[96521] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Klingon dialogue in STID (major spoilers)
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Rohan Fenwick)
Mon Jun 17 20:10:55 2013
From: Rohan Fenwick <qeslagh@hotmail.com>
To: "tlhingan-hol@kli.org" <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2013 10:10:21 +1000
In-Reply-To: <CA+7zAmNPV=g4TyyW5uZ8+F=2HHYVobvXGKbtrrtaACGTAkzQaA@mail.gmail.com>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@stodi.digitalkingdom.org
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ghItlhpu' De'vID=2C jatlh:
> A couple of us (Quvar=2C loghaD=2C Qov=2C and myself) tried to reconstruc=
t
> the dialogue from memory and notes taken during the movie=2C using the
> English and German subtitles=2C and also the version of the same
> dialogue from the English novelisation and its German translation.
Add me to this number. :) I took a notebook with me both times I saw the mo=
vie in the cinema. The speech went by too quickly for me to get a decent go=
at everything (anyone developed a version of Pitman Shorthand for Klingon?=
) but much of what I got concurs with everyone else's=3B there are a few pl=
aces I may be able to refine things.
> Klingon (announcement from Klingon scout ship):
> bISaqQo=92[taH?]chugh vaj bIHegh. DaH ma[beh]. bISuvtaH [...] bISaqQo=92.=
..
> (untranslated=2C but explained by Uhura as a threat for Kirk et al's ship=
to land)
This was really nice Klingon=2C I thought. Well articulated and clearly und=
erstandable.
> The ship lands=2C Uhura walks towards the Klingons=2C and she says:
> [jIv|Dev]wI=92 la[tlh|H] jIve[?].
> English sub: Who's in charge here?
Funny - the English version I saw (Australia) had "I am here to help you" a=
s the subtitle here. I had the Klingon as [?]wI'ra' jIH'e'=2C which seemed =
to correspond (despite the fact that we have no idea if {-'e'} can appear o=
n a pronoun-as-verb like this).
> Uhura: jIyI[t|=92|q].
> English sub: I am here to help you.
> German sub: Voller respekt. (=3D With respect.)
Again=2C I'm almost certain that the English corresponded with the German (=
"With respect") in the version I saw. Could one of the viewers of the Engli=
sh version have inadvertently missed a subtitle in their transcription?
I had this as {jIyI'} as well. It was one of Saldana's most clearly articul=
ated word tokens. Unfortunately {yI'} doesn't correspond to anything we kno=
w. :/
> Uhura: [l|r]a[tlh|ch] jI[H?]vo=92 na[H?] Da[H|q] pIghvamDaq So=92=92eghta=
H.
> English sub: With respect=2C there is a terrorist hiding in these ruins.
> German sub: In diesen Ruinen versteckt sich ein Terrorist. (=3D There is
> a terrorist hiding in these ruins.)
> (The {pIghvamDaq So=92=92eghtaH} part was clearly spoken. I heard the wor=
d
> before it as {DaH}=2C and actually completely understood {DaH pIghvamDaq
> So=92=92eghtaH} in the theatre=2C but it might've been {Daq}.)
Me too=2C and I think {DaH pIghvamDaq So''eghtaH} is right. As for the rest=
=2C I can't really help much.
> Uhura: =91ej Dochmey [wI?] [bIngDaq?] [mapegh?].
> English sub: He has killed many of our people.
> German sub: Er hat viele unserer Leute get=F6tet.
> (No idea what the Klingon is supposed to be. But from this point the
> English and German subtitles are in sync.)
>=20
> Klingon leader: toH=2C Hegh Humanpu=92. qatlh DISaH?
> English sub: Why should I care about a human killing humans?
I thought this should be {qatlh jISaH} (backed up by "I" in the English sub=
)=2C not {qatlh DISaH}=2C though of course either is grammatical.
> Uhura: potlhmo=92 batlh=2C vIqaw[=3Dqel?]ba=92.
> English sub: Because you care about honor=2C
> German sub: Weil Ihnen Ehre etwas bedeutet.
