[98543] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Canon for answering negative questions
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (lojmIt tI'wI' nuv 'utlh)
Sun May 4 16:59:42 2014
From: lojmIt tI'wI' nuv 'utlh <lojmitti7wi7nuv@gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CA+7zAmMRqZcRRgg2VZwN8d4oJnvM3WAHD6YUg8DANTHP2Aio4g@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 4 May 2014 11:52:09 -0400
To: De'vID <de.vid.jonpin@gmail.com>
Cc: KLI <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@kli.org
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My problem with this interpretation of {HIja=92} and {ghobe=92} is that =
different people will say with absolute confidence that a yes or no =
answer means exactly the opposite of what other people say it does. In =
the Shakespeare speech, he is saying, =93Do we not bleed?=94 as a kind =
of incredulous reaction to the suggestion that we are below the =
threshold of beings one should empathize with. He=92s saying, =93Are you =
so bold as to suggest that we do not bleed?=94
So, if you answer =93Yes=94 or =93No=94, are you answering the part =
about whether or not you are so bold, or are you answering the part =
about whether or not we bleed? In general, I think this is the kind of =
question best answered with a clear and complete statement, instead of =
bothering with a =93yes=94 or =93no=94 that can be so easily =
misinterpreted.
When you negate the verb, you make the question a lousy yes/no question, =
even if it sounds like one.
It=92s like if you are driving, and you are at an intersection and you =
turn to your friend who knows the way better than you do, if you ask, =
=93We turn left here, right?=94 and your friend answers, =93Right,=94 =
then you and your friend are both behaving in a manner indistinguishable =
from that of idiots. You don=92t care enough about the question to ask =
it in a way that the answer is likely to be meaningful and clear, and =
your friend doesn=92t care enough about giving you meaningful =
information to answer it unambiguously.
I=92ve been one of those people, turning left with confirmed confidence =
as the friend excitedly yells, =93NO! RIGHT! TURN RIGHT!"
lojmIt tI=92wI=92 nuv =91utlh
Door Repair Guy, Retired Honorably
On May 4, 2014, at 11:14 AM, De'vID <de.vid.jonpin@gmail.com> wrote:
>=20
> Qov:
> > What canon do we have indicating whether the answer to a negative =
question like :
> >
> > 'umbe''a' loDHom?
> >
> > would be
> >
> > HIja=92, =91um.
> >
> > or
> > ghobe=92, =91um.
>=20
> I don't have any canon, but what reason is there to think it wouldn't =
be {HIja', 'umbe'} to begin with? The answer to {'umchoH'a'} is {HIja', =
'umchoH}, and the answer to {belHa''a'} is {HIja', belHa'}, etc. I can't =
think of any reason {-be'} should behave differently than any other =
suffix in how it interacts with {-'a'}.
>=20
> Qov:
> > All I can think of is cheDuQchugh mareghbe=92=92a=92? which is of =
course rhetorical.
>=20
> ghobe', mareghbej.
>=20
> --=20
> De'vID
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> Tlhingan-hol mailing list
> Tlhingan-hol@kli.org
> http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol
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charset=3Dwindows-1252"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: =
after-white-space;"><div>My problem with this interpretation of {HIja=92} =
and {ghobe=92} is that different people will say with absolute =
confidence that a yes or no answer means exactly the opposite of what =
other people say it does. In the Shakespeare speech, he is saying, =93Do =
we not bleed?=94 as a kind of incredulous reaction to the suggestion =
that we are below the threshold of beings one should empathize with. =
He=92s saying, =93Are you so bold as to suggest that we do not =
bleed?=94</div><div><br></div><div>So, if you answer =93Yes=94 or =93No=94=
, are you answering the part about whether or not you are so bold, or =
are you answering the part about whether or not we bleed? In general, I =
think this is the kind of question best answered with a clear and =
complete statement, instead of bothering with a =93yes=94 or =93no=94 =
that can be so easily misinterpreted.</div><div><br></div><div>When you =
negate the verb, you make the question a lousy yes/no question, even if =
it sounds like one.</div><div><br></div><div>It=92s like if you are =
driving, and you are at an intersection and you turn to your friend who =
knows the way better than you do, if you ask, =93We turn left here, =
right?=94 and your friend answers, =93Right,=94 then you and your friend =
are both behaving in a manner indistinguishable from that of idiots. You =
don=92t care enough about the question to ask it in a way that the =
answer is likely to be meaningful and clear, and your friend doesn=92t =
care enough about giving you meaningful information to answer it =
unambiguously.</div><div><br></div><div>I=92ve been one of those people, =
turning left with confirmed confidence as the friend excitedly yells, =
=93NO! RIGHT! TURN RIGHT!"</div><br><div>
<div><div>lojmIt tI=92wI=92 nuv =91utlh</div><div>Door Repair Guy, =
Retired Honorably</div></div><div><br></div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline">
</div>
<br><div><div>On May 4, 2014, at 11:14 AM, De'vID <<a =
href=3D"mailto:de.vid.jonpin@gmail.com">de.vid.jonpin@gmail.com</a>> =
wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><p dir=3D"ltr"><br>
Qov:<br>
> What canon do we have indicating whether the answer to a negative =
question like :<br>
><br>
> 'umbe''a' loDHom?<br>
><br>
> would be<br>
><br>
> HIja=92, =91um.<br>
><br>
> or<br>
> ghobe=92, =91um.</p><p dir=3D"ltr">I don't have any canon, but what =
reason is there to think it wouldn't be {HIja', 'umbe'} to begin with? =
The answer to {'umchoH'a'} is {HIja', 'umchoH}, and the answer to =
{belHa''a'} is {HIja', belHa'}, etc. I can't think of any reason {-be'} =
should behave differently than any other suffix in how it interacts with =
{-'a'}.</p><p dir=3D"ltr">Qov:<br>
> All I can think of is cheDuQchugh mareghbe=92=92a=92? which is of =
course rhetorical.</p><p dir=3D"ltr">ghobe', mareghbej.</p><p =
dir=3D"ltr">-- <br>
De'vID</p>
_______________________________________________<br>Tlhingan-hol mailing =
list<br><a =
href=3D"mailto:Tlhingan-hol@kli.org">Tlhingan-hol@kli.org</a><br>http://ma=
il.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol<br></blockquote></div><br></body>=
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