[177885] in North American Network Operators' Group
Re: Low cost WDM gear
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Faisal Imtiaz)
Sat Feb 7 15:40:35 2015
X-Original-To: nanog@nanog.org
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2015 20:40:26 +0000 (GMT)
From: Faisal Imtiaz <faisal@snappytelecom.net>
To: Mike Hammett <nanog@ics-il.net>
In-Reply-To: <13363836.1143.1423337516982.JavaMail.mhammett@ThunderFuck>
Cc: NANOG <nanog@nanog.org>
Errors-To: nanog-bounces@nanog.org
Mike,
Lighting up dark fiber is very similar to doing fixed wireless links (which=
you are familiar with).
There are different components involved in making a solutions work.... for =
each of the problems you have stated there is solution, and yes you have to=
calculate the loss and match power / optics to make it work.
FYI.. all CWDM/DWDM Muxes are passive ... :)
Active components (can be external or integrated).
If you want to do a direct run, from DC to DC using the Dark Fiber, you wil=
l need to have signal regeneration (or you may be able to get away with amp=
s).
It is commonly expected for the transport provider to hand off the live cir=
cuit using standard SFP/SFP+, which means that they have to use a 'media co=
nverter' of some sorts to covert from Colorized Light to Standard 1330 or 8=
80nm hand off.
If you want more info, hit me off list.
Regards.
Faisal Imtiaz
Snappy Internet & Telecom
----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mike Hammett" <nanog@ics-il.net>
> To: "NANOG" <nanog@nanog.org>
> Sent: Saturday, February 7, 2015 2:32:14 PM
> Subject: Re: Low cost WDM gear
>=20
> Multiple 10G, yes. I'll reach out to the vendors mentioned to see how the=
y
> line up, but it looks like I need to look into amps for the passive gear.
> There's 8 huts between the two ends, so no shortage of opportunities to
> amplify the signal. I'll know more about that when I get the amount of lo=
ss
> along the route.
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> Most people I know leasing circuits are doing so because dark isn't avail=
able
> or is otherwise ass expensive due to above shortage. The last quote I got
> for dark out of a useful facility was like $2M. 100+ miles was like $200k=
,
> the last 10 miles or whatever was the balance. Even $100k for gear (two
> sides and some amps) pales in comparison to $2k+ a month for the next 20
> years for a single channel.
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> -----
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>=20
> ----- Original Message -----
>=20
> From: "Phil Bedard" <bedard.phil@gmail.com>
> To: "Mike Hammett" <nanog@ics-il.net>, "NANOG" <nanog@nanog.org>
> Sent: Saturday, February 7, 2015 1:17:48 PM
> Subject: Re: Low cost WDM gear
>=20
> Is this for 10G? I'm kind of assuming 10G. What kind of equipment is
> being plugged into these? 300km is way beyond what you'll get with a
> passive solution, it's definitely in the "long-haul" terrtory. If you are
> launching out of a router the best pluggable optic you can generally get
> is rated at 80km, 10GBase-ZR, but even a passive mux at each end shaves
> some of that distance off.
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> 300km is going to require amplifiers at intervals across the span. Who is
> providing the fiber? I'd start talking to traditional transport vendors.
> Ekinops as mentioned is probably decent at a lower price, Adva works well
> and isn't all that expensive, even Cisco has gear reasonably priced. If
> you want to cover 300km on a fiber span though "cheap" isn't really a wor=
d
> I would describe. It's why people lease circuits. :)
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> Phil
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> On 2/7/15, 18:04, "Mike Hammett" <nanog@ics-il.net> wrote:
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> >One particular route I'm looking at is 185 miles, so of the options
> >presented 300 km is closest. ;-)
> >=20
> >=20
> >=20
> >=20
> >-----
> >Mike Hammett
> >Intelligent Computing Solutions
> >http://www.ics-il.com
> >=20
> >----- Original Message -----
> >=20
> >From: "Christopher Morrow" <morrowc.lists@gmail.com>
> >To: "Kenneth McRae" <kenneth.mcrae@me.com>
> >Cc: "NANOG" <nanog@nanog.org>
> >Sent: Saturday, February 7, 2015 12:02:11 PM
> >Subject: Re: Low cost WDM gear
> >=20
> >would be good for mike to define 'long distances' here, is it:
> >2km
> >30km
> >300km
> >3000km
> >=20
> >Probably the 30-60k range is what you mean by 'long distances' but...
> >clarity might help.
> >=20
> >On Sat, Feb 7, 2015 at 12:55 PM, Kenneth McRae <kenneth.mcrae@me.com>
> >wrote:
> >> Mike,
> >>=20
> >> I just replaced a bunch of FiberStore WDM passive muxes with OSI
> >>Hardware
> >> equipment. The FiberStore gear was a huge disappointment (excessive
> >>loss,
> >> poor technical support, refusal to issue refund without threatening
> >>legal
> >> action, etc.). I have had good results from the OSI equipment so far. =
I
> >> run passive muxes for CWDM (8 - 16 channels).
> >>=20
> >> On Feb 07, 2015, at 09:51 AM, Manuel Mar=C3=ADn <mmg@transtelco.net> w=
rote:
> >>=20
> >> Hi Mike
> >>=20
> >> I can recommend a couple of vendors that provide cost effective
> >>solutions.
> >> Ekinops & Packetlight.
> >>=20
> >> On Saturday, February 7, 2015, Mike Hammett <nanog@ics-il.net> wrote:
> >>=20
> >> I know there are various Asian vendors for low cost (less than $500)
> >>muxes
> >> to throw 16 or however many colors onto a strand. However, they don't
> >>work
> >> so well when you don't control the optics used on both sides (therefor=
e
> >> must use standard wavelengths), obviously only do a handful of channel=
s
> >>and
> >> have a distance limitation.
> >> What solutions are out there that don't cost an arm and a leg?
> >> -----
> >> Mike Hammett
> >> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> >> http://www.ics-il.com
> >>=20
> >>=20
> >> --
> >> TRANSTELCO| Manuel Marin | VP Engineering | US: *+1 915-217-2232* | MX=
:
> >>*+52
> >> 656-257-1109*
> >>=20
> >> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication is intended only for the us=
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