[94499] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] (no subject)
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Felix Malmenbeck)
Mon Aug 27 16:40:48 2012
From: Felix Malmenbeck <felixm@kth.se>
To: Lisa S. <worthywoman@gmail.com>, "tlhingan-hol@kli.org"
<tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2012 20:40:11 +0000
In-Reply-To: <8095AEA7921A4723A9AE105A770CA891@laptop>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@stodi.digitalkingdom.org
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qaqIHpu'mo' jIbel, Lisa :)
Looking at that list:
Pages: In the Facebook translation, there was much talk of whether to refer=
to pages as Daqmey, muchmey, navmey, etc.
Which is most appropriate will probably vary from setting to setting (I thi=
nk muchmey or Daqmey may be appropriate here), but for the record, here's w=
hat we decided on there:
homepage =3D juH nav
page =3D nav
Page =3D Dol nav [this refers to the Facebook feature called "Pages", rathe=
r than pages in general]
webpage =3D 'Internet nav
website =3D 'Internet Daq
Images:
Will probably vary depending on taste, but I think <naghmey beQ> would do f=
ine here. Some would probably prefer <mIlloghmey>, though: http://klingonsk=
a.org/canon/search/?file=3D2010-12-25-email.txt&get=3Dsource
Races and beings:
<Segh Dep je> - Races and [nonhumanoid] beings
<mut Dep je> - Species and [nonhumanoid] beings
As for the naming of species and races:
Many of these don't have canonical Klingon names, so many would probably fa=
vor leaving them in English.
My thoughts on the individual examples can be found below.
Bajorans:
There's no canon to go off of, but because Klingons probably first learned =
of Bajorans via the Federation, I expect the likely refer to the planet eit=
her as *beyjor or *ba'jor, and the people as *beyjorngan or *ba'jorngan.
Betazoid:
The planet "Betazed" is called <be'taSeD> in Klingon, so the people might b=
e called *be'taSeDngan. That's not for certain, though; the planet+ngan pat=
tern is broken by the Ferengi, who are called <verengan> but whose planet i=
s <verenganar> (and Vulcans are simply <vulqangan>, not **vulqanngan**)
Breen:
No canon to go by.
Some Trek novels claim "Breen" is not the name of a single species, but one=
encompassing all of races in the Breen Confederacy.
We've only heard the Breen talk through weird helmets, and their voices com=
e out like static, so we don't really know how they pronounce it. So, it ma=
y be wise to simply leave it in English. Otherwise, you'll probably have to=
do some sort of phonetic approximation, such as *berIn.
Borg:
It seems likely the Klingons first learned of the Borg via the Federation, =
in which case they might perhaps be called *borgh or *bor'Iq or something.
I personally like to refer to them as *janyIn, as a pun on <jan> and <jatyI=
n>.
No canon to go by, though.
Cardassian:
<qarDaSngan> is canon.
Dominion:
Called <ngup'a'>, literally meaning something like "the great cape", or - i=
n slang terms - "the great political power".
Ferengi:
<verengan> is canon.
Klingon:
tlhIngan maH!
Krenim:
If the Klingons have even heard of the Krenim, it'd probably be through the=
Federation. Don't know if they'd be called *Qe'nIm or *Qe'nImngan or what;=
might be best to just leave as "Krenim".
Q:
No canon to go by; perhaps best to just leave as "Q".
Romulans:
<romuluSngan> is canon.
According to KGT, this name was inspired by the word Humans use for Romulan=
s, saying name Romulans have for themselves is "something quite distinct". =
This may be a reference to the Rihannsu series of novels (and others inspir=
ed by it), in which Romulus is referred to as "ch'Rihan", and the people ar=
e referred to as "Rihannsu".
Tamarian:
No canon to go by.
They are also referred to as "the children of Tamar", and I seem to recall =
that "Tamar" is pronounced roughly *temar, so maybe *temar puqpu'. Or just =
leave it in "English".
Tribble:
<yIH> is canon.
Vulcan:
<vulqangan> is canon.
Other alien races:
latlh nov Segh[mey]
________________________________
From: Lisa S. [worthywoman@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, August 27, 2012 03:01
To: tlhingan-hol@kli.org
Subject: [Tlhingan-hol] (no subject)
I have not been practicing or saying anything here in about a decade and 1/=
2, but I've read. It's time for me to begin at the beginning again.
I apologize for writing this in English, but I'm weary and not thinking wel=
l=85
There is this web site http://www.starbase75.com/ that has a "Klingon Por=
tal." It really was not very good, but I hate Whiners! Rather than just co=
mplain, I offered to help make suggestions and changes. The web dude accep=
ted my help, along with that of a couple of others (if you want to join tha=
t effort, contact alex.ashbrook@googlemail.com<mailto:alex.ashbrook@googlem=
ail.com> ).
