> What would be interesting is if all these rules/principals and
>>> transparency requirements were to be applied to all involved in the
>>> consumer QoE.
>>>
>>> - Kevin
>>>
>>> On 2/27/15, 1:34 PM, "Mel Beckman" <mel@beckman.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Bill,
>>>>
>>>>This is not feasible. ISPs work by oversubscription, so it's never
>>>>possible for all (or even 10% of all) customers to simultaneously deman=
d
>>>>their full bandwidth. If ISPs had to reserve the full bandwidth sold to
>>>>each customer in order to "do everything reasonably within your power t=
o
>>>>make sure I can access the Internet sites of my choice at X megabits pe=
r
>>>>second", then broadband connections would cost thousands of dollars per
>>>>month.
>>>>
>>>>Anyone who doesn't understand this fundamental fact of Internet
>>>>distribution will be unable to engage in reasonable discussion about IS=
P
>>>>practices.
>>>>
>>>>On Feb 27, 2015, at 9:56 AM, William Herrin
>>>><bill@herrin.us<mailto:bill@herrin.us>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Deceit is Bad Behavior. If you sell me an X megabit per second
>>>>Internet access service, you should do everything reasonably within
>>>>your power to make sure I can access the Internet sites of my choice
>>>>at X megabits per second.
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
