[91356] in tlhIngan-Hol
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] The Dhammapada: A Klingon Translation, verses 1-2
daemon@ATHENA.MIT.EDU (De'vID jonpIn)
Wed Dec 21 11:07:41 2011
In-Reply-To: <SNT106-W572A0CBEA2E4342A69B373A1A50@phx.gbl>
Date: Wed, 21 Dec 2011 17:07:28 +0100
From: "De'vID jonpIn" <de.vid.jonpin@gmail.com>
To: tlhIngan-Hol@kli.org
Errors-To: tlhingan-hol-bounces@stodi.digitalkingdom.org
Hi, Josh,
I think you should include the Pali text. There are quite a few
linguists and linguistically inclined folk on the list, some of whom
may be able to read Pali (or Sanskrit).
Josh Badgley:
> Chapter 1
>
> Pairs
>
>
> 'ay' wa'
>
> chang'engmey
<Yamakavaggo> {chang'engmey}
{chang'eng} or {chang'engmey} is perfect for <yamaka>. =A0(<vagga> just
means "section, chapter", and all the chapter titles include it in the
Pali.)
Josh:
> 1
>
> yab wanI'mey nung yab,
>
> che' yab,
>
> chenmoH yab.
>
> qaltaHvIS yab bIjatlhchugh qoj bIvangchugh,
>
> vaj bep Dutlha'
>
> rur tangqa' qam tlha'bogh rutlh'e'
>
>
> Mind precedes mental phenomena,
>
> Mind rules them, mind creates them.
>
> If you speak or act while the mind is corrupted
>
> Then agony follows you
>
> Like the wheel that follows the foot of the ox
manopubba.ngamaa dhammaa manose.t.thaa manomayaa
manasaa ce padu.t.thena bhaasati vaa karoti vaa
tato na.m dukkham anveti cakka.m va vahato pada.m.
I'll skip the business about minds and <dharma>s for now... nobody
really knows how to translate that into another language, let alone
Klingon.
I'm not sure that {qal} is the right word to use here. Have you
considered {nIt} or {watlh}? I think {nItHa'} / {nIt} would make a
nice correspondence to <padu.t.thena> / <pasannena> in this pair of
passages.
I would suggest {-DI'} rather than {-chugh}, and also add a {-bej} to
the consequence. I think this suggests a more immediate and stronger
connection between the cause and effect. Just because the original
says "if" <ce> doesn't mean you have to translate it with {-chugh}.
Also, just because the Pali (or English) uses a lot of nouns
(something follows you like something follows something else), doesn't
mean you have to (or should) use a lot of nouns in the Klingon
translation. I think that {bIbechbej} is a more Klingon way to
express "suffering follows you", and the meaning is clear when that
sentence is followed by the {rur}-simile.
Putting it together:
{nItHa'taHvIS yab bIjatlhDI' qoj bIvangDI' bIbechbej; tangqa' qam
tlha'bogh rutlh'e' rur bep}
Josh:
> 2
>
>
> yab wanI'mey nung yab,
>
> che' yab,
>
> chenmoH yab.
>
> wovtaHvIS yab bIjatlhchugh qoj bIvangchugh,
>
> vaj Qapla' Dutlha'
>
> rur mejbe'bogh QIb
>
>
> Mind precedes mental phenomena,
>
> Mind rules them, mind creates them.
>
> If you speak or act while the mind is bright,
>
> Then success follows you
>
> Like a shadow that does not depart.
manopubba.ngamaa dhammaa manose.t.thaa manomayaa
manasaa ce pasannena bhaasati vaa karoti vaa
tato na.m sukham anveti chaayaa va anapaayinii.
Again (and skipping over the <dharma> part), to parallel the first
verse, I'd suggest:
{nIttaHvIS yab bIjatlhDI' qoj bIvangDI' bIQapbej; not tlheDbogh QIb'e'
rur Qapla'}
--
De'vID
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