> (The {potlhmo' batlh} part is clear.)
Given the English sub=2C and the fact that I had {jISaH} in the previous su=
btitle=2C I think {bI[qaw|qel]ba'} is more accurate. Still not sure what th=
is verb root is=2C though.
> Uhura: =91ej cheboq[meH|neH] jIvum[=92e=92|meH|neH].
> English sub: And this man has none.
> German sub: Dieser Mann besitzt keine.
> (I'm thinking this was {'ej cheboqmeH jIvum neH}=2C or something which
> was along the lines of "I'm here to help you"=2C but the subtitles got
> shuffled around.)
>=20
> Uhura: QoblI=92ba=92 [sounds like -bang] SoH juppu=92lI=92 je. [sounded m=
ore like qe]
> English sub: You and your people are in danger.
> German sub: Sie und Ihre Leute sind in Gefahr.
> (If you strain=2C you can get {QoblI'ba' SoH juppu'lI' je} out of it...
> by assuming that Uhura mispronounces {'} by making the vowel before it
> nasally=2C so it sounds almost like {ng} or {q}. But it's a bit of a
> stretch.)
{QoblI'ba'} would be ungrammatical. I think there's something else going on=
here.
> At this point=2C a fight begins=2C and the Klingons all shout over each
> other and weapons fire: DaH bIHegh [=3D batlh maHegh?] / wo=92 wItoy=92 /
> Qapla=92 / Qu=92vatlh [?]
Yep=2C all sounds pretty right. {DaH bIHegh} was definitely in there.
ST:ID is still playing until late tomorrow night here=2C so I might go and =
take one last poke at it with this transcript in hand=2C to see if any more=
can be wrung out of it.
QeS
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<body class=3D'hmmessage'><div dir=3D'ltr'><br>ghItlhpu' De'vID=2C jatlh:<b=
r>>=3B A couple of us (Quvar=2C loghaD=2C Qov=2C and myself) tried to rec=
onstruct<br><div>>=3B the dialogue from memory and notes taken during the=
movie=2C using the<br>>=3B English and German subtitles=2C and also the =
version of the same<br>>=3B dialogue from the English novelisation and it=
s German translation.<br><br>Add me to this number. :) I took a notebook wi=
th me both times I saw the movie in the cinema. The speech went by too quic=
kly for me to get a decent go at everything (anyone developed a version of =
Pitman Shorthand for Klingon?) but much of what I got concurs with everyone=
else's=3B there are a few places I may be able to refine things.<br><br>&g=
t=3B Klingon (announcement from Klingon scout ship):<br>>=3B bISaqQo=92[t=
aH?]chugh vaj bIHegh. DaH ma[beh]. bISuvtaH [...] bISaqQo=92...<br>>=3B (=
untranslated=2C but explained by Uhura as a threat for Kirk et al's ship to=
land)<br><br>This was really nice Klingon=2C I thought. Well articulated a=
nd clearly understandable.<br><br>>=3B The ship lands=2C Uhura walks towa=
rds the Klingons=2C and she says:<br>>=3B [jIv|Dev]wI=92 la[tlh|H] jIve[?=
].<br>>=3B English sub: Who's in charge here?<br><br>Funny - the English =
version I saw (Australia) had "I am here to help you" as the subtitle here.=
I had the Klingon as [?]wI'ra' jIH'e'=2C which seemed to correspond (despi=
te the fact that we have no idea if {-'e'} can appear on a pronoun-as-verb =
like this).<br><br>>=3B Uhura: jIyI[t|=92|q].<br>>=3B English sub: I am=
here to help you.<br>>=3B German sub: Voller respekt. (=3D With respect.=
)<br><br>Again=2C I'm almost certain that the English corresponded with the=
German ("With respect") in the version I saw. Could one of the viewers of =