I just wanted to see if any of you have suggestions or corrections (for exa=
mple, which English words/concepts should I change to make for better trans=
lations)
Needed changes
* Pages
* Images
* Races and Beings
* Bajorans
* Betazoids
* Breens
* Borg
* Cardassians
* Dominion
* Ferengi
* Klingons
* Krenim
* Q
* Romulans
* Tamarians
* Tribbles
* Vulcans
*
Other Alien Races
* Vehicles
* Interstellar Cartography and Full Planetary Views
* Planet-side Locations
* Contests
* Rules
* Paperwork
* Winners
* Previous Contests
* In The Forum
* ...
* Klingon Portal
* Language
* Resources for Learning
* Basic Rules of the Language
* Beginners' Lessons
* Your Practice Here
* Klingon Writings From Our Members
* Excellent Examples on the Web
* Horrible Examples
* Culture
* Episodes with a Klingon Theme
* Writings
* Published (the links)
* Our Members' Efforts
* Klingons Can Be Seen Here
* ...
Lisa Stapp,
Confessionalgal@att.net
worthywoman@yahoo.com
worthywoman@gmail.com
Skype: lmstapp or 281-378-3225
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<div style=3D"direction: ltr;font-family: Tahoma;color: #000000;font-size: =
10pt;">qaqIHpu'mo' jIbel, Lisa :)<br>
<br>
Looking at that list:<br>
<br>
Pages: In the Facebook translation, there was much talk of whether to refer=
to pages as Daqmey, muchmey, navmey, etc.<br>
Which is most appropriate will probably vary from setting to setting (I thi=
nk muchmey or Daqmey may be appropriate here), but for the record, here's w=
hat we decided on there:<br>
<br>
homepage =3D juH nav<br>
page =3D nav<br>
Page =3D Dol nav [this refers to the Facebook feature called "Pages&qu=
ot;, rather than pages in general]<br>
webpage =3D 'Internet nav<br>
website =3D 'Internet Daq<br>
<br>
Images:<br>
Will probably vary depending on taste, but I think <naghmey beQ> woul=
d do fine here. Some would probably prefer <mIlloghmey>, though:
<a href=3D"http://klingonska.org/canon/search/?file=3D2010-12-25-email.txt&=
amp;get=3Dsource" target=3D"_blank">
http://klingonska.org/canon/search/?file=3D2010-12-25-email.txt&get=3Ds=
ource</a><br>
<br>
Races and beings:<br>
<Segh Dep je> - Races and [nonhumanoid] beings<br>
<mut Dep je> - Species and [nonhumanoid] beings<br>
<br>
<br>
As for the naming of species and races:<br>
Many of these don't have canonical Klingon names, so many would probably fa=
vor leaving them in English.<br>
My thoughts on the individual examples can be found below.<br>
<br>
<br>
Bajorans:<br>
There's no canon to go off of, but because Klingons probably first learned =
of Bajorans via the Federation, I expect the likely refer to the planet eit=
her as *beyjor or *ba'jor, and the people as *beyjorngan or *ba'jorngan.<br=
>
<br>
Betazoid:<br>
The planet "Betazed" is called <be'taSeD> in Klingon, so th=
e people might be called *be'taSeDngan. That's not for certain, though; the=
planet+ngan pattern is broken by the Ferengi, who are called <veren=
gan> but whose planet is <verenganar> (and Vulcans are
simply <vulqangan>, not **vulqanngan**)<br>
<br>
Breen:<br>
No canon to go by.<br>
Some Trek novels claim "Breen" is not the name of a single specie=
s, but one encompassing all of races in the Breen Confederacy.<br>
We've only heard the Breen talk through weird helmets, and their voices com=
e out like static, so we don't really know how they pronounce it. So, it ma=
y be wise to simply leave it in English. Otherwise, you'll probably have to=
do some sort of phonetic approximation,
such as *berIn.<br>
<br>
Borg:<br>
It seems likely the Klingons first learned of the Borg via the Federation, =
in which case they might perhaps be called *borgh or *bor'Iq or something.<=
br>
I personally like to refer to them as *janyIn, as a pun on <jan> and =
<jatyIn>.<br>
No canon to go by, though.<br>
<br>
Cardassian:<br>
<qarDaSngan> is canon.<br>
<br>
Dominion:<br>
Called <ngup'a'>, literally meaning something like "the great ca=
pe", or - in slang terms - "the great political power".<br>
<br>
Ferengi:<br>
<verengan> is canon.<br>
<br>
Klingon:<br>
tlhIngan maH!<br>
<br>
Krenim:<br>
If the Klingons have even heard of the Krenim, it'd probably be through the=
Federation. Don't know if they'd be called *Qe'nIm or *Qe'nImngan or what;=
might be best to just leave as "Krenim".<br>
<br>
Q:<br>
No canon to go by; perhaps best to just leave as "Q".<br>
<br>
Romulans:<br>
<romuluSngan> is canon.<br>
According to KGT, this name was inspired by the word Humans use for Romulan=
s, saying name Romulans have for themselves is "something quite distin=
ct". This may be a reference to the Rihannsu series of novels (and oth=
ers inspired by it), in which Romulus is referred
to as "ch'Rihan", and the people are referred to as "Rihann=
su".<br>
<br>
Tamarian:<br>
No canon to go by.<br>
They are also referred to as "the children of Tamar", and I seem =
to recall that "Tamar" is pronounced roughly *temar, so maybe *te=
mar puqpu'. Or just leave it in "English".<br>
<br>
Tribble:<br>
<yIH> is canon.<br>
<br>
Vulcan:<br>
<vulqangan> is canon.<br>
<br>
Other alien races:<br>
latlh nov Segh[mey]<br>
<br>
<div style=3D"font-family: Times New Roman; color: #000000; font-size: 16px=
">
<hr tabindex=3D"-1">
<div style=3D"direction: ltr;" id=3D"divRpF178586"><font color=3D"#000000" =
