[92324] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Sepmey
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (Steven Boozer)
Mon Feb 27 11:31:09 2012
From: Steven Boozer <sboozer@uchicago.edu>
To: "tlhingan-hol@kli.org" <tlhingan-hol@kli.org>
Date: Mon, 27 Feb 2012 10:30:59 -0600
In-Reply-To: <CA+7zAmOcSP-dK-dxMwc1V17pikz-1RSmFxBhrtLaOTT6T8M7LA@mail.gmail.com>
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@stodi.digitalkingdom.org
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Here's the only mention of No'hvadut in KGT:
KGT 26: In a divergence from the majority of Klingon dialects, the speaker=
s of Sakrej and No'hvadut ({noHva'Dut}) do not follow this pattern. In thes=
e dialects, there is no reforming of the sentences for toasts; the subject =
always follows the verb.
I took it to be a region, too. {Sa'Qej} is a region and AFAIK the various =
dialects Okrand discusses are usually named after regions or off-world colo=
nies/settlements (e.g. Morska) - with the exception of the city of Ruk'evet=
:
KGT 17: On rare occasion, a place's name can be traced to an individual or=
family, such as ... {ruq'e'vet} (Ruk'evet), a city in the {ghevchoq} Sep (=
Gevchok region), named for a warrior (whether actual or mythological is a m=
atter of dispute) who singlehandedly defeated an invading force.
KGT 30: while the verb {ghIH} means "be messy, sloppy" in {ta' Hol} and in=
most dialects, in the towns near Ruk'evet ({ruq'e'vet}), {ghIH} means "be =
careless". The more widespread word for "be careless" is {yepHa'}, and this=
word is used in addition to {ghIH} in the Ruk'evet area. To say "be messy,=
sloppy", the Ruk'evet inhabitants say {Soy'}, a verb meaning "be clumsy" e=
lsewhere. The Ruk'evet word for "be clumsy" is {jat}, which is phonetically=
identical to the noun meaning "tongue".
Perhaps this is just a minor variation in vocabulary - e.g. "submarine" vs.=
"hero" sandwich, "soda" vs. "pop" vs. "coke", etc. in the U.S. Merely a b=
it of local Ruk'evet color, but not enough to rise to the level of a dialec=
t with its own variant grammar.
--
Voragh
Ca'Non Master of the Klingons
From: De'vID jonpIn [mailto:de.vid.jonpin@gmail.com]
loghaD:
> Though it's not in the glossary section, KGT mentions No'hvadut (noHva'Du=
t).
'ach Sep pong 'oH'a'? chaq yoS veng ghap neH 'oH.
{noHva'Dut} rur {taq'ev}. KGTDaq tu'lu' 'ach mu'tay'HomDajDaq tu'lu'be'. =
Sep 'oH {taq'ev}'e' vISovbe'.
--
De'vID
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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-US link=3Dblue vli=
nk=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 f=
ace=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Here’s the o=
nly mention of No’hvadut in KGT:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=
=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-si=
ze:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font si=
ze=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>KGT 26:&nb=
sp; In a divergence from the majority of Klingon dialects, the speakers of =
Sakrej and No'hvadut ({noHva'Dut}) do not follow this pattern. In these dia=
lects, there is no reforming of the sentences for toasts; the subject alway=
s follows the verb.</span></font><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DCo=
nsolas><span style=3D'font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas;color:#1F497D'>=
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3D"#=
1f497d" face=3DConsolas><span style=3D'font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consola=
s;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><f=
ont size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>I to=
ok it to be a region, too. {Sa'Qej} is a region and AFAIK the various=
dialects Okrand discusses are usually named after regions or off-world col=
onies/settlements (e.g. Morska) – with the exception of the city of R=
uk’evet:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=
=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> <=
/o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times Ne=
w Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>KGT 17: On rare occasion, a=
place's name can be traced to an individual or family, such as ... {ruq'e'=
vet} (Ruk'evet), a city in the {ghevchoq} Sep (Gevchok region), named for a=
warrior (whether actual or mythological is a matter of dispute) who single=
handedly defeated an invading force.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=
=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-si=
ze:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font si=
ze=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>KGT 30:&nb=
sp; while the verb {ghIH} means “be messy, sloppy” in {ta' Hol}=
and in most dialects, in the towns near Ruk'evet ({ruq'e'vet}), {ghIH} mea=
ns “be careless”. The more widespread word for “be carele=
ss” is {yepHa'}, and this word is used in addition to {ghIH} in the R=
uk'evet area. To say “be messy, sloppy”, the Ruk'evet inhabitan=
ts say {Soy'}, a verb meaning “be clumsy” elsewhere. The Ruk'ev=
et word for “be clumsy” is {jat}, which is phonetically identic=
al to the noun meaning “tongue”.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p=
class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'f=
ont-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><f=
ont size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><o:p=
> </o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"=
Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Perhaps this is just a mi=
nor variation in vocabulary – e.g. “submarine” vs. “=
;hero” sandwich, “soda” vs. “pop” vs. “=
coke”, etc. in the U.S. Merely a bit of local Ruk’evet co=
lor, but not enough to rise to the level of a dialect with its own variant =
grammar.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 fa=
ce=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></=
span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman=
"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p><p cl=
ass=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DConsolas><span styl=
e=3D'font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas;color:#1F497D'>--<o:p></o:p></sp=
an></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3D=
Consolas><span style=3D'font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas;color:#1F497D=
'>Voragh<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 co=
lor=3D"#1f497d" face=3DConsolas><span style=3D'font-size:10.5pt;font-family=
:Consolas;color:#1F497D'>Ca'Non Master of the Klingons<o:p></o:p></span></f=
ont></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" face=3DConsol=
as><span style=3D'font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas;color:#1F497D'><o:p=
> </o:p></span></font></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3D=
"#1f497d" face=3D"Courier New"><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:=
"Courier New";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p><div style=
=3D'border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><di=
v><div style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0i=
n 0in 0in'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span style=
=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";font-weight:bold'>Fr=
om:</span></font></b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span style=3D'font-size:=
10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> De'vID jonpIn [mailto:de.vid.jon=
pin@gmail.com] <br><br><o:p></o:p></span></font></p></div></div><p><font si=
ze=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>loghaD:<br=
>> Though it's not in the glossary section, KGT mentions No’hvadut=
(noHva’Dut).<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p><font size=3D3 face=3D"T=
imes New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>'ach Sep pong 'oH'a'? =
; chaq yoS veng ghap neH 'oH.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p><font size=3D3=
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>{noHva'Dut} rur =
{taq'ev}. KGTDaq tu'lu' 'ach mu'tay'HomDajDaq tu'lu'be'. Sep 'o=
H {taq'ev}'e' vISovbe'.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p><p><font size=3D3 face=
=3D"Times New Roman"><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>--<br>De'vID<o:p></o:=
p></span></font></p></div></div></body></html>=
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