the English version have inadvertently missed a subtitle in their transcrip=
tion?<br><br>I had this as {jIyI'} as well. It was one of Saldana's most cl=
early articulated word tokens. Unfortunately {yI'} doesn't correspond to an=
ything we know. :/<br><br>>=3B Uhura: [l|r]a[tlh|ch] jI[H?]vo=92 na[H?] D=
a[H|q] pIghvamDaq So=92=92eghtaH.<br>>=3B English sub: With respect=2C th=
ere is a terrorist hiding in these ruins.<br>>=3B German sub: In diesen R=
uinen versteckt sich ein Terrorist. (=3D There is<br>>=3B a terrorist hid=
ing in these ruins.)<br>>=3B (The {pIghvamDaq So=92=92eghtaH} part was cl=
early spoken. I heard the word<br>>=3B before it as {DaH}=2C and actually=
completely understood {DaH pIghvamDaq<br>>=3B So=92=92eghtaH} in the the=
atre=2C but it might've been {Daq}.)<br><br>Me too=2C and I think {DaH pIgh=
vamDaq So''eghtaH} is right. As for the rest=2C I can't really help much.<b=
r><br>>=3B Uhura: =91ej Dochmey [wI?] [bIngDaq?] [mapegh?].<br>>=3B Eng=
lish sub: He has killed many of our people.<br>>=3B German sub: Er hat vi=
ele unserer Leute get=F6tet.<br>>=3B (No idea what the Klingon is suppose=
d to be. But from this point the<br>>=3B English and German subtitles are=
in sync.)<br>>=3B <br>>=3B Klingon leader: toH=2C Hegh Humanpu=92. qat=
lh DISaH?<br>>=3B English sub: Why should I care about a human killing hu=
mans?<br><br>I thought this should be {qatlh jISaH} (backed up by "I" in th=
e English sub)=2C not {qatlh DISaH}=2C though of course either is grammatic=
al.<br><br>>=3B Uhura: potlhmo=92 batlh=2C vIqaw[=3Dqel?]ba=92.<br>>=3B=
English sub: Because you care about honor=2C<br>>=3B German sub: Weil Ih=
nen Ehre etwas bedeutet.<br>>=3B (The {potlhmo' batlh} part is clear.)<br=
><br>Given the English sub=2C and the fact that I had {jISaH} in the previo=
us subtitle=2C I think {bI[qaw|qel]ba'} is more accurate. Still not sure wh=
at this verb root is=2C though.<br><br>>=3B Uhura: =91ej cheboq[meH|neH] =
jIvum[=92e=92|meH|neH].<br>>=3B English sub: And this man has none.<br>&g=
t=3B German sub: Dieser Mann besitzt keine.<br>>=3B (I'm thinking this wa=
s {'ej cheboqmeH jIvum neH}=2C or something which<br>>=3B was along the l=
ines of "I'm here to help you"=2C but the subtitles got<br>>=3B shuffled =
around.)<br>>=3B <br>>=3B Uhura: QoblI=92ba=92 [sounds like -bang] SoH =
juppu=92lI=92 je. [sounded more like qe]<br>>=3B English sub: You and you=
r people are in danger.<br>>=3B German sub: Sie und Ihre Leute sind in Ge=
fahr.<br>>=3B (If you strain=2C you can get {QoblI'ba' SoH juppu'lI' je} =
out of it...<br>>=3B by assuming that Uhura mispronounces {'} by making t=
he vowel before it<br>>=3B nasally=2C so it sounds almost like {ng} or {q=
}. But it's a bit of a<br>>=3B stretch.)<br><br>{QoblI'ba'} would be ungr=
ammatical. I think there's something else going on here.<br><br>>=3B At t=
his point=2C a fight begins=2C and the Klingons all shout over each<br>>=
=3B other and weapons fire: DaH bIHegh [=3D batlh maHegh?] / wo=92 wItoy=92=
/<br>>=3B Qapla=92 / Qu=92vatlh [?]<br><br>Yep=2C all sounds pretty righ=
t. {DaH bIHegh} was definitely in there.<br><br>ST:ID is still playing unti=
l late tomorrow night here=2C so I might go and take one last poke at it wi=
th this transcript in hand=2C to see if any more can be wrung out of it.<br=
><br>QeS<br><br></div> </div></body>
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