face=3D"Tahoma" size=3D"2"><b>From:</b> Lisa S. [worthywoman@gmail.com]<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, August 27, 2012 03:01<br>
<b>To:</b> tlhingan-hol@kli.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Tlhingan-hol] (no subject)<br>
</font><br>
</div>
<div></div>
<div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">
<div style=3D"font-family:'Calibri'; color:#000000; font-size:12pt">
<div>I have not been practicing or saying anything here in about a decade a=
nd 1/2, but I've read. It's time for me to begin at the beginning aga=
in.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>I apologize for writing this in English, but I'm weary and not thinkin=
g well=85</div>
<div> </div>
<div>There is this web site <a href=3D"http://www.starbase75.com/" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
http://www.starbase75.com/</a> that has a "Klingon Portal."=
It really was not very good, but I hate Whiners! Rather than just co=
mplain, I offered to help make suggestions and changes. The web dude =
accepted my help, along with that of a couple of others (if
you want to join that effort, contact <a href=3D"mailto:alex.ashbrook@goog=
lemail.com" target=3D"_blank">
alex.ashbrook@googlemail.com</a> ).</div>
<div> </div>
<div>I just wanted to see if any of you have suggestions or corrections (fo=
r example, which English words/concepts should I change to make for better =
translations)</div>
<div> </div>
<p><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Needed changes </font></p>
<ul>
<li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Pages </font>
<ul>
<li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Images </font>
<ul>
<li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Races and Beings </font>
<ul>
<li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Bajorans </font></li><li><font face=3D"T=
imes New Roman">Betazoids </font></li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Br=
eens </font></li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Borg </font></li><li><f=
ont face=3D"Times New Roman">Cardassians </font></li><li><font face=3D"Time=
s New Roman">Dominion </font></li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Fereng=
i </font></li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Klingons </font></li><li><=
font face=3D"Times New Roman">Krenim </font></li><li><font face=3D"Times Ne=
w Roman">Q </font></li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Romulans </font><=
/li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Tamarians </font></li><li><font face=
=3D"Times New Roman">Tribbles </font></li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman=
">Vulcans </font></li><li><br>
<br>
<font face=3D"Times New Roman">Other Alien Races </font></li></ul>
</li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Vehicles </font></li><li><font face=
=3D"Times New Roman">Interstellar Cartography and Full Planetary Views
</font></li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Planet-side Locations </font=
></li></ul>
</li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Contests </font>
<ul>
<li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Rules </font></li><li><font face=3D"Time=
s New Roman">Paperwork </font></li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Winne=
rs </font>
<ul>
<li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Previous Contests </font></li></ul>
</li></ul>
</li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">In The Forum </font>
<ul>
<li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">... </font></li><li><font face=3D"Times =
New Roman">Klingon Portal </font>
<ul>
<li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Language </font>
<ul>
<li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Resources for Learning </font></li><li><=
font face=3D"Times New Roman">Basic Rules of the Language </font></li><li><=
font face=3D"Times New Roman">Beginners' Lessons </font>
<ul>
<li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Your Practice Here </font></li></ul>
</li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Klingon Writings From Our Mem=
bers </font></li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Excellent Examples on t=
he Web </font></li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Horrible Examples </f=
ont></li></ul>
</li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Culture </font></li><li><font face=
=3D"Times New Roman">Episodes with a Klingon Theme </font></li><li><font fa=
ce=3D"Times New Roman">Writings </font>
<ul>
<li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Published (the links) </font></li><li><f=
ont face=3D"Times New Roman">Our Members' Efforts </font></li></ul>
</li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">Klingons Can Be Seen Here </font></=
li></ul>
</li><li><font face=3D"Times New Roman">... </font></li></ul>
</li></ul>
</li></ul>
<div style=3D"font-family:'Calibri'; color:#000000; font-size:12pt"><br>
<br>
Lisa Stapp, <br>
Confessionalgal@att.net<br>
worthywoman@yahoo.com<br>
worthywoman@gmail.com<br>
Skype: lmstapp or 281-378-3225 </div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
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